Adapting Van Buren (Workshop)

Discussion in 'Fan Art/Fan Fiction' started by Atomic Postman, Jun 5, 2021.

  1. Hardboiled Android

    Hardboiled Android Vault Senior Citizen

    Jun 7, 2015
    Hmm. You do have a point. If you want to go that route, the nreally you could cut down on their backstory quite a bit to make way for more substance elsewhere - it doesn't really matter anymore to know in detail their theology, they're just tribals who worship stars - and even them worshipping the stars doesn't even really matter all that much anymore. But this would not be my preference, I say try and make them fit into the storylines more in ways. They're people with their own motives independent of other actors. And the USSA ID could be an interesting reward.

    Sounds good.

    Maybe not Sidewinders Mando, that's already taken by... well the Sidewinders, but higher level sure.

    When I was initially doing this reread of New Mexico, I had this thought about why those Scorpions were at Vault 29: maybe the Scorpions have gotten too big for their britches. They've outcompeted most of the other tribes in ABQ, raided and destroyed everyone else. They used to have a system where youngsters made their bones by going out and conquering other tribes,but now there's nowhere left to go, the ABQ is conquered and then there's just empty desert. Everything else is too far away for the limited institutional means of the Scorpions to rally support. So, young people are going far afield to make their glory on their own. Further, people see the writing on the wall and that joining the Red Okies might be the only path to survival. Just a thought, nothing concrete here.

    Ok, ok, here's two things.

    Firstly, make them the main competitors of the Scorpion's Bite: the Scorpions hold the richer ruins on the east side of the Rio Grande, the Glyphers are a major tribes themselves who hold the desert to the East, which only has a small sliver of the city. They're raiders themselves, albeit not as savage as the Scorpions.

    And this one is sort of the secret main reason why I want you to keep them in... a quest concept. I already brought up the Las Lunas Decalogue stone, which I thought was a cool thing that gelled well with the Glyphers. Well, it also happens to gel particuarly well with everyone's favorite theocrats, the New Canaanites, considering the stone was probably in the first place a hoax concocted to support the Mormon thesis of Israelites in the New World.

    I've always found it curious that in New Vegas, outside of the name of Driver Nephi, absolutely no reference is made to those more peculiar aspects of Mormon belief that dominates the popular consciousness today. Instead they were treated like generic Christians, or even generic authentically religious people writ large. I think this was firstly because those strange elements of LDS weren't relevant to the story, and also out of a sense of politeness. While this is one of the partsI really like about New Vegas, its favorable depiction of Mormonism when there is a lot to recommend it despite their kookiness, I still feel like it should be addressed somewhere in the series.

    This, I think, provides an opportunity to do just that. Plus, it gives an opportunity to haave anothere instance of Mormon missionaries, a running motif I'm quite fond of in this campaign.

    So here's the quest: there are two missionaries among the Glyphers. They have discovered this stone and know it from ancient records to be a copy of the Ten Commandments, and they firmly believe it was left here by the Nephites. But they disagree over what to do with it: one wants to keep it here to preach to the Glyphers, who are interested in the stone but have a totally incorrect interpretation of it based on their mythology. The other would rather send the thing back to New Canaan as a glorious monument.

    The former option would convert the Glyphers and allow the player to use an ideological bent to push the Glyphers towards one course of action or another beneficial to the players in New Mexico. Of course this comes at the cost of the Glypher's culture. The other option would get you massive accolades in New Canaan, some kind of more material reward (?), but it would throw the Glyphers into a rage. Depending on how the players handle this, this could result in the murder of the missionaries and hostility to the party... or the anger could be redirected elsewhere in New Mexico.

    To achieve the conversion route there are a handful of options. First, simply make a convincing intelligent argument with skill and special checks. Failing this, use CODE to hypnotize the crowd. Third, use Hecate's same method of conversion. Fourth, have some display of high technology that proves you to be a god. To achieve the latter, you need to hire a Brahmin team from Quartz. If Ugly John is in charge, he'll charge an exorbitant rate unless you help him out. If you free the town, they'll give you the team for free out of gratitude. To avoid the worst case scenario with the glyphers, you can engage in a speech similar to the former but with the added option to frame some other tribe.*

    *Maybe one of the social elements of the Glyphers could be big open forum meetings, primitive democracy, mostly centered around wise men interpreting the signs as proxies to make arguments for some course of action or other.

