Fallout 2 mod FO2 Engine Tweaks (Sfall)

[Nimrod]

Button 0 in dialogs is a cheat Look at dialog loop and you understand - 0 button is a bug (also look at debug.log).

It may be a bug, but it's still useful. If a dialogue bug traps you in a loop, that's the only way to escape. Without it you'd have to quit fallout and loose whatever progress you hadn't saved.

Indeed. Having been forced to use this a few times, I'd be pretty reluctant to take it out of the game (or at least my game). There comes a time when I think people should just police themselves when it comes to bugs/exploits/whatever.

 

[Alray]

If that's true, then as long as the speed of travel across the world map doesn't depend on CPU speed, then neither should the encounter rate...

Ok, but if I set to WorldMapFPS not 20 value... For example 10 or 30. And I have different number of encounters. Almost the same speed at worldmap (with 15 or 20 values), but different number of encounter. With enc. fix encounters don't depend from CPU speed (or time delay or FPS). When you set WorldMapFPS you try to guess normal speed. It's just your decision.
And one more. You use ForceEncounter... What for? If encounters work fine?

If a dialogue bug traps you in a loop, that's the only way to escape. Without it you'd have to quit fallout and loose whatever progress you hadn't saved

I didn't see dialogs traps at FO2 scripts

 

[Timeslip]

Ok, but if I set to WorldMapFPS not 20 value... For example 10 or 30. And I have different number of encounters.

That's true...

Edit: OK, 1.18b is up, and includes your patch.

And one more. You use ForceEncounter... What for? If encounters work fine?

It doesn't give an outdoorsman skill check, and lets you force an encounter into any map regardless of where on the world map you are. It's useful for mods that want to script an encounter without worrying about players avoiding it by luck or by making an outdoorsman check.

I use it in the example hunger script, so that if the player needs food while travelling across the world map they get sent to an empty map to let them eat something before they start taking hp damage.

	... else if(last_stage != 2) then begin
			display_msg("You feel hungry");
			if(in_world_map) then begin
				force_encounter(0);
			end
	end else ...

 

[Per]

I have a question about the 13-year limit fix. You wrote that you avoided the timer reset problem, so does that mean you added more bits for the timer to work with? I'm going to mention this in the FAQ in my guide; can I report that this fix works without side effects?

Also, did you ever take a closer look at what specifically causes the too many items bug/button blackout bug?

Also, how easy or hard would it be to delve into the engine and find out exactly what specific traits and perks do mechanically (and/or fix them where they don't work properly), how the ammo/armour routines work exactly, how bursts work, and so on and so forth?

 

[Timeslip]

I have a question about the 13-year limit fix. You wrote that you avoided the timer reset problem, so does that mean you added more bits for the timer to work with? I'm going to mention this in the FAQ in my guide; can I report that this fix works without side effects?

No, the counter is still 32 bit, and there will still be side effects each time it rolls over. (Specifically scripts that compare values returned from game_time are going to have problems.) The only difference is that the correct year is returned even after it rolls over, which is really just an aesthetic thing so that the save games/world map etc. all display the right date.

Also, did you ever take a closer look at what specifically causes the too many items bug/button blackout bug?

I did spend some time looking, but couldn't find anything.

Also, how easy or hard would it be to delve into the engine and find out exactly what specific traits and perks do mechanically (and/or fix them where they don't work properly), how the ammo/armour routines work exactly, how bursts work, and so on and so forth?

Depends. Ask something about a specific perk, and I can probably find it. For ammo/armour, you're better off asking Glovz.

 

[killap]

So I tried out the new option that makes world map encounters independent of world map travel speed. It seems to work, but I honestly don't remember the number of encounters that I saw in the original game with my old computer back in 1999. Is 10 encounters from Vault City to NCR reasonable? In another test I did I got as high as 8 encounters from Arroyo to Den and in another test as low as 2 between the same two places. This is definitely more than I was getting with my machine and my patch without this option, but I realize the reason for this was because my computer was faster thus resulting in less encounters.

Do these encounter rates seem closer to what those playing years ago remember?

 

[Timeslip]

So I tried out the new option that makes world map encounters independent of world map travel speed. It seems to work, but I honestly don't remember the number of encounters that I saw in the original game with my old computer back in 1999. Is 10 encounters from Vault City to NCR reasonable? In another test I did I got as high as 8 encounters from Arroyo to Den and in another test as low as 2 between the same two places. This is definitely more than I was getting with my machine and my patch without this option, but I realize the reason for this was because my computer was faster thus resulting in less encounters.

Do these encounter rates seem closer to what those playing years ago remember?

I don't remember either, but given that it was still processor dependent back then then I think it's fair to say that there is no 'correct' rate of encounters, in which case you should just pick something you're happy with and stick with it. If you think it's to high I can tweak it up or down, or make it configurable via the ini file.

