SSE hires another ex-BISer

[kumquatq3]

per odins above request, i'll try to be a bit more nice about all this:

It would also be rather amusing to see someone try to push a game with poor multiplayer to his superiors when the superiors were the ones who wanted it in, IIRC.

IIRC: JE was saying the whole time, in various posts, that MP would be more or less tacked on. So I doubt it would come as a surprise to the suits or that he was running his mouth off to challenge the suits so early in the games development. The "suits" just wanted "MP" on the box. I don't think the suits would have suddenly cared about game quality (FO:BOS). In their mind, MP gets sales.

What they were working on at the time has no relation to the fact that multipleyer would have been an affecting factor

Clearly your correct. It would effect the game, obviously. I just don't think it would come anywhere near to destroying the game. I think you would hardly notice it. They were making the game, then making MP. I think that speaks volumes about the level to which it would have effected the game.

It's nothing more than name dropping to gain interest and support that quite frankly SSE didn't earn nor deserves.

In the past we have agreed on this in private, and again I wasn't arguing SS would make a good FO3, nor do I like how they present the BIS people they hire. I just believe, and continue too, that those two guys are capable of doing good things.

 

[Roshambo]

My comment was mere in reference to another post here - that SSE would consider FO3 if they brought in ex-BIS staff, so commerical success in the future, had community support, and other assorted If's. Too many 'if''s.

I agree, with the addition that they seem to think that they can somehow acquire people that used to develop the game and count that towards being able to make a Fallout 3 or even considering it enough to consider making the game.

Whether this means they would take on FO3, or even if that's a good thing, is another matter.

As they were former Interplay QA Testers (I'll be nice and hold off on what I think about Interplay's QA testing dept.), I think they could both very well help out with The Fall, especially from a QA standpoint. I don't see what that has anything to do with Fallout, though.

IIRC: JE was saying the whole time, in various posts, that MP would be more or less tacked on. So I doubt it would come as a surprise to the suits. Or that he was running his mouth off to challenge the suits so early in the games development. The "suits" just wanted "MP" on the box. I don't think the suits would have suddenly cared about game quality (FO:BOS).

Tacked on. That's a funny way to think about it, really, especially when it has to work around the other aspects of the game. Then there's the fact that the execs would be concerned with how the magazines would receive it, and most media rags tend to adore MP. The execs only care about features. They did get a Fallout game to their understanding. "Gritty"? Check. "Swearing"? Check. "Whores"? Check. "Mutant thingies"? Check. But the multiplayer was one of the main selling points of the game, and they wouldn't have done so if it wasn't working to their satisfaction.

Just like with one kind of combat being one way and the other being "tacked on". IIRC, JE or someone else also said the same about TB and RT. One would be made and the other would be tacked on. To those in the know, making one good combat engine is a feat in itself. Trying to do both and get them working right is just fooling themselves.

Clearly your correct. It would effect the game, obviously. I just don't think it would come anywhere near destroying the game. I think you would hardly notice it. They were making they game, then making MP. I think that speaks volumes about the level to which it would have effected tha game.

Clearly you've not been in the industry much or played games that were plagued by this problem. Yes, I didn't have to play RT in FOT, but what they had to do in order to make it work would have been so.

Also, did it occur to you that the kind of multiplayer might have been said to be co-op? Kind of hard to work the multiplayer campaign around the single campaign without it being affected or making an entirely new game. Bugs in both would show up all the more frequently, adding in a nice double-dose and some mystery ones where the kludging would have been evident.

In private we have agreed on this in the past, and again I wasn't arguing SS would make a good FO3, nor do I like how they present the BIS people they hire. I was just believe, and continue too, that those two guys are capable of doing good things.

Nice try, but I've been waiting for the lie to surface.

Congrats on the new job. This seems to suggest that SSE is closer to taking on FO3, no?

