Fallout 2 mod Fallout Sonora 1.14 and Sonora Dayglow 1.14 Vanilla Translation

[Jogre]

Hey so I have a question: What are the conditions for no longer getting the disappearing photo?

I've rescued Padre and Madre, attended the village council meeting, but I'm still got the third photo cutscene. I've noticed it isn't lowering my reputation like it usually does.

Is there a certain amount of mandatory progression to stop getting them?

 

[Cambragol]

They are replacements for the Hakunin dream sequences of Fallout 2, which were hardcoded, and timed. So, as far as I know, nothing you actually do in game affects their appearance/progression.

The player is left to interpret their meaning on his own.

I have built/am building a custom version of Fallout CE, and I may remove the appearance of the photos, or attach them to something (deaths of family members off-screen/timed?)

 

[NovaRain]

I think they are fine as they are. Attaching them to the main quest might catch some players who played Sonora before off guard (Madre/Padre suddenly die or Villa quests fail, but I didn't do anything special in my playthrough), unless you add a timer note similar to the water timer in FO1.

 

[Cambragol]

They are fine, but they are also something Nevada Band was forced to include. So not including them might have been their preferred option. They do confuse a LOT of people.

I thought a voice-over of some kind accompanying them could help explain their significance. Maybe a hearkening back to words of wisdom/warning from Granny Adonisia or some such. If only she was voiced.

unless you add a timer note similar to the water timer in FO1.

Interesting, though it would be tough to connect a specific date/length of time for the rescue of/failure to rescue your kin.

 

[NovaRain]

They are fine, but they are also something Nevada Band was forced to include. So not including them might have been their preferred option. They do confuse a LOT of people.

CE doesn't include sfall's MovieTimer_artimerX setting yet, so if you're gonna to include your own CE build, removing the whole timer/movie/rep decrease code should be a simpler choice.

 

[gustarballs1983]

Hey so I have a question: What are the conditions for no longer getting the disappearing photo?

I've rescued Padre and Madre, attended the village council meeting, but I'm still got the third photo cutscene. I've noticed it isn't lowering my reputation like it usually does.

Is there a certain amount of mandatory progression to stop getting them?

the simplest thing to do is to disable them in sfall:

there are four settings named something like Arroyo_timer1, 2, 3, 4 each one like
arroyo_timer=XXX
where xxx is the number of days from the start when the movie plays ( th movie plays at midnight ).
in order to prevent the movie from happening, simply set the =XXX to =-1 , and that's it no more annoying movies, and since ingame scripts are tied to the arroyo timer movies display, if the movies don't play the events after them don't happen.

 

[fanboy]

They are fine, but they are also something Nevada Band was forced to include.

Can the movies be deactivated by hex-editing the exe? If yes, then Nevada Band could have done that, since they use their own modified exe - and the inclusion of the movies would be a voluntary decision.
I think it would be nice to at least have them available optionally, since they are a part of the original release.

 

[gustarballs1983]

Can the movies be deactivated by hex-editing the exe? If yes, then Nevada Band could have done that, since they use their own modified exe - and the inclusion of the movies would be a voluntary decision.
I think it would be nice to at least have them available optionally, since they are a part of the original release.

sfall is literally doing that on the fly with live game, however you need to use it in order to disable the movies, and if you are on Linux or Mac you literally have to use wine in order to achive this.. and no Fallout2 CE does not support this feature... yet.. and it might be a long time before it does.

 

[fanboy]

Yes, I know. I'm more talking about the intent of the creators, since Cambragol wants to stay close to that. His new translation package might not contain sfall.

 

[gustarballs1983]

Yes, I know. I'm more talking about the intent of the creators, since Cambragol wants to stay close to that. His new translation package might not contain sfall.

the original intent of the devs was for the village to die if you haven't siccesfully rescued it's inhabitants before arroyo timer 4, also you'd had to seal some kind of a deal (a.k.a finish the game) or they'd turn hostile.. this was later toned down, to just red float text instead of vilagers attacking the player. the original intent was for this reminder to be there, though their relevance has diminished in devs spirits since then..

