Fallout 3 hands-on preview tidbits

[Ausir]

They are, again, breaking the canon with the predefined Fallout Universe.
And I can even ask: What the hell have I done on Fallout and Fallout 2, if the Enclave still exists as the Enclave and has "access to incredible technology"???

The Oil Rig was not the only Enclave base. And even one of the Fallout 2 endings mentions Enclave survivors.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

They still probably have more knowledge about pre-war military bases and their contents than anyone else.

I mentioned that, "Ruins of pre war facilities", but they have lost a significant number of people and there is no way for them to replenish those unless they now also recruit from the wasteland.

For me it is like this; why does the Enclave have to come back?
Let them rest, just like the Super Mutants.

Make new groups, new factions, new villains.

 

[ZiggyMeister]

They are, again, breaking the canon with the predefined Fallout Universe.
And I can even ask: What the hell have I done on Fallout and Fallout 2, if the Enclave still exists as the Enclave and has "access to incredible technology"???

The Oil Rig was not the only Enclave base. And even one of the Fallout 2 endings mentions Enclave survivors.

I'm not saying that the Enclave shouldn't exist, but I think that if they show up in Fallout 3 they shouldn't be as strong, as well organized and as technologically advanced as they were in Fallout 2, or even more!
At least they have lost their main leaders. The survivors would probably be some scattered small groups of the former Enclave but not organized as "The Enclave" with a well defined chain of command and with "access to incredible technology", even if 30 years have passed and they still had some knowledge of pre-war facilities and technology.

I find it hard to believe that after they were lucky to survive, they would be able to survive the wasteland without their numbers decreasing drastically to have the capacity to reorganize and move to the East Coast, where they would settle the new Wasteland Capital and with "access to incredible technology". All this in 30 years in a tough and dangerous place like the Pos-Apoc Wasteland, filled with Super-Mutants, Rabid Ghouls, Giant Rad Scorpions, Giant Rats, some Deathclaws and other strange looking creatures... And the Fallout Radiation!

I really don't dislike finding a lot of things from the previous games on Fallout 3, like the Enclave, the Super-Mutants, a Dog, etc... But what I don't like is the way Bethesda is saying that they will be part of plot of the main story, playing such a central part in the main quest!

And naming the Dog, Dogmeat!
I did something like that for 2 cats I had, some years after the first died. But it wasn't after more than 100 years, and not in some other place more than a thousand miles away, by someone that it's not supposed to be related to the previous Vault Dweller or even is aware that he ever existed!

Talking about coincidences...
Or maybe, during his teenage years, the new Vault Dweller found a very old PC game, that was stored in a very old pre-war "time-capsule", where the main character, the Vault Dweller, had a dog called Dogmeat, that he played over and over again...

 

[Reverend-Mauser]

(snip)

I thought i knew alot about The enclave...Wow well you certainly know your facts. It seems very possible for them to be a major power in another region. The capital thing makes sense, since they are all about "continuation of the GOV" wow.

I am going to write this all down.

Very informative and well played sir!

 

[Reverend-Mauser]

This is... man words just fall me short, but I find this one of... how should I say this; this is pure and simply wrong.

I am not going to resort to all kinds of angry fan boy rants of how stupid and evil Todd, Emil and Bethesda, but right now I would love to be in the same room with these people and yell it in their ears that they are the most poor excuses for designers ever.
They have managed to set standards to a new low that I had not imagined previously before, and that is not a good thing.


The Enclave is dead, and I don't want to hear all kinds of stories from apologists of how the Enclave could have survived and started over again just like the Super Mutants did.

The point of the earlier games was that you had to defeat these guys to a point that they no longer posed a threat to the world, and you supposedly did.
The Super Mutants mostly joined society peacefully and the remnants of the Enclave tried to eke out a poor existence amongst the remnants of pre war facilities.

And lets think outside the box for a moment; why should the Super Mutants and the Enclave pose the threat to the world once more?
Can't people think of original antagonists anymore, Van Buren (yeah yeah, Van Buren this, Van Buren that) brought up a group of dissastisfied NCR soldiers led by a (Pre War) scientist who wanted to reset the world from square one, there must be plenty of good ideas for a 'evil' group out there.


Bethesda's designers show again and again that they have no creativity, all they can do is follow upon the examples set by others.
This may be good for people who just started with games but for those who have been in it for quite some time it is just a slap in the face.

