Neo-Nazis on-line?

welsh

Junkmaster
There has been quite a bit of work done on how the internet can be used as a means to organize resistance against repressive regimes. For example, many look to the use of the internet to protest human rights abuses in Burma, or to criticize middle eastern regimes. The internet played a major role in Howard Dean's campaign.

So we know that the internet can be used for political purposes.

But what about using the internet for right-wing extremism? And why does seem to be gathering strength?

Also, who are the architects behind these communities and what do they wish to achieve?

Long article here- but worth reading if you are interested in such community boards and how they can be used for political purposes.

Electronic Storm
Stormfront grows a thriving neo-Nazi community
By T.K. Kim

On most days, the man once labeled a "near genius" in a Time magazine article spends the bulk of his time in an office of the Mandeville, La., home of infamous white supremacist David Duke.
There, Jamie Kelso whips across Duke's hardwood floors on a wheeled office chair as he attends to his work: monitoring the burgeoning community of the racist Stormfront Web site on one of six different computers.

To the thousands of white supremacists who regularly visit Stormfront and its forum, Kelso is best known by his e-moniker, "Charles A Lindbergh." He signs off all his posts with a quote from Lindbergh, a well-known racist and anti-Semite: "We can have peace and security only as long as we band together to preserve that most priceless possession, our inheritance of European blood."

"I admire the aviator so much, " Kelso says.

The aviator, were he still alive, might well admire Kelso. As Stormfront celebrates its 10th birthday — the first major hate site on the Internet, it was created by former Alabama Klan leader Don Black in 1995 — Kelso has much to be proud of. In the three years he's been a senior moderator of the site, it has grown from fewer than 10,000 registered users to, as of mid-June, an astounding 52,566. And while many thousands of that ever-growing total probably haven't visited in years, independent Web monitors recently ranked Stormfront the 338th largest electronic forum on the Internet, putting it easily into the top 1% of all sites on the World Wide Web.

Black and Kelso have created something more than just another hate site that draws people for a few months, then fades for lack of interest. Using everything from good manners to "white scholarships" to such catchy gimmicks as highlighting its members' birthdays, these two men have built something that very few people on the entire Internet have — a genuine and very large cyber-community. That they did it at a time when major neo-Nazi groups are on the decline is merely icing.

"Without a doubt," Bob DeMarais, a former staff member of the neo-Nazi National Alliance (see related story), wrote recently, "Stormfront is the most powerful active influence in the White Nationalist movement."

Want to find the latest headlines on black-on-white crime? Go to Stormfront. New developments in the National Alliance's leadership woes? Go to Stormfront. Details of yet another nefarious Jewish conspiracy? Go to Stormfront.

Stormfront's recent growth spurt is only the beginning, Kelso says. He and Black share a larger goal, one that their friend Duke also tried with a fair measure of success — establishing real legitimacy in the realm of public opinion.

Fade to Black
It began with Don Black.

Going back to high school, Black had always been one of the more enthusiastic proponents of white power. One of his first forays into the organized movement was in the 1970s, when he volunteered for the late white supremacist J.B. Stoner's unsuccessful run for governor of Georgia.

That was until Stoner's campaign manager, Jerry Ray, the brother of Martin Luther King Jr. assassin James Earl Ray, shot him in the chest. The shooting apparently stemmed from accusations that Black had broken into Stoner's office to steal a mailing list for the National Socialist White People's Party.

After recovering, Black went on to join the Knights of the Ku Klux Klan, the group headed by Duke in the 1970s. Working on Duke's unsuccessful campaign for Louisiana state senate, Black won Duke's trust, moving up to become his mentor's right-hand man. When Duke left the group amid allegations that he'd tried to sell its membership list to another Klan group for $35,000, Black took over.

But Black quickly got into trouble himself. In 1981, he and nine other white supremacists were arrested as they prepared to board a yacht with which they intended to invade the tiny Caribbean island of Dominica, oust its black-run government, and transform it into a "white state."