as for sfall it's a bit more tricky to get it right now..
as proper ddraw.ini is only obtainable via foxx's release. and foxx's release still sits at patch 1.14+, so you'd have to download Sonora& DLC from Nevada Band v1.15 also download Foxx's version, and additionally also download more recent sfall5 from Mr.Stalin's GitFlic account.
when you do that you install v1.15 to one directory,and foxx's relese to another. you copy over ddraw.ini from foxx's to v1.15 and ddraw.dll from unpacked latest Mr.Stalin's archive. you may want to also copy over some company scripts from Foxx's and update them from latest sfall5's archive.
also if you want the bookseller you may want to consider copying over those as well, plus, copying the bookseller mod, and the english translation for it, and copying& rearranging the mods-order.ini or mods-order.txt whichever sfall5 uses, also stuff like sfall-mods.ini and etc.

basically only doable, if you know what you are doing..

 

[Cambragol]

Can the movies be deactivated by hex-editing the exe? If yes, then Nevada Band could have done that, since they use their own modified exe - and the inclusion of the movies would be a voluntary decision.
I think it would be nice to at least have them available optionally, since they are a part of the original release.

Good point. I'm not sure, and had assumed they were forced to include them. Maybe I am wrong there. The confusion surrounding them remains however. I am not above tweaking things like that in my next version, which will depart slightly from a 'faithful translation'

the original intent of the devs was for the village to die if you haven't siccesfully rescued it's inhabitants before arroyo timer 4, also you'd had to seal some kind of a deal (a.k.a finish the game) or they'd turn hostile.. this was later toned down, to just red float text instead of vilagers attacking the player. the original intent was for this reminder to be there, though their relevance has diminished in devs spirits since then..

I didn't know this, though I suspected as much. If they did remain I'd lean into going in this direction, though turning the Villa hostile seems a little much, as the main character doesn't exactly depart under fanfare. It would be enough to kill off some of the family at each timer, eventually leaving the Villa empty.

Some people really hate timers though, so I strongly doubt I'll fiddle with this. Sfall is available for those who really can't stand them.

 

[Cambragol]

Hmm... looking at the code in Fallout2.exe (through the decompilation) and comparing with the scripting/global variable use by Nevada Band, there may be the potential for a serious bug in the game. A global variable might be being reused that, once incremented past a certain point, triggers 'destroyed Arroyo'... looking into this further.

 

[NovaRain]

Hmm... looking at the code in Fallout2.exe (through the decompilation) and comparing with the scripting/global variable use by Nevada Band, there may be the potential for a serious bug in the game. A global variable might be being reused that, once incremented past a certain point, triggers 'destroyed Arroyo'... looking into this further.

Sonora already has a fix for that in ZTMap.

if (town_known(AREA_VILLA_DSTR) != MARK_STATE_INVISIBLE) then begin
   mark_area_known(MARK_TYPE_TOWN, AREA_VILLA_DSTR, MARK_STATE_INVISIBLE);
   mark_area_known(MARK_TYPE_TOWN, AREA_VILLA, MARK_STATE_VISITED);
end

 

[malaise_chalk]

Hi! I'm doing my first playthrough of the game and would like to contribute to improving the translation as I go. As I dev my first instinct was to submit a PR: https://github.com/cambragol/Fallout-Sonora-English/pull/1. If there is a better way to do that, let me know! I hope to be able to provide lots of feedback.

 

[Cambragol]

CE doesn't include sfall's MovieTimer_artimerX setting yet, so if you're gonna to include your own CE build, removing the whole timer/movie/rep decrease code should be a simpler choice.

Just tested this, and went through the code, and looks like it is already fully implemented!

@malaise_chalk - welcome to the forum! I hope you will enjoy your first play through of Sonora - think it is well worth it. I also welcome any feedback which can improve the translation. Very welcome in fact, and appreciated.

Your first instinct was good, i.e. github, which seems ready made for this kind of thing, however, I find that gathering interest and focus in this thread has reaped the most benefits. No need to spread things out. So please post any issues/feedback/improvements here, and I will go through all of them. So far I have addressed (I think...) each and every point of feedback left here.

Cheers!

 

[Jogre]

They are replacements for the Hakunin dream sequences of Fallout 2, which were hardcoded, and timed. So, as far as I know, nothing you actually do in game affects their appearance/progression.

The player is left to interpret their meaning on his own.

Thanks for getting back to me.