    I know it's from Wasteland I said as much. Project Darwin, at least as you've rendered it here, I do think could fit fairly well, you really did do a good job with the concept of the android dungeon (though I should note in addition to treading on the toes of nearby Rebirth it treads on the toes of Utah Testing Grounds), but just doesn't happen to fit here particuarly well. Save it for another game - or, alternatively, you could ditch Utah Proving Grounds and replace it with this, extremely altered in terms of context, since it does feel odd to have a high-level quest from Granite fulfilled in mid-level Utah, and it makes New Mexico more connected to the rest of the world.

    The Communists, I don't like at all. I'm not a fan of the concept in Wasteland, it feels silly, but doubly so here when it becomes a pop culture reference too, and an internal revolt rather than external invasion (which obviously doesn't work for New Mexico).

    I do like the concept of another settlement, especially a 'civilized' settlement, just not in its current form.

    I meant that it could be used as the opportunity to do the description of the Cheyenne Wastes that I so desperately crave.

    Something worth noting: Almost all of the New Mexico content is in the Rio Grande valley or slightly east. West New Mexico is fairly empty.

    I 1000% prefer this (and even previous iterations) to the Yesterday map. Just ask the krauts to remove the hex grid and then apply the same effects, should be trivial since I imagine the hex grid is all on one layer seperate.
     
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  2. Atomic Postman

    Atomic Postman Vault Archives Overseer

    Mar 16, 2013
    Yeah yeah alright I'll put some effort in on them. Try and see if I can tie them into Bloomfield a little bit and get that USSA connection going.



    I'm going to revise the layout of the bunker and have some more characters mulling about. As Papa John says, stay tuned.


    Bad phrasing on my part. Moreso just making them better geared, smarter and more Klingon/Mando in style. I'm thinking they don't have the shells or parts for the artillery nor the Brahmin to haul it or artillery expert to fire it if they wanted to - all of which could be done by the players to absolutely annihilate Red Dawn (which is now just a town ran by the Red Okie Horde and renamed that by them).

    I was thinking the Twin Mother's band are losers who got washed out of the poison ritual trying to prove they're warriors but they're still just chumps. They want to either bring back the magic of the Vault to prove themselves or attract the rewards of the Legion to bring similar wealth.


    I like this. I will take this.


    I'm going to dump Darwin and replace them with another Sierra Army Depot in West New Mexico that replaces the Utah Testing Range. Maybe one of the quests of the Brotherhood is getting this location from the Scaven-Pickers. They know of it and scavenge it sometimes but the Brotherhood haven't been able to shake it out of the one or two they've captured.

    Hey presto, gone.



    They could have a more militant camp on the verges of Cheyenne Mountain that got wiped out once by the BoS on approach so their replacements are insta-hostile unless you call out to them in their language.




    I will ask them. What do you think of the black and white idea? Of course I can also change the nature of the type of black and white etc but I actually think it weirdly works.
     
  3. Hardboiled Android

    Hardboiled Android Vault Senior Citizen

    Jun 7, 2015
    Maybe they could be resettled at Bloomfield if you go that route with the Rangers? One way or another, their agrarian days seem to be numbered in the Rio Grande Valley. Not super sold on this idea myself, though.

    Got a chuckle out of me

    Klingon kind of, Mando no. Not too much professionalism or honor, need to be thoroughly raiders.

    Oh no I get that - those are the 'personal' humanistic factors that drove these particular individuals, but what I described is the underlying social-material factors driving that phenomenon.

    Maybe the Scorpions used to be from outside of Albuquerque and the tribes native to the ruins of the city were the "Albers?"

    Keep in mind this alone is not sufficient.

    Any gimmick? And good BoS integration.

    I would say that it almost works, but I'm not quite sold. it does have the advantage of looking like a slide projection or an old timey satellite or air reconnaissance photo, which is neat, but total black and white feels a bit far. There's a lot of potential variations to do with these sorts of settings, continue to play around with them. Maybe you could do one that's sort of orange-y, harping back to my original concept.

    Also, idea: Maybe what weakened the locals enough to let the Red Okies roll through is, in addition to infighting, the raids by the BoS. Maybe something similar could happen to Quartz, trading networks disrupted by BoS weakened it enough that ugly John (himself of course displaced by the Brotherhood) could take it.
     
