new critters

welsh

welsh

Junkmaster
One thing that I was somewhat disappointed with in Fallout 2 was the lack of new interesting critters. The aliens were kind of fun to look at, the geckos had their use but I thought they could have used more interesting creatures.

Can't remember if F02 introduced giant rats. But one thing I did like in Tactics were the cockroaches and the giant rats.

What kind of new critters would you like to see in Fallout 3?
 
welsh said:
Can't remember if F02 introduced giant rats. But one thing I did like in Tactics were the cockroaches and the giant rats.
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Fallout already had normal rats, mole rats and pig rats.

Fallout 2 introduced the wanamingos/aliens, small deatclaws, small radscorpions, mantis (which weren't used properly, they could've added a bit more to the game) and the geckos, which added a bit to the game, but not much either.

There were no awesome opponents in Fallout 2. The first time you met the deathclaws in Fallout, you had to run. Hard. God that ruled...

I wouldn't worry too much about NEW critters in Fallout 3, but one thing they definitely would have to do is restore the Deathclaws to their former positions of "dude, those things are cool". In Fallout 2 they were actually weaker than the frikkin' aliens, while in Fallout they were tougher than most super-mutants...
 
Wern't Mantis in Fallout 1. I remember them on the caravan missions.

Deathclaw should defenitly become as they were before.

I remember finding out about the deathclaws for the first time in Fallout. Talking to people and not getting straight answers apart from horrible story's about huge demon like creatures.

When i found out that they stood between the the town and gun runners i was actually scared to venture into that place.
i remember getting all prepared to go in there and confront them, my best weapons, tons of stims and grenades. When i saw one for the first time i nearly creamed my pants. Then i got the mission to kill them and got my ass kicked all over the place by just one.
I was gobbed smacked. I didn't dare fight them again, kept sneaky along the bottom of the map untill i meade it across with out being noticed.

But anyways, enough about deathclaws. What about snakes? Not very original but many could have survived easily in the wastes. Radiation could have slightly mutated them a bit giving the creatures a little power.

Just gessing here but i have to start some where...
 
deathclaws

Yes, I remember the Mantis from FO1 and also the Spore plant in Fallout 2.

And they definitely need to do more with the deathclaw. In FO 2 they were so easy to kill and in Tactics.... as Rosh says, sheep claws.

Still, new and interesting bad monsters would be enjoyable. Especially if one needed to be clever in avoiding or overcoming them.
 
Hm. Didn't Fallout 2 also introduce ants, wild dogs and wolves?

Maybe Fallout 3 should feature some sort of giant spider, like the the crystal spiders in Arcanum. Or hairy ones that suck the life out of your body...

Hehe.
 
i was actually sick of fighting ants and scorpians and rats and other stupid shit. Maybe if the developers had more than 3 different skins for humans you wouldnt get tired of fighting them.
 
i was actually sick of fighting ants and scorpians and rats and other stupid shit. Maybe if the developers had more than 3 different skins for humans you wouldnt get tired of fighting them.
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yes, this is true.
I was sic of this tiny monsers, they were boring to kill...
And in fallout 3 there should be more human skins!
 
But actually what you guys are getting at are two problems-

(1) that the monster-creature-critter encounters are too easy and generally not very imaginative. Aliens slapping you around with the floppy radiation "hands?" I liked the spitting cockroaches and loved the graphic on the fire geckos. But most of the monsters are pretty lame. I mean how many variety of human riff-raff do you need (gangs, maurders, highwaymen?) . The difference between a dog and a wolf to a character with an SMG is really just more experience.

Wolves, ants, rad scorpions, most bugs, dogs, most people are little more than fodder for experience points and get boring as the game progresses.

They need something more interesting.

For example, not sure how many of you enjoyed Half-Life. I know I did. I loved the variety of critters you came across from the head crabs to the ones that materialized all around you. But one of the best parts of that game was the giant tentacle in the furnace that you had to cleverly negotiate around. I realize that doing something like that would be difficult for Fallout, but the reason why good critters are good is because they are more than an easy kill but also create some sort of depth to the story and complexity for the players.

(2) The second problem that you guys are talking about is levelling up. In both FO1 and 2 the characters level up way to fast. Near the end of FO 1, once you got the armor and the turbo plasma rifle, the game is too easy. Easy games get boring.

Fallout 3 needs to go at a slower pace, make experience harder to get, allow leveling to take longer to go through and make the encounters with non-humans more interesting.
 
Well I would actually like to see less critters altogether. Humans Mutants and ghouls are fine for me with the *occasional* rabid dog pack or radscorpion nest etc. I always thought the Geckos were just plain silly and obviously Deathclaws were completely fucked up in 2. I agree completely with Rogue - DCs in Fo1 scared the crap outta me before I ever ran into them.
But at this rate (given the recent development plans) we will probably see dragons in FO3.
 
The Interplay team could at least double the amount of critters in the game with no worries at all. What would be nice though, is if they made different skins for the Human people. I'm sick of seeing that guy in yellow pyjamas, and that dude in the green clothes.
 