Great mod btw. I love how uncomfortable the Wasteland feels. It feels like a world where people are genuinely struggling, and it really encourages you to stand by decisions you make a lot more when whatever you do, someone inevitably suffers as a result. It feels like you have to defend why you think something is the right thing to do, rather than have the game just automatically agree with you, which is great, and makes it feel like the decisions you make really matter.

One question I had: I would be curious if you could explain all the ways the game has been rebalanced combat-wise, because I've noticed limbs get crippled more frequently, bullets are sold individually rather than in stacks, etc. - I'd be fascinated to see a list of all these little changes, because they all add up - And they do create a vibe that combat is made up of these desparate scraps, scrounging for ammunition, getting beat up, etc. - And I'd like to know what goes into that.

he simplest thing to do is to disable them in sfall:

there are four settings named something like Arroyo_timer1, 2, 3, 4 each one like
arroyo_timer=XXX
where xxx is the number of days from the start when the movie plays ( th movie plays at midnight ).
in order to prevent the movie from happening, simply set the =XXX to =-1 , and that's it no more annoying movies, and since ingame scripts are tied to the arroyo timer movies display, if the movies don't play the events after them don't happen.

My main issue was that I wasn't sure if I was doing something wrong.

Now that I know they don't really matter, I don't really mind them.

 

[Cambragol]

One question I had: I would be curious if you could explain all the ways the game has been rebalanced combat-wise, because I've noticed limbs get crippled more frequently, bullets are sold individually rather than in stacks, etc. - I'd be fascinated to see a list of all these little changes, because they all add up - And they do create a vibe that combat is made up of these desparate scraps, scrounging for ammunition, getting beat up, etc. - And I'd like to know what goes into that.

Glade you are enjoying the game. I get the same feeling you describe.
As for rebalance, I can't say more than you already know. This is an aspect of the mod I did not get into when translating/bug fixing. I am not a big 'balance' guy, and generally play role-play games rules free, meaning trying not to think or care about the mechanics running below the 'story'.

 

[malaise_chalk]

Makes sense! I'll leave feedback here.

Copied over from the PR:

TCKid.msg:241 "Oh that's... too bad... But if you do end up in in Casa Grande, then please, remember me. And now we better split up. Pretend this conversation never happened."
pro_scen.msg:93201 "Some junk that you think might have been a bed matters before it was destroyed by the environment."
"bed matters" -> "mattress"
New feedback:
VCCitizn.msg:125 "Wish Se�or Andres would come back from slavery."
This one is odd, since it makes it sounds like Andres could come back voluntarily if he wanted to. The sentiment here could be similar to L128 "Someone has to rescue Se�ora Maria from slavery.", or possibly something that just conveys the sentiment "I'm worried about Se�or Andres." A minor point here is that it would be somewhat unusual to use "slavery" when talking about an individual rather than a general concept. Something like "Someone has to rescue Se�ora Maria!" or "Someone has to rescue Se�ora Maria from the raiders!" would parse better.
VCBabula.msg:212 "Enough grumbling, granny. What happened?"
226: "Family heirlooms? That's it? Damn, granny, you're no help at all. Fine, I'll check out Dad's cellar."
Probably should be uppercase G to be consistent with the rest of the dialog

VCBandit.msg:256 "Oh, sorry. It must be tough growing up without a family or home?"
Either drop the question mark or make it a question "Is it tough…?"

VCBandit.msg:324/1324 "Stupid peasant, you... (mocks you, then coughs bitterly) You don't have the slightest idea about the outside world, do you? Your folks were taken to work in the mine. Though I doubt you even know what that is."
What is meant by "(mocks you)" in the action dialog? Perhaps "(laughs at you)"?

VCChild.msg:122 "I'm afraid they'll come back. The raiders."
The second half isn't a sentence. If it's halting speech, it might need ellipses: "I'm afraid they'll come back… The raiders…"

VCCtzBld.msg:208 "I thought I was a done for. But now I feel fine. You perform miracles. In the past, anyone who got a broken bone rarely survived. How did we not see your gift before"
"anyone who got a broken bone" is a bit awkward compared with "anyone who broke a bone" or the whole sentence could be "In the past, a broken bone was a death sentence."
212: "I'm heading out on a journey. Any help you could give me?"
The second half is a bit awkward in English. "Could you give me anything to help?" or "Could you spare any supplies?" might work.