At this point, I had thought that welsh meant that they were closer to becoming capable of such a thing, but I was incorrect in thinking he meant so by his recent post. It does bring up a lot more questions in the point that how Carsten expects the design of Fallout to be passed on with the earthworm method with a designer or two who just recently graduated from QA Testers...I mean, Analyst, as Interplay seems to call them now, and anyone else they can gather up. Judging from the games both have worked on, I would hypothetically say that they work well together. That still doesn't have anything to do with their understanding of the Fallout setting and ability to design in such as well as make sure SSE has enough of an idea.

In what way, if you would mind clarifying that for those of us who can't really see how a couple of people with limited experience with development (let's not kid ourselves or anyone else) and short time at BIS could be credited or even suggested of with such amazing feats?

Please note that I didn't say that they couldn't develop, only that they've had a bit of experience and not with the Fallout setting to any verifiable standard. I think the orbital station was one of the biggest things that pointed out that the design was obviously not well thought through. And yet since they've worked on such an item, they are vital to the creation of another like it, or what?

Well, I would say because they have already worked on a FO, even if it wasn't finished. They wern't exactly just figuring out were to place trees on the maps either. Just because they havn't proven anything to you, doesn't mean they can't make a good game.

Note that I didn't say they weren't capable of making great games, but instead was remarking about how they could be credited with being the force to make SSE capable to make a Fallout 3.

CONTEXT, MCDUMBASS, CONTEXT! WHY THE FUCK CAN'T SOME PEOPLE BOTHER TO READ IN CONTEXT?!

Oh, wait...you DID read in context, but you decided to be a moron about it and skew things around. Yes, you were talking about them developing a Fallout title, as you would have otherwise mentioned the other projects they worked on and not just "a FO".

But I'm not about to get into a tit for tat here. Bye now

At which, it is clear by now you're just dropping a remark for flamebait.

 

[kumquatq3]

Tacked on. That's a funny way to think about it, really, especially when it has to work around the other aspects of the game.

As you said, "it works around other aspects", not nessasarily altering them.

Then there's the fact that the execs would be concerned with how the magazines would receive it

After viewing the FO:BOS press video (everyone should see it shortly, with luck) and seeing how iply handled FO:BOS, how can you say that?

But the multiplayer was one of the main selling points of the game, and they wouldn't have done so if it wasn't working to their satisfaction

The magazines would careless about MP in FO. KOTOR got tons of awards with no MP. A good game is a good game.

As for the execs: It was one of the main selling points to them, but they just cared about having it on the box, not it winning awards. I can't except that the way MP was going to be handled, as stated by JE early on, was not agreed on by the exec. I doubt JE and MCA would have even started the game otherwise. Nor do I see a struggling Iply telling the devs to go back in and improve MP near the end of the dev cycle instead of releasing the game. I think Iplys track record backs me up there.

Just like with one kind of combat being one way and the other being "tacked on". IIRC, JE or someone else also said the same about TB and RT. One would be made and the other would be tacked on.

I don't think anyone ever said it would be tacked on. They just said TB would be favored when push came to shove. While I was worried about how that was going to play out, they did develop the system for Jefferson. So it's not like they were winging it. I can't really argue this, nor do i want to, because I just don't know how it would turn out. For what it worth, the devs seem very confident in what they had. Even after the game was axed.

Kind of hard to work the multiplayer campaign around the single campaign without it being affected or making an entirely new game. Bugs in both would show up all the more frequently, adding in a nice double-dose and some mystery ones where the kludging would have been evident.

As I said, the game would suffer for having MP, but MP in itself isn't damming. I would expect to have a pretty unbalnced MP, that had bugs, but was "runable". They were planning to error on the side of SP.

Nice try, but I've been waiting for the lie to surface.

What are you talking about? I'd show you the post, but I can't get to that forum anymore

Note that I didn't say they weren't capable of making great games, but instead was remarking about how they could be credited with being the force to make SSE capable to make a Fallout 3.

This was said:

This seems to suggest that SSE is closer to taking on FO3, no?

