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Discussion in 'General Gaming and Hardware Forum' started by cronicler, May 10, 2009.
Perhaps DA is a big enough game for this kind of moment to be rare.
It's pretty funny (and sad) how people on gametrailers got blown away by this trailer. It's a work of art to those people.
graphics look really crap. and the trailer is ridiculous. but it might just be the case that this is how games have to be marketed these days.
I'm checking the forums once in a while and read the FAQ a few days ago and I'm excited about it. then again, I liked Mass Effect.
I guess I'm in a tiny minority, but I think 3D graphics fail compared to 2D. The technology just isn't there yet.
It was while playing the demo for World of Goo that I had the revelation. Unlike 3D, good 2D graphics are pleasing to look at.
Depends on the way it's used.
I agree that it's more usual for developers using 3D graphics to develop less inspired visuals, the generic brown/gray shitholes of most shooters for example, Killzone 2, Gears of War, CoD, etc.
But some games such as Killer7 and Viewtiful Joe are absolutely gorgeous, the same with Blizzard's games, they tend to focus more on the aesthetic and less on graphical prowess.
There's an obsession with using as much as possible, versus using what you need to develop a polished visual sense of cohesion.
If you go 3D, you're competing with all 3D whether you like it or not. That includes movie-quality 3D. That DA game trailer is even trying to look like a movie trailer. If you went to see a movie and it had graphics like DA, what would you think?
Not that it couldn't be good if the writing was good, but from a visual standpoint it's noticably crude.
Look at Crysis and TF2. Look at Zeno Clash and The Witcher.
Four radically different styles in 3D.
What's wrong with BioWare?
That's a pretty loaded question.
They make, in my personal view, fairly mediocre video games.
It's like the gaming industry as a whole anyways. Just kinda bland that's not quite good enough.
I'd throw in Okami as well as I'd say that it looked the best out of any 3D game I've ever played due to proper use of stylization (which it uses to mask, to a certain extent, hardware limitations). I agree that 3D still has a ways to go in video games but I disagree that it can't look better than 2D. That said, 2D graphics are way under utilized and, when used correctly, do tend to look better than 3D for certain genres (FPS games would be too much of a pain to do with 2D sprites to be worthwhile).
They've been remaking Baldur's Gate for the past 10 years. Actually NWN was decent/good once it was fully patched, though it could have been better. It was a game designed for online use and really shined when an amazing programmer fully utilized it's options (RedGolem of Abyss404). Granted, when customers get their hands on it and start creating their own content, it's not so much a testament to one's game making skills but rather one's engine, resource, and tool making skills.
Dragon Age looks like it's shaping up to be a good or even great Bioware game (I throw this trailer out as it shows no actual gameplay) but in the end, it's yet another Bioware game. If Bioware really wants to impress then they need to make a game that doesn't follow their formula.
well, I happen to like their formula. the problem as I see it is that they're constantly taking away parts of their formula, either skipping them completely or replacing them with simpler parts. since BG2, their games have only been stripped to the bone layer after layer.
to me Dragon Age seems like a game where they're trying to put some flesh back on those old bones. they might not succeed 100% but at least it's a step in the right direction.
I've never even heard of Dragon Age until I saw this trailer. It didn't really give a lasting impression.
Well, it just looks like more violent and aggressive than usual high fantasy thing with nothing particulary exceptional about it. Hopefully its just a bad trailer.
I would never say 3D can't look better than 2D, but I would say it doesn't look better as of now - especially in computer games. For now 3D is at it's best when it's used in a stylistic way rather than a realistic way, because that can conceal some of its shortcomings. When I look at that DA trailer I see herky-jerky, stilted movement, obvious synthetic joints in the character models with unconvicing ranges of motion, and generic poses for interaction between models (such as the notorious "gettin' busy" scene). It's simply not pleasing to the eye.
Really. Ever played COD4, Far Cry 2 or Crysis?
That's the issue though, they look better technically, but ultimately they're incredibly boring, Viewtiful Joe may not be as impressive with the level of its technology, but it's still superior aesthetically to something like Crysis which hardly tries to have interesting art design, even the alien ship levels were pretty drab.
2D can be just as awful, it isn't some holy grail of artistic design and animation. It can look very bland and generic and stiff. But that isn't 2Ds fault. Its the art designers fault, the animators fault, its just lazy developers.
Same thing applies to most criticism against 3d that i have seen in this thread.
Honestly, 3D well done canl look much better than 2D.
Same thing applies both ways.
I never supported either 2D or 3D, I just said that the artistic ability of developers and their ability to integrate it effectively into a game is more important than technically advanced effects saturating the game.
Hmm, I have to, sort of, agree on your view of the formula. Although, the expansions to NWN were great, and much less boring than the original. I wish Bioware cooperated with the fans more, though, and released something with the use of CEP2. Instead, we got the amusing but somewhat short and bland modules (Kingmaker etc.)
Honestly though, DA looks to me like NWN got brought back to life, and the necromancer's level was too low. Honestly, the gameplay trailer shows that nothing got better since NWN.
To be honest I look forward to purchasing Dragon Age when it's released. Bioware at this point and time is pretty much the only North American developer releasing a decent Role Playing Game. Sadly at this point and time I only have a Mac Book and an Xbox 360 which leaves with very few options when it comes to playing RPGs.