Unfinished games that are actually good?

R.Graves

R.Graves

Confirmed Retard
The top 3 that immediately spring to my mind are Final Fantasy XV, Metal Gear Solid V, and, of course, Fallout: New Vegas. These three games are blatantly unfinished but they all have something about them that keeps pulling me back.

Other great games that aren't finished I've played are

Devil may cry 4 (literally the entire second half of the game was scrapped so the second half is literally just the same levels in reverse)
Deus ex: mankind Divided (like 6 hours into the game I was in a gun tutorial, something ain't right here)
Crash Twinsanity (my favorite crash bandicoot game, don't @ me, is absolutely loaded with charm but there's so much obvious cut content it's impossible to count)
Super Mario Sunshine (final product feels complete enough but it's a well known fact that 7 levels were cut which would amount to half the game)

Anyways do you guys have any examples of your own? This is super specific I know but I find it interesting.
 
The ones that I can think right away are (besides some already mentioned):
  • Fallout 2
  • Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic II
  • Xenogears
  • All games from Troika:
    • Arcanum: Of Steamworks and Magick Obscura
    • The Temple of Elemental Evil
    • Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines
Anyone who ever played these games can tell that they are unfinished, but they are all still pretty good.
 
I heard the ratio of gameplay to story on disc 2 of Xenogears was way out of wack due to how much was cut. Only thing from the xeno franchise I've played is Xenosaga (HD collection when?) Which was planned to be a six part game spanning two console generations but then well they only made 3.
 
The best ones were mentioned already. I still can't think of one as good as FF15 or MGS V.
 
I wouldn't call Fallout 2 or Arcanum unfinished games. It wouldn't surprise me if pretty much every game ever made cut content at some point. There's deadlines and sometimes the publisher will make certain demands (like removing the brothel in ToEE, IIRC).
Like, what exactly is unfinished about Arcanum? Do you mean that X-Files quest? Do you mean the presence of certain objects that serve no purpose in the game (tech gadgets that don't work or do anything)?
So is Fallout 1 unfinished because inventory is a drag and Ian gets stuck all the time? Is Planescape: Torment unfinished because combat sucks? How does it work?
 
Well most of the examples I gave either had wildly incomplete stories (mgsv/ ffxv)
Or had literally half of what was planned cut.
 
alec is right, there's usually more to be done in a game but deadlines, budgets, and complications are all things that hinder the idealistic vision someone would have for a game.

But there are those who are significantly cut in terms of what the player sees and anything I would have mentioned has already been said.
 
alec said:
I wouldn't call Fallout 2 or Arcanum unfinished games. It wouldn't surprise me if pretty much every game ever made cut content at some point. There's deadlines and sometimes the publisher will make certain demands (like removing the brothel in ToEE, IIRC).
Like, what exactly is unfinished about Arcanum? Do you mean that X-Files quest? Do you mean the presence of certain objects that serve no purpose in the game (tech gadgets that don't work or do anything)?
So is Fallout 1 unfinished because inventory is a drag and Ian gets stuck all the time? Is Planescape: Torment unfinished because combat sucks? How does it work?
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We all know Fallout 2 is unfinished. They had to cut quite a large part of the planned game to be able to ship it when Interplay said they should. They had to fill the game locations with jokes and references because they didn't have time to build those locations properly. They didn't have time to include entire planned locations and companions (like EPA for example).
The game is unfinished as in "we were going to make the game like planned, but then Interplay pushed the released date and wouldn't budge and we could not finish all the planned content, while filling it with last minute jokes and ideas that weren't planned".

To me, if the devs have this plan for the game, they are making the game following these plans, can actually finish the game the way they want to but for any reason are forced to just wrap-it up and say it's finished... Then it's an unfinished game. One thing is not being able to make the game you want because you aimed too high and just couldn't do it, deciding to change the plans half way and deliver a game that wasn't the original planned one. Or just remove some items/equipment/npc/quest because you can't make it work or just changed your mind. But if you know you can make the planned game, you're working on making it and then exterior reasons force you to not do it like that and you have to release the game anyway. It's an unfinished game to me.