Wasn't NCR supposed to be sieging, Brotherhood
bunkers? It was mentioned in the WIki timeline, that Van buren sadly left behind. And NCR was winning because of its numbers (and the BOS not letting in newbies )

I like NCR as a villian much more than your "ole super mutants that are still like a hundred years old, and powered armor menace's that like oil rigs.."

Yeah Tandy could totally be a bad girl.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Hello Reverend-Mauser,

Well the situation was like this, the current Maxson wanted to restore the dwindling power of the Brotherhood by taking away all advanced technology from 'lesser' people like the NCR under the reason that they weren't ready for it.
This caused some schism in the Brotherhood as not all members agreed with this policy.

Next to having problems with political rivals like Vault City and New Reno NCR also had internal problems like the trading caravan houses that ate away at the republic (you know, corrupt politicians etc).

Apparently at some point people stopped hearing from Shady Sands, assuming it was either destroyed by the Enclave remnants or the Brotherhood.

Dr Presper (the NCR one, not the pre war one), the president's scientific advisor was tired of the mess the world was in and wanted to start all over again, so he recruited dissatisfied NCR soldiers under him and started to look for the means to cleanse the wasteland of the 'unworthy'.

He planned to use Limit 115 (the New Plague) and B.O.M.B.001, a left over orbital weapons platform to wipe out the most advanced outpost in the wasteland.

I believe Tandy had already passed on by then.
And yes, the Brotherhood was loosing the war with the NCR, apparently they got over elitism and allowed some people to join them but not sufficient to replace the numbers they had lost to battle or those who left the Brotherhood.

 

[gc051360]

By bringing back the mutants, the enclave, and the BOS.....I think Bethesda really missed an opportunity to expand the story line, and do something creative.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

I occasionally speak with Shigor Birdman, the former head of Fallout Yurop and he shared with me some ideas for groups that really would fit in a commercial Fallout game.

Of course opinions differ but I think people would agree with me that if they read them that they would find them interesting.

By bringing back the mutants, the enclave, and the BOS.....I think Bethesda really missed an opportunity to expand the story line, and do something creative.

To be honest, it feels all like a rehash of Fallout 1 and 2, nothing original at all.
Just playing it safe.

 

[Reverend-Mauser]

Hello Reverend-Mauser,

Well the situation was like this, the current Maxson wanted to restore the dwindling power of the Brotherhood by taking away all advanced technology from 'lesser' people like the NCR under the reason that they weren't ready for it.
This caused some schism in the Brotherhood as not all members agreed with this policy.

Next to having problems with political rivals like Vault City and New Reno NCR also had internal problems like the trading caravan houses that ate away at the republic (you know, corrupt politicians etc).

Apparently at some point people stopped hearing from Shady Sands, assuming it was either destroyed by the Enclave remnants or the Brotherhood.

Dr Presper (the NCR one, not the pre war one), the president's scientific advisor was tired of the mess the world was in and wanted to start all over again, so he recruited dissatisfied NCR soldiers under him and started to look for the means to cleanse the wasteland of the 'unworthy'.

He planned to use Limit 115 (the New Plague) and B.O.M.B.001, a left over orbital weapons platform to wipe out the most advanced outpost in the wasteland.

I believe Tandy had already passed on by then.
And yes, the Brotherhood was loosing the war with the NCR, apparently they got over elitism and allowed some people to join them but not sufficient to replace the numbers they had lost to battle or those who left the Brotherhood.

ahh thanks dutch, always the voice of wisdom and reason.

I really am lazy sometimes with my sources. thanks for clearing that up.

 

[kebn]

Well the situation was like this <snip>

I forgot how much I liked the Van Buren plot. A Van Buren-esque mod / total conversion for fallout 3 would be glorious...

Anyway, no use in dwelling in what could have been, McDowell is good news at least.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Anyway, no use in dwelling in what could have been, McDowell is good news at least.

I so much wanted McDowell to voice a character in Fallout as I really like his voice, definitely a good 'sophisticated character' voice actor.

In another universe where I am actually a successful game designer and in charge of a Fallout project I would have made him voice 'the Overseer', the main 'villain' the player has to confront to determine the fate of the world.

 

[Pope Viper]

This is... man words just fall me short, but I find this one of... how should I say this; this is pure and simply wrong.

