why fallout 2 sucks (spoilers) (no I don't like fo3-4)

jschmo6766

First time out of the vault
"you were critically hit in the head for 0 damage. the bruise will look nice and make for good party talk."

okay.

"you critically missed and lost your next turn."

I'll just assume I completely missed... a lot harder than usual, then. right.

"tough alien was hit for 0 damage.
tough alien was hit for 20 damage.
tough alien was critically hit in the eye for 3 damage." (same person attacking it)

"tough sm deathclaw was hit for 2 damage.
Sulik missed.
tough sm deathclaw was hit for 0 damage.
tough sm deathclaw was critically hit in the head for 219 damage. the blow knocks him unconscious. tough sm deathclaw was killed." (b4 or after he was knocked unconscious though? oh, it doesn't matter? yeah, that's my point) (btw, same attacker again)

dice rolls are fine. 4-7 damage makes sense. 100-150 damage with another type of weapon against the same enemy makes sense. 0 to infinite damage doesn't make sense, it just feels random and ridiculous. applying status effects to enemies that die simultaneously regardless doesn't make sense.

- at any point in the game, you can randomly run into gangs of radscorpions/wilders/cannibals/golden geckos that do negligible damage... or run into massive amounts of master's army/enclave/fire breathing geckos that will kill a party member in one round before you get a chance to heal them.

-oh I'm sorry, that's not always a random occurrence, let me update that last point. sometimes this bullshit is actually SCRIPTED: at the military base for example, first you have to fight 12 wolves which entails WAITING for each of them to attack 3 times each (for 0 damage if they don't miss) b4 you can finally kill one of them (assuming your brain hasn't fried from watching and hearing "RAW-RAWF" 36 fucking times by then). then you must wait for the remaining 11 to attack 3 times each b4 killing the 2nd one, and so on.... UGH.

break for singing, sing it with me: 12 mobs of wolves on the screen, 12 mobs of wolves! first you wait, then you kill one, 11 mobs of wolves on the screen! 11 mobs of wolves on the screen, 11 mobs of wolves! first you wait, then you kill one, 10 mobs of wolves on the screen! 10 mobs of wolves on the screen, 10 mobs of wolves! first you wait, then you kill one................................................

a few thousand less hairs, an extra bag under each eye, and 3 more wrinkles on your face later:

then of course you look at the mine cart and "your" observation basically instructs you to do something that you'd have never otherwise done: attach the metal pole to the cart, then attach dynamite to the metal pole, b/c "you" thought that it was a great plan. stupid. then you're inside the military base and face packs of rats that also deal negligible or 0 damage. it's just as much of a snore fest. then the next level of this dungeon? 15 super mutants that kill a party member in a single round b4 you can act. even if you get to act, you won't be able to target a party member to heal them b/c they're entirely obscured by the mass of pixels that's supposed to be your enemy - which prevents you from clicking on your ally, which is for some reason the only way that you can target your ally. what a joke. I doubt the devs ever even played this game or that they had anyone playtest it. I HAVE AN IDEA! HOW ABOUT IF YOU HOLD THE CONTROL KEY, YOU CAN CLICK STRAIGHT THROUGH ENEMIES TO THE ALLY THAT THEY'RE BLOCKING? IS THAT SUCH A LOFTY CONCEPT?

-the combat is 95% WAITING for others to act, 4% clicking on an enemy to damage or ally to heal, and 1% praying. it's the worst combat system of any game I've ever played. by a lot. yet somehow I remember enjoying FO1. maybe random encounters didn't treat me so poorly or they weren't as random or there were more encounters in between ridiculously easy and statistically impossible.

-the quests consist of one or more of the following: A) talk to someone. B) run from point A to point B. C) kill something. D) acquire something. A through D are all "accomplished" by clicking and nothing more, ever.

-the weapons are either not necessary or they won't do significant damage b/c the enemies are either lvl 1 or 999999, only aliens and sometimes deathclaws are seemingly anywhere in between. what a shame that 90%+ of the effort that went into making this game was in variety of weapons when only a handful are viable against the only enemies that matter.

but what makes up for the worst combat of all time? the fact that by clicking through dialogue you can either make group A friendlier and group B hostile or vice versa, according to a rabid group of diehard fanboys that should be calling their doctors instead of playing this old steaming pile b/c their raging hard ons for it have lasted much longer than is healthy or anywhere close to normal. "consequence" you call it. simple change of text in reality. are you out of your fucking minds or what?

yeah, yeah, I know: "OOOOH-OOH, BUT MR. J SCHMO SIX-SEVEN-SIX-SI-IIIIIIIII-IIIX...THEIR DIALOGUE CHANGES BASED ON MY 'CHOIRCERRRRRRS'!!!! MAH-YYY CHAAAAAAAARRCERRRRRRSSSS!" obnoxious....