Black's resulting three-year prison sentence was time well spent. He took classes in computer programming that would provide the basis for his future.

Not long after his release, Black launched an abysmally unsuccessful campaign for a U.S. Senate seat from Alabama. He wound up marrying Duke's ex-wife, Chloe, and moving to West Palm Beach, Fla. Once there, he began dabbling with his computer, eventually setting up a dial-up bulletin board service for the radical right. By March 1995, that service evolved into Stormfront, the Net's best-known hate site.

Black saw clearly that with this new technology, white supremacists might finally bypass the mainstream media and political apparatus, getting their message out to people who otherwise would never hear it — people who now could listen in the privacy of their own homes without fear of embarrassment or reproach. "The potential of the Net for organizations and movements such as ours is enormous," Black told the Philadelphia Inquirer in 1996. "We're reaching tens of thousands of people who never before had access to our point of view."

Being the first of its kind helped Stormfront win enormous publicity. Black and his site were written up in newspapers around the country and the world, and he frequently appeared on major network news shows like abc's "Nightline," where, clad in suit and tie, he talked politely about allowing people access to information not filtered by the "media monopoly." Though he undoubtedly turned off many viewers, each major TV appearance led to a spike in visitors to Stormfront.

This Just In
Like a morning roll call, the posts pour in each day. Below the Stormfront motto, "White Pride World Wide," links to news stories with a racial angle light up the page, complete with headlines home-crafted by the members.
"Mestizo Rapes White Woman in Elevator," shouts one.

"Negro Man Stabs Elderly Woman, Shoots Detective, Negroes Screaming 'Police Brutality,'" another breathlessly reports.

And the list goes on.

But one thing you won't normally find on Stormfront are racial slurs. In fact, new members are explicitly warned not to use such language, and also not to post violent threats or anything describing illegal activity. Black clearly has modeled his site on some of the tactics used by Duke, who famously urged his Klan followers to "get out of the cow pasture and into hotel meeting rooms." As Black once told a reporter, "We don't use the 'nigger, nigger' type of approaches."

When New Jersey neo-Nazi Hal Turner began posting incendiary comments this March about a federal judge whose family was murdered, he was rapidly excommunicated. "[T]hey are so afraid of rocking the ZOG [Zionist Occupation Government] boat that they scurry around behind the scenes censoring posts of folks who are strong enough to speak the plain truth," Turner fumed later.

It's not that Stormfront is about moderation — hardly. The talk is all about the evils of African Americans, homosexuals, non-white immigrants, and, above all, Jews, who are blamed for most of what's wrong in the world.

As pointed out by Cass Sunstein, the University of Chicago law professor who wrote the 2001 book republic.com, "Extremists and hate-filled sites tend to attract likeminded people who, if isolated, could come to their senses." Likeminded people talking to one another, Sunstein says, "tend to become more extremist."

But it's all done with a tone of simmering civility. "One of the things that Don Black does very well is he doesn't fit the stereotype of an angry man," Kelso proudly told the Intelligence Report in a lengthy interview recently. "Don is the most under-recognized giant in the whole white nationalist movement."

Kelso, who was featured in a 1960s Time article about teenagers in the Los Angeles suburbs, personifies the approach. Animated and cordial, he happily offers to set up a Stormfront account for an Intelligence Report writer. He exudes a kind of grandfatherly charm — the same charm that he exhibits in some of his postings, and in his tireless welcoming of new members to the Stormfront community.

It is, Kelso says, "a positive spiritual approach."

Building Community
Stormfront — along with the many lesser radical forums on the Internet (see The Forums sidebar) — has always done better than the much more numerous hate Web pages.

Whereas typical hate sites function as one-way transfers of information — rather like a brochure posted in a grocery store that can be read but cannot be responded to — Stormfront has always been organized as a message board. Members can post opinions, listen to others respond, then post more feedback for all to read. The potential for dialogues to develop was built in — and, therefore, so was the potential to develop a genuine white supremacist cyber-community.

