Draft

Albatross

Still Mildly Glowing
Pending Draft Legislation Targeted for Spring 2005
The Draft will Start in June 2005

There is pending legislation in the House and Senate (twin bills: S 89 and HR 163) which will time the program's initiation so the draft can begin at early as Spring 2005 -- just after the 2004 presidential election. The administration is quietly trying to get these bills passed now, while the public's attention is on the elections, so our action on this is needed immediately.

$28 million has been added to the 2004 Selective Service System (SSS) budget to prepare for a military draft that could start as early as June 15, 2005. Selective Service must report to Bush on March 31, 2005 that the system, which has lain dormant for decades, is ready for activation. Please see website: www.sss.gov/perfplan_fy2004.html to view the sss annual performance plan - fiscal year 2004.

The pentagon has quietly begun a public campaign to fill all 10,350 draft board positions and 11,070 appeals board slots nationwide.. Though this is an unpopular election year topic, military experts and influential members of congress are suggesting that if Rumsfeld's prediction of a "long, hard slog" in Iraq and Afghanistan [and a permanent state of war on "terrorism"] proves accurate, the U.S. may have no choice but to draft.

Congress brought twin bills, S. 89 and HR 163 forward this year, http://www.hslda.org/legislation/na...s89/default.asp entitled the Universal National Service Act of 2003, "to provide for the common defense by requiring that all young persons [age 18--26] in the United States, including women, perform a period of military service or a period of civilian service in furtherance of the national defense and homeland security, and for other purposes." These active bills currently sit in the committee on armed services.

Dodging the draft will be more difficult than those from the Vietnam era.

College and Canada will not be options. In December 2001, Canada and the U.S. signed a "smart border declaration," which could be used to keep would-be draft dodgers in. Signed by Canada's minister of foreign affairs, John Manley, and U.S. Homeland Security director, Tom Ridge, the declaration involves a 30-point plan which implements, among other things, a "pre-clearance agreement" of people entering and departing each country. Reforms aimed at making the draft more equitable along gender and class lines also eliminates higher education as a shelter. Underclassmen would only be able to postpone service until the end of their current semester. Seniors would have until the end of the academic year.

Even those voters who currently support US actions abroad may still object to this move, knowing their own children or grandchildren will not have a say about whether to fight. Not that it should make a difference, but this plan, among other things, eliminates higher education as a
shelter and includes women in the draft.

The public has a right to air their opinions about such an important decision.

Please send this on to all the friends, parents, aunts and uncles, grandparents, and cousins that you know. Let your children know too -- it's their future, and they can be a powerful voice for change!

Please also contact your representatives to ask them why they aren't telling their constituents about these bills -- and contact newspapers and other media outlets to ask them why they're not covering this important story.
 
Doubt it'll happen.

If it does, however, I'll probably be drafted because I'll be 18 and not in school. Goddamnit.
 
To be blunt, fuck that. I can see compulsory military service in someplace like Israel, where you really are surrounded on all sides by enemies, but if this government thinks that instituting a draft for a needless "conflict" which every day seems more and more like Vietnam is going to fly with anyone they're crazy. I've never been political in my life, but if this looks like it's close to passing I'll be out in the streets protesting.
 
If this passes every soldier currently serving in the US armed forces will be pissed as hell.

I'll be damned if i'm going to be serving next to someone who's only here because it was a choice between the draft and jail... That shit gets soldiers killed.
 
Fuck, if that's legit there will be a shit-storm.

There is a big difference between sending a professional volunteer army abroad and sending conscripts. Based on those rules..... damn.

I know a number of reservists who are pissed off and scared about going. Can you imagine conscripts?
 
One of your links is dead...

Is it just me or just this seem like a chain letter that got posted?
 
What people seem to forget...we didn't bring this war on terror to be, we didn't ask for the fight, we didn't want lives to be lost, and through good and bad times, people seem to forget that. IMHO...it's either draftees or nukes...I'm not saying I prefer either...just that one or both will be used someday to fight this war.
 
I've heard about this somewhere, somehow. It's a bad thing of course, not being able to choose whether you want to fight or not, but I'm afraid that this will be a worldwide trend pretty soon. Conscripts are dead-cheap and expendable, since there's a large stock to pick from. And don't forget that this is the easiest way to solve unemployment and a weak economy.
If this goes through, Europe will eventually follow, methinks. I don't have a lot to worry about (I'm getting too old for these games), but it'll be a sad change, nonetheless. My sister's kid could one day be next, for instance. Or my imaginary offspring. Jeez...

War? War never changes, eh? :roll:
 
Blade Runner said:
If this goes through, Europe will eventually follow, methinks.

lol nfw (for belgium @ least)

we just "reformed" our army (army? if you can call it that...)
they started up a new reservist program and such (weekend warriorstyle)

pretty useless since we are only good at doing 2 things: clearing mines (both land and sea) and heavy airtransport (including extremely low altitude C130 Hercules drops)

but we will NEVER draft people
 
SuAside said:
but we will NEVER draft people

Only time will tell. We used to draft people just like any other country (yeah, I'm a fellow Belgian!). I hate to think it would change again, but these are strange and dangerous times, SuAside.

