Fallout 2 mod FO2 Engine Tweaks (Sfall)

[Timeslip]

While we are at saving. In this thread, we talked about an option that disallowes saving in combat. Any chance for something like this to get added?

That came up ages ago. I can't remember the discussion, but the result was that sfall already has an option to block all saving in combat except for at the very start of the players turn, before any ap are spent. That seemed to fix most of the bugs, but it would be trivial to extend it to block any saving in combat at all if needed. I just suspect that doing so would get the same reaction as the fix to stop hitting zero breaking dialog.

Most of the reports of saving in combat breaking the RP seem to be related to kaga. Tracking down the part of the script that's causing the problem would be a better idea than disallowing saving completely, if it's easy to do so and no problems are cropping up elsewhere.

 

[Lexx]

Ah ok. Didn't know that something like this is in there already. :p

 

[Timeslip]

2.14 is up.

>Added a method of creating critical tables for new critter types
>Added a new option to block all saving in combat (off by default)

The critical tables thing is fairly important, or any mod using the extra kill types option is going to get broken criticals on any of the new types, ranging from using the players critical messages, to always doing 0 damage to always being instadeath, depending on the exact number of the critter. (Thanks to mib88 for prodding me into doing it and doing some testing.)

Edit: Actually, the same issue probably still applies to critical misses... Is there anywhere else the critter type is used that I haven't considered?

 

[Fallout1FTW]

Does sfall support new weapon / item sounds?

 

[.Pixote.]

Can the "Rest until healed" and "Rest until party is healed" function be disabled/removed through Sfall. For players who want the ultimate challenge.

 

[SharkClub]

Can the "Rest until healed" and "Rest until party is healed" function be disabled/removed through Sfall. For players who want the ultimate challenge.

What would stop them from just using "rest until midnight" 5 times until the party is healed. It would just make it less convenient. People who want said "ultimate challenge" could just ignore the option to rest altogether.

 

[Timeslip]

I'd suggest setting the players health regen to 0 while they're on a local map instead. Or all the time, if you want to be really nasty. Or if you wanted to be really really nasty remove the immediate healing properties of stimpaks and have them heal a small amount of damage over time instead. Actually, that sounds like a pretty good idea for a mod... I may have to try doing that.

Edit: And with regards to sound effects, it doesn't let you do anything you can't do already by editing the proto. (Aside from letting you modify the sound effects in the proto mid game.) If you want anything particulaly complicated, the other option is to use an empty acm for the sound file, and then use the play_sfall_sound script function to play a sound effect of your choice.

 

[.Pixote.]

Can the "Rest until healed" and "Rest until party is healed" function be disabled/removed through Sfall. For players who want the ultimate challenge.

What would stop them from just using "rest until midnight" 5 times until the party is healed. It would just make it less convenient. People who want said "ultimate challenge" could just ignore the option to rest altogether.

Then we remove the healing/time relationship altogether...all the sudden Doctor skill becomes useful.

Or if you wanted to be really really nasty remove the immediate healing properties of stimpaks and have them heal a small amount of damage over time instead. Actually, that sounds like a pretty good idea for a mod... I may have to try doing that.

yes....yes...yes...

 

[Timeslip]

Then we remove the healing/time relationship altogether...all the sudden Doctor skill becomes useful.

Which was what I meant by 0 health regen. Although actually, the doctor skill still allows for some cheapness; you could use it, rest, use it, rest and repeat until healed. I'm not sure how best to manage that one... Maybe modify the skillcheck so that it's harder the closer to full health you are, or preventing you from using it if you haven't taken any damage in the last x hours. Perhaps a combination; firstaid only works on recently taken damage, and doctor only when you're badly wounded.

I suspect the npc doctors would get a whole lot of extra business.

 

[Ardent]

I'd suggest setting the players health regen to 0 while they're on a local map instead. Or all the time, if you want to be really nasty.

How would one go about that? I'm guessing the set_hp_per_level_mod(int mod) function is the way to go, but should it be used in a global script or it's OK to use it in the PC script (obj_dude.int) ?

Or if you wanted to be really really nasty remove the immediate healing properties of stimpaks and have them heal a small amount of damage over time instead.

I actually tried that in my mod and it made the game way too difficult - you relied more on luck (the real one) that you won't get hit, than on tactics or your combat prowess. It's because the shortest time for a drug to take effect is 1 minute, which is like 6-10 turns in combat. Considering the scarcity of stimpaks/healing items in my mod, fighting really stopped being fun.

Although actually, the doctor skill still allows for some cheapness; you could use it, rest, use it, rest and repeat until healed. I'm not sure how best to manage that one... Maybe modify the skillcheck so that it's harder the closer to full health you are, or preventing you from using it if you haven't taken any damage in the last x hours

MR will have an overhauled healing system, which allows you to heal more damage the higher the skill, and which prevents you from healing any HP at all if the skill is low and you don't have any healing items (first aid kit, doctor's bag, etc).

 

[Timeslip]

How would one go about that? I'm guessing the set_hp_per_level_mod(int mod) function is the way to go, but should it be used in a global script or it's OK to use it in the PC script (obj_dude.int) ?

No, that one's for changing the extra hp you get each level up. It's a secondary stat; healing rate or something. You'd use 'set_pc_extra_stat(STAT_<whatever it is>, -10000)'.