I am not going to resort to all kinds of angry fan boy rants of how stupid and evil Todd, Emil and Bethesda, but right now I would love to be in the same room with these people and yell it in their ears that they are the most poor excuses for designers ever.
They have managed to set standards to a new low that I had not imagined previously before, and that is not a good thing.


The Enclave is dead, and I don't want to hear all kinds of stories from apologists of how the Enclave could have survived and started over again just like the Super Mutants did.

The point of the earlier games was that you had to defeat these guys to a point that they no longer posed a threat to the world, and you supposedly did.
The Super Mutants mostly joined society peacefully and the remnants of the Enclave tried to eke out a poor existence amongst the remnants of pre war facilities.

And lets think outside the box for a moment; why should the Super Mutants and the Enclave pose the threat to the world once more?
Can't people think of original antagonists anymore, Van Buren (yeah yeah, Van Buren this, Van Buren that) brought up a group of dissastisfied NCR soldiers led by a (Pre War) scientist who wanted to reset the world from square one, there must be plenty of good ideas for a 'evil' group out there.


Bethesda's designers show again and again that they have no creativity, all they can do is follow upon the examples set by others.
This may be good for people who just started with games but for those who have been in it for quite some time it is just a slap in the face.

Wasn't NCR supposed to be sieging, Brotherhood
bunkers? It was mentioned in the WIki timeline, that Van buren sadly left behind. And NCR was winning because of its numbers (and the BOS not letting in newbies )

I like NCR as a villian much more than your "ole super mutants that are still like a hundred years old, and powered armor menace's that like oil rigs.."

Yeah Tandy could totally be a bad girl.

Strike 3 - You've been warned about doubleposting.

http://www.nma-fallout.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=509012#509069

Thanks for playing

Enjoy your trip on the Ban Train.

 

[Ausir]

The July issue of Polish CD-Action magazine will also have a hands-on preview, I'll post bits from it as soon as it's out.

Anyway, no one posted other bits from PSM3 yet?

 

[The Situationist]

I've got it. I made a huge post summarising it yesterday, but when I pressed submit it had logged me out, and I lost everything. There's quite a lot of new information and screenshots. I'll try again when I get home from work. And this time I'll copy it before posting.

 

[Ravager69]

Well, I wouldn't mind the Enclave as some minor outpost consisting of several heavily-armed people (why would they dumb the high-tech anyway? It's easier to survive in Advanced Power Armor and a Plasma Rifle, even if you used up all the ammo - it would still scare away most opponents), but a major threat? That, and the muties again...it's like a Marvel graphic novel - no matter how many times Lex Luthor\Dr Doom\Mandarine\Team Rocket\whoever gets his ass kicked, he aaalways return to take over the world once more, only to be stopped by the super hero\super hero's father\daughter\son\wife\dog.

So - I hope this new old Enclave will be a elitist organisation, very dangerous if encountered for most Wastelanders, but not strong enough to take over the area. I wonder - could there be an option to actually join the Enclave this time? This would kick ass - instead of saving the sorry lot of people left in the wastes, help to enslave or eradicate them, if only for the sake of variety of gameplay. Fallout's story always pissed me off because you *had to* save the world if wanted to complete the game.

The president....well, someone has to lead. We'll see about him, not enough stuff to chew on.

As for McDowell....it doesn't bother or satisfy me. I''l wait till I can see the effects of his work in-game.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

it's like a Marvel graphic novel - no matter how many times Lex Luthor\Dr Doom\Mandarine\Team Rocket\whoever gets his ass kicked, he aaalways return to take over the world once more, only to be stopped by the super hero\super hero's father\daughter\son\wife\dog.

You just managed to describe it in words, something I was looking for when I first heard of Mutants and the Enclave returning.

It has become a comic book!
With villains that come back time and time again.

Master/President "Next time Vaulter Dweller, next time I will get you!"

 

[terebikun]

It has become a comic book!
With villains that come back time and time again.

Wait, so Fallout's not supposed to be like a comic book? Those comic book-style loading screens sure had me fooled, confound it.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Wait, so Fallout's not supposed to be like a comic book? Those comic book-style loading screens sure had me fooled, confound it.

Not in the storyline man.
Tell me, do you have an Arch Enemy who pops up from time to time with an evil scheme against you and the world?