Turkey and Europe to make a union?

Discussion in 'General Discussion Forum' started by welsh, Oct 5, 2005.

  1. welsh

    welsh This ghoul has seen it all

    Apr 5, 2003
    I thought the Europeans were still having problems with a Constitution.

    Or is that Iraq?

    EU- No Muslims Allowed?

    A love- you bicker and you make up.

    So would Turkey be like a second-classed european country? Or is that left for the members of East Europe?

    But if you let in Turkey does that mean you have to let in.....

    Ratty, what are you doing about this?

    Ja.. Vee don't like Zees Turkish Mens vit our Voomen.


    Yes, more Turkish job-seekers means more supply for labor- leads to less demand- and so Europeans can make Walmart wages too.

    But its funny how you can't distinguish an ugly greek chick from an ugly Turkish chick.

    Ah and wouldn't it be funny if the Europeans got their own middle east country, and then it went muslim fundamentalist.

    Ok, your thoughts?
     
  2. greatatlantic

    greatatlantic It Wandered In From the Wastes

    153
    Jan 29, 2005
    What are you talking about? The ugly chicks are the Turkish chicks?

    I'm Greek by blood, does it show?
     
  3. Jebus

    Jebus Background Radiant
    Orderite

    Jan 29, 2004
    Yesterday, or the day before, Karel Van Miert - a Belgian former European Comissioner - appeared on a Belgian in-depth news show to talk about this whole Turkey-into-the-EU thing. He made a pretty big fool out of himself, yelling things like 'Turkey is Arabian' and 'Turkey has never been a part of European history'. He had me laughing, that's for sure.

    Today, however, I noticed that several of Belgium's newspapers - even the more respectable ones - are actually quoting him as an expert on the subject.

    I'm rather concerned. It seems like people are willing to accept all kinds of reasons - even the ridiculous ones or the all-out wrong ones - to keep Turkey out of the EU.
     
  4. Ashmo

    Ashmo Half-way Through My Half-life
    Orderite

    Jul 2, 2004
    Angela Merkel is head of the CHRISTIAN union. They are the conservatives. What do you expect them to do? Sing and dance and be happy?

    Religious reasons are fairly limited, except for some outback Bavarian hillbillies who think any nation reigned by Muslims is a tool of Satan.

    The problem with Turkey is that the EU has very strict humanitarian laws and Turkey only just managed to establish somewhat stable conditions compatible with them.

    Even the US couldn't become a part of the EU for humanitarian reasons.

    The question is whether the human rights established in Turkey are stable enough and whether the country itself is ready and democratic enough.

    The Constitution is an entirely different story and was mostly neglected because it ISN'T a mere constitution -- IIRC it consisted of three parts and only two of them made up the actual constitution, the third part defined very specific rules outside the scope of the constitution (although most of them were already covered by the de facto "constitution" we already have).

    Just don't go there.

    The last thing this refuge from the Real World needs is another thread full of unqualified blurts on what Joe Random and his dog think Europe should be like.

    Edited to decrease offensiveness
     
  5. DirtyDreamDesigner

    DirtyDreamDesigner Venerable Relic of the Wastes
    Moderator

    Apr 15, 2005
    Probably the same thing the rest of Croatia is doing; laughing our asses off.
     
  6. Jebus

    Jebus Background Radiant
    Orderite

    Jan 29, 2004
    People can laugh in the Balkans?
     
  7. Hellion

    Hellion Antediluvian Lurker

    449
    Jun 20, 2003
    As Chiraq (sp?) put it, "Turkey must undergo a cultural REVOLUTION in order to be able to join the EU within the next 20 (!!!!!) years". And they must also announce their recognition of Cyprus within the same time period. Personally, judging on Turkey's stance so far, I doubt they can pull it off, even within such a wide time frame.

    Yes you can. The Turkish chick has darker skin and speaks an incomprehensible arab-like language. :roll:

    Of course, half the population of Turkey probably has one or more European ancestors (blue-eyed and blonde Arabs with fair skin is not something you see every day, yet Turkey seems full of them), so it is quite possible that an ugly Greek/Spanish/French/English chick and an ugly Turkish chick might have more in common than it may seem...
     
  8. Jebus

    Jebus Background Radiant
    Orderite

    Jan 29, 2004
    Turks have nothing to do with Arabs. Arabs came from the Arabian peninsula, the Turks came from the same place most of the Eastern European people came from: the steppes.

    Funny how many people make that mistake.
     
  9. Brother None

    Brother None This ghoul has seen it all
    Staff Member Admin Orderite

    Apr 3, 2003
    Well, Jebus, you have to remember that when one speaks of "European" in a EU context one usually refers to Western Europe. The guys that got dragged along by the renaissance, industrialisation, all that hullabaloo.

    Defining this gets to be more difficult. Why does Greece have more rights to join the EU than Turkey? None whatsoever, from a cultural standpoint, Greece just happens to be at the center of our own cradle of European civilization obsession. Our bad. Still, if you let Greece in, it becomes hard to refuse Turkey.

    That said, I'm against Turkey joining in the same vein as I was against the EU-10 joining. I don't like it, I think rapid expansion is going to turn the EU into a ticking timebomb.

    But promises made are promises kept. It is simply a matter of decency in international politics to keep your promises, especially on matters such as this. Plus Turkey does have a lot to offer the EU, from a multicultural (hah!) and economic standpoint (since now, after the dismissing of the constitution, we're pretty much thrown back to our economic roots).

    Interesting problem is that Turkey, as opposed to the big EU-countries, is young and growing rapidly. By the time it is ready to join the EU (10 year minimum, 20-25 years is more probable), it'd be the biggest and thus democratically the most powerful EU nation. Ooops?
     
