Any experts on analyzing PC data to help with my PC issues?

SnapSlav

SnapSlav

NMA's local DotA fanatic
So, back in the day, bout 10 years ago, I was able to use some programs such as HijackThis, or provide other files to people who could take a look at them, and tell me what files and programs to alter on my PC, where and how, the whole nine yards. I'd basically be able to either mail or post the data, get a response on how to clean up my PC, and it would help me. Fast forward to 2009 when I built my latest (and current) PC, and I had so few problems with it, that I lost contact with all the people who used to help me without being able to come to my house and check my PC in person. But lately I've been having issues with my PC that repeated google searches and inquiries to establishments or friends of mine haven't been able to solve.

So I wonder, what programs are now in use that could serve a similar function, and is anyone here knowledgeable enough in them that they could help me?

As far as my problems have been going...
[spoiler:513952268a]In July (literally days after I registered here) my PC suddenly started acting "strangely". I couldn't describe it, because it was inconsistent, but ironically, Fallout 2 was affected the most. Loads that went by in the blink of an eye were suddenly 30 second stutter-filled waits. Desktop routines began taking ages to perform (even as simple as changing my volume). I took it to Fry's and their diagnostic said that I had corruption in my OS, which could only be solved by formatting my drive and reinstalling my OS. I decided to do this myself, backed up all my data, formatted my drive, reinstalled Windows (XP disc with a Vista HP upgrade disc) and the problem was solved.

I next encountered what I dubbed "The Unravel". Basically, while everything seemed fine on the surface, suddenly flash would stop working, skype would close all calls/conversations, and then my browser and other open programs would shut down on me. After all this, I couldn't even shut down or restart my system; I had to do so manually. After experiencing this consistently for weeks, I was able to narrow down that, for whatever reason, "The Unravel" would always occur after 4-5 hours of activity. I evaded it by restarting my PC every 4 hours, but naturally this didn't solve the problem. I pondered if somehow a bad driver was causing it, so I reformatted again.

"The Unravel" came back with me, but I tinkered with my settings, and that seemed to solve the problem. That I'm aware off, I haven't been struck by "The Unravel" for a whole month. But my PC still seems to be having issues. This time, it's ridiculously tough to describe. "Not performing well", I suppose? Sometimes programs will load expediently, sometimes they lock up my PC. Sometimes using another program- which friends also using them attest cause NO such symptoms as what I describe -causes my browsers (Firefox15 AND IE9) to freeze and not function, yet a couple times they didn't. What the hell's going on? I have no clue.[/spoiler:513952268a]
So, my PC is currently pretty empty, after 2 formats, and I'm trying to hammer out the problems before I reinstall all of my recreational software, but I'm at a point where I'm not even sure what to address. Virus scans have turned up zilch. Fry's diagnostic showed that my hardware was fine (which Geek Squad affirmed, a month later), although I'd certainly love to upgrade my PC at the next opportunity... But for now, I'm just trying to fix problems. All I want is for it to be performing like it was at the start of July, before all of this started.

Suggestions?
 
I highly doubt that this is a software problem seeing as you reformatted and the problem continues. I built my last two computers from scratch and had hardware problems both times. "The Unravel" is far too familiar. You'll want to check if it's hardware first, as that problem can be diagnosed with the most ease.

Download HW Monitor to check if it's a heating problem:

http://www.cpuid.com/softwares/hwmonitor.html

I use HW Monitor frequently, as it is a free program that monitors your heating and voltage norms and compares that data to what they're doing at the moment. (Research this software so you don't feel like it's dangerous.)

If there's no heating or voltage problem, download memtest86+:

http://www.memtest.org/

Also a free software, you'll have to burn this to a disc and run directly through your BIOS without loading your OS. There are instructions for burning this to a disc properly on the memtest website, and instructions for properly accessing and altering your BIOS on your motherboard manufacturer's website.

After restarting your computer there should be a key you can press that will enter your BIOS in the opening screen (prior to the Windows flashy opener). Only if the memtest86+ disc is in your disc drive, enter your BIOS, and find some area where you can 'Override Boot' directly from the D Drive (your disc drive) rather than your C Drive (where your OS loads from). Don't make any alterations to the BIOS, but if you can find an area to boot directly from your D or disc drive then do it and memtest86+ will begin scanning your CPU, board, and ram for any malfunctions (it will be a basic blue screen with old school testing filtering through the hardware connections). Let it do three full runs (otherwise you don't know for certain that it's not the hardware) and if there are any problems at all I guarantee the problem is with one of those three pieces of hardware.