You replied:

In what way, if you would mind clarifying that for those of us who can't really see how a couple of people with limited experience with development (let's not kid ourselves or anyone else) and short time at BIS could be credited or even suggested of with such amazing feats

Welsh comment that he thought SS was moving towards a FO3 with the addition of these two people. Your reply disagreed with that. Hence "in what way". This would suggest that you do not believe that the addition of these two people improve SS chances of making a good FO3, if they were to make it. After all, that IS what Welsh said, and you countered. So, if you thought that these people had talent and their expirence with VB would help them make a good FO3, then you wouldn't have suggested that they can't help SS move towards that goal. Instead, you suggested that they would not be able to further SS efforts in doing this. So, I DID take it in context. You just didn't say what you wanted to. Sorry for the misunderstanding

At which, it is clear by now you're just dropping a remark for flamebait

.

I disagree. I didn't want it to turn into a arguement where I can't get my points across because of the need to type "mcdumbass" to further my case.

 

[Odin]

Frankly, the crowing about SSE and Fallout together is making me more sick than anything, Odin. It's nothing more than name dropping to gain interest and support that quite frankly SSE didn't earn nor deserves. It's a case of shit or get off the pot, and Carsten should stow the comments about Fallout until he's really serious about it.

I actually agree on this and IMO SS shouldn't make another Fallout game, this is based on the games I've played from them and the obvious talent they have. Now I'm not saying they're talented or not, but what Fallout was and is it's not something I can see SS doing well/correctly according to the original game.

The only reason we're posting news about SS is due to The Fall, it's a PA game in progress. It does look interesting, but it doesn't look great IMO.. But I'll wait to try it out before making any judgements..

As to Carstens Fallout ramblings: Yeah, I can see it as a way to gain interest for The Fall, but on the other hand I can also see it as a genuine interest in getting that title under the SS's rooftop because they love it. Does that make them good enough for making a new Fallout game, not really.... Is it news worthy, yes I think so.

 

[Briosafreak]

orbital stations and all that other aspects that really don't fit into the Fallout setting.

Ok this idea is starting to have quite a number of followers, to my amazement, so let me explain a couple of things:

When George Kennan first devised the containment policy, wich asked for non direct confrontation with the Soviet Union and instead would take the long path of eventually beating the soviets in the economic and technological arenas, the US was indeed technologically on the forefront at the time.After the droping of the bombs in Japan the fear of the nuclear devastation starts making it`s way into popular culture.The Cold War begins, and after the 49 atomic blast from the soviets and the discovery of the Chinese program a few years later things really started to get more deeply rooted in that culture.

Then suddently this thing shows up:

Yep the Sputnik.
Suddently the "fear from above" syndrome sets in. The soviets were able to beat the US on the technology race, wich wasn`t the most reassuring thing, leading in part to the UFO culture that sets in by that time, and a top secret arms race to use outer space as a new geostrategical pivotal point starts, as the Sea (Mahan), the Land (Mackinder), both (in Spykeman`s work) and the air were.
Already in 1946 the RAND corporation had proposed a military network of satellites, after Arthur C. Clarke had come out with the communications satellite concept in 1945.

So the idea is as fifty`s atomic paranoia as anything else on the other Fallout games. This is, i suppose, one of the reasons Tin Cain defended space exploration as an interesting plot for a Fallout game a few years ago.

On the missiles thing, i have to show this picture from WW2:

Yep the feared V2, remember that Von Braun was a popular icon by those days, since he settled on the states, and all type of rockets were something deep intrenched on pulp sci-fi.

So on this case i don`t see in what this goes against the setting.

 

[tre]

I wouldn't mind a Fallout game from SSE.
Why not?
Sure, the people from BIS that they've picked up might not have had too much to do with the actual development (if I've got this right) of the previous Fallout games. But they've been "on" the team, watched the game/s build up, and might have caught something up of the atmosphere surrounding them.

And if SSE actually decides to give Fo3 a Go, it might or might not become totally fucked up (or less, of course).
Does that matter, though?
In my opinion, a Fallout 3 that sucks doesn't really bring the previous 2 games down.

