Vaults: Are they really crazy?

Dr Fallout

Dr Fallout

Centurion
After considerate thinking I have come to the conclusion, that vaults are not that bad and depraved as many know. While they ARE social experiments, we have a little proof that they are evil and cruel as many know. Their was certainly some contreversial ones, such as Bakersfield but the only evidence of them being outrageously insane is Fallout 3. ALL (apart from Fanfiction ones) the vaults that can be considered crazy are in Fallout 3. Little Lamplight, the cloning vault and others are in it. They are the only legitimate evidence that vaults are so 'evil'. Note this is on the assumption that everything in Fallout 3 is incorrect, due to massive immersion breakers, continuity errors and Bethesda inserted pieces of lore.

So there is only one vault that really has a less then agreeable experiment. The Bakersfield vault, or Necropolis. Even then it's not that scary or over-the-top, with the only change letting radiation in. I'm ignoring Tactics and other spin offs. Vault 21 in New Vegas is also moderate. It's just gamblers who gamble. In 1 and 2 we have two survivor vaults (13 and 8) and an experiment on racial diversity vault 15.

I may be wrong but in my vision of Fallout, there is no proof (or very small amounts) that vaults are 'crazy' as they are shown in Fallout 3. Remeber this is on the very probable assumption that almost everything in Fallout 3 is wrong.
 
http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Vault many of the insaneo-vaults are mentioned by Van Buren and/or Fallout Bible, and the RP adds many a mention in the V13 computers of FO2, such as one vault where all the jump-suits fall apart, leaving everybody naked - or the one where equipment is designed to fail on a regular basis, driving everybody insane, and of course, the legendary Vault 69 :wiggle:
 
Van Buren was.... I ignore anything to do with it... come on they had Amazonian women! What is so special about the Fallout bible? It's been edited and re-edited multitude of times, so I have trouble believing it... which is funny because it isn't real.
 
With so little to go by, all "canon" helps, otherwise, as you point out, we are left with very little.
Even Necropolis, iirc, is supposed to be just an accident, untill later, around FO2/Fallout Bible establishes that it was a deliberate experiment.

Even that is silly as hell - the fact that radiation makes ghouls. Throw in the fancy-ass "forced evolutionary virus" (LOL!!!) and suddenly it makes sense + super mutants :'D

I, for one, forgive all this sillynesses, and I probably woulda forgiven Amazone women too, especially if they were hawt :0

With well over a hundred vaults, and most of them being used for experimentation, I personally consider this something that kindov has no limits, allowing for even more silly stuff like Vault 69, as the idea-well begins to run dry. I'd like a vault where the PA system played the same pop hit song, for example, all day, every day :V
I know, Cool and the Gang - Celebration!
 
Hmm... I suposee if you want 'kewl' and 'awsum' then yeah have loads of random vaults but I prefer the idea of sensible and realistic experiments. Call me boring but I disliked the over-the-top experiments in Fallout 3 and slightly NV. The government isn't THAT stupid! Most FO3 experiments are just too goddamn dumb and expensive. Like seriously... the puppet one (I admit it was more of a joke)? And so many other expensive pointless vault ideas. It's my opinion really. BUT back to actual evidence. Fallout 3 is the only legitimate (NO BIBLE, it has to be a game) introduction of bizzare vaults that are furthered in NV to a lesser degree.
 
What I mean is - with over 100 vaults, and - let us list good, sensible, realistic experimentation ideas, go on

1. Eh... experiment on collective stress
2. Hmmm... experiment on food availability

98 to go

3. Experiment ooon... security flaws! That's a good one
4. Nothing but dyslectics/autists/adhd

The whole vault-experiment thing is made for "funny and silly ideas" once you run out of realistic ideas - and that pretty much explains why you can only find a tiny handful OF realistic ideas, and the rest are basically jokes. Of course Vault 69 is a joke, of course!

