Best Fallout Antagonist?

Best blah

  • Total voters
    65
It depends if we're going by first impressions or replay value.

I cast my vote for the Master less because of his status as a villain and more because of his concept. When I first played Fallout 1 I didn't know anything about it so the mystery of the super mutants was genuinely intriguing; coming to the point where you go into the unknown and are faced with this horrifying thing is a defining moment for the Fallout franchise and cements him as the best villain of the series.

However, on a closer inspection, his motivations aren't that original and his plans are somewhat dumbly flawed (did he honestly not know super mutants were sterile?), but I'll still give him 100 points for influencing the history of the world to this day without actually having to ever appear again.

Father Elijah is a good villain, but I don't know if I'd give him second place; his antagonism only hinges on the idea that your character was greedy and roleplaying as anything else makes all conversations in Dead Money somewhat nonsensical. Still, I like how they gave him a verbal quirk and his character in general was solid, so he's definitely third at least.

Frank Horrigan was okay. Fallout 2 would definitely feel lacking without him, but he wasn't so much a villain as he was an extension of them; a tool to oppose the player. He was an antagonist if the distinction can even be made.

Caesar felt like a victim of the game's development; he was an interesting and above all intelligent character, but a lot of the decisions he made for his legion felt to me like the lacked any sort of real motivation. The Legion in general always seemed to be cartoonishly evil to me as opposed to the other factions in New Vegas, but I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt and assuming this happened late in development, to give evil characters (or sexist or whatever) a banner they could ally themselves to. Nevertheless, Caesar suffers for it.


TL;DR Master #1 everyone else a shit
 
For me it was down to the Master or Caesar.
In the end I went with the Master, the struggle to get to him felt real, I had to kill off my Dogmeat just so I can infiltrate the Cathedral. Not only that but I had to talk to people to know if anyone knows anything about the Super Mutants, and I had to get a disguise so I can get to the Master.

And the saddest thing of all, I wouldn't even call him evil. he just seemed like some guy who wanted to do good but his plan was spoilt by one little detail.
It felt good to outsmart one of the most intelligent beings in the game, but at the same time, I felt sorry for him.
They managed to make a monstrous character appear human, compare that to any film or any other game, there wouldn't be a human element that sympathetic.
 
Millim said:
For me it was down to the Master or Caesar.
In the end I went with the Master, the struggle to get to him felt real, I had to kill off my Dogmeat just so I can infiltrate the Cathedral. Not only that but I had to talk to people to know if anyone knows anything about the Super Mutants, and I had to get a disguise so I can get to the Master.

And the saddest thing of all, I wouldn't even call him evil. he just seemed like some guy who wanted to do good but his plan was spoilt by one little detail.
It felt good to outsmart one of the most intelligent beings in the game, but at the same time, I felt sorry for him.
They managed to make a monstrous character appear human, compare that to any film or any other game, there wouldn't be a human element that sympathetic.
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That's true, The Master isn't interested in power or control. He just wants to create a perfect society.
 
Yeah I'd definitely say that's a good point. Whilst characters like Caesar and Ulysses might have compelling motivations, the sheer rush and determination to stop them from achieving their goals is ultimately done best by the Master.
 
R.Graves said:
You know I never noticed that until people pointed it out to me. But then again the game was made for me. (I was ten)
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Didn't notice it either, and I was 13 at the time, I think. This was in simpler times, when I considered Oblivion a masterpiece. :D

EDIT: We need to crucify whoever voted for Colonel Autumn. :wtf:
 
Dunno why Ulysses doesn't get more love. I absolutely love Ulysses. He's basically the antithesis to our character. He's a courier like us, he's travelled the ruins of America just like us, and he's done horrible things just like our character has the potential to do. He's a fantastic foil to the courier. Yeah his plan's insane, but he's insane, and I like that. Evil doesn't necessarily always have to have a concrete well-thought-out reason, it just needs to be interesting, and Ulysses is certainly interesting. Plus he has the most sultry voice of all time. I'd make a vinyl record out of his dialogue if I could.

I like pretty much every villain in New Vegas. Since Caesar's been mentioned a lot already I'll talk about Lanius. Lanius is built up throughout the game as this horrible, evil monster, he is called the "Monster of the East" after all. You hear talk on the radio about how he had an entire section of his army killed just because of a commander's incompetence. He crucifies people without hesitation or mercy. He butchered his own entire tribe without a second thought. Much like Joshua Graham, he too has been horribly scarred thanks to working for Caesar, and thus why he hides behind his helmet. Yet, in the end, despite all these horrible stories told, you can reason with him. You can actually talk your way out of fighting him with logical debate or shrewd bartering. I absolutely love that, because even though everyone says that Lanius is a power hungry brute that's more a deathclaw than a human being, he can still be reasoned with. He isn't Frank Horrigan, he isn't a complete abomination yet. I really really love that.
 
While on Lanius, he was somewhat unique in that he's built up as an ultimate badass incapable of mercy and impenetrable to defeat, yet (what is probably) the canon way of defeating him is to exploit his cowardice and convince him to run away with his tail in between his legs. I enjoyed that.
 
And while we're on Lanius, let's also mention how he's made into this imposing monster with that mask covering his face, and yet, should you kill him and remove it, he's quite handsome. Nothing's as it appears.

As for other possible antagonists from NV, what about Benny or Mr. House? Benny's such a weasel and slime, and Mr. House is so condescending and a total bastard in regards to his contempt for just about everyone else's intelligence.
 