"The great power of the Internet is it allows people who don't know each other ... to connect with people with shared interests," says Howard Rheingold, an Internet theorist and author. "The shared interests might be that 'I have a kid with leukemia.' Or, 'I'm a Nazi.' It gives marginalized people more power."

Black and Kelso, both men who could put up a relatively clean-cut and civilized front, saw eye to eye on the possibilities.

So when Jamie Kelso joined Stormfront about three years ago, he successfully began pushing for leading movement writers — men like Sam Dickson, a leader of the white supremacist Council of Conservative Citizens, and Willis Carto, publisher of the Holocaust-denying journal The Barnes Review — to start posting.

That was just part of an effort to make the site more inclusive.

Although the forum has recently censored some posts critical of the National Alliance — a major neo-Nazi group undergoing an internal civil war — it generally has tried to maintain a relatively non-sectarian stance, making people from different sectors of the radical right feel welcome to join in. As Black once told a reporter for Newhouse News Service, "Anyone can work to promote our ideas without being a member of any organization. I used to be annoyed by people who didn't join my organization, but I see the advantage now."

Black and Kelso take care to avoid appearing dictatorial. One result is that the forum, within the bounds of the radical right, feels very democratic — a gathering of people with similar interests in what increasingly looks like a community.

Every member gets to choose a graphic to accompany their postings.

Little smiley faces and other signs abound. It's not unusual to spot two members using an animation where the faces toast with mugs of beer.

There is a list of birthdays of members on the main page. Birthday greetings are frequently exchanged, along with notes of consolation or encouragement.

There are essay contests and $2,000 scholarships for white kids.

And, to encourage the shy, Kelso frequently starts innocuous threads to get people to start joining in the conversation. "Where is Your Home?" Kelso asks at the head of one. Or, atop another, "What inspired your screen name?"

The results have been fairly spectacular. In January 2002, Stormfront had a mere 5,000 members. A year later, membership reached 11,000; and a year after that, in early 2004, it had 23,000. By January 2005, membership hit about 42,000, and it finally topped 52,000 this June. In the last year, a Kelso analysis showed, the site has been gaining an average of almost 500 new members every week.

That doesn't include the large numbers of those who simply read Stormfront postings without joining up (becoming a member allows one to post messages and also to view personal information posted by other members). All together, total traffic to the site gave it an Alexa Web monitor ranking this June of the 8,682nd most visited site on the Internet — a rank well above that of most civil rights sites.

Bob DeMarais, for one, sees Kelso as integral to Stormfront's success. "Jamie Kelso did much of the marketing and promotion responsible for Stormfront's recent growth spurt," DeMarais wrote recently. "Kelso has a knack for making new people feel welcome and getting them to start posting."

But Does It Matter?
With Stormfront growing every day, a larger question has developed: What does it mean for the movement?
The site is very unlike a traditional hate group. There is no formal hierarchy, even though Black and Kelso run the site, and no charismatic leader issues orders. That's one reason that Devin Burghart, who analyzes hate groups for the Center for New Community in Chicago, doesn't think that Stormfront has the potential to be much more than a sounding board for angry racists. He also points out that for every white supremacist kept busy posting messages on his or her computer screen, there is one less person available to be out in the neighborhoods organizing.

Other experts see some organizing possibilities.

"While you can certainly build a community online, it [only] thrives with face-to-face interaction," said John Palfrey, executive director of the Berkman Center for Internet and Society at Harvard Law School. "Starting with the Internet, however, might not be a terrible idea."

That's what Joe Trippi did. As the first manager of the presidential campaign of Howard Dean, he raised immense sums and also got people out of their homes and into the campaign — all via the Internet. "What you've got to do, is you have to have two-way communication," Trippi explained in an interview. "It's the bond, to be able to talk to each other about you, that is important."

