Classic Fallout Games has better characters

Discussion in 'General Fallout Discussion' started by Negativity, Nov 3, 2018.

  1. Negativity

    Negativity Take a dirt nap

    125
    Oct 19, 2017
    I recently created a video with my opinions on the best Fallout characters, and discovered all of them were from the original Fallout games.



    It's clear that the classic Fallout games had far superior writing, so i guess my question is, why aren't there any really good memorable characters from the new fallout games?
     
  2. Norzan

    Norzan Vault Fossil

    Apr 7, 2017
    New Vegas had too many for me to not remember. I'd argue some of them were better than some from the first two games.

    Same for writing, can't really agree with the first two Fallout games having far superior writing. I'd argue as well that the writing is better in several places compared to Fallout 2 and in some cases Fallout 1, or at least in the same level.

    Bethesda Fallouts do have really have no memorable characters, except for a few.
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 4
  3. Hulk'O'Saurus

    Hulk'O'Saurus Still Mildly Glowing

    264
    Jul 10, 2018
    Was just talking with a mate of mine about the latest Diablo and the like/dislike ratio of the trailer on utub. We rambled on for a bit, and ended with the conclusion that bigger companies generally make less visionary games. Although they may end up having more polished gameplay, it usually is devoid of memorable, unique and meaningful events/quests/writing/characters/mechanics. They aim, instead, for not rocking the boat.

    In short, the bigger/older the company, the more likely the game won't be exceptional or memorable. There has been exceptions, but the general rule seems to stand.
     
  4. Negativity

    Negativity Take a dirt nap

    125
    Oct 19, 2017
    I suppose that's true somewhat, however some companies like rockstar and nintendo are making bigger and better games. I think that rule does stand though.
     
  5. Gizmojunk

    Gizmojunk Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Nov 26, 2007
    The more detail that you add, and the bigger your audience, the more likely you are to offend, or have it fly over their heads.
     
  6. NMLevesque

    NMLevesque Commie Ghost

    618
    Jul 2, 2016
    Bethesda doesn't test things out as a pen & paper game, nor do they hire actual writers. As best I can tell they have some kind of severe allergy to originality.

    As for big companies, I disagree. All they do is push the cinematic envelope further than anyone else, and that's it really. The actual gameplay can be laughably bad.
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 1
  7. Gizmojunk

    Gizmojunk Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Nov 26, 2007
    I honestly believe that this is a business tactic, and not the result of incompetence. As bad as their games are [to us], one cannot deny that they usually sell exceedingly well, and consistently so. :( I think that they ruined Fallout merely to follow procedure; knowing that a great Fallout game would not sell as well as the food-court mush they usually sell... and it would seem they were right. :(

    I think that FO4 was a misstep for them, but still a step that was squarely on their path of reductive gaming; and won't deter them from staying their course.

     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2018
  8. SiriusShenanigans

    SiriusShenanigans Those who write on Heaven’s walls...

    96
    Jun 27, 2018
    Bethesda seems to hire people who are out and around places here in Maryland. There are pretty much no other major video game making companies in Maryland, so they are definitely not picking up the best and the brightest in the industry. They just get people who can vaguely write what they want, but it doesn't excuse them from not having standards.

    I would say that even fallout New Vegas lacks the strength of characters that 1 and 2 had. Can I tell you anything about anybody on the strip who isn't Benny or Mr.House or the Kings? Probably not. Could I tell you about any given citizen in the town of Gecko? Heck yeah!
     
  9. Cobra Commander

    Cobra Commander Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    972
    Dec 6, 2016
    I can tell A LOT about the people there. Cachino is a psycho that like to beat women. Joana the prostitute is his favorite girl and she is in love with Carlito, a former Omerta hidding in Vault 21, a hotel run by Sarah, the blonde girl that will give you access to her pussy if you bring enough vault suits to her. She is sister of Michael Angelo, who thinks Mr. House will send killers behind him. In front of hisofficer you will find the NCR embassy, with Ambassador Crocker and that bitch Captain Papas. She have a spy in the Gomorrah, who is trying to figure out the plans of Big Sal and Nero, who secretly forged an alliance with the Legion....

    and so go on :)
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 2
  10. SquidVan

    SquidVan Pirate and Bankrobber oTO Orderite

    Jun 1, 2018
    Bethesda isn't incompetent they just sell to the largest audience possible. People don't want to roll dice in games now and whatnot. Like I've said, I don't hate Skyrim. I hate it as a RPG, but it's a decent mod-capable sandbox at best.
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 1
  11. Gizmojunk

    Gizmojunk Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Nov 26, 2007
    ...And that's because they don't like to be told, 'No'—but that's what RPGs do; they evaluate when to say, "No".
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 1
  12. Vostyok

    Vostyok First time out of the vault

    38
    Oct 16, 2018
    I think we project a lot of personality onto characters in Fallout 1/2. A lot of them we don't even get to see their faces. Compare Ian (long hair, biker leathers, loves chems but wary of the stronger stuff, doesn't mind shooting people in the back). Not much else to go on with him, since he only gets a couple dozen lines of dialogue, if that. Sulik, Marcus, Vic, Tycho, et al, they all have interesting backstories, at least some of it. But then they don't really have much in the way of character development aside from their introductions, apart from a line here or there in specific circumstances.

