FIFE - open source RPG engine with Fallout support

Discussion in 'Fallout General Modding' started by mvBarracuda, Sep 15, 2005.

  1. Wild_qwerty

    Wild_qwerty Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Feb 2, 2004
    So whats the latest news with FIFE? Is the map editor working now so that maps can be edited as well as viewed?

    Is the game 'playable' so that you can move the player around and shoot things :)
     
  2. mvBarracuda

    mvBarracuda Vault Dweller

    754
    Apr 11, 2004
    All FIFE news can be found at our new dev blog:
    http://blog.fifengine.de

    The engine is far from that. We support running around with a critter now but no blockers. You can trigger shooting animations by using the new scripting system.

    ATM we're cleaning up the sources and prepare MSVC support for FIFE. No great new features ATM :-(
     
  3. Wild_qwerty

    Wild_qwerty Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Feb 2, 2004
    whats msvc?
     
  4. mvBarracuda

    mvBarracuda Vault Dweller

    754
    Apr 11, 2004
  5. mvBarracuda

    mvBarracuda Vault Dweller

    754
    Apr 11, 2004
  6. mvBarracuda

    mvBarracuda Vault Dweller

    754
    Apr 11, 2004
  7. Psyckosama

    Psyckosama First time out of the vault

    96
    Oct 22, 2003
    Hi. I love your work and hope I don't come off too demanding but I'd like to ask about a few things which I'd like to know if you're going to be considering/using.

    1) Will this be capable of accepting content from other similar games such as Fallout Tactics, Jagged Alliance, or Arcanum?

    2) Would it be possible to have vehicle support for transport and combat? Or support for turrets and integrated weapons?

    3) Would it be possible to have alternate movement options, such as the option to an enter a building through the windows like in Arcanum or the ability to crouch of fall prone like in Tactics.

    4) Would it be possible to have auto-loading loading maps to creature the illusion of a truly massive and continuous game world?

    5) Would it be possible to have a coloring system like in FoT where you could change the pallet colors of say, hair, skin, clothing, ect on the sprites?

    6) Could you make environmental destruction/construction possible? For example could it you blow a hole in a wall or built a shack?

    7) Would support for multiple party members/parties be possible to implement?

    8) Is there any possibility that ballistic arc based weapons, such as JA2s infamous mortar (or even as simple as chucking a grenade over a wall) be implemented?

    Reason I'm asking is because it seems that today most companies choose to attend to the action kiddies and tell gamers who want something deeper and don't obsess about shiny graphics to fuck ourselves. This engine could potentially be used for much more than Fallout. I can help but wonder if this could be used to make a Jagged Alliance 2 style tactical game, a Baldur's Gate style Fantast RPG, a classic Diablo style hack and slash, or even if someone especially creative gets their hands on it, maybe even something odd like a Harvest Moon style Sim?

    I'm sorry if it seems like I'm demanding something, but I'm just wondering if this couldn't be something more than just a fallout engine remake. Thanks
     
  8. mvBarracuda

    mvBarracuda Vault Dweller

    754
    Apr 11, 2004
    No problem :-) Here we go.

    Natively? No. Why should it?

    Seriously: adding support for more file formats can get very complicated and time consuming. FIFE is open source and everyone is free to contribute code. So if anyone writes content loaders for these games we'll gladly import the code into our SVN repository.

    FIFE is very extendable but it's not the task of the team to support dozens of proprietery formats. The reason why we did chose to support the Fallout file formats was because they offered us a rather simply way (they were almost fully documentated by TeamX) to bring content into the engine without creating it from scratch (maps, gfx, sounds, etc.).

    We do currently focus on the scripting abilities and map geometry. So if we ever add support for more proprietery formats you should give us some good reasons why it would be worth supporting these games.

    Hmm I guess that vehicles to move on the maps should be possible later. However we'll concentrate on getting good working NPCs on the maps first.

    Stationary turrets will be no problem. What do you mean with "integrated weapons"?

    I'm pretty sure that we'll implement a system for alternative movement methods. However it's up to you to create the necessary content for it. We'll prolly provide an example for a movement mode script in lua and you can write your one ones to support whatever movement method you like.

