Examples of Bad Writing in Fallout 4 [Spoilers]

The entire battle between the 3 factions boils down solely on "Synths humanity". That's why The Institute was written in a way where it's entirely vague and unclear in their motives overall. They weren't really expanded on since they already had the standard "Dooz tha androids have self-awarenessesss??" plot and the writers didn't really bother with much of anything else and even added another faction based entirely on that concept alone which shows how half-assed and shallow the story was overall.

I don't think most people realize just how shallow and overblown this plot point is alone. In fact I'm surprised it's not mentioned more often.
 
Gay Tony said:
The entire battle between the 3 factions boils down solely on "Synths humanity".
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Except, of course there's 4 factions. Also, the BOS and Institute agree they're not human.

That's why The Institute was written in a way where it's entirely vague and unclear in their motives overall. They weren't really expanded on since they already had the standard "Dooz tha androids have self-awarenessesss??"
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The thing is, the Institute has no motivation for making 3rd Generation Synths. I was highly invested in android self-awareness as a plot but they make no discussion of it or have plots related to it ohter han Danse and Currie.

Both of which are some of the best in the game.

plot and the writers didn't really bother with much of anything else and even added another faction based entirely on that concept alone which shows how half-assed and shallow the story was overall.

I don't think most people realize just how shallow and overblown this plot point is alone. In fact I'm surprised it's not mentioned more often.
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Some of my favorite video games are based on robot self-awareness. It's a great plot, like revenge.

They just didn't develop it.
 
JO'Geran said:
Minutemen don't count. There questline is meaningless radiant quests, and there ending has no advantages over BOS/Railroad.
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It's amusingly also the "best" ending as you can keep peace with three major factions and everything is fucking rainbows and lullabys.

Apparently, the BOS will just leave and the Railroad will go on swimmingly.
 
Railroad existence is quite baffling to be honest. Who would care for human rights of synths when You have zombies and orkz as neighbours? No to mention basic problems supplies like food or water. Honestly organisation like this would fit more on the developed west coast instead of "the great war ended 20 days ago" east coast.
 
Steve the Enclave grunt said:
Railroad existence is quite baffling to be honest. Who would care for human rights of synths when You have zombies and orkz as neighbours? No to mention basic problems supplies like food or water. Honestly organisation like this would fit more on the developed west coast instead of "the great war ended 20 days ago" east coast.
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If the Institute actually ran the Commonwealth and kept the region stable yet at the cost of being authoritarian then I could see how the Railroad could be justified.
 
Most of Fallout 4 is badly written, so it's hard to pick one specific example. But I really hated the scene where you become acting director of the institute. Specifically how the other board members dismiss you on grounds not being a scientist. This really pissed me off because I always put a lot of work into developing scientific characters. It's just another example of Fallout 4 not giving the player any freedom to develop a character; instead we're pigeonholed into playing an established character, and a bland one at that.

Isn't this supposed to be an RPG? Even games with established characters actually acknowledge the player's actions and how they choose to play.
 
Steve the Enclave grunt said:
Railroad existence is quite baffling to be honest. Who would care for human rights of synths when You have zombies and orkz as neighbours? No to mention basic problems supplies like food or water. Honestly organisation like this would fit more on the developed west coast instead of "the great war ended 20 days ago" east coast.
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Well, they mentioned a lot of people don't give a shit about Synths, they just love fucking with the Institute.
 
therealyesman said:
One thing which I found to be groundbreakingly bad writing is the part where the game ends.

So you get one of the 2 endings, and well, your companions have a say.

If you join the Institute, Valentine must be mad, he should probably pop you one with his pipe gun.

But nah. He is fine with you joining the very thing he hates.
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What?

Valentine chews you the fuck out and only backs off if you remind him the Brotherhood wants to commit genocide.

In fact, everyone is like, "You bastard!"

I'm like, "THE BROTHERHOOD IS WORSE."
 
CT Phipps said:
What?

Valentine chews you the fuck out and only backs off if you remind him the Brotherhood wants to commit genocide.

In fact, everyone is like, "You bastard!"

I'm like, "THE BROTHERHOOD IS WORSE."
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That's the worst part, you can't even properly defend yourself when you side with the Institute. I mean, it's the best choice obviously! You're the director, and now you can actually influence all the bullshit going on in the Institute. It's kinda shady to replace random people with synths? Yeah, let's not do that anymore. How about using our awesome technology to help the wasteland instead of burrowing deeper and doing jiggly shit? Hell yeah, I'm the director! We can turn this shitsteamer around!
But of course, all you can say "Uuuuuh Institute is hope" or some shit like that.
Valentine isn't all that mad though, he's a little miffed but then it's all peachy. I think the only one that gets really mad at you in a main quest, ever, is Pesto Gravy when you do Nuka World. Of course, he still hangs around Sanctuary and won't fuck the fuck off, and if you bring that Nuka World companion idiot with you you'll get to witness the gloriousness of two immortal characters trying to kill each other preferably using your collection of power armour...
 