I actually tried that in my mod and it made the game way too difficult - you relied more on luck (the real one) that you won't get hit, than on tactics or your combat prowess. It's because the shortest time for a drug to take effect is 1 minute, which is like 6-10 turns in combat. Considering the scarcity of stimpaks/healing items in my mod, fighting really stopped being fun.

I was thinking of applying the healing via a script, rather than relying on drug effects. (Although mainly because of only having 3 events to play with, rather than the 1 minute lag thing, which I hadn't considered.)

Maybe to keep things fair the pc should get a couple more hp per level. It would probably take a bit of playtesting to get it all working in a balanced way.

 

[Ardent]

No, that one's for changing the extra hp you get each level up. It's a secondary stat; healing rate or something. You'd use 'set_pc_extra_stat(STAT_<whatever>, -10000)'.

Thanks, I'll give it a try.

I was thinking of applying the healing via a script, rather than relying on drug effects. (Although mainly because of only having 3 events to play with, rather than the 1 minute lag thing, which I hadn't considered.)

Maybe to keep things fair the pc should get a couple more hp per level. It would probably take a bit of playtesting to get it all working in a balanced way.

Oh, then I can't wait for your mod

***

Now, totally off the healing topic, but on the actual topic of this thread:

I was thinking about replacing the Gambling skill with a Deception skill (more info here), to make the game more difficult for Diplomatic players. But in order to do that, I would need to change the way this skill is calculated. I can't remember if you ever said anything if this was implementable or not? (or maybe it's possible to do it already?)

Thanks for some insight on this.

 

[Timeslip]

I was thinking about replacing the Gambling skill with a Deception skill (more info here), to make the game more difficult for Diplomatic players. But in order to do that, I would need to change the way this skill is calculated. I can't remember if you ever said anything if this was implementable or not? (or maybe it's possible to do it already?)

It would be easy to do, but unless I've forgotten about it there's nothing in sfall to do it at the moment. Since it would need to take effect at character creation before any scripts run, I'll add it in the form of an ini file, so you'd write something like 'Skill1=s1|p0.5|c5' to get a skill that has a bonus of 1x str, 0.5x perception and 5x charisma.

 

[Ardent]

It would be easy to do, but unless I've forgotten about it there's nothing in sfall to do it at the moment. Since it would need to take effect at character creation before any scripts run, I'll add it in the form of an ini file, so you'd write something like 'Skill1=s1|p0.5|c5' to get a skill that has a bonus of 1x str, 0.5x perception and 5x charisma.

Awesome! Thanks a lot!

 

[Lexx]

If I remember correct, you wanted to do something for the character creation stuff some time ago, so that there is more freedom in trait editing, etc. as well. :p

 

[Timeslip]

Awesome! Thanks a lot!

And committed to svn. It'll be in 2.15.

There's actually a bit more flexibility than what you get from the normal skill tables; instead of limiting you to 2 stats and an integer multiplier shared by all stats, you can give fractional multipliers, as many stats as you like, and each stat can have a different multiplier. I've also let you modify the skill base and the skill point multiplier. (Which is just 1 for everything normally, so I'm not quite sure what the point was...) I haven't touched the modifiers that come from the difficulty level, or trait modifiers.

If I remember correct, you wanted to do something for the character creation stuff some time ago, so that there is more freedom in trait editing, etc. as well. :p

Editing of traits via config file has been in since 2.0c. (And scripts much much earlier, but that's no use for character creation.)

 

[Lexx]

Yes, but not everything was possible with it. I don't remember exactly what right now, but it must be in the wiki.

/Edit: On the Sfall request page is a link to Here.

 

[Timeslip]

Yes, but not everything was possible with it. I don't remember exactly what right now, but it must be in the wiki.

/Edit: On the Sfall request page is a link to Here.

Ah, so I was. ok, I've commited a way of modifying stats/skills to svn. It doesn't have the freedom to do everything that the original traits can do, because given their wide range of hardcoded effects it's not really practical to have every one of them in a config file. Any effects beyond a simple bonus to a stat or skill will still need to be scripted.

 

[Lexx]

Putting it in here, because it might be related:

I remember from back in the days that there might be a kind of script / dialog limit in Fallout 2. Is that true?

Why I ask: I've hit my 1451 script now (original Fallout 2 + my own) and now instead of dialog text, I can only see Error in the new one. I am pretty sure that the problem lies not in the script itself, because it really isn't all that complicated.

If there is a limit: Any way to get around it?

 

[Ardent]

I remember from back in the days that there might be a kind of script / dialog limit in Fallout 2. Is that true?

Why I ask: I've hit my 1451 script now (original Fallout 2 + my own) and now instead of dialog text, I can only see Error in the new one. I am pretty sure that the problem lies not in the script itself, because it really isn't all that complicated.

If there is a limit: Any way to get around it?

At MR we're at 1834 scripts and counting, and we've been running into the "dialogue bug" frequently. It's as though some positions in the script list generate this error while others not. But since about 1800th script, we're getting this almost 100% of times.

In the mapper, whenever the script reads something from the msg file, it displays error, while in regular game it crashes the game completely.

If there was a possibility to overcome this limitation or pinpoint what the problem is exactly, it would be absolutely awesome.