David Weinberger, who served as senior Internet advisor under Trippi and is now a fellow at the Berkman Center, agreed. "The left and the right can do the same thing," he told the Intelligence Report. "The Net can do the same thing for racists as it did for the Dean campaign. Treating your readers not as readers but as participants is a really good way of creating community and getting supporters."

There are already some signs that Stormfront's cyber-community may be developing, at least in some places, into physical community. Earlier this year, a group of members got together in San Diego for the first time.

"We just talked about whatever came to mind for three and a half hours or so," one wrote afterward. "We all want to start doing this on a regular basis in order to foster camaraderie and group cohesion. ... We wish to have larger and larger numbers of people coming out with each successive get-together."

The event, another wrote back, "is only the beginning for bigger and better things to come. Eventually, there will be political organization and activity."

All this is music to Jamie Kelso.

"You always want to paint your opponents in the worst possible light," Kelso said of antiracist activists and other Stormfront detractors. "That becomes hard to do when an organization reaches large numbers. It's not plausible to say hundreds of thousands of people are nuts. We're striving to be seen as our own kind of mainstream, and that we're not kooky."

The recent successes of Stormfront have been, as Trippi would say, "viral." More than 70 people a day are joining the forum, and although some are mere tourists or even antiracist researchers, huge numbers are potential true believers. If Black and Kelso continue to succeed — if Stormfront members increasingly come out from behind their computer monitors and get into the streets — it could turn out that the forum becomes one of the real pillars of American radicalism. Kelso, always the optimist, predicts reaching a membership of 500,000 by 2010.

That is probably unrealistic. But the possibility has veterans of the Internet and the world of real competitive politics worried. "I'd hate to think," Trippi says, "what Hitler could've done with the Internet."
 
The Net is a medium.
A medium (per socioscientific definition) transports information.
The Net is a largely uncontrolled, unfiltered and uncensored medium.
Ideologies, conspiracy theories and stupidity is information.

So, your point being?
 
I rather think its interesting-
(1) How these folks use the internet
(2) Why they use the internet
(3) What their goals are.

Are neo-nazi's a good thing?

(Depends if you are a neo-nazi?)
 
It amazes me how someone stupid enough to be a neo-nazi is still able to use a computer and the internet...


Fucking Windows...
 
DirtyDreamDesigner said:
It amazes me how someone stupid enough to be a neo-nazi is still able to use a computer and the internet...
No, the other way round.
How can someone who is intelligent enough for creating not just a website, but a whole online community and keeps it running be such moronic and still be a neo-nazi?

And again: Intelligence and ignorance are obviously not related :cry:
 
Member of Khans said:
No, the other way round.
How can someone who is intelligent enough for creating not just a website, but a whole online community and keeps it running be such moronic and still be a neo-nazi?

And again: Intelligence and ignorance are obviously not related :cry:

It's simple, from a psychology standpoint. It is a way of getting attention for being "bad" like every 14 year-old has in some form. For logic to be thrown to the wind in light of this, it is for simpler reasons like wanting attention, and what better way to get attention than by creating a place for similar attention-craving mental children?
 
T.K. Kim said:
That was until Stoner's campaign manager, Jerry Ray, the brother of Martin Luther King Jr. assassin James Earl Ray, shot him in the chest. The shooting apparently stemmed from accusations that Black had broken into Stoner's office to steal a mailing list for the National Socialist White People's Party.

It's nice to see that white supremacists are perfectly rational.
 
As long as it does not affect to manny dumbasses i'm not afraid.
If it affects too many ignorant fools then they might realise that they can get power by organising, and then all hell is lose. The Dilema of democrasy; even the one that fights to bring the democrasy down are allowed to vote and to have power.
 
Thing is- this is like Fox News...

It's not about truth or honesty or even critical thinking. It's more about validating one's own opinion- no matter how moronic that opinion might be.

We've had a number of these white supremist assholes post here, attempting valid arguments.

But it's silly. The white supremist argument is just so full inconsistencies and logical holes that it doesn't hold up.