On a sidenote: our army stinks at everything they do. Our equipment is way too old, the average age of a soldier is like 40 or something, our uniforms look like crap, ... Pfff. Glad I never had to go to the Army. I would have felt ashamed. :wink:
 
Paladin Solo said:
What people seem to forget...we didn't bring this war on terror to be, we didn't ask for the fight, we didn't want lives to be lost, and through good and bad times, people seem to forget that. IMHO...it's either draftees or nukes...I'm not saying I prefer either...just that one or both will be used someday to fight this war.

So, what exactly does the war on terror have to with Iraq?
 
Paladin Solo said:
What people seem to forget...we didn't bring this war on terror to be, we didn't ask for the fight, we didn't want lives to be lost, and through good and bad times, people seem to forget that.

Yes we did, if by "we" you mean the government. Tell me again what Iraq had to do with the world trade center? Oh wait, that's right, they didn't have anything to do with it.

And as Elissar said, this is bad for the soldiers we already have. What happens when you draft some guy who has no desire to be anywhere near a war, has no competence as a leader or a soldier, yet is forced to be in be in the army? You eventually get soldiers and officers that endanger the lives of those around them with their incompetence and get fragged. Any of you whose fathers have been in Vietnam, ask them about it sometime, see what a brilliant idea drafting people for a war that has nothing to do with defending the US is.
 
Not to even mention the economic impact of the military swelling its ranks with people that have to be paid, fed, equipped, trained, etc...
Where is the gov going to get the money for that? Or the extra administrators needed to keep logistics smooth?
 
The rich college boys can stop it. They always get away from such unfair duties (if they have the right parents).

It seems like an extreme and dangerous move to me that would not be good at all for public sentiment and international reputation. Is conscription really needed to supply cadets, even if it is neccessary to have such a large military build up? How popular is a career in the miitary in the US? It seems drastic to cause so much political conflict just to get some reluctant and probably poor quality 'potential' soldiers.
 
I think the draft is a great idea. It will give our generation the incentive to go out and vote. In addition it will allow everyone who thinks that the war on terror is a great thing, as long as someone else is fighting it a chance to put their ass where their mouth is, so to speak.

So what specialty are you planning on doing PS when you get drafted? Mouthpiece?

-Murdoch, who turns 26 on Feb 8, 2005.
 
I actively disagree with this war, so it is possible for me to get out of it.

btw, looked it up:

http://www.congress.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d108:S.89:

We should be fine. It was a bill that came into play last year... the other bill at the beginning of the year. They were both passed down to a subcommittee, and haven't been looked at in over a year. Just another scare.

ALSO: you gave a link to the SSS page... but if anyone went to the homepage..
http://www.sss.gov/Default.htm
Notwithstanding recent stories in the news media and on the Internet, Selective Service is not getting ready to conduct a draft for the U.S. Armed Forces -- either with a special skills or regular draft. Rather, the Agency remains prepared to manage a draft if and when the President and the Congress so direct. This responsibility has been ongoing since 1980 and is nothing new. Further, both the President and the Secretary of Defense have stated on more than one occasion that there is no need for a draft for the War on Terrorism or any likely contingency, such as Iraq. Additionally, the Congress has not acted on any proposed legislation to reinstate a draft. Therefore, Selective Service continues to refine its plans to be prepared as is required by law, and to register young men who are ages 18 through 25.

You see? It really is a chainmail type deal.
 
Albatross said:
College and Canada will not be options. In December 2001, Canada and the U.S. signed a "smart border declaration," which could be used to keep would-be draft dodgers in. Signed by Canada's minister of foreign affairs, John Manley, and U.S. Homeland Security director, Tom Ridge, the declaration involves a 30-point plan which implements, among other things, a "pre-clearance agreement" of people entering and departing each country. Reforms aimed at making the draft more equitable along gender and class lines also eliminates higher education as a shelter. Underclassmen would only be able to postpone service until the end of their current semester. Seniors would have until the end of the academic year.

Fuck that. I was born with a dual American-Canadian citizenship. I was born and raised in Wiscosin, but I've been going to university in Canada for two years already with another 3-4 more years to go there.

True, I don't need to worry about the draft because of my hearing loss in the first place, but if I didn't have that would I still be forced to serve in the draft even though I'm not some guy who JUST ran away to Canada or joined up at a university?
 
The thing you need to understand about this is that it is worse than a draft. If this passes then everyone between the ages of 18 and 26 have to perform two years of military or civilian service. No ways out. No medical excuses, No religious or belief objections, and no college or other job during that time. And this includes people residing in the US that are not legal citizens and leaves who these people are entirely up to the president.

The bills are

http://congress.org/congressorg/bill.xc?billnum=S.89&congress=108#summary

and

http://congress.org/congressorg/bill.xc?billnum=H.R.163&congress=108

I did my research before posting it.

And most military personal I have seen talking about this do not want this, if anyone was wondering.[/url]
 
Ah, so it's military or civilian service.
So if you plead that you're deaf/physically disabled/pacifist/yellow, they'll have you cleaning the streets or something.
 
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