Dr Fallout
Centurion
And than we have a Middle East influenced by the authoritarian government of Iran, which while still religiously strict is more progressive and secular than Saudi Arabia.
Muuuuuuuslim Baaaaaan! But don't call it that!
- Thread starter Crni Vuk
- Start date
Supreme Shah Ismail
Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?
Iraq couldn't even invade Iran successfully even after a revolution and the Shah's army leadership disappearing. Even with the rest of the world backing them. I doubt the Saudis or even Israel could ever dream of taking on Iran. If anyone else is a major power in the east its not Isreal or the Saudis, its Turkey. Just as large as a population as Iran and just as a defensible.
Dr Fallout
Centurion
A large part of that is because of the terrain, the fact that the Iraqi army sucks, the various Kurdistan nationalists who sided with Iran and because the Iranians were motivated to defend their country. It's not uncommon for a what is seemingly a weak country torn apart by a revolution to be invaded by other nations (case in point, France after the French Revolution when the Austrians invaded). The Saudi's wouldn't be able to take it, but Israel has nukes. And Turkey is pretty powerful, but it barely practices it's influence apart from supporting Syrian Rebels against the Kurds.
MutantScalper
Dogmeat
Big protests at the airports. They've been holding just some average people in detention? So much is happening, even our national media has difficulty staying up to date.
naossano
So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
How many terrorist attacks were suffered on the US soil during Obama two terms, or Bush 2nd terms ? How is it suddenly more important to ban muslim ? Ofcourse, let's not mention the people killed by us citizen with guns on the us soil. Or those killed worldwide by us bombs.
Not saying terrorists don't exist, but it is an extremely minor treat compared with many of those actually faced by us citizens.
Not saying terrorists don't exist, but it is an extremely minor treat compared with many of those actually faced by us citizens.
Yes, but it makes an awesome scape goat and it is a great way to get attention, without actually fighting someone. Like you can not really take the jews these days, since it has become somewhat out of fashion you know, WW2 and and that, the Germans kinda spoiled the fun for everyone in that part. And the Soviets collapsed on their own without permission, so what is left to keep the people frightened?
Do you know what everyone with half a brain really fears? Unified middle east. Imagine if that region would gain some stability and peace for just 10 or 15 years where they actually get together and forming a Union like the EU in Europe. It would be a real power house. However, as strange as it sounds, the middle east and most parts of Africa will be the looser in the future, not because of our military, but because they will suffer the most from the effects of climate change. However, no one can say how things will turn out when it's not 1 million refugees washing up on Europes shores, but 100 million people, over 1 year in 2090 or what ever, when the average temperature has climbed up 4° and a lot of places run out of water and farmable soil. If we don't manage up to this point to at least use around 70 or better 90% of renewable energy as sources our energy needs, we might be really fucked.
But largely seen as a terrorist regime by the US ...
Do you know what everyone with half a brain really fears? Unified middle east. Imagine if that region would gain some stability and peace for just 10 or 15 years where they actually get together and forming a Union like the EU in Europe. It would be a real power house. However, as strange as it sounds, the middle east and most parts of Africa will be the looser in the future, not because of our military, but because they will suffer the most from the effects of climate change. However, no one can say how things will turn out when it's not 1 million refugees washing up on Europes shores, but 100 million people, over 1 year in 2090 or what ever, when the average temperature has climbed up 4° and a lot of places run out of water and farmable soil. If we don't manage up to this point to at least use around 70 or better 90% of renewable energy as sources our energy needs, we might be really fucked.
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Supreme Shah Ismail
Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?
Try justifying the use of nukes on large civilian populations in this day and age to anybody. You would either be out right attacked or lose all support. Lest we not forget the various pro Iran Palestinian groups and the fact every neighbor Israel has hates them and would invade them given the chance. Iran has always been the most powerful nation in the region, maybe not the largest but it could take on anyone else there and win.
I never understood this fear of Iran anyway, when you look at it, they are one of the more progressive regimes down there, as far as islamic nations go. I mean they have lots of females in their parliament for fucks sake.
Supreme Shah Ismail
Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?
The VP for Iran is a women btw. Yes the government can be authoritarian (but so was the Shah, who himself was not a bad man by any means) and unlike the Shah's reign there are now many non secular religious rules (but nowhere near as bad as ISIS or the Saudis) but not only have the rules become so much more lax but its also a legitimate democracy. There are parties with different opposing views, various religious groups/ethnicity's have seats in parliament and so do a lot of women. If you think Iran is some sort of backward uncivilized shanty town of a country you do not know anything about Iran. Only country arguably more progressive and secular is Israel and Turkey. But both country's have huge issues with other ethnic groups (Kurd's and Palestinians) and are very authoritarian.