So why perpetuate it? Because ti makes you feel good about yourself? By making it seem that you are superior to someone else by birthright?

Fucking stupid.

You want to feel superior and you want to be respected, try to earn that respect.
(Unless you're W and then you get to be president by birthright- sorry got to Bush bash).
 
Loxley said:
all hell is lose.
Purgatory for teh win!

In other news, Skinheads are even bigger in Russia then in the US. Which is terrifying considering most of them are directly related to veterans of what is still called The Great Patriotic War and also considering just how many people died because of Nazi aggression. Neo Nazi crime is a massive problem all over Russia, targeting essentially all Ethnicites and of course, Jews. Worse by far then Communist extremist parties who tend to just talk a good game without any action. At least they are beaten, arrested and their head-quarters are condemned and locked up.

One of the few good things I can say about Putin. He doesn't take no shit from Nazis.
 
(The neo-nazi chatroom any given thursday...)

-
-JewH8ter: Do u h8te teh jeWs?
-girlhitler: Yer...
-JewH8ter: Yor a gurl?
-girlhitler: Uh huh ya
-JewH8ter: Lets cyBar!
-

:lol: ,
The Vault Dweller
 
What's wrong with neo-Nazis? A lot of my friends are neo-Nazis and they're okay. Sure, they kinda sorta worship Hitler and his croonies, but hey: everyone needs some sort of rolemodel, you know? And Hitler wasn't all that bad. Okay, so he was responsible for the death of a couple of million jews, but let us not forget that he was also the driving force behind the creation of the VW Beetle, an affordable car of which several millions were produced and a real gem compared to most cars.
Plus, let us certainly not forget that a lot of neo-Nazis have very good reasons to be what they are. One of my closest friends, Achmed Ben Al-Mud Hatar, only became a neo-Nazi because his parents were killed by jews. The same goes for Mohammed Hassan Il-Yer Gutan, my neighbour, and Bechir Hulam Ufer, the guy who has to serve kebab 14 hours a day, only because his rich family was not allowed to live in Jerusalem anymore, being forced out of their homeland by jews, goddammit.
Don't get me wrong: when I first met them, I was also highly sceptical about their attitude and beliefs, but they made it perfecty clear to me that this scepticism of mine was just another form of racism.
"Are you calling me a nigger?" said Achmed Ben Al-Mud Hatar, the very first time I met him. I had made a remark about the swastika tattoo on his arm.
I hesitated to say 'yes' since he was pointing a knife at my stomach.
"No," I said. "I mean: sure, you're a coloured person and all, but colour is only skindeep and shit, and underneath all of that pigment you are just like me, all bones and intestines filled with shit and piss."
After years of being brainwashed by my progressive teachers at school and all the progressive politicians that rule my country, I knew exactly what to say. Achmed Ben Al-Mud Hatar was very pleased with that answer. He lowered the knife just a little. The blade was now pointing at my penis.
"Alright," he said, "I see that your own beliefs and instincts, your quite normal fear for the strange and the unknown, have been thoroughly destroyed by your tutors. That is a good thing. But it is not enough. Tutors can be liars still. And mind my words, whitey: they have told you lies. I'm sure they told you that Napoleon Bonaparte was a hero and that Adolph Hitler was a villain, aren't I right?"
I nodded. It felt like the only reasonable thing to do, what with the blade of a large bowie knife practically touching my dick.
Mohammed Hassan Il-Yer Gutan started laughing.
"Whitey is a fast learner," he said as he lighted another reefer.
"Well now," said Achmed Ben Al-Mud Hatar, "would you call me a villain because I am a muslim? Would you? Would you dare to call me a bad guy just because I believe in the holy words of Allah which were written down by Himself in the Quran?"
I could tell he was getting a little stressed. His hand was shaking and the tip of the blade was piercing through my pants and into my balls. It was a strange sensation. It hurt, but it wasn't totally unpleasant. I wanted it to stop, but not just yet. Achmed Ben Al-Mud Hatar looked straight into my eyes.