  4. Atomic Postman

    Atomic Postman Vault Archives Overseer

    Mar 16, 2013
    Eh not quite. If Hecate is a goner and so are the Luddites - the status quo resumes. Perhaps a tie into Bloomfield could be a holoprojector in the Bloomfield strategy room that shows a star map - you could effectively rekindle their religion with it. That's until the Legion rolls in anyway.





    Yeah just general warrior society. They're very Khan esque and will remain so.


    Killing their way through Alber and running out of steam is a good idea and a nice way to also foreshadow the eventual problems of the Legion.




    I'm going to lean into the glowing mushroom and cave dwelling stuff. You could open up a storyline of offering the shrooms as gifts to the Scaven Pickers - RadAway without the headache or rarity.


    It would replace Utah Testing Range i.e it would have the mozzombies and the cryo-nest. Lacks the reality of the mosquitos experiment being a real thing from Utah Testing Range but Fallout is alt-reality so who cares.


    I've asked the Jerries for a gridless version. I actually think the current grid with icons and not a coloured grid would look best but whatever. In the meantime here's a New Vegas filter version you might like:
    fomap_full (4).jpg

    This would be something the people at Underpass/Quartz would complain about pretty vocally yeah. That this is the Brotherhood's fault.

    Edit: Gridless version fomap_full_2.jpg


    Filtered Gridless version: fomap_full_2 (1).jpg
     

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    Last edited: Jul 22, 2021
  5. Hardboiled Android

    Hardboiled Android Vault Senior Citizen

    Jun 7, 2015
    Film grain filters are definitely a winner in every instance
     
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  6. Atomic Postman

    Atomic Postman Vault Archives Overseer

    Mar 16, 2013
    I quite like the orange filtered one with the grain. I think I might use that.
     
  7. Atomic Postman

    Atomic Postman Vault Archives Overseer

    Mar 16, 2013
    @Hardboiled Android

    I added a paragraph to accommodate the Bone Dancers, and moved Burning Springs to East Carbon, Utah.

    The Bone Dancers
    upload_2021-7-22_12-44-57.png


    The Bone Dancers live in the ruins of Park City, Utah. Descended from survivors of an international film festival and locals, what were once artists and movie-makers descended into violent cannibalism and their artistic roots transformed into horrifying sadism. The Bone Dancers have a simplistic occultist religion wherein they practice cannibalism as a form of worship at their “Temple of Blood” (An Old-World movie theatre). They believe that they absorb the strength and souls of those they eat, and please their dark “God” in the process. They carry spears, knives and bats. They wear tribal leathers but adorn themselves with the skeletal remains of their victims. They value the flesh of the young as the most pure and powerful, but eat outsiders only.
     
  8. Hardboiled Android

    Hardboiled Android Vault Senior Citizen

    Jun 7, 2015
    Oh wow, this is absolutely fantastic, really glad I didn't relent because you made something great here!

    Having the Bonedancers come from what is essentially Sundance is a brilliant touch, as is them being a group of depraved descendantsa of artists - after all, where else do you find such comical levels of sadism outside but the movie theater?

    This use of Temple of Blood is also a great example of the sort of Wasteland itnegration that works.

    The location doesn't really matter, but Park City seems way too close to both the New Canaanites et al and the Eagle Rock. Plus so close to SLC could hardly by described as "the fringes of Utah." I'd say move them further south, maybe somewhere in or around Provo since that's where Sundance is (though obviously not Sundance itself)
     
  9. Atomic Postman

    Atomic Postman Vault Archives Overseer

    Mar 16, 2013
    I changed the wording in the Railroad Bulls quest (new name of the Roadsters, every GJ quest is a Big Rock Candy Mountain lyric now) to accommodate their new location. A player versed in the region could roll Survival to call the Dusty Runners out on their illogical threat - if they're starving and need the food, they wouldn't be able to make it to the Bone Dancers in the first place. It's an empty threat because they'd get eaten alongside the kids anyway and they know that - it just sounds scary.
     
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  10. Hardboiled Android

    Hardboiled Android Vault Senior Citizen

    Jun 7, 2015
    Well two things - firstly, it's not super relevant, I just think the Bone Dancers shouldn't be quite so close to SLC and Ogden. But whether it's Provo or Park City, the threat is just as empty.