Also a great post detailing how an US invasion of Iran would be one of the biggest military disasters in US history: https://www.quora.com/What-would-be-the-nature-of-a-US-led-invasion-of-Iran
D
Deleted member 98605
Guest
No one is going to invade Iran, but the USN will wipe the gulf clean and the Israelis *will* strike any nuclear site they see. That I can foresee, if we really have to get into a shootin' war, but an invasion - who is saying to march the Marines to Tehran? That's wholly different. It'll be a smackdown, but not a murder, sort of thing.
Like the UK? I have seen the football hooligan groups UK has in action live, right in front of me while destroying shop windows and breaking cars and attacking the police.
And they were even "educated" people, let me quote a news article about it:
Barbarians and totally uncivilized for sure.
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Supreme Shah Ismail
Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?
Even then it be disastrous, they will retaliate and badly. Just in general its a smart idea not to go to war with Iran. They have just as high chancing of winning as the US/Israel might.
But I feel we are getting a bit off topic, but I did feel I need to stress Iran isn't a war zone nor is it a backwards totalitarian regime. Nor would it be a smart idea or very successful to attack or invade Iran. The Iran ban makes no sense because no Iranians have been terrorists. It shows the ban for what it really is racism and Islamophobia its not utilitarian in the slightest.
D
Deleted member 98605
Guest
I think you overestimate their chances. The USN has already engaged the Iranians in the 80s. The USN objectively won. Israel, as well, has the slant in air force. If the USN denied the Persians the gulf, and the Israelis strike the reactors - which they have done to Syria and Iraq already - there's no real chance of them 'winning'. It wouldn't even be a war, it's denial, strikes. Israel doesn't want Iran to get nukes and will bomb Iranian facilities. The USN can sink every boat and ship the Iranians have in the gulf - easily. The goals of the two powers against Iran are much more tangible and realistic than the Iraqi goals, and since no boots are going to be slogged you'll barely hear a whimper about it.
MutantScalper
Dogmeat
Shooting in a Quebec mosque, at least six dead. Wonder if this is linked to the whole Trump-thing.
Dr Fallout
Centurion
Well firstly, don't target large civilian populations. In this day and age rockets can be so accurate we can target large armies on ground with the help of computers. Secondly, I think if you're going to be raped, it doesn't really matter if others will queue up for a gangbang. Basically, the premise of nuclear warfare is that both powers would rather go down swinging than go down dead, which is why it's dangerous. If Israel, hell if merely the government is to fall utterly, they may think that it's worth bringing down Iran with them.
The problem with that assessment I find is that most other nations are backed by stronger powers like Russia, but specifically the US. They don't have to invade (though I bet that they can and win, no matter what some with person with a political degree will say), just repulse the Iranians, bomb them to shit and isolate them. They'll never really defeat Iran, but turning them into a Muhadjeen style guerrilla state or weak government would be good enough. Although all of this is conjecture, and doubtful to happen. Unless Iran tries to violently expand (not gonna happen), the US and Israel won't get into a fight. Hopefully. Iran and Turkey are the best hope for the Middle East.
"The immigration ban excempts muslim countries where The Trump Organization owns golf courses and real estate".
While it is admirable to finally a see a politician actually do all the things verbatim that he promised during the campaign, it's not all that great that it had to be this one...
But the good thing is that he's pushing for safe zones in Syria and so on, providing aid where it's needed, because it's kinda silly to let people travel half the globe through dozens of safe countries and still call them "refugees" if we're being honest. Providing help locally is definitely the way to go... Although recent reports from libyan refugee camps indicate that these camps are seriously bad. Like, concentration camp bad, where smugglers randomly shoot people. Which just goes to show that the aid needs to be provided locally, and not after they travelled literally to another continent.
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Dr Fallout
Centurion
Iran's the odd one out. All the rest have unstable or tottering governments that make background checks impossible or even hard to do. That would be my excuse, but the inclusion of Iran just turns it into a political (perhaps business) move, rather than an attempt to create a safer America.
Throatpunch
Banned
Islam is a barbarous religion.
So by logical extension Muslim majority countries are......
Even without the invasions its a joke. They stone gays, kill adulterers and much more horrid stuff. All of this is endorsed in the Koran.
Thats pretty barbarous
God I wish that guy were still here.
mʌɪˈnɒrɪti,mɪˈnɒrɪti/
noun
So by logical extension Muslim majority countries are......
Even without the invasions its a joke. They stone gays, kill adulterers and much more horrid stuff. All of this is endorsed in the Koran.
Thats pretty barbarous
The LRA is a minority within Christianity. Most Muslims are at least vaguely extremist. Go check some of Vergils old posts for stats.
God I wish that guy were still here.
Minority
mʌɪˈnɒrɪti,mɪˈnɒrɪti/
noun
- the smaller number or part, especially a number or part representing less than half of the whole.
"only a minority of properties are rented"
The majority religion of these countries is barbaric and uncivilized
This really rustles my jimmies.
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MutantScalper
Dogmeat
Doesn't Iraq still have like, a puppet regime installed by USA? And now the puppet regime banned Americans from coming to Iraq.
Doomsdaypreppe
r never disappoints.
r never disappoints.