Sure, an ideal situation is that BIS "re-forms", completely or in part, and somehow get their hands on the license and the engine.
But that seems not only far fetched, but also totally screwed.
I don't know anything of other companies trying to get a hold of the Fo license, and thus, no comments on other companies.
Other companies might do this better, though. I don't know.
I haven't played any of SSE's earlier games, but The Fall looks promising.

If SSE does release a completely insane game, then we can all turn our backs and grunt something about them at least trying to please our craving minds.

my 2 cents.

Take care.

 

[Roshambo]

As you said, "it works around other aspects", not nessasarily altering them.

Nice try, but if you're going to twist my words out of context another time, I'll find something amusing that would suit you. In the context I used...hell, you know, you're just being a shithead for the sake of it.

In other words, to point it out to someone as hopelessly clueless as yourself, they would have to design the character system and a lot more with the considerations of multiplayer in mind. If you think multiplayer is something you just tack on and expect it to work, you're an idiot. I really don't need to go into how the combat system and co-op play would have to be taken into account when developing the game, as that would go over your head. Putting TB and RT and adding in SP and MP, all together in the discussion and in how they have to be developed, would pop your mind like a zit.

Then there's the fact that the execs would be concerned with how the magazines would receive it

After viewing the FO:BOS press video (everyone should see it shortly, with luck) and seeing how iply handled FO:BOS, how can you say that?

I didn't say that they were right in how they did it. You probably should stop with the straw man arguments. They're not working.

The magazines would careless about MP in FO. KOTOR got tons of awards with no MP. A good game is a good game.

Now you're a definite idiot. PC Gamer has a strong slant towards MP, as to other rags, and multiplayer done poorly being a suicidal aspect should have occurred to even your cro-magnum level of understanding development, but unfortunately it didn't. For your benefit: Just imagine FOT and how that game would have been treated if the MP was complete shit. Well, it was in many ways, but it was possibly the only saving grace that game had, and it was dropped by GameSpy faster than most other titles.

I don't think anyone ever said it would be tacked on. They just said TB would be favored when push came to shove.

Or that TB would be developed first and then RT added on afterwards, it was said as much. That's one of the more asinine way to develop since it doesn't take into considerations of a plethora of issues that are frequent with games with two distinct combat options of that sort and often could lead into some messes. There's been a whole load of things that have brought about the problems inherent with this, it's a moot point by now. I could ask Saint to come here and point out the exact reasons why, as I'm quite tired with wasting my time on a asskisser of Interplay proportions.

While I was worried about how that was going to play out, they did develop the system for Jefferson. So it's not like they were winging it. I can't really argue this, nor do i want to, because I just don't know how it would turn out. For what it worth, the devs seem very confident in what they had. Even after the game was axed.

So given that they did a system for Jefferson, they would give priority to TB "when push came to shove".

Which is it? Did they develop it already as you claim? Why would they then talk about "when push came to shove" as you claim?

That's because it wasn't done yet. At least not in context of Fallout. Yet, that doesn't stop you from dancing back and forth between such claims when it suits you.

As I said, the game would suffer for having MP, but MP in itself isn't damming..

Another straw man argument.

Nice try, but I've been waiting for the lie to surface.

What are you talking about? I'd show you the post, but I can't get to that forum anymore

Next time, DO read in context. You had said this:

In private we have agreed on this in the past, and again I wasn't arguing SS would make a good FO3, nor do I like how they present the BIS people they hire. I was just believe, and continue too, that those two guys are capable of doing good things.

When in fact you had then replied with a post with all sorts of ass kissing about how great they are, it wasn't funny. We were talking about Fallout 3 and then you slipped in "doesn't mean they can't make a great game". I had already pointed out that they were working on designs and setting points under people who already had a displayed skewing of the Fallout universe. I could see someone a bit more experienced being of some help, but that's not even guaranteed. Or I could point out that while MicroForté also had benefits of talking to some of the original people, they still were quite clueless and only one of them showed any sign of understanding what Fallout's setting was, and he was one of the art guys. I'm supposed to be putting faith into someone's dev house because they picked up a couple of people who happened to work on a title, but most of those who do have a displayed firm knowledge of Fallout's setting are elsewhere, a bit scattered around. Am I supposed to jump for joy and start gushing about Fallout 3 when they nab an art guy next and crow about it?