"choice," lol, bunch of dumbass believers in here, aren't you all? enjoy your silly, childish illusion of choice and suffer through this terribly designed game for it, you poor delusional clowns.
 
troll? oh it's a troll, that's your counter-argument b/c there is no real one, correct? how can I troll by stating facts?

EDIT: and why should I be banned? b/c my criticism is real? if it was some dumbass posting while misspelling half his words and using poor grammar you'd archive it, but I should get banned b/c it hits too close to home I suppose?

RE-EDIT: I read other msgs on this forum that are just as cruel to fo4 fans with language that is more frequently foul than my small % of 4 letter words.

RE-RE-EDIT: this is coming from ppl using memes as a significant fraction of their msgs... and I'M the one who should be banned? kazacuchi, your sig is a troll, "make fallout great again"? we're not supposed to get into a political debate?
 
troll? oh it's a troll, that's your counter-argument b/c there is no real one, correct? how can I troll by stating facts?
Because your very first post here is a wall of text that basically boils down to "I don't like RNG, the game has bugs, you're a bunch of delusional clowns". Yeah, no trolling whatsoever.
EDIT: and why should I be banned? b/c my criticism is real? if it was some dumbass posting while misspelling half his words and using poor grammar you'd archive it, but I should get banned b/c it hits too close to home I suppose?
It IS some dumbass misspelling half his word, so yeah, I will archive it. But it doesn't appear that you're actually here to have a civil discussion, so I don't really think anyone is going to bother responding to your oh so valid points that hit so close to home.
 
troll? oh it's a troll, that's your counter-argument b/c there is no real one, correct? how can I troll by stating facts?

EDIT: and why should I be banned? b/c my criticism is real? if it was some dumbass posting while misspelling half his words and using poor grammar you'd archive it, but I should get banned b/c it hits too close to home I suppose?

RE-EDIT: I read other msgs on this forum that are just as cruel to fo4 fans with language that is more frequently foul than my small % of 4 letter words.

So just reading your first two points, you seem to fail to grasp the idea of CRPGs from the late 90's.
 
troll? oh it's a troll, that's your counter-argument b/c there is no real one, correct? how can I troll by stating facts?

EDIT: and why should I be banned? b/c my criticism is real? if it was some dumbass posting while misspelling half his words and using poor grammar you'd archive it, but I should get banned b/c it hits too close to home I suppose?

RE-EDIT: I read other msgs on this forum that are just as cruel to fo4 fans with language that is more frequently foul than my small % of 4 letter words.
butthurt fo4 redditor detected
 
butthurt fo4 redditor detected
He really is a Redditor, and most of his posts are just about how Fallout 2 sucks.
Anyway jschmo6766, I ask you again: Are you actually here to have a discussion or do you just want to flame bait?
I mean, you just copy-pasted one of your Reddit posts in here, a post that is so shoddy that even Reddit would consider it flame-baiting spam.
 
butthurt fo4 redditor detected
parrot who speaks only in memes detected, who's never said an original thing in his life and most likely no one ever responds to b/c there's nothing to respond to. and it's in the title: I don't like fo4.

He really is a Redditor, and most of his posts are just about how Fallout 2 sucks.
Anyway jschmo6766, I ask you again: Are you actually here to have a discussion or do you just want to flame bait?
I mean, you just copy-pasted one of your Reddit posts in here, a post that is so shoddy that even Reddit would consider it flame-baiting spam.
actually it's not copy pasted at all, it's much different. I obv typed it all up again. so no, you're wrong and I'm obv discussing.
 
"you were critically hit in the head for 0 damage. the bruise will look nice and make for good party talk."

okay.

"you critically missed and lost your next turn."

I'll just assume I completely missed... a lot harder than usual, then. right.

"tough alien was hit for 0 damage.
tough alien was hit for 20 damage.
tough alien was critically hit in the eye for 3 damage." (same person attacking it)

"tough sm deathclaw was hit for 2 damage.
Sulik missed.
tough sm deathclaw was hit for 0 damage.
tough sm deathclaw was critically hit in the head for 219 damage. the blow knocks him unconscious. tough sm deathclaw was killed." (b4 or after he was knocked unconscious though? oh, it doesn't matter? yeah, that's my point) (btw, same attacker again)

dice rolls are fine. 4-7 damage makes sense. 100-150 damage with another type of weapon against the same enemy makes sense. 0 to infinite damage doesn't make sense, it just feels random and ridiculous. applying status effects to enemies that die simultaneously regardless doesn't make sense.

- at any point in the game, you can randomly run into gangs of radscorpions/wilders/cannibals/golden geckos that do negligible damage... or run into massive amounts of master's army/enclave/fire breathing geckos that will kill a party member in one round before you get a chance to heal them.