Also, don't throw "maybe YOU like everything kewl and awsum" at me, when YOU also play the same game, which includes super-mutants, ghouls and wanamingos. Those are NOT realistic, and are purely, only and solely awesome-and-cool. It's just lore-established, fan-accepted awesome-and-cool. By clinging on to what is firmly established, we turn into grumps. FO3 was a piece of shit, but FONV brought new silly shit into the mix, like Roman-soldier clad rebels - no matter how you spin or twist it - it is lame and silly, only for kewlness. There exists NO real rebel/militia force in the entire world that dresses up like Romans or Mongols or whatever, it simply is not realistic. You do know raccoon-people were initially part of the FO1-plans, and with some bad luck would have been another established, fan-accepted part of Fallout lore: raccoon people...
 
I think the important thing to keep in mind when judging vault experiments is that they ought to keep in mind the actual purpose of the Vaults. The shadowy powers of the pre-war military industrial complex realized that earth was pretty much screwed, so they used the vaults to test various scenarios that could happen in long-term isolation during space travel. If a vault experiment would potentially reveal something that future interstellar travelers would want to know, then it's a valid experiment.

So things like "the VR and life support" thing actually pass muster, but the "planting post-hypnotic suggestions in white noise" really isn't. "Populated by twenty men, ten women, and one panther" should probably be considered apocryphal (EDIT: I initially said "non-canonical" but in retrospect I think it's fine if a story of such a vault exists in-universe, but we should never actually go there, and if a dev someday wants Vault 43 to be something else, they should go for it.).

Even the gender disparity vaults that the Vault 43 thing is riffiing on seem somewhat out of whack. You could perhaps justify 999 women and 1 man for a generation ship, but the opposite makes no sense and this is going to fix itself within 1 generation (except possibly adding the risk of inbreeding depression.)
 
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Thank you Cabbage! Thank you! That is almost exactly what I meant.

And keep this out of the typical, 'because some things are kewl... let's make everything else kewl and awsum shit!' I like structured, explained worlds, not random shit because it's awsome (massive difference between the first two and FO3). Pretty much all the examples you made (wanamingo, ghouls and super mutants) while totally unrealistic are explained in the game. Not just random thing like cars explode... cause uh... exploshions are kewl... and whatnot. It's the same reason why I like Morrowind and ignore ALL lore afterwards because it's so poorly made. THE STOMRCLOAKS CANNOT WIN!!! WHERE DO THEY GET MORE MEN AND FOOD AND WEAPONS???

NOTE: Sorry if I sounded a bit rude...

Oh and zegh, to you the government is so stupid they enjoy spending millions, hell, billions of dollars on joke vaults?
 
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Dr Fallout said:
Oh and zegh, to you the government is so stupid they enjoy spending millions, hell, billions of dollars on joke vaults?
Click to expand...

What's with the assumptions?
No.
To me the creators of fallout are "so stupid" the enjoy writing governments that spend millions, hell, billions on joke vaults.
Better?

Just because I am able to observe some things, don't mean I approve of things.
I observe: Super mutants.
I observe: Ghouls.
I observe: Silly as hell vaults.
I observe: Functional communities, with farming and guard routines.

Which one of those do you deduct that I approve of the most?

Also, explaining something doesn't make it less silly. I can explain Vault 69 too: They were super-curious at finding out what happens if you make such an environment. It's not a good explanation, in fact, it's lame - but so is "FEV", it's a generic "transform an organism into a mooonsteeer for no apparent reason"-magic ring, and just because it is accepted, doens't make it particularily realistic.

It also doesn't mean that I somehow am a fan of Skyrim, so please, cool it with the assumptions.
 
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Yeah that's where the creators failed. Fallout 1 was a well built world. Fallout 2 has more choice and quests but the real abusing of the Fallout setting began there. Bethesda took it into a massive climax of stupidity whil Fallout 2 begin it with it's jokes and strange groups. I have a problem where only one game really shows the lore properly. Morrowind for the Elder Scrolls, Fallout 1 for Fallout.

I didn't point Skyrim at you, just a general rant.

