What was the Funniest Argument You've had with a Bethesda Apologist?

Dr Fallout said:
'It's just your opinion, which is wrong.'
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Technically there are two types of opinions: ones that make sense and ones that are stupid (I believe the sky is lime green because god loves green). They're all personal preference though.
 
I hate the opinion argument. If you think Fallout 4 is a masterpiece worthy of representing the combined efforts of the human race or the pinnacle of entertainment you're fucking wrong. Some opinions are so stupid I disregard them entirely. "fallout 4 is fun durr hehe zooboo and memes ecksdee" I can live with, but people giving this game 70+ on Metacritic are fucking idiots.

On the topic of Metacritic and shit I'm struggling making my Dishonored 2 review. The technical issues... I can live with them but it goes to show how much time was rushed.
 
SarcasticGoodGuy said:
I hate the opinion argument. If you think Fallout 4 is a masterpiece worthy of representing the combined efforts of the human race or the pinnacle of entertainment you're fucking wrong. Some opinions are so stupid I disregard them entirely. "fallout 4 is fun durr hehe zooboo and memes ecksdee" I can live with, but people giving this game 70+ on Metacritic are fucking idiots.

On the topic of Metacritic and shit I'm struggling making my Dishonored 2 review. The technical issues... I can live with them but it goes to show how much time was rushed.
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To paraphrase Thorlaserpunch on the old Bethesda forums...

If someone told me that they think Caddyshack 2 is a better film than Citizen Kane, I feel that would be a less wrong opinion than Fallout 4 being the best in the series.
 
Okay.... so this happened.

Also, hating a really bad video game is now a 'bandwagon'... fucking hell. Hate CoD? Hah! You're just a part of a bandwagon!

https://gyazo.com/32c4461b82b63fe06f044768dad46420

This link starts of the brain cell loss progress; a person says that the 'Railroad' and the 'Institute' are just as good contributions as factions like the Unity and west coast BoS.
You know what I love? When a franchise just so happily change someones beliefs and everything they stand for in a different direction, O BOY ARE MY PANTS WET when I hear about how Different and Better BOS is now. (psst Virgil is a good thing here, psst).

https://gyazo.com/4a7a46566c6505fec60a109f0ae67aea

Here is my response. Another user states that the Enclave Armor, was in Nuka World just so they can show it of. I'm sorry, but even if it wasn't created by The Enclave (god bless them), and just a prototype, they wouldn't show it off to the world. Hey World! Look at this Power Armor which hasn't even been released yet, and psst it's advanced as fuck. (beware the bad storytelling chinese communists)

https://gyazo.com/a3dbf0f068568f797148591c1cddddb1

This was his response.... oh lord. There is no argument but 'it's their franchise it's their thing don't get upset over something which was a huge fucking deal in fallout 2 you pre-war jet twat)
Also please read the last 'argument' he states in the last picture. Hah! You see it's similar! You start of as a courier, just like in F4 when you start as Commander Shepard, his wife is dead and his son is gone you must save him veteran of the good!

Fallout 4 in Reddit is just cancerous.



86908d14-2d89-4147-99ff-fb97949eae17
 
I have got a fresh new thread material. Here is a result of me posting mister caption shitout 4 review.

Ediros
#1 · 2d, 23h ago · · 19 ·


Also, I hope that bethesda and zenimax sell off Fallout and never, ever touch it again. But since people prefer loot, shoot and return instead of a deep compeling RPG, the chances are slim.

Have a nice video

SevenWays 56
#2 · 2d, 23h ago · 6 · ·
>> Ediros

... Wow someone's mad

Thunder Quill
#3 · 2d, 23h ago · 3 · ·
>> SevenWays 56 He's been like that for a while.



>> Ediros I was honestly really curious as to why you hate the game, and was going to watch the video, but It's three hours long. I don't have the time to watch that. Plus I'd end up disagreeing with you in the end, cause I enjoyed it as a game.

Final_Draft
#4 · 2d, 23h ago · 5 · ·
>> Ediros I enjoyed the game. Sure, the rpg elements are weaker, but Fallout 4 is by no means a bad game.

Thunder Quill
#5 · 2d, 23h ago · · ·
>> Final_Draft Agreed.