Keep backpedalling. No...don't even bother.

Welsh comment that he thought SS was moving towards a FO3 with the addition of these two people. Your reply disagreed with that.

I had already corrected the misunderstanding. You know, right after he clarified his statement. You might want to go back and read it for the first time before you make yourself into a bigger idiot.

Too late.

(Snip a whole lot of stupid shit spewed by kumquat3 due to illiteracy or mental retardation.

I disagree. I didn't want it to turn into a arguement where I can't get my points across because of the need to type "mcdumbass" to further my case.

Well, it suits you. You frequently can't tell what you're trying to talk about nor seem to remember what the hell you posted. You can't get your points across because quite frankly you suck at communication.

Briosa: Which they never took advantage of since they used BOMBERS, not missiles or rockets, and the orbital station was listed as a location. It also begs the question of how does the hero/heroine get there? A rocket likely more than a couple hundred years old, or do they pull it out of their ass McGuyver style with a stimpack and a rocket launcher? Or is someone going to pull a Star Trek? Or is it to the dreaded "wasteland has advanced enough to no longer be post-apocalyptic, but the buildings are fucked" scenario people didn't care to see, as they liked to see Fallout's world hosed beyond belief (but within the setting, of course)?

 

[Roshambo]

Here's a repost of welsh's post for those too stupid to figure out that the first page of this thread still exists. It's been edited, but the original post's contents are still intact. It's especially amusing when said stupid people couldn't figure out why I might have been quoting welsh, which even had the clarification from his post in the quote itself.

Yes, it is nice to see a guy has found a job again.

My comment was mere in reference to another post here - that SSE would consider FO3 if they brought in ex-BIS staff, so commerical success in the future, had community support, and other assorted If's. Too many 'if''s. But this hire would seem consistent with the idea of bringing in more BIS staff.

Whether this means they would take on FO3, or even if that's a good thing, is another matter.

I do have to agree with what has been posted earlier, meaning what Mr. Teatime posted and said on the SSE forums.

It seems SSE would not be able to stay consistent with earlier Fallout Games, and if it can't than it shouldn't do fallout.

The Post-Apoc genre is not limited to Fallout, even if the name 'Fallout' has cash value. If you can't do a Fallout game, don't advertise for it. It would be better, as Rosh suggested above, for SSE to do their own post-apoc game than to try to make a game and slap a Fallout label on it. Do that, and you will only betray the customer.

 

[Daemon Spawn]

Wtf is all this space station crap I'm reading about? This wasn't going into Fallout 3 was it?

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

For anyone who cares, it should be noted that MP wasn't being worked on by the time VB got axed. It wasn't like MP was being developed along side the single palyer game. MP would have suffered, not the quests.

You still have to design quests so that they would work in multiplayer, though. Well, that's assuming that the designers were smart enough to take that in to account before they added the multiplayer rather than making everything, slapping in the multiplayer, and then discovering how many things QA finds that can easily be broken by having multiple players attempting to do them.

I don't think anyone ever said it would be tacked on. They just said TB would be favored when push came to shove.

Keep in mind the turn based thing, which was supposedly a priority, wasn't even implimented yet when the game was cancelled.

My comment was mere in reference to another post here - that SSE would consider FO3 if they brought in ex-BIS staff, so commerical success in the future, had community support, and other assorted If's. Too many 'if''s. But this hire would seem consistent with the idea of bringing in more BIS staff.

Well, to date, Silver Style has hired two BIS people. One has actually done design work on a released game - IceWind Dale 2. The other never has done design work on a released game.