Let me know if you have any questions or problems. No one ever helped me with my first computer and it was eventually stolen by the PC repair shop here in town so I am quite sympathetic.
 
yay, a Computer Lay person having issues.

1)
when you are backing up your data, you are NOT backing up any executeables or actual programs correct? on your new installs you are downloading FRESH copies of those programs?

2)
if that is not much of an option, you are putting all this on a separate hard drive? are you unplugging that hard drive so it is completely off the system when you reinstall, do ALL your updates, and putting on your anti-virus, etc... AND THEN plugging it in and running a full scan on that backup data?

3)
how old is the hardware? most noteably the PSU, mobo, cpu, ram, and ANY add-in cards. i would go into bios settings but without knowing what options/settings you have on your bios, and what settings you NEED at what values... that is pointless.

4)
how old are your hard drives? if one/both of them are starting to fail with either massive increasing bad sectors or the head going bad....

im guessing they are a flavor of IDE so low-levelling the HD or running a test on them is probably not a good idea. if it is a HD starting to fail, replacing it is most likely the best idea all factors included.

5)
how clean is the power in your neighborhood? does your PSU have a voltage selector?

if your power is clean, not an issue. if it has just recently become an issue due to wiring or transmission wires or the meter going bad.... if the PSU does NOT have a voltage selector that means it is fully active PFC which mitigates most of those issues. if your power is dirty even a good PFC PSU wont help and you will need a UPS, and not just the cheap ones. you would need one that offers AT LEAST "double filtering" or such.

6)
have you at least LOOKED at your windows startup files? look at msconfig and see what that shows.
 
Thanks person, I'll look into those. My issue with the simple answer "it sounds like it's hardware" is that it ignores how ALL of my latest problems began after a SOFTWARE fix. Remember, I didn't have any of these issues even when my computer was suffering from the OS being corrupted, and once I fixed the corruption, NEW issues arose. That's just too much of a coincidence for me to ignore, and while it's certainly POSSIBLE that I have a hardware failing, I almost think "I screwed up something during reinstall" is a more likely scenario... >.<

TheWesDude, I am not "a computer lay person". I'm simply not an expert, and I prefer seeking advice when I'm uncertain because others may know better. For many of your inquiries, you would've already had the answers if you just read my post.

1) I back up the base files, so everything needs re-installation. Drivers, codecs, EVERYTHING. I backed up everything I was aware was installed (except for games, because I had the CDs, but I backed up the game FILES [saves, etc]). To my knowledge, everything I NEED is reinstalled.
2) The external is scanned separate from main desktop and my external is completely separated while I'm running tests on my desktop. I ISOLATE variables, not compound them with new ones; I'm not an idiot.
3) This was already answered. Specifically, a little over 3 years; I built this system in July 2009, and I owned the parts for a few weeks/months before assembly.
4) Same as #3.
5) I don't even know what that means, but I'll take it to mean "my power is clean". The electric company is incompetent and they've habitually shut power off at times 12 hours earlier than scheduled when they've needed to upgrade our grid systems, but the actual SERVICE from a day to day basis has never, ever been an issue.
6) See the last part of #2. Yes, obviously. Nothing that a quick google search would label as out of place, let alone repeated virus/malware scans.
 
SnapSlav said:
Thanks person, I'll look into those. My issue with the simple answer "it sounds like it's hardware" is that it ignores how ALL of my latest problems began after a SOFTWARE fix.
Click to expand...

Yep, felt the same way, but I assure you, the rest of your hardware is just as susceptible to corruption as your hard drive when you make those major software changes.

donperkan said:
Memory is failing.
Click to expand...

That's the best bet.

TheWesDude said:
3) how old is the hardware? most noteably the PSU, mobo, cpu, ram, and ANY add-in cards. i would go into bios settings but without knowing what options/settings you have on your bios, and what settings you NEED at what values... that is pointless.
Click to expand...

Even if all of the hardware you purchased is brand new it doesn't mean that everything is up-to-date. Make sure to get the latest BIOS updates from your board manufacturer's site, and check if there are any updates to your CPU at your processor manufacturer's site.
 
It's really hard to help someone when they're refusing to give information about their system. We still have no idea what hardware you're using.
 
fedaykin said:
It's really hard to help someone when they're refusing to give information about their system. We still have no idea what hardware you're using.
Click to expand...
I imagine it's harder BEING helped when you're more than willing to provide such information, but users would much rather be snarky and make vague, accusatory statements like this rather than specifying what particular information they need so I could supply it... I kinda laid it all out in the first post; if there's a program that can aggregate all my information (and is safe, but that's a given) that would convey the information, just tell me and I'm willing to give it a try. Dxdiag, or myself listing off my parts that I purchased, whatever... just say it, and I'll get it. Please don't waste my time saying I'm not cooperating when I'm waiting for instruction.

person, I've now gotten my hands on the Hardware Monitor, but I'm not exactly sure what I'm trying to look for. So it basically just keeps a running list of my temperature, RPMs, and voltages as they fluctuate? Will the program itself point out if anything looks to be a "problem" or is that something for me to know by checking the numbers? Also, I had a freak occurance (meaning this hasn't been one of my ongoing issues, but I'm still going to try to address it) of my PC shutting off unexpectedly yesterday, and I didn't know what caused it, but thought it might be an overheat. If it happened again, would I be able to open the Hardware Monitor AFTER the next reboot and find anything, or does the information it collects get wiped every time the program is closed? I only have 1 monitor to work with, so I don't have the setup of filling one screen with programs while the second screen has technical information. Basically I'm just not certain what to do with the program...

Haven't grabbed/used memtest yet, but I've also been trying to figure out if my memory sticks have begun to fail... Most have pointed to "no", but I've still wondered.

As for software updates... that's probably where I'm at my weakest- at least in this thread. Hardware is my forte, not software, and I've had enough "bad" experiences in the past few months with driver installations not registering, failing, or otherwise making my PC worse off than it was without them. Overall that's where I'm the most easily confused, and simple instructions like "get the next one" go over my head. Plenty of other instructions will make perfect sense to me, but not that, in this particular area...
 
All fedaykin was referring to was the basic hardware information:

Board: Asus FX blah blah blah
CPU: AMD blah
Hard drive:
RAM:
Video:
Supply:

. . . and that stuff. It helps especially for brands that are notoriously shitty or for ware that is old and obviously needs to be updated. Let me know what board (brand, model & #) and CPU you have so I can give you the links to the update pages and give the steps to using it (easiest with a usb drive).

With HW Monitor, one of the degrees would be highlighted (exclamation point or red lettering) if the temperature or voltage were too low or high. If there's no such problem during your regular PC use then you can probably move on.

Here's the thing: a software problem is a hard drive problem. If you're not using your hard drive and you face the same problem that you have, then the problem is with another piece of equipment in there. Memtest is a program that when booted before your hard drive, only runs through your board, CPU and RAM. If there's any error recorded during that time, then your problem will be narrowed severely, and you could guarantee that it's no software issue (anymore).

Keep us posted.
 
Well, not knowing whether or not I shouldn't close the program, I kept it running while playing some of my (for the time being) more PC-intensive games. Although the Max temps went up, nothing was highlighted, so it looks alright, I guess.

As for the parts (that I could ascertain.... can't track down every box/receipt yet), they are:
Board: ASUS P5Q Deluxe
CPU: Intel Core 2 Quad Q9400
Hard drive: Hmmm.... can't find that atm. Its size is 1TB, but not like it helps with brand info.
RAM: 2 2GB "Ballistix" Sticks (4GB total)
Video: Radeon HD 4670
Supply: Antec True Power Trio, Model: TP3-650

The drivers for the MB have given me nothing but trouble, and all my research has pointed that they don't offer anything that Windows doesn't cover by default. Somehow it messes up more than it ever fixes. Between my first and second formats, I spent a couple weeks systematically uninstalling and reinstalling every combination of each and every separate driver from both ASUS's site and the MB disc itself, and the PC worked best without ANY of them (the single exception of having issues getting various programs to register my mic without the sound drivers; but once more, installing the driver just caused more issues than it solved)... Getting "the most up-to-date" MB drivers is something I'm quite literally going to be hell-bent on avoiding... Just too many headaches from it in the past.
 
SnapSlav said:
TheWesDude, I am not "a computer lay person". I'm simply not an expert, and I prefer seeking advice when I'm uncertain because others may know better. For many of your inquiries, you would've already had the answers if you just read my post.