Random Dude
#6 · 2d, 23h ago · 5 · ·
>> Ediros I've lost count of how many times you've complained about Fallout 4 in this group.

Seriously it feels like you only make topics in this group relating to your hate for Fallout 4, why not make a POSITIVE post about the other Fallouts instead?

The Dark Soul
#7 · 2d, 22h ago · 5 · ·
>> Ediros *sigh*

People will play The Elder Scrolls and like what they do ("fight, loot, return"). But then they play Fallout, which does all the same stuff The Elder Scrolls does ("fight, loot, return")and get all pissy about it because "it does not feel like an RPG". Then demonize those who defends Fallout, and then demonize those who are against The Elder Scrolls.

Smh.

And yeah, I agree with the post above. All you do is ejaculate your hate about Fallout 4. Can't you post something nice for once? About any of the Fallouts?!

Cakebomb
#8 · 2d, 21h ago · 4 · ·
>> Ediros Are you autistic, or just a troll?

The Cynical Brony
#9 · 2d, 20h ago · 1 · ·
>> Ediros Or maybe, mate, Fallout 4 is a decent bloody game. Maybe it isn't the literal antichrist because it dared to be different than the other games. Hell, like others have said, why not post something good about the other games? Like Fallout New Vegas! That has tons of good things to talk about!

>> The Dark Soul TBH, "Kill, loot, return" applies to basically all the Fallout games. It was fine when they did it, it's fine when 4 does it.

Professor Plum
Story Approver
Group Contributor
#10 · 2d, 19h ago · 3 · ·
>> Ediros

Fucking lol.

Kell
#11 · 2d, 16h ago · 2 · ·
Kris664
#12 · 2d, 11h ago · · ·
>> Ediros Man up and stop hating a game that is basically no different from the other games, like others point out, elder scrolls too.

Sanguinius Paladin
#13 · 2d, 11h ago · · ·
>> Cakebomb

I got a joke to add that.

What do you call a person who's mindlessly dedicated to their cause, always have to make a big deal, can't let things go after a long period of time, always believing their opinion is fact, ruining people's fun because they were triggered by it, and treats people like shit because they're better than them?

Cakebomb
#14 · 2d, 9h ago · · ·
>> Sanguinius Paladin Uhhhhhhhhhh I'm going to say it's either me, because that what you seem to be getting at, or a hipster.

Sanguinius Paladin
#15 · 2d, 9h ago · 1 · ·
>> Cakebomb

Nope.

A Liberal Regressive

Sanguinius Paladin
#16 · 2d, 9h ago · · ·
>> Cakebomb

I mean it's really funny and sad that some people are still holding hatred and ejaculating hate every 24/7 towards a game that's been out for ONE YEAR (For Fuck sakes). Just like the libtards protesting about Trump as President all because he said hurtful things that hurt their fefes.

But they share the same thing in common, not moving on with their lives and not getting a life.

Cakebomb
#17 · 2d, 9h ago · · ·
>> Sanguinius Paladin Ah, okay. I was worried I was about to get a verbal beat down their for a second.

Sanguinius Paladin
#18 · 2d, 9h ago · · ·
>> Cakebomb

Don't worry about it, you're okay.

Cakebomb
#19 · 2d, 6h ago · · ·
>> Sanguinius Paladin Thanks.

At least Trump brought Christmas early this year.

Paddle Steamer
#20 · 2d, 4h ago · 4 · ·
>> Thunder Quill

He's been like that since before the game even released.


FTFY

Sanguinius Paladin
#21 · 21h, 42m ago · 1 · ·
>> SevenWays 56

>> Thunder Quill

>> Final_Draft

>> Random Dude

>> The Dark Soul

>> Cakebomb

>> The Cynical Brony

>> Professor Plum

>> Kell

>> Kris664

>> Paddle Steamer

This OP in a nutshell.



Youtube Video


So next time ignore him.

Cakebomb
#22 · 21h, 39m ago · · ·
>> Sanguinius Paladin Alright.

Random Dude
#23 · 21h, 31m ago · · ·
>> Sanguinius Paladin I don't know what I learned from that video... Ignore people or need attention or don't ignore them because they will die?



... I'm still gonna ignore this guy though...