The one that did do design work on a released game doesn't understand why certain events should be handled, such as attacking a town person in town. That'll break IWD2's gameplay because even if you beat the guards, the town doors are locked and there's no way to get out.

Given the level of experience of these two guys, and I'm not saying they wouldn't turn out to be fantastic designers at some point, but it really looks to me like the whole point of hiring them is to make people like kumkwat3 think they can actually make a super duper good CRPG just by name association. Not too many companies make a big deal about hiring someone unless that person is really well known. When you hire a person like Jason Husges that has no design credits on anything we can see and then make a fuss about it - one has to wonder why that is.

Honestly, one has to wonder this - if these two are so talented, why didn't Obsidian hire them up? After all, Obsidian sucked up quite a few people after the lay offs and continued to take on more.

Kumkwat3 makes the statement about people who have worked with them trusting them, but that obviously can't be the case because those two have to hop a plane to Germany to find work when the people they worked with before are just down the block.

Wtf is all this space station crap I'm reading about? This wasn't going into Fallout 3 was it?

Yup..

 

[kumquatq3]

Keep in mind the turn based thing, which was supposedly a priority, wasn't even implimented yet when the game was cancelled.

Yes, I know. As I said, I don't know how TB combat would have turned out.

but that obviously can't be the case because those two have to hop a plane to Germany to find work when the people they worked with before are just down the block.

First, they didn't go to Germany. Second, Obsidians resources arn't limitless. Those two wern't close to the only ones fired. With any luck, you might have to eat those words soon too.

Also, you should look up the circumstances husges was brought in under. Say what you want about how carsten runs his buisness, but he isn't a bad guy. I think he is just a nice guy, who is also trying to a run a buisness, but again, I wish they wouldn't annouce the bis people they hire that way.

Anyways, rosh is fully in "mcdumbass" mode, so I'm outty.

 

[Roshambo]

Keep in mind the turn based thing, which was supposedly a priority, wasn't even implimented yet when the game was cancelled.

Yes, I know. As I said, I don't know how TB combat would have turned out.

Probably because you have jack shit for understanding how development works.

First, they didn't go to Germany.

Saint knows this, moron, he's posted about it before. He was speaking hypothetically. I would also like to note that I don't put much faith into anyone doing development remotely for any complex project. A HL mod, sure, but not much else, especially when there's likely language problems.

Most likely they may be put into a remote QA team, since they have experience with that.

EDIT: Well, it looks like Saint is a bit more informed than both you or I. Especially when you go into using the past tense when Saint didn't say "they went to Germany". Brush up on your English skills or graduate the 4th grade sometime soon. Since you put so much into Carsten's words, and I have to take Slaughter's word of validity since I don't care to dig through the SS forums:

> And Puuk is moving to Berlin? You found a publisher for Germany?

The second point is correct, the first is... let's say unclear. Damien and me talked about his relocation this year. That said, he receives a lot of job offers from interesting companies in the US. A game designer like him is always a win for every company. If he can find a good job next to his home we would let him go without making any problems. Same counts for Jeff.

Second, Obsidians resources arn't limitless. Those two wern't close to the only ones fired. With any luck, you might have to eat those words soon too.

Why? You've been eating a shit sandwich of your own making for quite some time. Lonely?

Also, you should look up the circumstances husges was brought in under. Say what you want about how carsten runs his buisness, but he isn't a bad guy. I think he is just a nice guy, who is also trying to a run a buisness, but again, I wish they wouldn't annouce the bis people they hire that way.

Aside from more asskissing, what relevence does the above paragraph have to do with anything? You've already said the same things before.

Niceness can be faked just like how you fake intelligence...no, intelligence can't really be faked for long at all.

Anyways, rosh is fully in "mcdumbass" mode, so I'm outty.

I don't think anyone would mind me saying this, but let's hope that is permanent, especially when you're too hopelessly stupid to understand what has been written and have to skew welsh's post out of context to suit your own needs when in fact the fellow made a clarification of said post, a point you chose to ignore.

Let's not forget the main reason why you were removed from being a moderator.