-oh I'm sorry, that's not always a random occurrence, let me update that last point. sometimes this bullshit is actually SCRIPTED: at the military base for example, first you have to fight 12 wolves which entails WAITING for each of them to attack 3 times each (for 0 damage if they don't miss) b4 you can finally kill one of them (assuming your brain hasn't fried from watching and hearing "RAW-RAWF" 36 fucking times by then). then you must wait for the remaining 11 to attack 3 times each b4 killing the 2nd one, and so on.... UGH.

break for singing, sing it with me: 12 mobs of wolves on the screen, 12 mobs of wolves! first you wait, then you kill one, 11 mobs of wolves on the screen! 11 mobs of wolves on the screen, 11 mobs of wolves! first you wait, then you kill one, 10 mobs of wolves on the screen! 10 mobs of wolves on the screen, 10 mobs of wolves! first you wait, then you kill one................................................

a few thousand less hairs, an extra bag under each eye, and 3 more wrinkles on your face later:

then of course you look at the mine cart and "your" observation basically instructs you to do something that you'd have never otherwise done: attach the metal pole to the cart, then attach dynamite to the metal pole, b/c "you" thought that it was a great plan. stupid. then you're inside the military base and face packs of rats that also deal negligible or 0 damage. it's just as much of a snore fest. then the next level of this dungeon? 15 super mutants that kill a party member in a single round b4 you can act. even if you get to act, you won't be able to target a party member to heal them b/c they're entirely obscured by the mass of pixels that's supposed to be your enemy - which prevents you from clicking on your ally, which is for some reason the only way that you can target your ally. what a joke. I doubt the devs ever even played this game or that they had anyone playtest it. I HAVE AN IDEA! HOW ABOUT IF YOU HOLD THE CONTROL KEY, YOU CAN CLICK STRAIGHT THROUGH ENEMIES TO THE ALLY THAT THEY'RE BLOCKING? IS THAT SUCH A LOFTY CONCEPT?

-the combat is 95% WAITING for others to act, 4% clicking on an enemy to damage or ally to heal, and 1% praying. it's the worst combat system of any game I've ever played. by a lot. yet somehow I remember enjoying FO1. maybe random encounters didn't treat me so poorly or they weren't as random or there were more encounters in between ridiculously easy and statistically impossible.

-the quests consist of one or more of the following: A) talk to someone. B) run from point A to point B. C) kill something. D) acquire something. A through D are all "accomplished" by clicking and nothing more, ever.

-the weapons are either not necessary or they won't do significant damage b/c the enemies are either lvl 1 or 999999, only aliens and sometimes deathclaws are seemingly anywhere in between. what a shame that 90%+ of the effort that went into making this game was in variety of weapons when only a handful are viable against the only enemies that matter.

but what makes up for the worst combat of all time? the fact that by clicking through dialogue you can either make group A friendlier and group B hostile or vice versa, according to a rabid group of diehard fanboys that should be calling their doctors instead of playing this old steaming pile b/c their raging hard ons for it have lasted much longer than is healthy or anywhere close to normal. "consequence" you call it. simple change of text in reality. are you out of your fucking minds or what?

yeah, yeah, I know: "OOOOH-OOH, BUT MR. J SCHMO SIX-SEVEN-SIX-SI-IIIIIIIII-IIIX...THEIR DIALOGUE CHANGES BASED ON MY 'CHOIRCERRRRRRS'!!!! MAH-YYY CHAAAAAAAARRCERRRRRRSSSS!" obnoxious....

"choice," lol, bunch of dumbass believers in here, aren't you all? enjoy your silly, childish illusion of choice and suffer through this terribly designed game for it, you poor delusional clowns.

Basically you're not very good at Fallout 2 therefore it sucks?
 
parrot who speaks only in memes detected, who's never said an original thing in his life and most likely no one ever responds to b/c there's nothing to respond to. and it's in the title: I don't like fo4.


actually it's not copy pasted at all, it's much different. I obv typed it all up again. so no, you're wrong and I'm obv discussing.
You responded just now. :D

you must get bloodborne and its dlc. most rewarding experience in gaming is beating miyazaki's souls and souls-like games. after you figure out how to counter an enemy's moves and start killing bosses you'll feel it. my fav games of the past such as morrowwind, baldur's gate, fallout 2, planescape torment, chrono trigger, ocarina of time all seem boring now sadly. great stories and chars and everything, yeah, but the gameplay is nowhere near as good as I thought it was after playing through dark souls and bloodborne. I beat bloodborne 6 times with the same char and am on my way through it again with him. I'm even spoiled by the way the story is presented. it's not really, you just piece together what has gone on in its universe through item descriptions and the environment. it's brilliant and makes the straightforward story-telling of other games seem so much less creative. it takes a time investment until you're efficient but if you put it in you won't regret it and you'll be looking up the rest of the creator's games. also takes a lot of patience, maybe even stubbornness, but if you can appreciate fallout 2 over 4, morrowwind over skyrim, then bloodborne might be for you if you also like a challenge.