VCCtzHom:204 "I needed supplies and stuff to rescue you and the others."
The "and stuff" sounds like a teenage dismissing a complaint. Perhaps "I *needed* those supplies to rescue you and the others."


That's all for now. Please let me know if this kind of feedback is the right level of granularity. I've tried to focus on things that seem like mistakes, or read awkwardly to a native speaker.

Also, bravo on the remarkable achievement of translating this whole game alone. It's astoundingly good work!

 

[Cambragol]

@malaise_chalk - good feedback, I will address all the points I didn't change. Anything not mentioned has already been tweaked/added into the translation. So thanks for that!

VCChild.msg:122 "I'm afraid they'll come back. The raiders."
This is okay, a kid, or an adult, could deliver this line in this way. Not hesitating, but just bluntly, blurting out words.

212: "I'm heading out on a journey. Any help you could give me?"
Maybe awkward, but the situation is awkward. He's asking for any help, maybe even insinuating physical help, or accompaniment, but the other party only offers supplies in response. If anything, 'heading out on a journey' sounds weird. Changed it to: 'I'm heading after our people'

That's it. All the rest is in, and will be in the next release.

Thanks again! The granularity is fine. I am all for a perfectly polished translation, so little details all count for me.

Also, bravo on the remarkable achievement of translating this whole game alone. It's astoundingly good work!

Thanks!

 

[malaise_chalk]

All your points makes sense to me.

One thing I couldn't figure out while playing was what the guillemets («) in some dialog entries meant. Example:

GCPit.msg{105}{}{«I can't believe my eyes!» Is this really Power Armor?!}
I thought I also saw them in a random encounter too, though my ability to grep for non-ascii characters in the encoding these files are in isn't quite working (or they exist only in this file).


While we're in GCPit.msg, there are a lot of entries in Pete's dialog which pair "sir" for male characters but "senora" for female, e.g.:

{206}{}{Whatever's more convenient, sir.}
{1206}{}{Whatever's more convenient, senora.}

Others pair spanish with spanish (amigo/amiga) or english with english (sir/ma'am on 107/1107). There's also one example of "senorita" where most are "senora".

Also, I don't know if it's possible in the engine, but it would be a nice touch to use "ñ" for these spanish words.


(player, after being denied access to larger inventory)
{253}{}{Uh, no, the boss knows best.}
{254}{}{You know, you don't always have to be so obedient.}
"obedient" is a bit of a strange word to use in this context. It could be "subservient" or "servile" if the player is implying that Pete is overly submissive to his boss. But since this is a throwaway response that doesn't go anywhere in the conversation maybe something like "You should learn that rules are meant to be broken." or "Ah, a stickler for the rules." or "Of course, I wouldn't want you to get in trouble with 'the boss'." (sarcastic) might work.



{283}{}{Everyone's used to it. And it's convenient. Just be careful; someone's started minting their own caps. It's bad because if there are too many caps, they'll lose value. I'll bet our culprit will be someone who has caps to spare, comprende amigo?}

This is totally fine, but I'd expect the word "counterfeit" to show up somewhere in this dialog tree as it's the main word used to describe fake money. "started minting their own caps" could be "started making counterfeit caps". Or L285 "minting fake caps" could be "minting/making counterfeit caps".

{294}{}{What do you think, amigo? Trailer... tools... boom! Someone's gotta do it, you know? I'd ask other residents, but I'm afraid Todd will get lynched. I don't anyone getting hurt.}
{1294}{}{What do you think, amiga? Trailer... tools... boom! Someone's gotta do it, you know? I'd ask other residents, but I'm afraid Todd will get lynched. I don't anyone getting hurt.}
{295}{}{Okay, I understand. Get into his trailer, look for tools for making caps. If they're there, destroy them.}

To me, "tools" implies smaller, more handheld implements, compared with "cap-making machine" used elsewhere in the dialog. The second could be changed to "look for the source of these counterfeit caps, and destroy it." or "look for the machine used to make the counterfeit caps, and destroy it." The first line is harder to change straightforwardly. My best suggestion is "What do you think, amiga? We've got to make sure whatever is making those caps is... aggressively non-functional. Someone's gotta do it, you know? I'd ask other residents, but I'm afraid Todd will get lynched. I don't anyone getting hurt."