Todd Howard on RPGs

Brother None

This ghoul has seen it all
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Gameplayer Australia has a "state of the RPG" feature with several quotes from Todd Howard, and a kind of odd opinion from themselves on what Fallout 3 is all about.<blockquote>Todd Howard, executive producer of the proudly Western Fallout 3 at Bethesda, puts it more simply. “We stay away from all the big cut-scene/story-telling stuff, to be honest,” he says. “We’re more fans of the ‘make your own story’ idea.”
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Todd Howard feels the same. “Player expectations move with the technology,” he says. “Gamers are sophisticated enough to know what the all the new hardware can do and they certainly aren’t going to let something off just because it’s an RPG.”
(...)
Howard emphasises the importance of getting off to a good start: “You always want the first few hours of the game to be nice to any player, “ he says . “No matter how good they are at games, they haven’t played this particular one yet, so you need to ease whoever it is into it.”

Here at least, the RPG has an advantage: it’s fundamentally designed to train you up from nothing, as Howard points out. “It’s often easy in an RPG to keep layering on the complexity with new abilities. It actually makes the game more fun and addictive then if you gave all that stuff out at the beginning.”

After that, it’s all about the grind – specifically, disguising it so you don’t notice that it’s there. Howard again: “Mostly it’s about plenty of player progression and making repetitive actions, such as combat, interesting. If the basic monster-killing is fun and exciting, I will do it over and over for hours on end – especially if it unlocks new abilities.”
(...)
The final RPG that’s got us excited is the upcoming Fallout 3, which should be out by the end of this year. The fact that this is a sequel to an ageing franchise that hasn’t had an entry in ten years shouldn’t matter – this is Bethesda’s next project, and if Oblivion’s anything to go by, it’ll be a cracker. Expect jet-black humour and people juice everywhere – the combat system will allow you to pause the action at any particular time and target specific body parts.

Howard fully expects Fallout 3 to push RPGs forward by “mixing genres and providing plenty of unique interactions” for the gamer. This could be a potential game of the year. And let’s not forget that there are also Elveon, Age of Conan, Too Human and Cry On waiting on the sidelines.</blockquote>Link: State of the RPG on Gameplayer Australia.

Spotted on Blue's News.
 
:crazy: "...If the basic monster-killing is fun and exciting, I will do it over and over for hours on end – especially if it unlocks new abilities." :crazy:

I'm guessing a total pacifist path is out. So mini-dungeons filled with baddies and random treasure it is. :roll:
 
I won't mind it if they make the caves with baddies short and sweet and only in random encounters a la Fallout...

... but if they make huge, dark, dungeons that all look alike and are part of the quests then that's going to be pretty boring :x
 
I'm blocking it mentally. I'm really tired of listening to anything those people have to say.

Gary Gygax died yesterday and I believe that it's just one of many signs that RPGs are going into (immersive) oblivion.
 
I'm sick, sick and tired of the "our game is the shizt even though no one even played it and there's no way to prove it" stuff!!!!! F***!!!! Screw game developers and their hype.
 
Seriously, thats a load of bullshit. How come I find myself playing older games over and over again? Its because technology hasn't done shit.
I upgraded my computer to run Crysis and many other games. Crysis was a HUGE piece of shit. Seriously, I'm not lying; it sucked hard and short. I beat Crysis so fast, it wasn't even difficult. It was just as disappointing as Far Cry. People at Bethesda are so retarded. They have no idea how to make a good game. Even Crystal Caves is more fun then Oblivion and that game is old as fuck. Technology didn't save Bethesda there now did it? Good thing we have companies like Valve or Blizzard. All these amateur game companies investing too much time in graphics and not using enough brains to make stimulating gameplay. Fallout 1 and 2 will always have more"immersion"(hope I got that right) then anything Bethesda comes out with. Mainly because of the description box which explains everything in Tongue-in-Cheek fashion. This is not a flame, I'm calling them out on their obvious bullshit they preach.
 
To be fair, if Crystal caves was done in an upgraded color palette you wouldn't complain(edit: about the graphical upgrade), it has some of the harshest colors I've seen in a while, same with Bio-Menace, and many of the early Keens (which got better as time and color depth progressed).

But a full perspective overhaul would be painful and likely kill longevity of the game because they'd be so into the bloom and doom that they'd loose content like they always do...
 
Mord_Sith seeing your avatar gave me an idea to publish a book on "How to raise an overhyped gamer". Today's gaming communities really need this book or we'll risk being even more brainwashed by PRs of game developers.
 
Todd Howard feels the same. “Player expectations move with the technology,” he says. “Gamers are sophisticated enough to know what the all the new hardware can do and they certainly aren’t going to let something off just because it’s an RPG.”

Except that not all that long ago, many RPG and strategy gamers were willing to say "i don't care how it looks, i only care how it plays." If Todd Howard has been the lead designer for Civ4, I think he might somehow have made it an FPS. Just a feeling.