So do you love or hate fallout 2?
 
He really is a Redditor, and most of his posts are just about how Fallout 2 sucks.
Anyway jschmo6766, I ask you again: Are you actually here to have a discussion or do you just want to flame bait?
I mean, you just copy-pasted one of your Reddit posts in here, a post that is so shoddy that even Reddit would consider it flame-baiting spam.
oh and that whole massive amount of posts to reddit were all within the past 2 or 3 days b/c I've recently gotten back into FO2 after putting it down for sucking so hard. but after every phantasy star, breath of fire, tales of, suikoden, megami tensei, final fantasy, baldur's gate, icewind dale, TES (up to morrowwind) it was time to try and trudge through this awfully designed game again. it's mindnumingly bad. every time I play I find more to hate. I hate exploring san francisco, 80%+ of the houses have nothing in them and 90%+ of the ppl aren't worth talking to, this is an extremely conservative estimate and you know it.

You responded just now. :D



So do you love or hate fallout 2?

obvious typo. FO1, clearly.
 
and it's in the title: I don't like fo4

And you automatically think that makes any difference

what a shame that 90%+ of the effort that went into making this game was in variety of weapons when only a handful are viable against the only enemies that matter.

Maybe you just have a bad build. I´ve used low level weapons weapons at beggining of the game and I had no problem.

dice rolls are fine. 4-7 damage makes sense. 100-150 damage with another type of weapon against the same enemy makes sense. 0 to infinite damage doesn't make sense, it just feels random and ridiculous. applying status effects to enemies that die simultaneously regardless doesn't make sense.

That´s just the game making calculations.

- at any point in the game, you can randomly run into gangs of radscorpions/wilders/cannibals/golden geckos that do negligible damage... or run into massive amounts of master's army/enclave/fire breathing geckos that will kill a party member in one round before you get a chance to heal them.

Sometimes you get easier opponents sometimes difficult ones. That´s why it´s called random encounter.
 
oh and that whole massive amount of posts to reddit were all within the past 2 or 3 days b/c I've recently gotten back into FO2 after putting it down for sucking so hard. but after every phantasy star, breath of fire, tales of, suikoden, megami tensei, final fantasy, baldur's gate, icewind dale, TES (up to morrowwind) it was time to try and trudge through this awfully designed game again. it's mindnumingly bad. every time I play I find more to hate. I hate exploring san francisco, 80%+ of the houses have nothing in them and 90%+ of the ppl aren't worth talking to, this is an extremely conservative estimate and you know it.



obvious typo. FO1, clearly.
how is fo1 different in game mechanics from fo2?
 
It really sounds like you just suck at the game. You pick Narg and complain that the game shouldn't have included that character, seriously? Fallout 2 is not exactly a friendly game when it comes to bad builds. Taking Narg as your first character, complaining that small guns are useless (obviously you haven't seen the Gauss rifle...), basically complaining about all your shoddy choices.
It's like this comic:
http://thepunchlineismachismo.com/archives/comic/almost-a-true-story
You wanted to play a certain character very different from what it was supposed to be played.
So you like JRPGs. Fallout 2 isn't a JRPG. But you do appear to have played some western RPGs as well, so I'm really not sure how you can be so pissed off by Fallout 2. I mean, you obviously understand the basics of character creation and classes. It's like playing Morrowind playing as a Redguard Barbarian trying to go all magic. Kinda not a good idea.
 
I'd say some of these complaints are valid.
  • Pitting you against a bunch of wolves and rats late-game is time-wasting bullshit, even if it makes sense that there'd be wolves/rats there.
  • Large models obscuring smaller ones and screwing with target selection is annoying as hell. Can't think of any other 2D/TB games of the time that fix this though. Even big games like Diablo 2 had this problem 3 years later. Pretty sure it even happens today in Diablo 3.
  • There are a bunch of shitty fetch quests and boring running back and forth. But there's also a ton of good quests to make up for that.
The rest of the complaints seem more like a combination of not understanding the systems and not liking (c)RPGs. Plus some of it is just plain wrong. Also, it sounds like he's too stupid to figure out how to turn up combat speed.
 
And you automatically think that makes any difference
oh yes it does. I knew for a fact that ppl would assume that the only reason I even played FO2 is b/c I played FO4 when I actually haven't played FO4 yet (BECAUSE I remember jack shit from FO2 [b/c it sucks])
 
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