Final_Draft
#24 · 20h, 15m ago · · ·
>> Sanguinius Paladin Fair enough~ though it was the first complaint

Thunder Quill
#25 · 19h, 25m ago · · ·
>> Sanguinius Paladin ADD means you have trouble paying atention. It's even worse with ADHD, the extra hyper addon

Sanguinius Paladin
#26 · 19h, 22m ago · · ·
>> Thunder Quill

I know what it means. Just a joke.

Thunder Quill
#27 · 19h, 14m ago · · ·
>> Sanguinius Paladin I know, I didn't mean to offend. Just commenting on the video was all.

Kris664
#28 · 6h, 50m ago · · ·
>> Sanguinius Paladin ok

Narlepoax III
#29 · 5h, 33m ago · · ·
>> Ediros

Alright, dude. Stick a band-aid up your ass, pop some ibuprofen, and get the fuck over it. Nobody here thinks your constant whining is amusing.
 
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@Ediros I don't understand why would you stay in that.... cesspool. Stay right here, or the Codex, mate. I'm afraid you might got infected by such stupidity.
 
Black Angel said:
@Ediros I don't understand why would you stay in that.... cesspool. Stay right here, or the Codex, mate. I'm afraid you might got infected by such stupidity.
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I am only staying there, because I just like pissing off those guys. That and see if there is anything that can change their opinions.

Turns out there isn't, they are just brain dead idiots.

I was already going crazy from lack of NMA posts ;)
 
I rarely post in NMA, but I don't want to post these things on the Codex. Sometimes I feel like the world has gone mad, so I need to have some comments on the matter. Maybe I'm wrong. You guys will tell me.

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I don't know want to call anyone who disagrees with me a "Bethesda apologist", as long as they haven't called me a "New Vegas fanboy" or "Fallout elitist" first. But these kind of conversations are the ones you would have with a Bethesda apologist anyway, so here it goes, summarized:

1. Someone posts MisterCaption's excellent video on Reddit. It's three hours long, and naturally I wouldn't have watched it if it was a video praising Fallout 4, since fuck that. IMO, it's still FAR too long. He could have easily made his points in half the time (and if I had no life, I would download the video myself and edit it).
2. Person A says "bla bla another circlejerk video, people believing it's them vs us, this mentality ruins gaming".
3. I reply this will always happen when a franchise has taken such a drastic turn.
4. Person A basically says "it hasn't taken a drastic turn, and I don't see why people don't play the better game as opposed to criticizing Fallout 4". To another person, he replied "Most old rpg systems existed because there was no better way to implement something".
5. Naturally I point out that "the better game" has been out for six years already. Unless you are addicted to crap like Skyrim, no game will be enjoyable for six years if you play it all the time, and in the two years I played New Vegas I pretty much exhausted it, different dialogue checks notwithstanding, and that I would be surprised if people still play Fallout 4 six years from now. (By then, I'm pretty sure they will have moved onto Fallout 4 with swords and sorcery, a.k.a. TES VI). Then I explain that the reason isometric games have become much less common is because casual 3D FPS games sell much more, and that what those games do, isometric could do much better (when it comes to roleplaying mechanics).
6. He calls isometric RPGs linear. Ironically Bethesda's games are non-linear because they are terrible RPGs. Some of the best open world RPGs ever made have linearity in them: Gothic, Fallout, Fallout: New Vegas. Sadly I made a poor choice of words and said that Bethesda's games are fairly linear in how they work too: exhaust a place's quests, move on to the next area (this is partially true, but you can go anywhere you want as opposed to a next, fixed location).
7. After he says the issue has been blown out of proportion, I mention it is natural for this to happen when there's a company (Obsidian) that could easily return Fallout to greatness with Tim Cain at its helm. This very quickly devolves into "New Vegas didn't met sales or reviews however, so it's debatable" (that Fallout can BE GREAT AGAIN), hence I say "I don't care since it's an amazing RPG and better than Bethesda's attempts" (really, as if I were to lose sleep because the game was rated 84 at Metacritic). He says this is subjective, I say no one has been able to argue against it (more of this in a moment).
8. The conversation turns to shit as he is now comparing USER MADE MODS to New Vegas, saying user mods are more polished than the game. Despite my best attempts to explain to him that the comparison is absurd (infinite time with no money loss vs finite time, finite experience with the engine and tools), he keeps on it and then compares FO3 conversions to New Vegas. If someone has played any of these, let me know. My experience with conversions is that even the most praised ones are absolute shit from a polish standpoint. He also said Obsidian should have improved Bethesda's engine. :/
9. When I say no one has ever successfully defend Fallout 3 to be a better RPG than New Vegas (hence why I say it is the better RPG and it's pretty much out of the discussion), he says the following, and I quote:

I have, mainly on steam.

