Belgium To Intoxicate Its Schoolchildren

[Sander]

That link to some Amazon book will not load...

Drawing on his experience as a parent and as a creator of children's cartoons, as well as interviews with dozens of psychologists and educators, Jones forcefully argues that violent video games, movies, music and comics provide a safe fantasy world within which children learn to become familiar with and control the frightening emotions of anger, violence and sexuality. He debunks studies linking violent media with violence in society and argues that children clearly understand the difference between pretend and reality.

So your 'evidence' is no more than some random dudes opinion?

Just shut up before you give everyone but you a brain hemorrhage.
For fuck's sake, man, that man has done research and has argumentatively founded his opinion, which means it's an *educated* opinion. Since you're just a random dude with the completely unfounded opinion that 'violent play is bad, mkay' (which is disturbingly like Ned Flanders) you must be, of course, right!
Oh, by the way, you're the one who wants swords to be abolished (changing the status quo) so the burden of proof lies with you. Go get some proof.

But a fake weapon can be used as a real weapon to *vent* there anger, then that fake weapon can be replaced by a real weapon...
If any human being becomes accustomed to behaviour then they do it more and more and quickly become obsessive, not the other way around.

*blinks*
Where have you been living, a box in the middle of the ocean? Do you look around? All of the people you see on the street have done those violent, evil games in their youth, and are not any worse off for it. In fact, they've gotten better because they have learned how to*safely* control these emotions and vent them without having to harm people. It's the reason why some people take up sports or other hobbies.

 

[KQX]

That link to some Amazon book will not load...

Hmm, works for me. I'll double check.

So your 'evidence' is no more than some random dudes opinion?

As opposed to your random opinions? Actually the book acts as a collection of many studies on pretend violence and children. How about actually reading what you just quoted:

...interviews with dozens of psychologists and educators...

The book even cites many studies that appear to support your lines of reasoning, and points out their faulty analysis and shortcomings.

 

[Richoid]

Ok, you want evidence?
Here is a discusion on the issue http://salmon.psy.plym.ac.uk/year1/inttopic/yr1int.htm

And here is evidence from parents who have experienced i first hand
http://parentcenter.babycenter.com/comments/73147?i=20

Who is Ned Flanders? that religious guy of the Simpsons?

Where have you been living, a box in the middle of the ocean? Do you look around? All of the people you see on the street have done those violent, evil games in their youth, and are not any worse off for it. In fact, they've gotten better because they have learned how to*safely* control these emotions and vent them without having to harm people. It's the reason why some people take up sports or other hobbies.

Yes but some of them will become murderers because of this, im not saying the majority will...

 

[DirtyDreamDesigner]

Nice arguments, Richoid: A discussion that has absolutely no relevance to the topic and a paranoid american parent watchdog group (where, again, the arguments for banning gun toys are idiotic and irrelevant).

 

[Sander]

Ok, you want evidence?
Here is a discusion on the issue http://salmon.psy.plym.ac.uk/year1/inttopic/yr1int.htm

Eh?
There's only one sentence on that page referring to it, and it's a question. If that's your definition of evidence, you, sir, need to get some proper education. On any kind of level, since it seems you failed elementary school 'comprehensive reading' as well.
Here's that one sentence on the page:

Does playing with war toys make children violent and is there evidence to support this?

The rest of the page discusses agression in general and gender-related differences in violent behaviour.

And here is evidence from parents who have experienced i first hand
http://parentcenter.babycenter.com/comments/73147?i=20

No, it's an example of what happens if you let loaded firearms fall in the hands of eight-year-olds, since eight-year-olds don't know how to properly handle guns, and in some cases don't know what a gun can do to a man, yet.
The reason that this doesn't matter is because they learn the difference when they're a bit older (unless you're so overprotective that you don't ever let them near anything resembling a gun), and by the time they get access to guns they know full-well what those can do. Unless the parent was a moron and left the loaded gun to be found by a small child.
By the way, these are also just opinions of random people, on both sides of the argument as well. Much worse than an educated study of the subject, as KQX provided you with.

Who is Ned Flanders? that religious guy of the Simpsons?

Yes, the one who's overly protective of his children.

Yes but some of them will become murderers because of this, im not saying the majority will...

Ah yes, some people will become murderers because they once played with a fake gun.

