I want to talk about the 5mm ammo. The kind that goes in miniguns and the original assault rifle. What is it, why is it? Was it supposed to be 5.56mm NATO and Bethesda dropped the ball? But then why have both .223 FMJ and 7.62 NATO as well? Please someone help me!
5mm
- Thread starter nukepunk
- Start date
I suppose the 5mm is really 5.56mm, but I wouldn't stress over it, the game has plenty of holes if you look close enough. 
I remember there's a related thread long time ago. Personally I suppose the devs might take Russian 5.45mm for some kind of a reference, since in FO1 the two 5mm weapons have reference to Russian/East European somehow. Or maybe some cartridge smaller/lighter than .223/5.56mm. Don't know if .20 (5mm) varmint wildcat cartridges started being popular in mid '90 during FO1 development though. I hope we can get some more information about weapons/ammo design from Chris Taylor or other devs.
WillisPDunlevey
Mildly Dipped
http://www.6mmbr.com/20caliber.html
http://www.angelfire.com/sd/6mmackley/twentycaliber.html
Here is a .20 caliber AR-15. 3200 FPS
http://vha.activeboard.com/t44480363/new-20-on-the-block/
.20 cal rounds in AR-15 mag (5.56 brass can be resized to 5mm)
http://www.angelfire.com/sd/6mmackley/twentycaliber.html
Here is a .20 caliber AR-15. 3200 FPS
http://vha.activeboard.com/t44480363/new-20-on-the-block/
I, for one, always thought about how 5mm/.223 rounds would be incredibly tiny. I have no idea why any real life guns use such insignificantly small ammo. Especially the .223. I mean, they're alright for a hunting rifle. But a goddamn sniper rifle, firing rounds not much larger than what legally constitutes a "firearm bullet" in many areas?!
WillisPDunlevey
Mildly Dipped
SealyStar said:
the .20 caliber bullets I linked to in an earlier post can reach 4000 fps.
At close range with steel or tungsten cores, they will penetrate armor pretty well (especially from a mini gun). They also have such a small cross section it helps them to penetrate armor.
A .22 magnum pistol round would penetrate a early gen Kevlar helmet when a 9mm, 45, 357 etc would not. The .22 mag was a fast and small bullet.
As for the sniper rifle, it specifically said in the description it was rechambered from .308 the the "more common" .223, and I agree it's a stupid move. If you include .223 and .308, .223 should be the assault round and .308 the sniper round, not the other way around. Which brings us back to the 5mm. What's up with 5mm?
SealyStar said:
Assault rifles fire medium sized bullets. Bigger than a pistol round, smaller than a Rifle round. When the US went from the M-14 Battle Rifle to the AR M16 assault rifle, a boonie rat could carry twice the ammo or better for the same weight. Something like that at least.
The problem is, .204 Ruger wasn't invented yet during FO1 development (2004 vs 1995~97), so saying Fallout's 5mm is derived from (or taking reference on) .204 Ruger didn't make much sense.nukepunk said:
EDIT: Just thought another possible candidate: 4.85mm British experimental ammo (actual bullet diameter 5mm) in the NATO trials of the 1970's. Coincidentally, FO2's XL70E3 loaded with 5mm, just like XL70 in real life loaded with 4.85mm.
People read too much into the weapons from the original Fallouts. The guys that made the game weren't gun experts. They through in all sorts of weapons, often based on things they had seen in movies (Minigun - Predator. .223 Pistol - Bladerunner), or comics (10mm Pistol), or weapons they just plain liked (Desert Eagle!). There was very little rhyme or rhythm to it. Adding more modern/recent weapons had just mudded the waters even more...but people like guns. The purists say the wastelands should have less guns, and less ammo.
WillisPDunlevey
Mildly Dipped
I think semantics of cartridge vs. bullet size, weight etc is being mixed about in this thread.
nukepunk said:
And one thread for every ammo type, really?
SealyStar said:
Did you even play Fallout 2? One of the coolest weapons in gaming history is a pistol that shoots rifle bullets. This is a sci-fi fantasy game. The gauss pistol, or rifle, being the most powerful small arms weapons in Fallout 2, fire a round that is super small and has massive penetration properties. What was it called? MFC? New thread for MFC now.
NovaRain said:
Okay, so it would be a blatant retcon. Any vocal objections? 5mm Gatling (I felt it needed a suffix but NATO seemed inappropriate, so why not a nod to a pioneer of rapid fire?) could be the Fallout world's version of 5.7x28mm.
Do not think what that means for the P90c.
Buxbaum666 said:
The people must be thorough...soon there will be new thread for very perk.
...and the P90c is a bullshit weapon for Fallout..Pixote. said:Buxbaum666 said:
The people must be thorough...soon there will be new thread for very perk.
What are you talking about? Do you mean that it's bullshit from a thematic/aesthetic viewpoint (being too modern/futuristic), which I agree with, or from an in-game stats viewpoint, which I disagree with entirely?
It blew people into chunks beautifully, but the setting was wrong IMO. Mind you I always gave one to Sulik and let him go berserk.
.Pixote. said:
me and a friend often "daydreamed" of this, a complete fallout type world, but without the fantastical creatures (ghouls, mutants, monsters) and without all the available guns.
always reflecting to how it is presented in old "road warrior", with the one defunct shotgun shell, and otherwise total 4 rounds fired in the whole movie - not to mention people using bows, crossbows and such weapons instead.
come to think of it, it is strange that there isnt a single bow in the entire wasteland :I