    MacCready, in comparison, has loads of dialogue, opens up more as you travel, opens up even more as you complete his quests (two of them, not counting his stuff in FO3 in lamplight) has a unique outfit and choice dialogue in certain events and conversations with others. And it's nice to see a returning character, even if they brush over the history with Little Lamplight and big-town (what a shithole).

    So... I'm not sure about your points about the characters in comparison. FO3 of course they were just window dressing for the most part, especially your robot/baggage cart companions, but then they did have to worry about modelling a million different faces, outfits and voice acting. I can't remember many characters from the old Daggerfall game, for instance.

    Writing has definately seen a big drop there, I do agree with that. Bethesda don't seem to like following up quests with satisfying endings. It's okay if they end abruptly, and then you get some resolution to them later, but you frequently do not. A lot of the Oblivion and Skyrim stuff ended like this: Quest - resolution - "thanks" - never mentioned ever again. Sandbox crap for sandbox gamers.

    Oh, and New Vegas characters were awesome. Getting Veronica her prom dress (please ignore the bloodstains, hon', they'll wash out) and her reaction squeal was an epic moment that gave me man-proud for all time.
     
  13. sadman

    sadman First time out of the vault

    3
    Oct 29, 2018
    I agree with the Master, and maybe Horrigan. But really the overseer made the list of all things even if were just going with only classic fallout games. How are you going to skip my man, Marcus?

    and if were counting all fallout games i think any of these easily can claim spot 1-5.

    Boone, Arcade, Mr. house, ceaser, cass, vulpis, Dr. mobuis, dean, Christine, The King, veronica, strong, Hancock, or valentine. The only mainline fallout game where I cant even remember a single character from is 3
     
  14. SiriusShenanigans

    SiriusShenanigans Those who write on Heaven’s walls...

    96
    Jun 27, 2018
    Here is the thing though, while I have a vague memory of some of these characters, I just simply don't care about them. They are so simple and generic that I don't feel like I would be missing out if I didn't run into them or talked to them. Fallout 2 has characters like that one bartender who scams children out of valuable cards from the Tragic The Garnering card game and gets you hooked on the addictive game as well. Or the doctor named "Doc Painless" because...well, it's mostly a joke around here, or the poor lady who just cries and wails at you about her lost cat until the game feels bad enough for you that it gives you like ... 200 exp, or even the restarant owner who declares herself as your mom and sends you on errands. They have such interesting quirks and features I can't forget them. I just couldn't care about any of the boring npcs of the strip.
     
  15. Cobra Commander

    Cobra Commander Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    972
    Dec 6, 2016
    really? it's a shame to hear that, one less Fallout for you to enjoy, then.
     
  16. Octavian

    Octavian It Wandered In From the Wastes

    127
    Jun 16, 2018
    Maybe overall but imo there are some really good characters in the newer games.
    3: Butch, Col Autumn
    Vegas: Caesar, House, Benny, the King, Hanlon, all 3 DM companions, Mobius, all of the human companions but Arcade, Raul, even EDE kinda
    4: Nick (but Nick is great, probably my favorite companion in all of fallout, mostly because of the way he is used IN the story)
     
  17. naossano

    naossano So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Oct 19, 2006
    Beth have no writing process. They make some outline and the dev just go along with it.
     
  18. SquidVan

    SquidVan Pirate and Bankrobber oTO Orderite

    Jun 1, 2018
    Exactly a part of the appeal of RPGs to me is fucking up and sometimes doing something spectacular. Both things should be just as plausible. You should be able to do just enough, a critical fail, a critical success, all of it. Not that silly VATS press a button critical hit meter.
     
  19. NMLevesque

    NMLevesque Commie Ghost

    618
    Jul 2, 2016
    That sounds more like a matter of your personal taste than the actual difference in writing.
     
  20. SiriusShenanigans

    SiriusShenanigans Those who write on Heaven’s walls...

    96
    Jun 27, 2018
    Yes, there is a certain amount of taste to it, but the way I see it is that New Vegas plays a lot of their characters straight and doesn't do anything interesting with them. Big Sal works in Gomorrah. Pretty much anybody there looks like they would take drugs and beat women. Its also the kind of location where they just look like they would support the legion from the get-go. There is no nuance to speak of. Stuff like Joana being a prostitute with a heart of gold is another tired trope that I've seen before and have come to expect. Meanwhile, I find that characters like the bartender in gecko have no reason to be playing tragic the gathering, but it becomes an aspect of their character rather than yet another feather in an established trope or a feature of the environment that he comes from. Sometimes having the environment affect the area is nice, but it should be done in interesting ways. There needs to be intrigue and upset, and I find more often than not, New Vegas is in the business of straightforward storytelling. I get frustrated with how characters don't seem to have life in them, or only on occasion. It feels like it is a story where factions dictate the outcomes of things and not by the individuals that make up those factions. The Omerta's obviously side with the legion. The White Glove are obviously cannibals. The Chairmen are obviously going to try to use the chip they shot you in the head to get.