    Auto-loading? Please elaborate. Sorry, but I don't really get it :-(

    At least we plan to implement such a system:
    http://wiki.fifengine.de/index.php?title=GFX_format#Features

    Should be possible via scripts. But I'll ask our coders if we can make it easier for scripters by adding a certain support for it so you don't need to work around it with scripts too much.

    It would be possible :-p

    But that would require a lot of work and as we're busy with other things; party NPCs got no priority ATM. We would need a good AI coder first because we got no expert in this field of development on the team at the moment.

    Should be possible. We haven't considered this yet and I can't say how much extra work it would be to add it. The main reason is that we don't have a ruleset yet so there are no weapons either.

    Hehe we did chose the route to become an engine for all kind of ISO games months ago. So we want to make FIFE that flexible you're able to create all kind of RPGs and RTS' with it.

    They open sourced the JA2 sources and a team works on an improved JA2 version ATM. I guess this engine would be a better platform for your game. If you think that FIFE would be better suited for your game you got at least better chances to get support for the JA2 file formats somehow because implementing support for documented formats is far easier than reverse engineering them for us.

    There is GemRB, the open source Infinity engine. I guess this will be your best bet for "Baldurs Gate"-like games.
    http://gemrb.sourceforge.net/

    As I said: it all depends on if someone adds support for the native file formats of these games. Supporting real-time combat is planned if you want to create a hack'n'slash. I don't know Harvest Moon. What's so special about it?

    We support every kind of ISO games in theory. However we'll add support for basic RPG tasks. So if you want to write an RTS' with it ATM, you'll need to write a lot of lua code yourself to get it working. However for RTS' there is Stratagus so I guess it's good that we focus on supporting RPGs first.
    http://stratagus.sourceforge.net/

    You're not demanding anything, you just ask; and we're happy that at least some people care about FIFE :-)

    And to answer your final question: yes, the (majority of the) team thinks that FIFE should become more than a Fallout engine clone.
     
  9. Psyckosama

    Psyckosama First time out of the vault

    96
    Oct 22, 2003
    That was more a general question... I'm personally thinking if any content was to be used from those games them it would probably be best to move it over. Maybe a better question would have been how set in stone will it be towards the exact nature of the fallout file and content structure.

    Reason I brought it up is that as games go, their content could be easily compatible with what we have in fallout as on is already fallout and the other has a steampunk look that could make for some very interesting communities

    Stationary turrets will be no problem. What do you mean with "integrated weapons"?[/quote]

    One example could be a tank turret. The turret might be pointing one way while the tank will be pointing the other.

    Or a hull mounted machine gun…

    Coolness. Thanks.

    How to explain... This is an example so feel free to mess wih the idea. okay, lets day you have nine maps 5x5 maps laid out like the following...

    123
    456
    789

    Your character is in map 5 while the others are loaded around it.

    Now lets say you enter map 4. Maps 3, 6, 9 are removed from memory and in their places the maps that are supposed to coordinate to 1, 4, and 7 load... lets call them ABC so you end up having this:

    A12
    B45
    C78

    Through use of random monster spawning and a goodly but not excessive number filler maps or some kind of random generation you could have an illusion of a continuous map. I'm not sure but I think that's how Arcanum did it and it worked rather well for making the world look big as well as allowing you alternate was of getting into a town

    Oh sweet. Thanks. :)

    I was thinking more random destruction. Like if you can't find a door, make one, kind of destruction.

    Hey now, no problems, first things first. These are more just general ideas that I'm throwing into the wind and hoping you like them enough to throw them somewhere on the agenda for when you're done with the engine and in the throwing in new functions for the hell of it stage. ;)

    Cool. :)

    Oh great! That sounds just totally awesome.

    I know, but I'm not quite sure how far they are into it (need to check, been several months) and I don't think they're putting in a dialogue tree which in my mind is a must for any game with its salt.

    That said, I'm not working on a game at the moment, and honestly, I would not use the JA2 graphics because they're even more dated than fallouts but without the charm. (that said, game rocks). This is more general thought process at the moment. Though that said, once you guys produce a functional engine to play with I doubt I'll be able to help myself.

    It was an example as above. Personally, I'm not the biggest fan of the infinity engine. Looks real nice but seems to lack personality and in general just does not feel as 'real' as the fallout engine.

    Harvest moon is a farming simulation RPG. You become a farmer, build your farm, plant crops, raise animals, get married, have children, ect. It's really all very odd and hard to describe. Really, I recommend you just did up a rom or something. Very addictive and is probably one of the most unique games around.