Howard emphasises the importance of getting off to a good start: “You always want the first few hours of the game to be nice to any player, “ he says . “No matter how good they are at games, they haven’t played this particular one yet, so you need to ease whoever it is into it.”

Except that this isn't a magical fairy land, Todd. This is a post-apocalyptic wasteland. Everyone hates everyone and they are all out to get you. Fallout 1, the game starts by pushing you out into the wastes with little direction. Fallout 2, the game starts in a temple filled with traps and monsters, and you have to beat it to move on.

Fallout isn't suppossed to be nice, or pretty.
 
I miss the Infinity engine. Even though the pixels were brick-size, it had soul. How I'd love to see new Infinity Engine using hand-drawed graphics....
 
Mostly it’s about plenty of player progression and making repetitive actions, such as combat, interesting. If the basic monster-killing is fun and exciting, I will do it over and over for hours on end – especially if it unlocks new abilities.
The thing that really struck me about this is that even Solitaire's gameplay can be addicting - there is very little strategy, and even if you barely understand the strategy, you can still have a wonderfully addictive time just clicking, clicking, drag-and-dropping rather haphazardly. Chess, however, is esentially just drag-and-dropping, but because of it's immense depth, there is tons of intellectually stimulating replay value, which is something I doubt Fallout 3 will have.

Fallout 1 and 2 strived to make the combat fun while still deep (it didn't always succeed, but at least it tried), but Fallout 3's combat design doesn't even seem like it is trying. Furthermore, what Fallout 1 and 2 lacked in combat depth they more than made up for with non-combat gameplay - diplomacy, deception, circumvention, stealth. Those last 4 items are the things that we've heard pratically jack-squat about in Fallout 3.
 
goffy59 said:
Seriously, thats a load of bullshit. How come I find myself playing older games over and over again? Its because technology hasn't done shit.
I upgraded my computer to run Crysis and many other games. Crysis was a HUGE piece of shit. Seriously, I'm not lying; it sucked hard and short. I beat Crysis so fast, it wasn't even difficult. It was just as disappointing as Far Cry. People at Bethesda are so retarded. They have no idea how to make a good game. Even Crystal Caves is more fun then Oblivion and that game is old as fuck. Technology didn't save Bethesda there now did it? Good thing we have companies like Valve or Blizzard. All these amateur game companies investing too much time in graphics and not using enough brains to make stimulating gameplay.
Frankly, I stopped liking the obsession with graphics some time ago. Namely in last year when I realised that the cutting edge technology has two big flaws, namely:
1. It forces developers to pay a lot of money for development which forces them to appeal to masses.
2. It forces me to buy a new computer every few years, which I don't want to do anymore. I briefly considered buying a new computer when The Witcher came out, but I decided that it would force me to spend money that I prefer to spend on real things, especially that I don't need those cutting edge graphics.

When I play Wasteland, I don't wish for 3D graphics, bloom and water that looks like real - I wish for less combat encounters and better interface.

When I play Avernum, I don't wish for realistic physics and ultra graphics - I wish for better dialogues.

So, personally, I would prefer if developers would cut the costs on both sides down and focused on providing content that is really important to me - excellent mechanics, dialogues and quests.
As for the great graphics side of things - I love them on boxes, maps and manuals - I'd love to buy a game with a good looking box, good thick manual and map, excellent dialogues, quests and mechanics, even if it would look like Wasteland (but in a modern resolution, of course).

Ravager69 said:
I miss the Infinity engine. Even though the pixels were brick-size, it had soul. How I'd love to see new Infinity Engine using hand-drawed graphics....
Brick sized? In 1024 x 768?
I loved the ID and ID2 graphics - I wonder if they were hand-drawn or pre-rendered...
 
I'm already sick of hearing about Fallout 3, the press releases always utter the exact same words, changed around slightly to seem original; "We're not done yet, we're not giving you any details, you want it done this way, we're doing it this way, fuck you, it's our game, you can go fuck yourself if you want us to do it this way, we need to make money, if we don't we can't make three more sequels, xbox has a much larger audience than the 'real' roleplaying niche on the PC, etc."

I'm sure everyone else is already sick of hearing this as much as I am. :puke:
 
DarkLegacy said:
I'm sure everyone else is already sick of hearing this as much as I am. :puke:

I know I am. That's why I said I'm mentally blocking every fucking news about F3. I'm sick of reading that crap!
 
DarkLegacy said:
I'm sure everyone else is already sick of hearing this as much as I am. :puke:

Indeed, I sometimes wonder what is left to say after reading yet another interview or article with the Bethesda gang.
 
Sorrow said:
So, personally, I would prefer if developers would cut the costs on both sides down and focused on providing content that is really important to me - excellent mechanics, dialogues and quests.