1) I back up the base files, so everything needs re-installation. Drivers, codecs, EVERYTHING. I backed up everything I was aware was installed (except for games, because I had the CDs, but I backed up the game FILES [saves, etc]). To my knowledge, everything I NEED is reinstalled.
2) The external is scanned separate from main desktop and my external is completely separated while I'm running tests on my desktop. I ISOLATE variables, not compound them with new ones; I'm not an idiot.
3) This was already answered. Specifically, a little over 3 years; I built this system in July 2009, and I owned the parts for a few weeks/months before assembly.
4) Same as #3.
5) I don't even know what that means, but I'll take it to mean "my power is clean". The electric company is incompetent and they've habitually shut power off at times 12 hours earlier than scheduled when they've needed to upgrade our grid systems, but the actual SERVICE from a day to day basis has never, ever been an issue.
6) See the last part of #2. Yes, obviously. Nothing that a quick google search would label as out of place, let alone repeated virus/malware scans.
Click to expand...

1) the key is executeables. do you back up anything that a virus/trojan could infect. it does no good to reinstall your OS to just reinstall it from a backup.

2) does not answer the question. after scanning your main, do you also run full scans on your backup data? is there another known good computer you have access to that can scan that drive?

3) does not answer the question. when you "built" the computer is irrelevant. its the age of all the individual components that is important. i most recently "built" my computer in 2009. i have hardware on my computer that is from 2005. and my keyboard and main mouse and speakers are from 1999. one of my hard drives is from 2000, and another is from 1998. the reason for the question was to discover the age of the individual components in the computer. which you failed to answer. even if you bought them in 2009 they could be drastically older.

4)
see #3

5)
clean power is very important. dirty power can make hardware fail, or cause errors. it can make functioning hardware appear to be bad.

in the US, "clean" power is usually considered 105-115v @ 55-65 HZ. dirty power is how often its outside that range. as we have converted over from the main backbone distribution lines from AC to DC, its not uncommon to rather than 110v to be 100v. mostly because upgrading the "front" side of the power grid is much more expensive than upgrading the back end.

so yes, this is very important. the dirtier your power is, the more that is a consideration.

6)
you did not say anything about that, and it is important. only a "lay computer person" leaves out important information like this step. especially as its the first step most people look at for troubleshooting.


your post did not answer the specifics of my questions. hence why i asked them.

just because a testing program tells you that you have memory faults does not mean your memory is faulty.

you could have a bad stick. sure.
1) the memory slot could have dust in it preventing good connection
2) you could have a burnt out transistor/capacitor/resistor on the mobo
3) your cpu could be faulty
4) you could have dirty power
5) the memory stick could be bad
6) through heat/cooling cycles the memory could become unseated
7) the memory bus could be bad
8) the bios could be bad

so you ran a hardware test and it says you have a bad memory stick. replacing that memory stick only tests 2 of the 8 above possible causes.

here is a test for you. swap the memory sticks, re-run the test. see if it says the other slot is bad. then use those sticks in other slots ( if you have them ) and run the test again. then swap the sticks and run the test again. if it is consistently telling you the same stick is bad, now you have tried to account for many more than 2. if it is telling you the memory in a slot is bad, it means your problem is somewhere else.

but i am sure you already ran all of these tests and just didnt tell us this information because you are not a lay computer person.
 
donperkan said:
YOUR MEMORY IS FAILING.
Click to expand...
sea said:
These symptoms are all things I'd associate with hard disk failure.
Click to expand...

These things are obviously hard to tell. As sea suggests, running Memtest86 is the most reliable way to tell if the problem is with the hard drive or not.

The Asus P5Q Deluxe has four slots, so another way of finding the issue is to move your two memory sticks to slots 3 and 4. If you run smoothly (which involves extensive use) then you need to return your board as one or both of your first two slots are faulty (this happened with my first Asus board). If you come across the same problem then just remove one stick at a time and see if the problem is with one of your sticks.

If you still can't find the problem then enter your BIOS. There should be a hardware or CPU menu where you can choose which cores are active or not. Asus software separates cores into pairs, so I would first try disabling the first two cores, using the less active 3 and 4. If there's still a problem then switch. If two run smoothly and the other two don't, then you've got a bad processor.

Still, I would suggest running memtest for half a day, as it can be the most efficient.