    Though Fallout Farmer could be a kick...

    I understand. Just throwing out ideas once again. As I said, I don't mean to sound demanding to like I'm putting you folks under any pressure. Hell. I think you're freckin' saints for doing this to begin with!

    I love it. I see endless potential, man. Hell, when you get it working to spec, maybe you folks should even look into some licensing options for it.

    I can't wait until the engine is done. It will be an impressive sight to say the least. Great job so far and thanks for listening to my crazed fanboy rantings. If I knew more about coding I'd volunteer for it.

    Hell, might be as good a time as any to start learning. :p

    Thanks! :D
     
  10. Demonslayer

    Demonslayer Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    968
    Aug 8, 2005
    Been reading the whole thread and it looks good.
    The only thing that kinda makes me unconfortable is the lower menu being inthe middle. I like it more like the other FO when it uses all the lower space, not just middle.

    And it looks like it might be possible to merge fallout 1 and 2 maps and possible some interesting features from FOT in the same game.

    Excelent!
     
  11. mvBarracuda

    mvBarracuda Vault Dweller

    754
    Apr 11, 2004
    FIFE won't need the Fallout file formats. We'll offer support for other file formats e.g. our own map format, animation format (PNG + XML), script format (lua) and sound format (ogg). So you're not bound to the limitations of the Fallout formats.

    If you want to create an Arcanum-like game: mod Arcanum :-) We did chose to support Fallout because modding it is pain in the ass. More file formats would be a lot of work for little benefit. I don't say that we won't support more formats, I'm just stating that I don't think that the team will work on them. Third party contributions are welcome.

    Hmm hard to decide ATM. I guess we need to wait some months till we see proper NPC support. After that we might be able to look into vehicles.

    As far as I understood the system nothing like that is planned for FIFE. You'll have single map files and can connect the map how you want them. E.g. via a world map or via the map exit grids you know from Fallout.

    AFAIK nothing like that is planned. Modders can surely script destroyable doors but the whole scenery won't be destroyable.

    Oki, got that :-)


    Hehe it'll definately take time. But we would be really happy if the modders could start building some maps in the next 6 months. But I won't make any promises :-/

    Hehe if you intend to work with FIFE on own games later you should definately have a look into Lua. We use it as scripting language.

    Here is a good read:
    http://www.lua.org/pil/

    You're welcome :-)

    That can be altered in one minute by editing the GUI script :-)

    We plan to offer a kind of FO1 / FO2 to FIFE map conversion tool for the map editor. We don't plan to support FO:T file formats.
     
  12. chewie

    chewie Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    322
    Dec 3, 2005
    Hi Demonslayer :)

    MvBarracuda already replied to your question, but here are some more details:

    Currently we (The Zero-Projekt Team) are using a default resolution (atm I chose 1024x768) where the gui is filling the lower space. All resolutions above the default leads to a "centered" gui. But I have also some rudimentary support ready for bigger / smaller gfx. (static, e.g. for 640x480) You only have to check the current resolution, loading the needed gfx and alter the position of the GUI-elements. At least, it really is only some LUA to make this possible. But you have to provide the whole GUI-gfx in each of your supported resolutions

    I already thought about dropping a feature request to the devs wether we can support realtime-resizing for images or not. That should save time for modders to create the gfx and will also keep the resulting game content smaller.
     
  13. Demonslayer

    Demonslayer Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    968
    Aug 8, 2005
    If possible keep updating with screenshots.
    They are eyecandy :D
     
  14. Wejgomi

    Wejgomi First time out of the vault

    1
    Nov 5, 2006
    Sticky this !

    Well, well I've been tracking this one for some years, and its nice to find people refuse IanOut soul die, spend time creating a new interface and engine for such considerably old game..


    It's better be STICKY because this is really something different, its more like a new game than a modding project, so I guess it deserves to be special.. :P


    take care..
     
  15. mvBarracuda

    mvBarracuda Vault Dweller

    754
    Apr 11, 2004
    Re: Sticky this !

    It's not really the ianout spirit that is within the FIFE team. Our aim is more to create a modern framework for ISO games that run cross platform. By supporting the Fallout file formats we hope that future Fallout mods could be made far easier with FIFE instead of using the Fallout engine itself.