 

[Richoid]

No, it's an example of what happens if you let loaded firearms fall in the hands of eight-year-olds, since eight-year-olds don't know how to properly handle guns, and in some cases don't know what a gun can do to a man, yet.
The reason that this doesn't matter is because they learn the difference when they're a bit older (unless you're so overprotective that you don't ever let them near anything resembling a gun), and by the time they get access to guns they know full-well what those can do. Unless the parent was a moron and left the loaded gun to be found by a small child.
By the way, these are also just opinions of random people, on both sides of the argument as well. Much worse than an educated study of the subject, as KQX provided you with.

Yes but what im saying is that toy guns lead to acts like these. if you tell a child a plug socket is dangerous and they wont put their fingers in it but if you let them play with it then they will electricute themselves.

By the way, these are also just opinions of random people, on both sides of the argument as well. Much worse than an educated study of the subject, as KQX provided you with.

Educated by whos standards?

Ah yes, some people will become murderers because they once played with a fake gun.

So after all that you do agree with me?

 

[Ratty Sr.]

Ok, you want evidence?
Here is a discusion on the issue http://salmon.psy.plym.ac.uk/year1/inttopic/yr1int.htm

And here is evidence from parents who have experienced i first hand
http://parentcenter.babycenter.com/comments/73147?i=20

Holy shit, you have the debate skills of a nine-year-old. Please tell me you aren't trying to rebut to a book written by experts with a random link to a discussion list that addresses absolutely nothing and another random link to a collection of comments made by Internet anonymi who are no more qualified authorities in the field of children psychology than you or Sander.

 

[Sander]

Yes but what im saying is that toy guns lead to acts like these. if you tell a child a plug socket is dangerous and they wont put their fingers in it but if you let them play with it then they will electricute themselves.

Hah, that doesn't work. Telling children not to do something because it's dangerous in most cases leads to them trying it anyway. The infamous 'hot stove' technique.
Also, you were using this as evidence. It isn't. Come up with some real evidence.

Educated by whos standards?

Graduated psychologists are educated by definition.

So after all that you do agree with me?

What? Is your sense of sarcasm as underdeveloped as your education?
You're a Brit. Sarcasm is an important part of British humour. Fuck.

 

[Ratty Sr.]

Yes but what im saying is that toy guns lead to acts like these. if you tell a child a plug socket is dangerous and they wont put their fingers in it but if you let them play with it then they will electricute themselves.

Worst analogy ever. We are talking about letting children play with *plastic* guns, not real ones.

Educated by whos standards?

By standards of respected educational institutions where they got their PhDs, Captain Clueless. When you manage to graduate out of middle school maybe you will have an idea what that means. Not much chance of that happening, though.

So after all that you do agree with me?

He was being sarcastic, Einstein.

 

[Richoid]

What? Is your sense of sarcasm as underdeveloped as your education?
You're a Brit. Sarcasm is an important part of British humour. Fuck.

Thats sort of ironic as i was also being sarcastic, its fairly obvious as you have posted severaly pages of disagreement about the topic, also im not a Brit i just live in Britain.

Graduated psychologists are educated by definition.

But it does not mention graduated psychologists at all...

Hah, that doesn't work. Telling children not to do something because it's dangerous in most cases leads to them trying it anyway. The infamous 'hot stove' technique.

So how come children do not electricute themselves?

 

[Wooz]

Hahahahahahahah. Damn.

 

[Sander]

Thats sort of ironic as i was also being sarcastic, its fairly obvious as you have posted severaly pages of disagreement about the topic, also im not a Brit i just live in Britain.

One point of sarcasm is that it also needs to serve a purpose and be somewhat detectable when written. Considering the level of the rest of your posts and the context, your use of it is neither.

But it does not mention graduated psychologists at all...

Again, reading comprehension.
Here we go: "...interviews with dozens of psychologists and educators..."
I don't see anyone who's graduated, no sirree. Not at all.

So how come children do not electricute themselves?

Because parents place those nice protectors over power outlets, and I've yet to see the first child who could actually fit their fingers in both holes at the same time and far enough in to get any form of electrical shock.
Children do burn their hands on the stove or other hot things even when they're told that it will hurt them, though.