Arcanum was also planned in a way and then had to rush to release before implementing all the planned content the way the devs were building the game. I can't remember which locations by name anymore, but several locations were supposed to have way more content, companions were supposed to be more fleshed out and have more dialogues/interactions/story, and the "push to release the game as is" is also the reason why some races do not have female playable characters, because they run out of time to make all the new sprites and animations for those females (props to them for coming up with a decent lore reason for that at last minute).

Hell. if you don't trust my words, here is Jason Anderson saying it himself:
And, in form with their previous two releases, Bloodlines made lasting impressions on all who reviewed it. It was again praised for the subject matter but slammed for all the bugs. Like the one that killed my computer. This recurring theme is, in Anderson's mind, what led to Troika's downfall, though he contends most of the blood is on the publishers' hands. "Right or wrong, we just needed more time to test and polish the games, and none of our three publishers were willing to give it to us. Each and every game was pulled out of our hands before we were through with it. In all fairness, I have to say that we were late and over budget, but that still does not justify giving the public an unfinished product."
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Fair enough, but I still wouldn't call Fallout 2 and Arcanum unfinished games.
I also seriously doubt that they filled locations with jokes and references BECAUSE they didn't have time to build those locations properly. If you don't have time for the normal stuff, you don't have time for those jokes and references either.
 
Stalker 1 was always for me an unfinished game considering the vast amount of content they promised trough the development of the game. From real choices and consequences, to operating vehicles like helicopters and cars - the code was still in the game when it was released and a few modders data mined it after the release and even got a car working for the player but it exploded the moment it bumped in to something.

 
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Crni Vuk said:
Stalker 1 was always for me an unfinished game considering the vast amount of content they promised trough the development of the game. From real choices and consequences, to operating vehicles like helicopters and cars - the code was still in the game when it was released and a few modders data mined it after the release and even got a car working for the player but it exploded the moment it bumped in to something.
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I think Lost Alpha is supposed to try to make SoC somewhat more like what it was promised. I don't know how close it is but I hear it in STALKER circles often enough it must be worth mentioning.
 
alec said:
If you don't have time for the normal stuff, you don't have time for those jokes and references either.
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Coming up with wacky stuff that doesn't make much sense and completely obvious pop culture references takes much less time than coming up with well thought stuff. Because you can literally just put the first thing that comes into your mind instead of having to review other possible content that can go into these locations.

They most likely didn't had the time for the latter, but had enough for the the former.
 
alec said:
Fair enough, but I still wouldn't call Fallout 2 and Arcanum unfinished games.
I also seriously doubt that they filled locations with jokes and references BECAUSE they didn't have time to build those locations properly. If you don't have time for the normal stuff, you don't have time for those jokes and references either.
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I researched this a lot in the past and made a post about it before. Basically, Interplay wanted a Fallout game as big (content, map, quests, etc) as Baldur's Gate but with a shorter team and much less time (Interplay also moved people from the Fallout team into Planescape Torment team in the middle of Fallout 2 development). Black Isle was running out of time and couldn't make all the visual assets for many of the planned content, so they just let any developer use their own ideas they got in the spot that wouldn't need new assets, they pretty much allowed any silly idea because they had to fill the locations because Interplay demanded them filled, but they couldn't use new assets because they didn't have time to make them... So it became like "the wild west" (devs own words, not mine).

Anyway, I have to go to sleep, so here is my past post:
Risewild said:
Many of the humor in Fallout 2 was because they were running out of time and had a lot of areas that were very empty. They had to come up with things in short notice.
Remember that Interplay wanted a game twice as big as Fallout 1 but that felt less empty. All of this in a very short amount of time to finish and release the game (around 9 months IIRC).

The graphic and model teams couldn't even finish all the things Black Isle wanted to include in the game, so many things that were actually well planned got cut out.

Then they had to come up with quick content to place in the game using the resources they already had... Humoristic pop-culture references are the easy way out when you have to fill a wasteland and some settlements with forced content and are running out of time.

I found a nice interview that illustrates the problem:
Feargus Urquhart said:
We'd started working on Fallout 2 before we'd even shipped Fallout 1. That was in the middle of 1997. By the beginning of 1998, when Interplay was having some financial difficulties, they decided they wanted to make Fallout 2 and make it in the same amount of time as the original, and as far as they were concerned, we'd already been developing it for half a year already. So that gave us basically nine months to make the whole game.
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Eric DeMilt said:
Fallout 1 was amazing, it really knocked it out the park. But Interplay launched it right before launching Baldur's Gate, and in terms of revenue, Baldur's Gate absolutely smoked Fallout - Fallout initially sold something like 200,000 units while Baldur's Gate sold like a million. And it was a much bigger game. So when we kicked off Fallout 2, there was the ambition to make it as big as Baldur's Gate, and that's where a lot of the pressure came from.
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As well as a hectic development schedule, that extra pressure led to Black Isle creating and calcifying what would become some of the Fallout series' most-famous trademarks. In the case of dynamic, fleshed-out characters, this was on purpose. In the case of bizarre and often hilarious glitches, it was by accident.
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To meet their tight production schedule, designers would often have to draft huge game areas and then move quickly onto the next, leaving vast portions of Fallout 2 sparse or underpopulated, right up until its release date. It was a harried way of working, but it actually helped to cultivate Fallout's absurdist visual style; with swathes of the map still requiring characters, missions, and other playable material right down to the last minute, Fallout 2's artists and programmers were creatively set loose, and developed appropriately strange ideas.
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Dan Spitzley said:
I basically sat down and thought up everything and anything I could to fill these spaces. That's where a lot of the crazier stuff, like the treasure-hunting dwarf or the Radscorpion that played chess, ended up coming from.
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Eric DeMilt said:
Back then there was collaboration. Our team was pretty small and there were no strict guidelines for how things got done. It was a like a Wild West development style. If you had an idea and could get it into Fallout, then we'd say 'yep, do it’.
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Risewild said:
I researched this a lot in the past and made a post about it before.
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Bravo, I'm sure you have. But so have I. And I think you're obsessed with these jokes and references and can't see the bigger picture anymore. Weren't you the guy who claimed that Fallout 3 and Fallout 4 suck because Bethesda took Fallout 2 as an example and not the superior first game?
Fallout 2 is so much more than a Radscorpion playing chess and Anna's ghost asking for her locket. I thought it was about saving a village, looking for a G.E.C.K. and confronting the Enclave. The game is so big, you can play it for a month and still not finish the main quest, but I'm supposed to downgrade the whole thing because there's some funny stuff in there? Sure. Guess what? The Restoration Project adds even more silliness, so you should actually be happy with this so-called unfinished game.
As for the interviews: everyone always looks for a scapegoat. 'We wanted to make the bestest game ever, but we only had 1 week, boohoohoo.' 'We were planning a much bigger game, but then the publisher took away half of our budget and half of our wages, so all we could come up with was drivel and jokes.'
Reality is that Fallout 2 was well-received when it hit the shelves. The bugs and the fact that it looked too much like the first game were the main criticisms. No one whined about 'empty' houses and maps because it's a post-apocalyptic world, so you'd fucking expect such maps. I can't remember people whining about Chuck Stodgers or Tin Man or Keeng Ra'at back then because we were smart enough to consider those to be ... jokes and references. Even more so because postmodernism was huge during the late nineties and practically everything made for entertainment was full of references. Ever seen this cartoon called The Simpsons? It used to be really big. It also referenced the most bizarre things in pretty much all of its episodes. I guess it must be forgotten now because jokes and references fucked up the plotlines. But back then, you'd watch it and every so often you'd say: "O man, that's a reference to this or that!" and you'd feel good about yourself for having figured that out.

:roll:

We will have to agree to disagree. It's pointless to try to change my mind about some of the best games ever made for pc.
 