    There are a bunch of excellent projects like killaps patch & and the mega mod just to name two. So it's hard to justify to stickify one project post and to not do so with the other ones. If you really think that the FIFE thread should be stickied, contact one of the forums mods or admins. I'm not an admin or mod at NMA so I can't make it a sticky on my own.

    Thx for the kind words :-)
     
  16. Strato

    Strato First time out of the vault

    15
    Feb 21, 2006
    Merry Xmass for FIFE Team! :wink:
     
  17. mvBarracuda

    mvBarracuda Vault Dweller

    754
    Apr 11, 2004
    Thank you very much Strato :-) Cool to see that some people like you still care about FIFE

    We've just released a new version of the compile SDK and wrote a little developer blog post to keep you up to date about the latest events. We even plan to release a new official version in the next days :-)

    You can read about all details here:
    http://mirror1.cvsdude.com/trac/fife/engine/wiki/2006/12/30/06.24

    The FIFE team wishes all Fallout fans a happy new year!
     
  18. SquishyDeadBody

    SquishyDeadBody It Wandered In From the Wastes

    142
    Dec 27, 2006
    I am A Modding Moron, I have very little understanding of the mechanics behind the games. :?

    Will FIFE be easy to use and have an instruction manual simple enough even the most computer illiterate person could make a mod? :?:

    Is their a tutorial on making your own Critters etc inside the FIFE engine?
    I hope, because going back from program to program reading over the same long and meticulous jargon gets mind numbing.

    I would like to see more of a Screen shot kind of tutorial that would help out a lot more along side the mind numbing jargon.

    This has all probably been answered before and Im sorry if it has I just cant seem to allocate it amongst the other seemingly endless posts when I search for it. :scratch:
     
  19. mvBarracuda

    mvBarracuda Vault Dweller

    754
    Apr 11, 2004
    In one word: NO. Absolutely not. It's not even our aim, though I consider this impossible anyway.

    What the want to achieve with FIFE is:
    1. Provide a modern 2D ISO engine with Fallout support.
    2. Support for alternative operating systems so you can create mods that run on linux, win32, mac, etc.
    3. Eleminate these ugly limitations of the Fallout engine. Nothing is more frustrating than investing a lot of time into something but to find out that the engine doesn't support the feature you want.
    4. Make modding more productive. That does _NOT_ mean that it will be really easy but we want to remove some of the limitations that made modding Fallout so hard.

    If you did never work with a map editor or a scripting language FIFE _WON'T_ work for you. FIFE is _NOT_ for the people who were unable to mod Fallout. It's for the hard working modders that hit the limits of the engine every day and want to do something beyond it.

    As rule of thumb: if you can't make a Fallout mod, you can make a good FIFE one either. Modding is about learning to work with the engine. We just want to ease the learning process and offer additional possibilities for the ones who are willing to invest some time to wrap their head around the FIFE engine.

    We'll provide example files for the features we support. There are already example critters in SVN if you want to have a look. We won't have a big documentation because somebody would need to write it. Any volunteers?

    Everyone who's willing to invest some time into modding should be able to cope with this though. I'm no coder either and as even I got the concept I'm sure that the majority of modders won't have many problems to get into the way FIFE works.

    FIFE is no little tool box which you can use to magically click together your RPGs. It's meant to be a serious engine project so I guess you'll need to invest some time to get into it.

    We try to make it as easy as possible but such kind of tutorials are not planned. The reason for it: I don't have the time to write them. But our wiki is free for everyone so you're encouraged to create such guides.

    These kind of questions were not really raised before so I was happy to answer them now :-)
     
  20. SquishyDeadBody

    SquishyDeadBody It Wandered In From the Wastes

    142
    Dec 27, 2006
    I am very excited and happy to hear the answers you have. :lalala:

    Its good that this engine will push the limits of the game already in question.
    It's good to know wether or not this engine is meant for serious modders or the average joe. :silly:
    This will help for some people who are just starting, to know what they are getting into.
    I understand some of the Modding Ideas I was just wanting to know the depth of the tutorials and development.
    I don't want to get a program that I wont understand.
    But if I do I would like to know if it is at least possible to operate with time spent with the program.


    Your feedback is very appreciated I am very glad the FIFE team is working on this engine.
    :rockon:
    Thanks!

    P.S.
    Happy New year!
    :wiggle: