What aspects of Fallout: Tactics and Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel contradict canon?

Albert Cole

Albert Cole

Vault Dweller
Hi guys, new here! ^.^

I'm curious: exactly what elements in these two games contradict canon events/statements presented in other titles? From what I understand, certain parts of Tactics are canon (the gist of it is), but the entirety of Brotherhood of Steel isn't. I'm sure we all could agree that Brotherhood of Steel is a pretty sub-par game, but would it be possible to get away with considering it canon in my head? It bugs me that there's another Fallout game that we all pretend doesn't exist. :/

Either way, tell me what you think! :D
 
About the official canonicity, if i recall things right, the new publisher had chosen to remove spin-off from canon to have less material to take into account in their sequel, while the support of FoT from the community got them to reconsider it canon instead of semi-canon.

I played FoT the most (after Fo1-Fo2) so i can link a few elements.

- Graphically, the deathclaws, ghouls, & super-mutants are depicted as visually different than in Fo1-Fo2. Same for the BOS clothes. I assume Fo1-Fo2 graphics override it, canon-wise.
- In FoT video introduction, the BOS is said to be born from a vault. Their backstory is already established in Fo1 as NOT coming from a vault.
- In Fo2, the only talking deathclaws are those experimented by the Enclave and those creatures try to hide it. The creators insisted than they are al dead and they there will be zeron talking deathclaws in upcoming episodes. In FoT, released after Fo2, but chronologically taking place before it, before the Enclave is even known, you have a full species of talking deathclaws, that don't even try to hide that they can talk. They don't state how/why they can talk.
- In FoT, you see some psi raiders able to tame animals (including mentioned above deathclaws) and control them through their power. While psi do exist in Fo universe, that specific group might or might not be canon.
- The midwestern BOS is said to have come into FoT gameworld through zeppelin. It is yet to be confirmed if those exist and are usable in the Fo world.
- Most of the ending have the Midwestern because a very powerfull/dominating force is a pretty large region of the US. It seems unlikely that they don't have influence well beyond that region. It is quite weird that no one heard of them by Fo3-FoNV timeline/region.
 
In Brotherhood of Steel (the console game) the backstory in the manual tells that at some point Vault-Tec at some point managed to get FEV from the US government and apparently also did genetics research of it own.

There has never been any indication that Vault-Tec was into genetic engineering, they mostly seemed to do construction (Vaults), power sources (nuclear reactors), computers (ZAX) and electronics.

Furthermore it is quite unlikely that the US government would just give or sell Vault-Tec FEV, even for experiments as there were already two researching facilities working on it; West-Tek were FEV was created, and Mariposa Base which was completely re-purposed for FEV research.

This BTW also applies for Fallout 3's Vault 87. This facility contradicts FO1 and 2 and does not even make sense. Why would a Vault be used for FEV experiments? The Vaults Experiments were never about creating super soldiers.

BTW, in Brotherhood of Steel itself FEV or there being new vats in the Vault are never brought up. Rather the researchers of the Vault were trying to develop a cure for mutation induced sterility and this is what the Super Mutants were after.
 
When the intro calls the BOS "military vault dwellers", you could assume they are using "vault" generically to mean a bomb shelter meant for extended use. Forgivable.

A bigger problem is calling Vault 0 "the hub of the vault network". They could have used the same kind of facility but made it a strictly military facility, which would make sense since it's Cheyenne Mountain. But as is, it turns Vault-Tec into something that it never seemed to be.

Rather than many separate vaults, some running as experiments, that would open at various times, the Vault 0 idea implies that there's an overarching plan for recovery, and that it includes most or all of the vaults. Originally, they were mostly left to their own fates.

It would be interesting to list canon-breaking (FO1-FO2 canon) elements from FOT and FO3 and compare. Kind of a canon-beak face-off, or is that an anti-canon duel? Including things that Should Not Be...taking deathclaws and Vault 87 mutants.
 
Sorry, I meant talking (and hairy) deathclaws in FOT.

To the old-timers, the Vault 87 supermutants seemed like another example of implausibly moving classic FO elements to DC.
 
Bos using Advanced power armors isnt cannon imo. Also,, there is a faction of guys obsessed by high tech in Tactics, that doesnt fit the universe of fallout.
 
The Vault 87 super mutants are stupid and I say this as someone who likes Fallout 3 and has researched the back story and lore. I think they're stupid because why would someone make super soldiers after the bombs hit? Given that no one could get into Vault 87 to make sure the experiment would go through, there wasn't a US left to fight for and they had a fully functioning GECK. Any sensible person would have focused on surviving and rebuilding using Vault 87 rather than using its inhabitants as guinea pigs. A lot of Bethesda's experiments irk me. Why would Vault 92 or 108's experiments continue after the bombs hit without an enforcement mechanism? Why would you intentionally drive people insane or keep making deranged clones? The only reason is Bethesda took the "the Vaults weren't meant to save anyone" mentality to far. I do like Bethesda, but those are plot holes.