They like it for the same reasons they like stalker
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Disregarding the fact he keeps confusing "better game" with "better RPG" (I told him that what makes a game better is purely subjective, since the purpose of a game is to have fun, and thus, no one can force me to enjoy a game; but what makes a game a "better RPG" is something that can be argued), I just called it a day and left the conversation at that.

Again, I didn't call him a Bethesda apologist, even if he did call me an "elitist" (for liking better RPGs and wanting Fallout to be better, it seems). I even said Bethesda owns the franchise and I can't just tell them "STOP MAKING FALLOUT GAMES", since they bought it fair and square (I understand I may get some flak here for saying this, but it's business at the end of the day), all we can do is demand them to make better games and hope they do so.

I said is people have a reason to be upset, especially when they were with the franchise from the beginning, and that it's definitely not nice to see the man behind the franchise try to recover it, only to be outbid by a bigger outfit. How can someone be against all of these truths (I honestly don't see how all of this is up for discussion, but whatever) is beyond me.
 
SarcasticGoodGuy said:
Another good one I found in this thread is a guy saying that the low Metacritic user score "doesn't mean anything", and then proceeding to cite Steam's 'mostly positive' as a reason as to why the game is good.
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Ironically, Fallout 4 got the worst user rating on steam of any Fallout game.
 
Ediros said:
I have got a fresh new thread material. Here is a result of me posting mister caption shitout 4 review.
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I have five minutes to spare before I return to play Akalabeth, so here I go.

I enjoyed the game. Sure, the rpg elements are weaker, but Fallout 4 is by no means a bad game.
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If you tweak that to "is by no means a bad game to me" (meaning people can have different opinions), he is basically saying the truth. I thought Skyrim was an awful RPG, but it did take 500 hours of my life, so I consider it a good game. A very flawed game, but it was fun. Mindless fun.

why not make a POSITIVE post about the other Fallouts instead?
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The positives have been out there for 19 years already. 6 years for New Vegas.

People will play The Elder Scrolls and like what they do ("fight, loot, return"). But then they play Fallout, which does all the same stuff The Elder Scrolls does ("fight, loot, return")and get all pissy about it because "it does not feel like an RPG". Then demonize those who defends Fallout, and then demonize those who are against The Elder Scrolls.
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TBH, "Kill, loot, return" applies to basically all the Fallout games. It was fine when they did it, it's fine when 4 does it.
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It's funny because Fallout means "Bethesda's Fallouts" in this case. Essentially Oblivion and Skyrim with guns. FO1, FO2, and New Vegas aren't like that. There's barely any combat in New Vegas to begin with as opposed to, say, Morrowind.

Also: Skyrim's gameplay is boring as shit, but that's basically the essence of TES.

Or maybe, mate, Fallout 4 is a decent bloody game. Maybe it isn't the literal antichrist because it dared to be different than the other games.
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It "dared to be different"... I'd say it "wanted to be worse". A voiced protagonist and a butchered dialogue wheel is not daring to be different, it's actively making bad decisions. I refuse to think this was "accidental", this kind of shit doesn't happen accidentally, you don't accidentally make a hand grenade and blow up your house.
 
The rest of the stuff they vomited are plain retarded (like bringing up metacritic score. Seriously, did he just basically ignored the fact that FO4 literally got the same score? Meh, just redderp being redderp). But this...
Lucas9 said:
4. ...... "Most old rpg systems existed because there was no better way to implement something".
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This takes the cake. I think I just lose a brain cell or two reading that shit. Basically, yet another variant of "the older games were turn-based/isometric because of technological limitations!" argument, but this time it literally attacked the system/mechanic.