 

[Richoid]

One point of sarcasm is that it also needs to serve a purpose and be somewhat detectable when written. Considering the level of the rest of your posts and the context, your use of it is neither.

As i have already explained, it is hard to choose on the internet.

Again, reading comprehension.
Here we go: "...interviews with dozens of psychologists and educators..."
I don't see anyone who's graduated, no sirree. Not at all.

And your point is? That has nothing to do with anything, i mearly pointed out that they had no graduated phycologists and you quote about them...

Because parents place those nice protectors over power outlets, and I've yet to see the first child who could actually fit their fingers in both holes at the same time and far enough in to get any form of electrical shock.
Children do burn their hands on the stove or other hot things even when they're told that it will hurt them, though.

If childrens fingers cannot fit into power outlets then what is the point in those protectors?

 

[Jebus]

Are you really this dense?

And your point is? That has nothing to do with anything, i mearly pointed out that they had no graduated phycologists and you quote about them...

The fact that you cannot even spell 'psychologists' is pretty funny in the current context.

Or wait - is this your unique blend of sarcasm again?

And, it has everything to do with everything. You say that that book offers no professional ('educated') views, yet the description Sander posted two times now clearly states that the book was, at least in a large part, based on interviews with psychologists and educators. You seem to be greatly missing the point here.

If childrens fingers cannot fit into power outlets then what is the point in those protectors?

Do you even speak English?

I personally haven't seen a single socket in my entire life (in a finished building) without a protector. That doesn't stop kids from trying, though - but the only way they could possibly get electrocuted would be if they were to insert a metal spike in each hole at the same time, something that would probably be over the head of many toddlers.

Anyway, you're just stuttering and convulsing now. If you can't present any decent arguments, just shut the fuck up and get the hell out of here.

 

[Sander]

As i have already explained, it is hard to choose on the internet.

...
Classic.
And explained? Where? In that invisible post?

And your point is? That has nothing to do with anything, i mearly pointed out that they had no graduated phycologists and you quote about them...

You can only call someone a psychologist when they're graduated, otherwise they're *studying* to be psychologists, they aren't psychologists.
Could you be any more clueless?
Oh, and then they also talked about educators. People who educate, and hence are educated themselves.

If childrens fingers cannot fit into power outlets then what is the point in those protectors?

See this word: comprehension. Study it. Learn it's meaning. Then learn it. The come back.

 

[Ratty Sr.]

I personally haven't seen a single socket in my entire life (in a finished building) without a protector.

It's funny that I haven't seen a single socket in my entire life *with* a protector. Third World for the win.

And yes, I used to stick my little fingers into sockets simply despite my parents' pleas. And no, Richoid, I never got electrocuted.

 

[Richoid]

But hey, in the same reasoning Fallout should be banned since it encourages violence and killing people.

No it does not encourage it, look at the atmosphere, it is the complete epitome of despair, it demonstrates that violence is BAD.

And explained? Where? In that invisible post?

The post where you spoke of sarcasm.

You can only call someone a psychologist when they're graduated, otherwise they're *studying* to be psychologists, they aren't psychologists.
Could you be any more clueless?
Oh, and then they also talked about educators. People who educate, and hence are educated themselves.

Yes, and? My point is it does not say anything about graduated psychologists.

 

[Sander]

No it does not encourage it, look at the atmoshphere, it is the complete epitomy of dispair, it demonstrates that violence is BAD.

What, by encouraging you to kill people for personal gain? Because the most rewarding route throught the game involves a lot of killing.

The post where you spoke of sarcasim.

What? You only said that you used sarcasm and that didn't get noticed. That's not the same as explaining that, and I quote, 'it is hard to choose on the internet.'

Yes, and? My point is it does not say anything about graduated phychologists.

No, you're right, the word graduated doesn't get used. But any time a person is called a psychologist it means they've graduated, because otherwise they aren't a psychologist, just someone studying to be one.

 

[Jebus]

I personally haven't seen a single socket in my entire life (in a finished building) without a protector.

It's funny that I haven't seen a single socket in my entire life *with* a protector. Third World for the win.

What? Dude, that's amazing.

Are you janking my chain?

 

[Richoid]

What, by encouraging you to kill people for personal gain? Because the most rewarding route throught the game involves a lot of killing.

Yes, and what happens to the vault dweller at the end? is he happy? exactly, it discourages evils.