Based on 3 and NV, we know that the Midwestern BoS exists in some form. There is a threat to the east in NV and a rogue faction is mentioned in 3. It is logical to assume that they control the land in between. As for not expanding, I'm figuring Bethesda will go with destroying the Calculator and the BoS doesn't get much of of Vault 0/Cheyenne Mountain. The BoS would be more focused on reconstruction, that after 80 years or so between FoT and NV, they weren't as focused on expanding and making contact with the Western BoS because they had internal problems with controlling and rebuilding a vast territory. This also leaves room for a civil war that could have slowed reconstruction a bit.
 
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Beast lords controlled Deathclaws by holding their matriarch hostage, not by mind control. It was explicitly stated that they are too intelligent to be controlled like that. And hair on them makes some sense, since they are in a much colder environment now. The talking part? Well, yea, a little bit far fetched, but then again, we have snapping turtles that somehow become fully humanoid through radiation and FEV...

A bigger problem is calling Vault 0 "the hub of the vault network". They could have used the same kind of facility but made it a strictly military facility, which would make sense since it's Cheyenne Mountain. But as is, it turns Vault-Tec into something that it never seemed to be.
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We could just say that the Vault 0 wasn't even built by Vault-tec and it was there before project safehouse. The real life US gov has a bunker there anyway. And the name? We could agree that it's the one non-canon part of it, but the bunker itself makes perfect sense. Its design is completely un-vault-like too.

To me the best way is to make canon what doesn't contradict things that were already established. I personally treat it as such. And I really hope that Midwest BoS makes a return someday, as it's my favorite faction in the wastelands.
 
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While more of a minor inconsistency than a direct contradiction, the design philosophy of power armor doesn't match the concepts of power armor in the main games. There are several parts sticking out, the strange "ear-flaps" that would carry on to the East Coast Enclave armor, and the shoulders whichseem to hang off or just project outwards, amongst other pieces of the suit. Very different from the compact, closed designs of the T-51b and APA, everything is sleek and close together, gaving it the tin man look instead of the feel of functioning parts protruding from every visible seam.

"I would redo the sprite of the Power Armor to make it more retro. Not that there is anything technically wrong with the sprite, it's a great piece of art. It's just that it is a bit out of place in the Fallout Universe. But bear in mind that we had to design it over a year ago and Interplay approved everything we did." - Tony Oakden, producer of FOT

It's a great design aesthetically speaking, but it doesn't fit the practical-looking technology that power armor always seemed to be developed upon.
 
Aesthetics are always at conflict with what matters. It's "the rule of cool", that is, "if it looks cool" is what matters, versus what actually works. The very stereotype "steel bikini" aesthetic you find in many fantasy RPGs is the most infamous example of choosing what's "cool" and pure aesthetics versus what makes sense or actually works. But "the rule of cool" is all over the place. Simply put, the style of the originals didn't fixate on the rule at all, they went their own way. FOBOS, meanwhile, was almost entirely guided by the hollow rule. Just take the Jane, the Raider Matron for example... I mean, what even IS that? It makes zero sense, it's purely aesthetic.
 
SnapSlav said:
Aesthetics are always at conflict with what matters. It's "the rule of cool", that is, "if it looks cool" is what matters, versus what actually works. The very stereotype "steel bikini" aesthetic you find in many fantasy RPGs is the most infamous example of choosing what's "cool" and pure aesthetics versus what makes sense or actually works. But "the rule of cool" is all over the place. .
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Everyone know that 2 square meters of cotton on a woman is more protective than 12 square meters of metal. I always felt that logic was condescending towards the fan bases of those games. As for the visuals of Midwestern BoS armor, the visuals getting reused in 3 was Bethesda's inconsistency. Even Bethesda said some portions of Tactics wouldn't be considered canon. I'm assuming that means no robot army and things weren't easy for them after Tactics. With some artistic inconsistencies, video game developers have the right to experiment artistically. If not, Fallout 4 wouldn't be a possibility since Bethesda wouldn't have taken a risk on in because the older fan base wouldn't be happy.
 
naossano said:
The reavers & beastlords were underused in FoT.
I assume it is linked to Interplay rushing them...
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I think there was a lot of Reaver content cut, maybe 2-3 missions. Your diagnosis as to why is largely correct. There might have been another Beastlord mission removed as well.

You may have noticed how the mission map numbers skip over several digits. As I recall most of the skips represent cut content.

Look way back for posts by Gareth ("Section 8"), here and on DAC. He was a Microforte employee on FOT and FOT2.
 
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