Yeeessss! :clap:

It's EXACTLY what's missing from.... just about every game that's come out in the past few years. At least from the major studios. Though I'm not going to act as if there was some golden age where great cRPGs were released and that now we're in some sort of decadent time bereft of "true" RPGs.
 
Moving Target said:
Yeeessss! :clap:

It's EXACTLY what's missing from.... just about every game that's come out in the past few years. At least from the major studios.
Frankly, 90% games I bought in last 10 years are games that go to shelf after a couple of hours of playing or prove fatally flawed after a longer time.
Icewind Dale 2 - I played it for 5 hours and got bored with it.
Neverwinter Nights - I played it for 3 hours, disliked the elven whore on loading screens, shiny special effects and dumbed-down gameplay. I stopped playing it after discovering that I can't kill "innocent" people (or children).
Arcanum - played it for a day, got put off by weird character development system that gives me a character that is weaker than mere commoners in towns and simply feels unfinished. Started playing again after I found a character editor and edited my character to be equal to townspeople, I played for a few weeks, but got put off by dungeon crawling and broken combat system - never got myself to finish it.
Delta Force: Black Hawk Down - played for 2 days, got put off by horrible AI of allies, which made the game very frustrating.
The Temple of Elemental Evil - played for 2 hours, got to Homlet, got bored to death. I tried starting it for 12 times and finally uninstalled it.
Hammer And Sickle - installed it, saw the Starforce logo - returned it to store.
Laser Squad Nemesis - played it for 2 hours, got bored to death with uninspired gameplay - old Laser Squad was much more playable.
Omega Syndrome - found it unplayable, edited savegames to make a decent character - got pretty far before dying. Talked with developer to change the game balance. Got bored with uninspiring dungeon crawling after 2 days. After some time the developer released a patch that made game crawl even on high-end hardware and disappeared because too few people bought the game, which proves that piracy isn't needed to make a shitty design fail. Downloaded an old demo, which somehow made my CD-Key "expire". The game doesn't want to run on my comp anymore. I sent two e-mails about it to the creator, but he didn't bother to reply, which is pretty amusing taking in account that he criticized Bioshock for its DRM :) .

There were a few games that I really enjoyed, namely Close Combat: Modern Tactics (only because of modding), a space shooter called Astro Menace, another shooter called Soldat and Operation: Flashpoint. That's all. The rest was wasted money. Wait, no wasted money - I actually learned a lot about bad design.

Most of time I spent playing and modding Fallout, CCMT, X-Com 3: Apocalypse, Soldat and BG2:ToB.

Generally, I detest the mainstream devs and I'm quickly losing respect towards indie ones.
I tried a few indie cRPGs and so far I like only Spiderweb's ones - I think I'll buy some of them when I'll have some money.

Moving Target said:
Though I'm not going to act as if there was some golden age where great cRPGs were released and that now we're in some sort of decadent time bereft of "true" RPGs.
I don't believe that there was a golden age too.
I remember how frustrated I was in times of Fallout with some elements of the game. I thought that it will get better.
I hoped that Baldur's Gate will be like Fallout, but much better.
It wasn't and things went downhill from there.

Personally, I dream about a cross between Fallout: A GURPS Post-Nuclear Adventure and Wasteland - simple, cheap 2d graphics, combat system that would be close to GURPS or The Riddle of Steel, interesting world, good dialogues, good story, good quests...
 
Moving Target said:
Yeeessss! :clap:

Shit.

Please don't encourage him.

Sorrow said:
Omega Syndrome - found it unplayable, edited savegames to make a decent character - got pretty far before dying. Talked with developer to change the game balance. Got bored with uninspiring dungeon crawling after 2 days. After some time the developer released a patch that made game crawl even on high-end hardware and disappeared because too few people bought the game, which proves that piracy isn't needed to make a shitty design fail. Downloaded an old demo, which somehow made my CD-Key "expire". The game doesn't want to run on my comp anymore. I sent two e-mails about it to the creator, but he didn't bother to reply, which is pretty amusing taking in account that he criticized Bioshock for its DRM

What you fail to mention is that it was one of your whining posts that made up his mind to give up. The problem was that he found working like this unrewarding. And who can blame him, when the most feedback he gets is from you.

Way to go, Sorrow :clap:

Also, that was one hell of a stupid, short-sighted post you made just now. I was thinking you couldn't get any lower after telling Iron Tower's Vince that he was "part of the problem", but here you are spouting an even dumber vision on the state of RPGs.

You always find new ways to surprise me.

Sorrow said:
Personally, I dream about a cross between Fallout: A GURPS Post-Nuclear Adventure and Wasteland - simple, cheap 2d graphics, combat system that would be close to GURPS or The Riddle of Steel, interesting world, good dialogues, good story, good quests...

So make it.
 
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