  10. John Uskglass

    John Uskglass Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Aug 29, 2003
    We rarley totally agree Jebus, but this may be changing. You are totally right.

    And the EU was a ticking timebomb from the beggining Kharn. The simple fact is that Europeans like killing eachother in bloody wars, and anything that represses that will just ultimatley make the next bloodbath worse.
     
  11. Brother None

    Brother None This ghoul has seen it all
    Staff Member Admin Orderite

    Apr 3, 2003
    I yawn in the face of your demagogic speeches. That kind of inevitability-determinist claptrap is barely constructive. I bet you're expecting China to fragment and fued too, huh? Let's not forget the States, too...
     
  12. DirtyDreamDesigner

    DirtyDreamDesigner Venerable Relic of the Wastes
    Moderator

    Apr 15, 2005
    Hehehe, laugh it up, tuition boy, your taxes will be paying for my agricultural reforms and urban development for the next 2 years. :mrgreen:
     
  13. Loxley

    Loxley Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    911
    Apr 11, 2003
    Yes but as you can see from what DDD says their asses falls of. Anyone can guess why the romanians don't laugh?
     
  14. Fas Ist

    Fas Ist It Wandered In From the Wastes

    179
    Jun 12, 2004
    Sure, not Croatia, but Turkey in the EU.I suggest the great inviting of Kazakhstan, Israel and Azerbaijan.
    Greece was pushed into the EU by the Capitalists, because it could become a Socialist country.
    No.The Indo-Europeans were living in Iran, Afganistan and parts from Pakistan.The distance between them and the Turks was like from Lisboa to The Ukrane.
     
  15. Silencer

    Silencer Night Watchman Staff Member Admin

    Nov 7, 2003
    Wait... France isn't ready for Europe?
     
  16. Jebus

    Jebus Background Radiant
    Orderite

    Jan 29, 2004
    Why would you strike out 'Eastern' and then act like it was never there? I mean, do you really think me so stupid I wouldn't notice it? What the hell is going on in that little Bulgaric head of yours?

    Also, let us go deeper into this.

    QUESTION A: Did the Turks come from the steppes?

    ANSWER: Yes.

    QUESTION B: Did - say - the Slavs come from the steppes?

    ANSWER: Yes.



    You see Was Ist, the steppes are rather large. I never did claim they lived on the same square kilometer of steppe, or happily shared cabin and wife. They may have been several hundreds of kilometers apart, but that makes no difference: you're all filthy, stinking, fatherless spawn of nomadic filth to me. Especially the Poles.

    And I mean this is the nicest possible way.


    *EDIT* I'm not racist tho'. Not at all.

    *EDIT2* BECAUSE EASTERN EUROPEANS CANNOT BE CONSIDERED HUMAN HAR HAR HAR
     
  17. alec

    alec White heterosexual male Orderite

    May 21, 2003
    I wholeheartedly agree with Kharn. Europe is expanding way too fast. Can't be a good thing, that.

    On the other hand: what do I care? I like stories with a bad ending way better than feel-good-stories. Feel-good-stories make alec feel like something the cat dragged in. And alec not like feeling like something the cat dragged in. :(
     
  18. John Uskglass

    John Uskglass Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Aug 29, 2003
    Fas ist makes a fool out of himself again. Damn boy, you do this better then me in my hay day.


    Indo-European homeland is generally considered to be either just north of some parts of the Caucases (Kurgan hypotheses) which has expansion into Turkey the first Indo-European expansion (as the Hittites where either Indo-European or very close to it) around 4,000 BC. Another, has the Indo-Europeans expand peacfully from Asia Minor with agriculture, which IIRC a guy named Colin Renfrew, and there is the much newer Black Sea deluge theroy that has Indo-European develop as a trade language among the Baltic peoples and then get the fuck out when the Black Sea meets with the Medditeranian.

    So any way you are basically a huge douche.
     
  19. Fas Ist

    Fas Ist It Wandered In From the Wastes

    179
    Jun 12, 2004
    True.16 years ago, almost all of these 10 countries were socialistic, against capitalism and EU.But what's the point of deterring the membership of Croatia, Bulgaria and Romania, after those 10 were accepted?
    And Turkey - it is not an European country.Also - it is an extremely poor one(from an European point of view).People there are not educated, easy-manipulative religious fanatics and nationalists.My god, when I was to Istanbul in March this year, I saw at least 10 000 Turkish flags just for a few days :shock: .But Istanbul is not Turkey.If you want to feel the real "spirit" of Turkey go to Anatolia :shock:

    LOL
    I don't know, but better check what is going on in the 'enormous' Belgaric head of yours.
    All the Europeans came from a simular place!That's why we are called Indo-Europeans :!: If we had been simular to Turks, we would have been called Nomads.

    Yeah, sure, but my country is the oldest European one, which still exists today!And stop insulting the Poles, mister "The Biggest Iceberg Is Larger Than My Homeland".You even don't have an own Belg language.

    CCR, what does Arianna mean then?Also - you speak about later events.
     
  20. John Uskglass

    John Uskglass Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Aug 29, 2003
    Nationalism strikes again! And people wonder why we hate the French?!


    That's just stupid Fas ist. Even you know that on some level.

    I think you mean Altaic, super-douche.

    And, hey, Fas ist, you know what kind of name Bulgar is? IT'S ALTAIC ASSRAPER.

    And no, that's still bullshit. We are all mixes of hundreds of diffirent races: because I am mostly Norman and Anglo-Saxon I'm probably part French, German, Celtic, Pictish, Dutch, Scandanavian, and because you are Bulgarian you are probably part Turkish, Bulgar, Slav, Romanian, Greek, Romany, and because Jebus is Belgian he is probably 99% Gay and Congolese Pygmy.