Also, as a side note, not once in maybe thirty times has a computer expert's diagnostic of my PC been accurate. You're the one who cares, and you're the one who's going to find the problem.
 
person said:
Also, as a side note, not once in maybe thirty times has a computer expert's diagnostic of my PC been accurate. You're the one who cares, and you're the one who's going to find the problem.
Click to expand...
Yeah..... that sounds about right. ~_~

Well, now I just need to calm my nerves before I go rifling through my tower. I highly doubt I could return my board, however, even if it turned out to be faulty. Fry's Electronics, ya know.... =/

Also, if I wasn't clear before (since several of the aggressive posters' comments seem to make me think as much was the case) I'm on a ridiculously strict budget for this. Close to "zero", in fact. Chronic unemployment and all the fun that brings... If money wasn't such an issue, I wouldn't be so picky about the fixes, cause I could just swap out new parts without a care in the world. But, assuming I really could definitively narrow down my problems to failing memory sticks, replacing those are a cost I'm more than comfortable with paying.

Anyway, I greatly appreciate your courteousness and honesty, person.
 
agressive poster?

you are not providing much in the way of specifics. or say it was answered when it wasnt. and when you try to provide an answer, you dont really provide the answer, just an answer.

i would not suspect a hard drive problem. a head going bad could explain your symptoms, but losing a couple sectors doesnt.

the core 3 parts of the computer:
mobo
cpu
ram

you can only test those by using an alternate system, or by ruling out your power or PSU with or without testing.

and you never answered the question on if your PSU has a voltage selector.

have you done the testing setup i advised? what was the results?

and the reason for all these questions is to nail down to what part is bad. no point in replacing memory just because some program said first try u have bad memory just to find out a bit later that it was really your mobo that was bad. or that your PSU was going bad giving your computer bad power which fried your hardware.

call some computer shops and find out if they do PSU testing, if they say yes, ask if their test is just a PSU test or a load tester too. if its not a load tester, keep calling.


or you could tell us what testing you have done on your own. do not leave out details.
 
I'd have to concur with other posters: the most likely culprits are either a failing hard drive or faulty memory. It could also be a damaged/faulty power supply providing bad voltage or overheating.

As suggested, run Memtest. If that doesn't show an issue, remove a stick and run your system with only one stick. If the issue pops up again, switch to the other stick. Also, try moving them to the 3rd and 4th slots rather than the first two (or vice versa if you already have them in the 3rd and 4th slots).

If none of that resolves it, you'll have to isolate the HDD as a possible cause. Only real way to do that is to get a known good HDD and run with that (maybe find a friend who has an old one sitting around, maybe in an old laptop?).

Then you have to move to the PSU (another one where the best way is to swap with a known good one) and overheating (which is easy: pull off the side-panel and have a large desk-fan or the like blow in it -- also, check to make sure the CPU, GPU, and case fans all spin properly and aren't clogged with dust or sticking for some other reason).

Diagnosing a computer issue like this is a real pain-in-the-ass, no doubt about it.
 
Check all the connections too -- that all the cards and sticks are properly in their slots, all the cables are fully attached etc. I've had problems with my sound card coming out of the slot, which caused glitches and crashes.
 
Jebus said:
Did you try turning your PC off and back on again?
Click to expand...
And the pointless posts have reached a new low... LOL

fedaykin said:
I've had problems with my sound card coming out of the slot, which caused glitches and crashes.
Click to expand...
That's...... huh. Never heard of THAT! But back when it was first assembled, I had a couple issues of it not turning on from the power/restart buttons on the tower, so I had to manually push the buttons on the motherboard each time I wanted to boot up. A quick rooting around and I discovered the necessary cords had either slipped or were connected to the wrong place. Anyway, that was years ago, but that's about the extent of THAT type of issue I've ever run into. I open up my tower somewhat frequently to clean it out and check for any bad connection (old habit from the days of Genesis... I always wanna "remove the cartridge" and "blow in it", and the like... XD). This last week I went to work cleaning out some considerably thick dust that stuck to my CPU fan. None of the cords were out of order, and besides the CPU fan blowing in the opposite direction of the rest of the tower's airflow (I don't know HOW I missed that, all these years) everything looked fine.

I guess, since the general consensus keeps coming back to "Memory or Hard Drive", I'll focus on those for now. But I have a software-related question for those who have any anecdotal experiences (because ALL of this is subjective, of course, but it helps) to share: Much like my issues 1-2 months ago with my MB drivers causing harm rather than good, what sorts of programs have you guys either witnessed or used yourselves have caused issues with systems, rather than helping them run more smoothly? For a while I was running through my software "checklist" to see if I had missed anything, or perhaps installed something that I shouldn't. Naturally I'm not talking about malware, but official, allegedly "good" software/drivers, that ended up doing harm instead.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top