Am I in the minority when I say I'm not bothered by Super Mutants in Fallout 3?

Discussion in 'Fallout 3 Discussion' started by Sn1p3r187, Sep 1, 2021.

  1. Sn1p3r187

    Sn1p3r187 Carolinian Shaolin Monk

    895
    Apr 7, 2014
    While I do know that most people give shit for the existence of Super Mutants in the Capitol Wasteland. I'm more inclined to be infuriated by the existence of Super Mutants in the Commonwealth (to which IMO was really a cheap copout more than anything and makes zero sense). I'm not so much bothered by there being an entire Vault dedicated to FEV research. In fact, I think if it were did right. It would've opened up so much more for the idea of how super mutants were operating with an airborne variant of the FEV that was actually more unstable and sporadic for mutation that for what was initially presented by the original brand at Mariposa Military Base. If anything, this airborne/unstable variant could've been used to say and play to the idea that Capitol Wasteland mutants are far more dangerous and unstable than their west coast cousins. It could actually make a bit more sense that Mariposa military base wasn't the only research center dedicated to FEV. Knowing Vault-Tec. It could actually make sense they had contacts in the military to develop Bioweapons in a Vault. Of course Bethesda shitted the bed by not developing that idea more and adding to the idea that the east coast mutants have/had central leadership until Fallout 4. Which is also a copout and a sorry excuse I might add. Within the year they spent developing F3. They could've at least developed the concept and ideals of Vault 87 super mutants as a faction far better.
     
  2. Blastwave Dave

    Blastwave Dave First time out of the vault

    17
    Sep 12, 2021
    Never bothered me that much, neither did the new take on The Brotherhood. I find them somewhat lazy though, you never really get insight into F3's mutants, they just exist to be orcs for enemy variety. Like most things Bethesda writes, theres potential, but everything is boiled down to shooting at the end of the day.
     
  3. John Cassidy Joestar

    John Cassidy Joestar First time out of the vault

    40
    Aug 22, 2017
    FEV is the magic writer's gateway to justify sci-fi elements in a somewhat grounded world with coherent in universe history, physics and biology.
    My only problem with Fallout 3 is that they didnt had the guts (rather they didnt want too) to develop new mutants and new stuff based on FEV. They only put Super Mutants again but dumber and less subtetly, they act like W40k orcs without their charm and they dont have a clear hierarchy or even a culture. They just exist as stuff to be shot, no world building, no layers of thought were put in their design. Its just disapointing the more I think of it.
     
  4. Gizmojunk

    Gizmojunk Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Nov 26, 2007
    ? Serious?

    FEV didn't make the ghouls ...it's debated, but not mentioned in the game afaik.
    Fallout's gameworld has the laws of physics bent to their expectation and fear of radiation and the atom bombs. That part is not FEV related.

    It is the future they thought about...but blown to hell. The ghouls are essentially Fallout's anti-elves; green psuedo-immortals who remember the age long past, but ugly and not at all deft or agile.
     
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  5. Norzan

    Norzan Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Apr 7, 2017
    The main issue with Super Mutants being on the East Coast, besides making no sense, it's just that it's lame. You have this whole new landscape never touched upon by any game before in the series and what you do? You populate it with shit that already exists. It's lame as fuck and really boring. It makes the map of the US look really small in terms of scope.

    Obviously the reason they are in it, along with everything else recycled from the first two games, is the fact that Bethesda are lazy assholes. Why come up with new shit when most of the work was already done by previous games?
     
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  6. Gizmojunk

    Gizmojunk Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Nov 26, 2007
    The reason is brand identification; remove the recycled bits... and what's Fallouty about it? Nothing; it's a frankenshooter. It's the ultimate 'Me Too!'... before the meaning of the phrase was taken over to mean something else.
     
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  7. John Cassidy Joestar

    John Cassidy Joestar First time out of the vault

    40
    Aug 22, 2017
    Its debated sure, Tim Cain said it was the FEV, others said it was radiation but Harold is a special case. I think Avelonne said that some are irradiated and other from Necropolis are a mix of radiation and FEV like Harold. I could be wrong though so dont quote me on that.
    They also had creative liberties when it came to radiation with Fallout 2 and onwards but I digress, the FEV was meant to allow many things like Deathclaws, molerats or Wannamingos to exist in the lore. Fallout 3's writer staff could've worked on that and seeing the concept art from Adam Adamowicz they could've go for more fucked up mutants but they didnt.
     
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  8. Gizmojunk

    Gizmojunk Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Nov 26, 2007
    I do not believe that Deathclaws and Wannamingos are FEV creatures. I think they are both engineered biological weapons. The Deathclaw was said [somewhere] to be based on Jackson's Chameleon & Ape DNA. The Wanamingos were said to have an engineered [to be very short] lifespan; IIRC.
     
  9. Morgan_

    Morgan_ The Fool

    Jul 3, 2020
    It doesn't really botther me either. I would have just liked it to be done better though. If anything I think I would have made them much dumber, more akin to animals and more hideous like the concept art linked above. Bethesda has switched gears to playing things safe as has even been directly stated by some of their lead people like Ken Rolston when talking about the weirdness of Morrowind and the plan to move away from that going forward. F3 mutants show this attitude quite well.
     
  10. John Cassidy Joestar

    John Cassidy Joestar First time out of the vault

    40
    Aug 22, 2017
    It is written in the Fallout 2's strategy guide that Deathclaws were refined with FEV by the Master apparently, but like you said the governement started with Jackson's Chameleon as a basis.
    However, Wanamingos are purely FEV monsters from the EPA according to the Fallout Bible. They have an internal biological clock too, hence the very short life span.
     
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  11. Iprovidelittlepianos

    Iprovidelittlepianos Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?

    416
    May 12, 2020
    If I remember correctly Tim Cain said ghouls were created by radiation. Chris Taylor said it was radiation plus FEV.
     
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  12. Ugly Kid

    Ugly Kid It Wandered In From the Wastes

    172
    May 9, 2018
    I have my own theory on ghoul creation. Ignoring Bethesda lore of course.

    In Fallout 1 and 2, the only ghouls in existence are from Necropolis and were treated as one time things.

    Van Buren would've (sort of) retconned that with the Reservation.

    In New Vegas the only ghouls who definitely aren't from either location are Raul and Dean Domino.

    I think a similarity could be drawn between all cases. A group of people huddled in a fallout shelter, yet the fallout shelter fails.

    For Raul it's never explicitly stated how or when he became ghoulified, so my headcanon is his family had a makeshift bunker that didn't work.

    I can't remember whether Domino stayed in the Sierra Madre since the bombs or if he found his way there after. If he was always there then perhaps everyone who was present want sent to a bunker. If he wasn't always there then maybe Hollywood people had a special bunker?

    Either way this explanation wouldn't contradict anything from classic Fallout or Van Buren. It would keep the ghouls rare, special, but at the same time allowing them to be present in all games.
     
  13. Atomic Postman

    Atomic Postman Vault Archives Overseer

    Mar 16, 2013

    With Raul it's pretty heavily implied it happened whilst he and his sister were living in the irradiated ruins of Mexico City, to the point it might be explicit. Been a while but I recall something about his sister treating him.