FEV sounds stupid and it's purpose SOUNDS stupid but it's not. It may happen with genetic testing in the future, And keep in mind I'm not against un-realistic environments... AS LONG AS THEY'RE EXPLAINED!!!!

(FEV and mutations)
 
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My initial point was that sometimes lore is out of your hands. It is pretty much established that these vaults were used for all kinds of experiments, some sensible, some ridiculous. I agree that ridiculousness is ridiculous, otherwise I'd be dumb, and I'm not, I was just trying to go at it from another angle.

And yes, genetic manipulation yes - but come on... Centaurs? With two heads, S&M necklaces, and plenty of arms as feet? That's not explainable... :D I mean, sure "crazy evil scientists infused helpless slaves with FEV and - " yeah, but no. I'm not complaining about the centaurs, I fucking love the centaurs, just making a point. Fiction IS cool, because it's not real. Realism added to a certain extent makes it all more... real... "closer to home", it makes it easyer for us to imagine ourselves in that situation. But make it too real, and we'd be playing games about people playing games.

Which reminds me of https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rw8gE3lnpLQ :V
 
Wanamingos then? How exactly did they genetically construct the tentacle-arms, and the completely alien anatomy - they aren't mammals, they're not reptiles, I don't think they're even vertebrates! I mean, aren't chimpanzees hopped up on steroids, trained to do martial arts, both more realistic and potentially frightening? (WHY haven't anybody done this!?)

And just for the record, I was slightly dissapointed by the whole vault-experiment twist, since I didn't feel like it added anything to the lore. Vault 13s water-chip failing is a perfectly reasonable anomaly, so is 1 vault door not closing properly. Explaining this as "exactly according to a sinister plan" is slightly eyeroll-worthy, imho.
 
I see what you mean with the experiments. Keep in mind I got the games during the Fallout 3 craze, hence I thought they had to be experiments... now I wonder... ;)

The wanamingos are... well not realistic but explained. Remeber I AM NOT AGAINST un-realistic stuff. It just has to be explained, no random Fallout 3 shit.
 
Yes, yes, I get what you mean. I guess it's partly my own fault, since I'm such a fan of the whole "coming at it at a different angle"-stuff, I often do end up misunderstood as if arguing against, and for something else. The whole devils-advocate thing, I guess.

And, you've no idea how often I've had to say the same thing: I'm not against un-realistic stuff! A friend of mine begins to sigh as soon as I begin to utter the R-word, which is probably why I'm being "the devils advocate" with it... (he adored FO3)
 
zegh8578 said:
And yes, genetic manipulation yes - but come on... Centaurs? With two heads, S&M necklaces, and plenty of arms as feet? That's not explainable... :D
Click to expand...

Aren't centaurs the product of throwing a bunch of people, dogs, etc. into the vats at once? I think then the problem is not that "horrible mutant monstrosity exists" but that there's some uniformity in centaur design. This was more forgivable back when these games were more abstracted, I figure.

But anyway, centaurs should be way-rarer than any other FEV thing.
 
Same here. Well I have decided... from now on... just to me mind... ONLY Fallout 1's lore counts. SO Vaults are not experiments but simply nuclear shelters and whatnot. Fallout 2 will still be one of my favourite games but after replaying Fallout 1, my first Fallout game... it wins.
 
Centaurs are horrific, probably the creepyest foe in the Fallout universe, especially since it's never clear to you how exactly they are hurting you, except they poke their heads at you, and make creepy kissing noises :D
I loved that though, the uncertainty of it, like "what are you DOING to me!? D:"
Similar with the floaters, when they slap that... tongue-thing at you. I stole that particular idea for a writing of mine, where I imagined thumb-shaped aliens, mindlessly snailing around, with only a mouth-orifice, that they shot a big, slimy tongue out, to catch over-sized bugs. If provoked by people, they would slap the tongues randomly around, with enough force to, well, cause a serious nose-bleed - but more than enough to ruin your entire day, and probably many nights of sleep to come :D
 
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