    Though it's not necessarially a sure thing that they would be eaten - you established that the Bone Dancers are among the biggest customers of the Heartbreak Hotel. But I suppose that's different, since the Heartbreakers are well armed and armored and organized enough to make the Bone Dancers think twice, and also they're a steady source of slaves. But the Dust Runners are a piddling, weak band with no friends, and they'll only be delivering the goods once, so it's no problem to eat them too. In any case, having the Bone Dancers down in Provo or environs would in addition to giving the Canaanites some breathing room would make the trade between them and the Heartbreak Hotel a lot more viable
     
  11. Atomic Postman

    Atomic Postman Vault Archives Overseer

    Mar 16, 2013
    I suppose but then it kills the Sundance reference. The players aren't going to know they're descended from artists and movie directors but smart players can put the name together with the location to get the reference. As for the New Canaanites - we're told by Ulysses they were always harassed by raiders anyway. I figure the Bone Dancers after getting slugged by .45s a few times too many just keep away from the Salt Lake.
     
  12. Hardboiled Android

    Hardboiled Android Vault Senior Citizen

    Jun 7, 2015
    Well there are several ski resorts outside of Provo called Sundance. Alternatively you could have someone mention that the Bone Dancers used to live in the ruins of Park City but were driven southwards following the emergence of the New Canaanites.

    But maybe you're right, they do have the Rocky Mountains between themselves and the New Canaanites, which makes for some light harassment but nothing too serious.
     
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  13. Atomic Postman

    Atomic Postman Vault Archives Overseer

    Mar 16, 2013
    Placing them in Provo would also pose the problem of the players having to pass through them every time they travel the Long 15.

    I've also edited Colorado exactly to your copy suggestions. A pain but necessary. I'll start writing a revised New Mexico soon.
     
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  14. Hardboiled Android

    Hardboiled Android Vault Senior Citizen

    Jun 7, 2015
    Well in Park City they're also going to be straying pretty close to them using Route 80.

    Also something I think I missed in my notes - the title/image for Burning Springs is not properly centered. Also go back through and double check your formatting on subtitles, there's some inconsistency - sometimes certain types of things (EG quests, names) are underlined, some times they're not, that sort of thing.
     
  15. Atomic Postman

    Atomic Postman Vault Archives Overseer

    Mar 16, 2013
    Good point - just fixed that. I also put Burham Springs as Section 1 of Utah since it's near East Carbon now. Feels slightly odd not to kick off with New Canaan however I am determined in the idea of following the flow of player discovery and naturally Burning Springs is the first of Utah they come across. It feels like a better decision overall to have it in Utah and after Grand Junction now for a multitude of reasons though. I always had the lingering thought it'd be a bad first location to come across after Van Buren.
     
  16. Hardboiled Android

    Hardboiled Android Vault Senior Citizen

    Jun 7, 2015
    I still kind of feel like it makes more sense for New Canaan to come first, especially since it's not like the players will be reading this, but I understand your reasoning.

    Also, just want to note that I started chipping away at Utah corrections last night. Almost done with New Canaan.
     
  17. Atomic Postman

    Atomic Postman Vault Archives Overseer

    Mar 16, 2013
    I handed a copy to a former player of mine and one of the things he brought up from the doc was how much he liked the feeling of player flow, got him invested in the mindset of the players and exploring the world. That's where my like of that comes from, but I'm also a fan of it too.
     
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  18. Hardboiled Android

    Hardboiled Android Vault Senior Citizen

    Jun 7, 2015
    Are you planning on printing a copy of this at some point for your own personal enjoyment?
     
  19. Atomic Postman

    Atomic Postman Vault Archives Overseer

    Mar 16, 2013
    Nah because 1) getting my PnP printed was (is) kind of a prolonged process and 2) there's no real point since it will act as my personal DM adventure module - I use a computer/laptop as a DM screen so it's better off digital. It also allows me to make edits. It took nearly 3 years before I was happy enough with the PnP to decide it could go to paper with no regrets. I have no intentions of taking the same approach with this. I might even change the worldbuilding on the fly as the campaign gets going - especially to include player backstories and their story-arcs.
     
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  20. Atomic Postman

    Atomic Postman Vault Archives Overseer

    Mar 16, 2013
    Also in revising the Lone Mesa Bunker, @Hardboiled Android it's quite funny looking back at the Maxson Bunker document. It is really quite poor in more ways than one. I mean, I get the unfinished "they are important to the plot stuff" but some of it feels very dated, like all the women being dependent on men, skilled only in cooking (not a joke go read that now lmao) and the NPC who is lazy and doesn't care about the Brotherhood other than "padding his resume" (whatever the fuck that means) is also the only black guy in the bunker.
     
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