"No," I whispered, "of course not. I would never make fun of your religion nor of your beliefs. You have the right to believe in whatever you like. If I were to tell you that you can't, I would be a no good racist."
I was again quoting my teachers from high school and various highly intelligent politicians I had seen on television, a great medium that enables humans to form their own opinions and become individuals with very distinct and interesting personalities.
Achmed Ben Al-Mud Hatar was pleased with my answer.
"But," he said, "then how can you be sceptical about the swastika on my arm? That swastika is a symbol, not unlike the crucifix of Christianity or the crescent moon of Islam. It is something very dear to me and my friends here. It expresses that I believe the words of Adolph Hitler written down in his bestselling book Mein Kampf, a book as holy and true as your bible or my Quran."
I was silent for a moment. I felt dumb to not have figured that out myself. I had been intolerant towards people of different beliefs and so had all my teachers and all those politicians who had told me how to behave and be a good citizen. We had made the worst mistake imaginable. We were less progressive than we had thought. I felt miserable and ashamed.
"Well, whitey?" said Achmed Ben Al-Mud Hatar.
"I'm so sorry," I said, "I didn't realize how shortsighted I was. You have opened my eyes. I was a racist and I didn't even know. I feel like crying."
"No need for that," said Achmed Ben Al-Mud Hatar. "I'm sure you will not forget what we have told you here today. You have to open your mind and accept that other people have other beliefs."
"I do now," I said, "I will never make that mistake again."
I was a little dazed and confused and just wanted to go home to think everything over.
"Whoah, whoah, whoah," said Bechir Hulam Ufer, "not so fast, whitey. You insulted us and we just can't forgive you yet."
"What do you mean," I said.
All of a sudden I got scared. Achmed Ben Al-Mud Hatar was still wielding that bowie knife and Bechir Hulam Ufer was holding a similar weapon.
"You're going to have to promise to us that you will accept us for who we are and for what we believe in," said Mohammed Hassan Il-Yer Gutan.
"Yeah," said Bechir Hulam Ufer, "and the only way you can do that is by getting on all fours and offering us your little ass."
"But..." I said.
"Yeah," said Achmed Ben Al-Mud Hatar, "that's right: you're going to offer us your butt."
And that's what I did, brethren. After trying to make a fool of three coloured people with different beliefs, it was the least I could do. So I got on all fours and opened up for my new neo-Nazi friends. It was painful, sure, but I felt I deserved it after acting like such an intolerant fool. That day I promised myself to never make such a mistake ever again. Which is why I say: "What's so awfully wrong with Neo-nazis? They're people just like you and me, you know? So stop being a racist, stop being intolerant, and open your mind. You'll feel so much better once you realize that no one is right and no one is wrong. We're all brothers and sisters. The only thing we really need is love."

alec
 
Although I've said this elsewhere already, I'll just say it again:

Neo-nazis aren't neccessarily stupid. The same goes for anarchists, fascists, Jehova's Wittnesses and all kinds of other folks.

It's just that their views are incompatible with yours or mine.

From a natural survivalist point of view being a racist and treating foreigners as untermenschen is a decent concept. That doesn't mean it's compatible with the social system we've established throughout the past couple of hundred (or thousand) years in Europe, though.

Our altruistic society doesn't have any legitimation. We consider it to be a Good Thing, yes, but we can't legitimate it without introducing a-priori concepts like the human "mind" or some divine entity.
From that POV, it makes a lot more sense not to have any respect for humans you do not depend on at all than to treat them as your equals for some esotherical reasons.

Granted, I doubt most nazis think that far, but the same is true for the majority of any other "movement" or group (I don't think Feminism would have that much support if the majority of people thought the whole thing through).
 
Ashmo said:
Although I've said this elsewhere already, I'll just say it again:

Neo-nazis aren't neccessarily stupid. The same goes for anarchists, fascists, Jehova's Wittnesses and all kinds of other folks.