Ilosar said:
But yeah, I don't think they did a great job with the PC. The trauma one faces from the events of the prologue just aren't portrayed in the game. Sure, that doesn't mean the PC should have gone into PTSD, but at least some hints that they were haunted by the events and afraid of the hellhole they suddenly find themselves in would have helped a lot. Like yelling ''what the hell?'' the first time they encounter a Ghoul, for instance.
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My thoughts exactly. I have a game in mind which succeeded in that regard, Tomb Raider (the reboot from 2013). While you actually kill hundreds of people while playing a "fragile young girl", it never feels out of place so to speak, mainly because of Lara's voice actress. The first times you fight hostiles, she freaking begs them to leave her alone, she warns them several times that if they keep pushing, she'll have no choice but to defend her life, and you hear her sobbing when she is forced to kill the first ones. It's nothing but a few more lines of voice acting, nothing hard to code, but it changes everything in regards to the violence in these games, and how your character is supposed to feel about it. It would have been easy to do it with the first raiders and the first ghouls you encounter.

Including these 4 more lines of dialogs during the raider encounter in Concord would have solved the mort important writing issues with playing Nora too. Maybe a little more jamming probability during the first hour would have also hinted the fact that she's not a trained soldier. There's still the problem with the power armor though.
 
The player's whole relationship with Shaun and Nate/Nora was written horrendously. There wasn't a point in which I cared about any of them. That's partly because of a lack of exposure and the fact that neither of them really constitute as full-fledged characters.

It's as if Emil believed the player would care about them solely because they're your husbando/wife and baby. You hardly spend any time with them and then you're automatically expected to mourn the loss of your partner and want to go out looking for your baby. Nora and Nate lacked any distinguishing traits because they're essentially treat as the player's alternative choice of sex despite both being voiced, fully established characters with separate backgrounds. And Shaun lacks any character altogether at the start on account of him being a baby.

These problems could have easily been remedied. Extend the opening segment and actually do something unique in the Pre-War setting with your family. Nora and Nate should have been treat as separate characters since their roles are both established in the setting, and they should have reacted differently to being plunged into the apocalypse like others have said. Shaun should have been at least 6-10 years old so that he could have actually had a character prior to being abducted and indoctrinated by the Institute. When you find out that he's a 60 year old man now, that's the entire emotional crutch of the game gone and it essentially devolves into AIs vs. Humanity cliches.

Bethesda should have also written Shaun (and Institute as a whole) to be more malleable if you were to oppose him or side with him. I mean, he does want to hand you control over the Institute. But that's a problem with the faction system altogether. I can't believe Fallout 3 actually did this stuff better with Liam Neeso...I mean James. You did actually 'grow up' with him and were exposed to what he's like as a character, even if his priorities are muddled.

I think it would have been better in your character was a blank slate...because Fallout has always been about creating your own character. But because Bethesda wanted to experiment with voiced characters without fully committing to making them or their story interesting, we really ended up with the worst of both worlds.
 
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Prior to Bethesda, the PCs in the Fallout series have always been born as institutionalized cult family members [of the vault or tribe]; even in FO:Tactics; and then sent on a mission to protect that family. It's never seemed like a blank slate [which is a good thing IMO]. Bethesda's TES games have a blank slate PC; one that is practically an adult infant with no past, no family, no skills, no acquaintances; and no apparent means of having survived to their present age. It's like they fell out of a hole in the sky one night, and started wandering.
 
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Do you ever think fallout was just too 'hard' to design and write the concept for Bethesda. Like they really didn't get the moral ambiguity that was really implied by the institute etc. Do you think it was too hard for them to write characters that would be effected by multiple faction choices. Do you think they just tried to copy NV faction but failed miserably ?
 
lolpop109 said:
Do you ever think fallout was just too 'hard' to design and write the concept for Bethesda. Like they really didn't get the moral ambiguity that was really implied by the institute etc. Do you think it was too hard for them to write characters that would be effected by multiple faction choices. Do you think they just tried to copy NV faction but failed miserably ?
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No. I think that when designing FO3 they wanted the Vegemite flavor's reputation with the Nutella flavor's mass appeal. A bait & Switch only for those in the know; as nearly all of their intended market would't know the difference.

I don't think it was too difficult, I think it was a road that they didn't want to walk, when their goal lay in the opposite direction. They never cared about the IP, they wanted a TES reskin to to be able to sell the game again using a different setting.

The insidious bit is that I think the lack of complexity, scope, and player accountability for the PC's actions... is totally deliberate and by design ~tailor fit to their target audience. I think they purposely create their games to be just tolerable enough to almost everyone, to get the broadest possible market appeal; and at the full expense of making the best possible game for any single demographic... [IE. Fallout series fans, in this case] They just used us for positive word of mouth during development, then cast us aside. Never intending to make good on the anticipation they purposely generated.
 
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TorontRayne said:
Danse turned out pretty cool with the synth twist. There just wasn't much to attach to really. The settlements left a giant hole in the game where no plot could fill.
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It's cool that you give credit where it's due. That's what makes the NMA such an interesting place to be. Yeah, the scene when you have to do your duty and confront him is surprisingly well written, in my opinion. I like the way they chose to make him deal with the situation. Not quite a redeeming scene or anything, but a regular, normally written scene that makes the story progress with no vulgar winks winks or nonsense.
 
Ilosar said:
Don't forget that the female PC was a lawyer before the War. I mean, it doesn't mean she's a wuss, but it does put into question how she acquired all those survival skills. Maybe she was drafted beforehand?

I hate how it was done. They could've told the player how she knows how to shoot example her husband taught her by taking her to a shooting range but no. They made the story seem like it was based around the husband, with the husbands voice narrating the beginning and telling us that he was in the Army and fought in the battle of Anchorage. his wife's story just a lawyer.
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