Fuck, if only they wouldn't be so retarded to be blinded by flashy cinematic linear interactive "video game", they would've realized older games were classics because they were actual game. It's nearly 2017, "technological limitation" isn't really a thing anymore yet AAA developers could barely design, let alone program actually good gameplay system/mechanics.
 
Lucas9 said:
How can someone be against all of these truths (I honestly don't see how all of this is up for discussion, but whatever) is beyond me.
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The answer: Tribalistic fanboyism. It's apparently the in-thing for gaming and why my default expression on the Internet is :roll: or :scratch:.

Apparently, there is no such thing as being able to like something and still be able to criticise it to death (though 4 along with modern Bethesda games deserve the flack). It's either blind love or blind hate for those idiots.

Besides, based on the actual responses of fans on r/Fallout (or rather other proper discussions sites where the tribal fanboys don't stalk about) whenever New Vegas comes up, most of gamers these days actually don't like 4 that much or are more critical of it these days. Heck, the tribal fanboys are the ones that get flack for being mindless fanboys.
 
CerberusGate said:
Besides, based on the actual responses of fans on r/Fallout (or rather other proper discussions sites where the tribal fanboys don't stalk about) whenever New Vegas comes up, most of gamers these days actually don't like 4 that much or are more critical of it these days. Heck, the tribal fanboys are the ones that get flack for being mindless fanboys.
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I think even Fallout 3 fans have begun to understand where the original Fallout fanbase came from (with its criticism). They have now witnessed first hand Bethesda turning their beloved game into a dumb shooter.
 
Black Angel said:
Fuck, if only they wouldn't be so retarded to be blinded by flashy cinematic linear interactive "video game", they would've realized older games were classics because they were actual game. It's nearly 2017, "technological limitation" isn't really a thing anymore yet AAA developers could barely design, let alone program actually good gameplay system/mechanics.
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What's particularly funny, is that I think todays games are quite often 'technically' limited by the choices the developers/publishers made. Take Dragon Age for example, or Fallout 4, and what happend to the dialog and variety of the dialog, NPCs and role playing to those games when they decided that everything, even the protagonist, has to be fully voiced. How could we ever hope to get a game with the scope of Planescape or something similar, if everyone needs a voice? I understand reading is hard ... but it's simply not feasible - nor desireable - to give everyone a voice.
And let us not even talk about the visual limitation of making everything 3D.
 
Crni Vuk said:
What's particularly funny, is that I think todays games are quite often 'technically' limited by the choices the developers/publishers made. Take Dragon Age for example, or Fallout 4, and what happend to the dialog and variety of the dialog, NPCs and role playing to those games when they decided that everything, even the protagonist, has to be fully voiced. How could we ever hope to get a game with the scope of Planescape or something similar, if everyone needs a voice? I understand reading is hard ... but it's simply not feasible - nor desireable - to give everyone a voice.
And let us not even talk about the visual limitation of making everything 3D.
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That's exactly what I meant. Everything, even the system, became so railroaded might as well call it an interactive movie/novel.

And regarding the topic of Planescape, shit they actually got a big part of the game voice-acted but (as far as where I got in my halted playthrough, a lil bit past Curst) it was so well-done it enhance the experience instead of taking away from it, like the way it did these days with these so-called AAA games.
 
Crni Vuk said:
What's particularly funny, is that I think todays games are quite often 'technically' limited by the choices the developers/publishers made. Take Dragon Age for example, or Fallout 4, and what happend to the dialog and variety of the dialog, NPCs and role playing to those games when they decided that everything, even the protagonist, has to be fully voiced. How could we ever hope to get a game with the scope of Planescape or something similar, if everyone needs a voice? I understand reading is hard ... but it's simply not feasible - nor desireable - to give everyone a voice.
And let us not even talk about the visual limitation of making everything 3D.
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Well, the solution to voice-acting is contracting talent from community theaters (aka the Bioware solution). You pay several actors to do a few lines for a single character (or a few) and boom, done. This is obviously more involved though, and Bethesda seems to like keeping everyone in the dark (including voice actors). The guy that voiced Kellogg didn't even know he was working on Fallout 4; he had no idea what the context was.
 
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