Dark Souls Trilogy obviously have a ton of cut content, including the unfinished Lost Izalith area (Dark Souls), item that lets you go back in time (Dark Souls II), and the original story for Lothric (Dark Souls III).
You could say that the final products for these three are polished (somewhat), but unfinished. Due to Bandai Namco puts out poor marketing about dying and time constraints, Or maybe FromSoftware thought the games were fine on its own despite their flaws.
In Fact, Demon's Souls and Bloodborne have some cut content as well, but the prime example for unfinished games that are good goes to the Dark Souls Trilogy.
They're fine on its own (in some way), but would it be amazing if someone or FromSoftware (if they're willing) decides to remake the Trilogy by restoring some useful cut content like the original story for Dark Souls III? Because I'm curiously intrigued of how it plays out in contrast to what we've gotten for retail release.
So what do you think about this?
 
alec said:
Bravo, I'm sure you have. But so have I. And I think you're obsessed with these jokes and references and can't see the bigger picture anymore. Weren't you the guy who claimed that Fallout 3 and Fallout 4 suck because Bethesda took Fallout 2 as an example and not the superior first game?
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You're confusing me with someone else, probably @Norzan .
alec said:
Fallout 2 is so much more than a Radscorpion playing chess and Anna's ghost asking for her locket. I thought it was about saving a village, looking for a G.E.C.K. and confronting the Enclave. The game is so big, you can play it for a month and still not finish the main quest, but I'm supposed to downgrade the whole thing because there's some funny stuff in there? Sure. Guess what? The Restoration Project adds even more silliness, so you should actually be happy with this so-called unfinished game.
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I never said the game is unfinished because it has funny things, I'm actually one of the few that has absolutely no problem with ghosts, chess playing scorpions, talking plants and deathclaws, mobsters, porn stars, etc.
I said the game is unfinished because they ran out of time and had to cut and also not implement a lot of planned content and instead had to fill it up with unplanned material at the last minute.
I never said that unfinished game equals to BAD GAME! . I even prefer Fallout 2 to Fallout 1 and New Vegas, and always said I did. It's no secret around here. I play the damn game every year since I first got it (back in 199*), it's my favorite game on PC ever. :confused:

I really think you misunderstood my posts here, I'm not saying that Fallout 2 is bad because it's unfinished, I'm saying that despite being unfinished, it's pretty good (the best for me). Isn't that the point of this thread? :dance:
alec said:
As for the interviews: everyone always looks for a scapegoat. 'We wanted to make the bestest game ever, but we only had 1 week, boohoohoo.' 'We were planning a much bigger game, but then the publisher took away half of our budget and half of our wages, so all we could come up with was drivel and jokes.'
Reality is that Fallout 2 was well-received when it hit the shelves. The bugs and the fact that it looked too much like the first game were the main criticisms. No one whined about 'empty' houses and maps because it's a post-apocalyptic world, so you'd fucking expect such maps. I can't remember people whining about Chuck Stodgers or Tin Man or Keeng Ra'at back then because we were smart enough to consider those to be ... jokes and references. Even more so because postmodernism was huge during the late nineties and practically everything made for entertainment was full of references. Ever seen this cartoon called The Simpsons? It used to be really big. It also referenced the most bizarre things in pretty much all of its episodes. I guess it must be forgotten now because jokes and references fucked up the plotlines. But back then, you'd watch it and every so often you'd say: "O man, that's a reference to this or that!" and you'd feel good about yourself for having figured that out.
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Again, this has nothing to do with what I posted. Like, at all.
I never complained about any of those things you talk about... So I'm not sure where you're coming from. Again, what I wrote just before this quote applies here too. You really misunderstood in a very weird way my posts in this thread.

:roll:

alec said:
We will have to agree to disagree. It's pointless to try to change my mind about some of the best games ever made for pc.
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But I don't disagree. :rofl: That's the thing, you seem to disagree with the opposite of what I think. Which is that those games I posted in this thread are great. They are all some of my favorite games that I play regularly (apart from Xenogears, haven't played that one in ages). Are Fallout New Vegas or KotORII (or all the other games I mentioned) bad games because they're unfinished? NOT AT ALL. But they're still unfinished and we all know that, just as we all know they are GREAT. They all had problems that prevented them from finishing the game that they were developing and had to wrap them up before they wanted to.
 
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Eye Of The Beholder

As I understand it, for the DOS version, they simply left the ending off the disk, assuming that not enough people would make it all the way to the end.

EoB rather notoriously drops the player back to the DOS prompt (with a pitiful parting text message) as soon as you kill the Beholder; but the ending exists on the Amiga platform.
 
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