It's just that their views are incompatible with yours or mine.

From a natural survivalist point of view being a racist and treating foreigners as untermenschen is a decent concept. That doesn't mean it's compatible with the social system we've established throughout the past couple of hundred (or thousand) years in Europe, though.

Our altruistic society doesn't have any legitimation. We consider it to be a Good Thing, yes, but we can't legitimate it without introducing a-priori concepts like the human "mind" or some divine entity.
From that POV, it makes a lot more sense not to have any respect for humans you do not depend on at all than to treat them as your equals for some esotherical reasons.

Granted, I doubt most nazis think that far, but the same is true for the majority of any other "movement" or group (I don't think Feminism would have that much support if the majority of people thought the whole thing through).
But in this case you are assuming that the goal of any group should be to ensure the 'survival' of only its own people.
Usually, though, this isn't even the best course of action, especially if you look at synergy effects.

As for the article, I find the contrast with the one-way communication in the 1930s interesting. Where Hitler's charismatic and frantic speeches roused many people then, now it is the possibility to talk back that draws a lot of people in, apparently.
 
Good point Sander. People live for positive reinforcement. If you get some dipshit teenage who thinks ok to hate a person because of their race, religion or other beliefs, than isolated he might feel embattered or on the defensive. But if you get two of these kids talking to each other, you have an ally. If you get more, you get lots of positive self-love going on.

So maybe this thing is really just about masturbation of one's ego? Stroke each other off and feel good about it.

Good story Alec. Good to see you have learned a lesson in tolerance.
 
Insanity isn't a little bit of xenophobia. That is purely human nature.

Using insane excuses to rationalize it, just like every Neo-Nazi has, is what makes me consider the whole bunch of them to be absolutely batshit. Even Satanism has some logic value to it. Irrational acute xenophobia is a common point of, surprise surprise, sociopathic tendencies. And exactly what is it about Hitler that impresses these kids? Oh, yes, the sociopathic tendencies. See the point here?

So they would have to come up with a better set of reasons why I should consider any Neo-Nazi to be above others, just because they say so for insane reasons. On the contrast, people here know I do admire Hideki Tojo, for being someone who committed multiple war crimes but took responsibility for them - a measure of integrity many modern US politicians do NOT have.

But that doesn't make me adopt his doctrine to kill off Chinese or anything like that...that would be insane. That is the difference between learning wisdom from the past, and insanely idolizing someone or a mentality that was greater up on the sociopathic food chain than these kids could ever do with their probably comparatively worthless lives. Even some good came from Hitler's presence in the world, from someone's perspective. However, I still have yet to find much of a use for the meth'd out Spun Valley trash that comprises the local brand of Neo-Nazi mentality. :D
 
Roshambo said:
However, I still have yet to find much of a use for the meth'd out Spun Valley trash that comprises the local brand of Neo-Nazi mentality. :D


Correct me if I am wrong, but wouldn't these Neo-Nazis themselves be considered 'race traitors'? I seem to recall from reading Shirer's "Rise and Fall of the Third Reich" that while deviants were allowed at first, over time people who exhibited glaring personality defects in and of themselves were eliminated as well. Not that I brushed up on Nazi philosophy or anything, but wouldn't a meth junkie be considered a waste on society, and hence would be desirous to remove them from the 'hard-working' white mainstream?

Rather ironic.
 
All I can say to that is, indeed. Now you know my chagrin with these people. It just makes no sense.

I really don't see the drunken redneck to be of any greater supposed social worth, but I have yet to see that as well.

Although, I do have to hand them one thing. They are, by definition, discriminating. That kind of discrimination can be a good thing, sometimes. Take for example a recent KKK parade, and then the riots in response to it. At least if you're a minority around the KKK, you only have to be faster than other minorities. If you suddenly find yourself in the middle of the riot in response to the KKK, run for your life or grab something, otherwise you might get your ass beat no matter what color. :D
 
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