By new critters you mean cool monsters to kill?
Don't know about the rats, rat attack never bothered me. Just get a big gun, preferrably a flamethrower, or a grenade - it's easy AND fun!

Snakes are a nice idea, although personally I'd prefer to have them set up as poison traps around desert settlements as opposed to a kill-able creature.

You can have mutant vultures, wild dogs, or a rat family that feed on dead bodies in areas uninhabitable by humans (old military installations, basements, abandoned mines, ghost town) some time after you kill the big animal/human.

Give raider gangs a few attack dogs, too - for variety.
 
but the levelling shouldn't be going as slow as in e.g the baldur's gate games, because when it takes that much time to gain a new level i would get sic of the game pretty fast. And yeah there should be some really powerful enemies in fo3 that will both scare the shit out of you and be very powerful at the same time. The monsters should also more often do different attacks (at least the animations and they might be able to cripple your hand or something with their claws (just a bad suggestion but such things might be a good addition to the game)), like a radscorpion using it's tail to sting and using it's claws to crush or some such... And the game should have a good tutorial like e.g the one in aoe2 (age of empires 2). It would be a rather good idead for sales purposes to have a multiplayer part, as long as it will be made well and work well with the rest of the game, as i think JE sawyer mentioned.
The game should be interesting and you should be stuck to the screen from the intro of the game till its ending. That way i've never yet felt in any game, because small elements of irritation has always been apperant. What would have been great was that if the world around you did move on and things happen whilst you were wandering around, and people went by their normal business...Yeah and there should be a lot more skins for the humans (and the ghouls/mutants as well). And i think the car in fo2 was appropriate except for the battle part AND the bugs associated to it before the patches were released...


***And i know i should use paragraphs but i'm too darned tired to do that now..
 
I agree, that leveling up could take too long and bore characters. One thing I did like in Fallout was that character levels didn't change the game that much. You only got a few health points and a few skill points but getting the perks were rare and most of the early perks weren't that helpful (although a few like awareness were very important).

But more traps would be interesting. More big bad critters would be great. A giant cockroach is only so effective, but I loved the talking rats in FO2.

At the same time, the aliens in the hold of the tanker just seemed like laziness. "Oh we need to make this tanker story more interesting so lets create a monster in the ship and use aliens. It worked for Redding." Come on. If they wanted a monster in the ship, it could have been more interesting. Imagine, for instance, having the character explore a dark hold where they really can't see much and encounter something nasty, like a mutant octopus that's using the ship as a source of food, or some other predator that we haven't seen before. Perhpas it's killing the crew one by one and they keep disappearing. That might not be the best idea, but it's better than aliens walking around in the hold of a ship.

Mutant vultures would be fun. But even something that makes the character have to think. For instance, there could be an encounter where the entire town is suffering from a disease, and the character has to use his science and health skills to figure out what the disease is. The virus itself could be the monster in that case.

I agree with you, the training in Age of Empires 2 was really good, and it's one of my favorite games, mostly because I thought they gave a pretty good product (although the conquerors' expansion improved it).
 
Personally, I would like to see somthing big and nasty come out of the sea, such as mutant whales or giant octopusses. Another thing I'd like to see would be a robotic tank-like enemy whom after defeating, you can scrounge parts off of and use the mechanics skill to turn them into a new weapon or perhaps even a robot NPC.
 
Deathclaws should definitely be restored to their proper place at the top of the food chain. Maybe even a few variations of them would be in order. When it comes to freak mutations, the designer could come up with some creative and unique monsters.
 
To tell the truth I would like to see less critters. I prefer mano-a-mano conflicts whether they be combat, indifference, or dislike.
 
The thing about most critters is, they aren't difficult for those who are most suited to fight them, Combat Boys. They are more a minor investment of time rather than effort or strategy or in-game wealth.
In short, they are a small waste of time. They're good early on, but later in the game, it was somewhat pathetic when a lasergun-wielding, Power-armor clad vault-dweller was grappling with rats and mutated bugs.
But the people who did have to invest effort, capital, etc. with the bugs (Charisma and some Thief-boys) really didn't gain anything from them. The XP awards were pathetic and rarely were the encounters with the bugs more than obstacles to minor goals (like some random encounters.
I don't have any real idea for changing this, but I don't think that diversifying the critters will help on anything more than an aesthetic level.
 
kinda like the carrion crawler in BG? (Sorry playing it now and the centipede thing made me think of it :-\). But yea I've got mixed feelings on monsters. I would like to see some neat new ones enter the experience (Somethings makin me think birds right now) but it does get annoying when you're character becomes stronger and you have to waste time fighting the rats. Even if the combat isn't hard, it can really be time consuming when they are in large numbers. To solve that problem could there be an auto-resolve? I know its probably been suggested but who knows.
 
You know I don't think I've heard any talk of auto-resolve but that wouldn't be a bad idea to implement. I used it rarely in JA2 but it might make the RT people happy.
 
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