 

[gracul]

I remember what pain in the ass was traveling from The Den to Vault City back in the old days. Mostly i had a full list of saves (1 in the den, 2 was free till i get to vc, and rest encounters), so i would suggest a ratio of 7 to 10 encounters on the distance from Den to VC.

 

[killap]

I remember what pain in the ass was traveling from The Den to Vault City back in the old days. Mostly i had a full list of saves (1 in the den, 2 was free till i get to vc, and rest encounters), so i would suggest a ratio of 7 to 10 encounters on the distance from Den to VC.

I got about that in my test runs.

@Timeslip
Anything you can make configurable is fine by me.

 

[gracul]

Seems that WorldMapFPS=20 is quite about perfect.

 

[Glovz]

Also, how easy or hard would it be to delve into the engine and find out exactly what specific traits and perks do mechanically (and/or fix them where they don't work properly), how the ammo/armour routines work exactly, how bursts work, and so on and so forth?

Depends. Ask something about a specific perk, and I can probably find it. For ammo/armour, you're better off asking Glovz.

I'm afraid I will not be much help. I have learned the little I know about the damage calculation form others here at the forum. With that knowledge and teaching myself to understand assembly code logic I was able to figure out a way to change the calculation, but I still do not understand how to walk through the exe's code. That's why I asked previously:

Is there any way you could identify where the engine reads .pro file information?

 

[Timeslip]

I'm afraid I will not be much help. I have learned the little I know about the damage calculation form others here at the forum. With that knowledge and teaching myself to understand assembly code logic I was able to figure out a way to change the calculation, but I still do not understand how to walk through the exe's code.

I assumed that Per was asking for the calculations used, rather than the code layout. I thought you'd know some of them already, having spent time modifing them.

That's why I asked previously:

Is there any way you could identify where the engine reads .pro file information?

I haven't had time to look yet. I'll let you know as soon as I do.

 

[Glovz]

I understand the damage calculation just fine, but it is very limited what one can do with it.

@Per
What were you considering when you asked about "ammo/armour routines"?

 

[Per]

@Per
What were you considering when you asked about "ammo/armour routines"?

I was under the impression that they weren't completely worked out. For instance, do we have a model that explains the minor damage variation between 5mm ammo types in Fo1 despite major differences in modifiers?

 

[Alray]

Do these encounter rates seem closer to what those playing years ago remember?

I made a lot of test. I think that these enc. rate quite similar to original F2.
Try patch with a car . At last i feel different areas on map ('hot' - near Navarro and Raiders, 'normal' - near BH). Near raiders I had 2-4 encounters (with a car), and just ~1 near Vault13 - Vault15
Like in 1999.

(And don't forget about outdorsman skill)


And you always can set WorldMapEncounterFix to 0

 

[Glovz]

I was under the impression that they weren't completely worked out. For instance, do we have a model that explains the minor damage variation between 5mm ammo types in Fo1 despite major differences in modifiers?

I don't know enough about FO1 to describe the differences in the damage calculation compared to FO2. I believe I found the damage calculation code block in the FO1 exe but it is different from the FO2 exe code block.

As I said before, thanks to the work done by others and my own research, I can explain exactly how the one code block in the FO2 exe works but that's it.

The FO2 damage formula code block is described here:
http://www.nma-fallout.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10538
But the interpreted formula is incorrect. The calculation cannot really be expressed as a single formula because there are conditions checked for and jumps that occur based on those conditions.

If anyone is interested in a full explanation of the damage calculation code block in the FO2 exe, please let me know and I will start a new thread. (there's a lot to take in )

 

[Deever]

I just want to say that you timeslip and killap are AWESOME!

Bringing life back to fallout universe!

I had never played any mods before this, but now I'm getting more into fallout again because of you guys.

A read through this thread finally shed light for me on what the global.fx thing does, and what the differant filters look like that are in your ddraw

Here's the pics that other people posted in the thread that show the differances, in case anyone else is looking for this info:
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d11/gentduke/compare2.jpg

And the linear filter (admame2x is filter #5 in the above screenshot):
http://dream.maxdsl.ru/img/FalloutFilters.png

 

[Mr.Wolna]

which filter is the best?
I think liniar ist that right?

 

[Deever]

which filter is the best?
I think liniar ist that right?

It's 100% a personal matter. Its whichever you feel is better.
Look at the screenshot showing filters 1-5 and the global.fx
Then look at the one showing filter original with linear on or off, and filter #5 (the admame2x one) with linear on off.
See which one you think looks better and try that.

To a couple people, they like the #5 filter best (the admame2x), and at least one likes the linear as well as #5 on at same time.

But its totally a personal preferance. Depends on how grainy or blurry you like the game, and also what resolution you are running at. If you just run at 640x480 there's not much need for filters if you are happy with original fallout 2 looks

To me, linear by itself and no other filters makes the original kinda blurry. But maybe some like it that way.

 

[Mr.Wolna]

Allrigt, Thanks i will it try by myself!

I just need the glofal.fx for rhe filter and sfall or something other?