You were too busy asskissing to Briareus and Sean "Kumtwatq3's Butch" Reynolds, including deleting most of a thread when we don't do that here. Now we know what the K stands for. I wonder if Briareus feels like a total idiot too after Sean posted that PayPal bullshit, after Briareus goes to great lengths to defend him. Was he counting on Sean making him look incredibly stupid with that garbage?

Wow, I bet he didn't see that coming!*

*- Everyone else did.

 

[Briosafreak]

Wtf is all this space station crap I'm reading about? This wasn't going into Fallout 3 was it?

Ok what part of my explanation you didn`t get?

Well, it looks like Saint is a bit more informed than both you or I.

Funny since ALL SAINT KNOWS ABOUT THE STORY HE ASKED KUMQUAT!
Then he invented some bits. He knows jack shit about the story when compared to kumquat, Sammael, Odin or me.

Honestly, one has to wonder this - if these two are so talented, why didn't Obsidian hire them up?

Because they didn`t want to maybe?????? Really, instead of cocking up bullshit stories just ask them. It`s easy.

So given that they did a system for Jefferson, they would give priority to TB "when push came to shove".

*sigh* ok you weren`t here so you deserve an explanation on this. Baldurs Gate3: The Black Hound was made with a real time with pause in mind. After a couple of reunions they decided to put a TB mode already thinking of using the engine in the furure for future Fallout titles. When Fallout3 started priority went to make that TB in the better way they could, and rt went to the sideline. They saw how Arcanum failled, but were willing to try , because a TB fallout was always preferable to a non-tb Fallout.

Why what they had to do because Interplay forced them is a sin, and when Troika did the same thing everything went fine with no drama is ridiculous fanboism.

Briareus was wrong in what he wrote, and was unfair with NMA. kukquat didn`t had enough experience to deal with the situation, and was wrong in indirectly supporting Sean. But let`s get one thing straight, whenever he talks about Fallout3 he knows what he`s saying, and not just guessing, inventing or distorting things like Rosh or Saint.

And the fact he has the Moron sign and Saint that when asked me to leave NMA and go to RPGCodex, after i told him i needed time to help NMA in all the changes Odin had devised told me "FUCK NMA" still is treated as some guru is laughable. In a sad way.

Put your eyes on DAC, wich was the greatest and strongest Fallout community, and see how it is now. Their only assets are the (great) news from MadMax and Project Phoenix. I sure as hell don`t want NMA to end like that, and will fight against it.

 

[Daemon Spawn]

Wtf is all this space station crap I'm reading about? This wasn't going into Fallout 3 was it?

Ok what part of my explanation you didn`t get?

Sorry, I didn't know where the space station stuff came from. Kind of just appeared, I think. Maybe I missed a news post or something.

 

[God is Dog backwards]

This place is getting bad. Kumquat now has the moron sign? For disagreeing with Rosh and Saint? Jesus. Something needs to be done, and quick, before this place turns into DAC.

 

[Role-Player]

 

[Big T]

Careful or you'll end up with a special rank

 

[Jebus]

Careful or you'll end up with a special rank

Which is a sad thing.



Like I said on another thread: 'moron' signs should be reserved for morons.

And I really don't think Kumquat3 can be considered a moron. Not at all.

It's a sad thing the entire Fallout community seems be heading into the same direction: extremism.

*runs*

 

[kumquatq3]

Wow, you leave for a few hours....

Funny since ALL SAINT KNOWS ABOUT THE STORY HE ASKED KUMQUAT!

Just so saint doesn't flip out, he doesn't ask me about VB, his admins do and pass it on.

 

[Murdoch]

Careful or you'll end up with a special rank

Which is a sad thing.



Like I said on another thread: 'moron' signs should be reserved for morons.

And I really don't think Kumquat3 can be considered a moron. Not at all.

It's a sad thing the entire Fallout community seems be heading into the same direction: extremism.

*runs*

Seconded

-prepares to see his beloved Morte disappear-