Ragemage said:
Dunno why Ulysses doesn't get more love. I absolutely love Ulysses. He's basically the antithesis to our character. He's a courier like us, he's travelled the ruins of America just like us, and he's done horrible things just like our character has the potential to do. He's a fantastic foil to the courier. Yeah his plan's insane, but he's insane, and I like that. Evil doesn't necessarily always have to have a concrete well-thought-out reason, it just needs to be interesting, and Ulysses is certainly interesting. Plus he has the most sultry voice of all time. I'd make a vinyl record out of his dialogue if I could.

I like pretty much every villain in New Vegas. Since Caesar's been mentioned a lot already I'll talk about Lanius. Lanius is built up throughout the game as this horrible, evil monster, he is called the "Monster of the East" after all. You hear talk on the radio about how he had an entire section of his army killed just because of a commander's incompetence. He crucifies people without hesitation or mercy. He butchered his own entire tribe without a second thought. Much like Joshua Graham, he too has been horribly scarred thanks to working for Caesar, and thus why he hides behind his helmet. Yet, in the end, despite all these horrible stories told, you can reason with him. You can actually talk your way out of fighting him with logical debate or shrewd bartering. I absolutely love that, because even though everyone says that Lanius is a power hungry brute that's more a deathclaw than a human being, he can still be reasoned with. He isn't Frank Horrigan, he isn't a complete abomination yet. I really really love that.
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Oh yes, Ulysses was a truly amazing character. I'm not an emotive guy, and I really, really disliked his DLC's gameplay. I thought it was long, boring and hard beyond reason. But bear with me, his speeches made me continue, and when it was all over, I left the Divide with emotion. I felt that my character had changed, had learned something big about the very concept of "home" and that he, somehow, atoned for his sins and made his nemesis do the same. Ulysses changed, when he saw me change. And that's how well written he is : when he manages to make you emotive over a DLC you didn't like to play. When the antagonist is able to change when you do the same. I'm currently playing a dice RPG, and the player's antagonist is heavily inspired by Ulysses.
Lanius is amazing too. Even if the confrontation left me a little bit disappointed, the build up was perfect. Hearing soldiers fearing the arrival of "the monster of the east" built a tension. When even Ulysses and Joshua Graham show some kind of fear towards him, you know who you are dealing with. Not just a man. An idea. Brutality made flesh. War incarnate, walking among the men... And the fact that he's not even coming for you makes him even more terrifying : you're simply an obstacle on his path. You are not an idea, you are not the west. But when you talk to him, you realize a terrible thing : war is the father of civilization. Either he admits it, or he's destroyed by it. That's brillant.

The antagonist I would have loved to see was Presper, in Van Buren. I don't know if the team behind the fanmade Van Buren had access to his dialog files somehow (if they exist), but I have hopes to meet again a charismatic villain in a Fallout game, now. From what I've read about him, he seemed like a broken man, crushed by his intelligence and empathy. A love for the world and humanity, so hurt by the vision of what it has become, that he decides to help everyone with a clean slate. That's an interesting premise for a villain.
 
Chud said:
As for other possible antagonists from NV, what about Benny or Mr. House? Benny's such a weasel and slime, and Mr. House is so condescending and a total bastard in regards to his contempt for just about everyone else's intelligence.
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I like how Mr House seems to be all knowing but actually can't control his own city without the courier. He can't stop Benny, he can't stop the Omertas and he can't stop Legion infiltration... though he all knows it's there.
 
Dr Fallout said:
I like how Mr House seems to be all knowing but actually can't control his own city without the courier. He can't stop Benny, he can't stop the Omertas and he can't stop Legion infiltration... though he all knows it's there.
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Yes, and I think it creates some kind of mystery around him. Either he knows and doesn't really care because he already has a plan for that, or he knows and can't do anything, but is too proud to admit it. You never really have "the" definitive answer, and I like that.
I really, really love the relationship between him and the courier. Even at the last missions for him, he never truly makes you feel like his champion, and the courier always has a sarcastic answer for him. They need each other for their own gain, they both pretend to trust each other but they both know it's a lie... There is always some kind of tension and mistrust, until the very end. You then realize that both of you may have acted for your own interests, but it somehow serves a greater purpose, now. It's interesting, fun and original.
 
mithrap said:
Yes, and I think it creates some kind of mystery around him. Either he knows and doesn't really care because he already has a plan for that, or he knows and can't do anything, but is too proud to admit it. You never really have "the" definitive answer, and I like that.
I really, really love the relationship between him and the courier. Even at the last missions for him, he never truly makes you feel like his champion, and the courier always has a sarcastic answer for him. They need each other for their own gain, they both pretend to trust each other but they both know it's a lie... There is always some kind of tension and mistrust, until the very end. You then realize that both of you may have acted for your own interests, but it somehow serves a greater purpose, now. It's interesting, fun and original.
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He knows but he can't do anything.
It's as simple as that. There's no evidence that he some sort of plan to deal with it, proof being when Benny and the Omerta's succeed in damaging the NCR and city.
 
NV's is full of neat little contradictions and ironies. Mr. House is all knowing and powerful, yet a vegetable, unable to move let alone breathe outside. The Legion and NCR's power stems from expansionistic goals that are threatening to tear them apart should either one succeed. Caesar's intelligent and ruthless, yet weak and dying of brain cancer. Kimball's the leader of the largest nation of the wastes, yet cannot lead for worth a damn. Talk about Achilles' heal.

I do have a special place for Benny, as far as antagonists are concerned; he's the weasel I just love to hate. So smarmy and cowardly. I enjoy killing him every time.
 
Chud said:
NV's is full of neat little contradictions and ironies. Mr. House is all knowing and powerful, yet a vegetable, unable to move let alone breathe outside. The Legion and NCR's power stems from expansionistic goals that are threatening to tear them apart should either one succeed. Caesar's intelligent and ruthless, yet weak and dying of brain cancer. Kimball's the leader of the largest nation of the wastes, yet cannot lead for worth a damn. Talk about Achilles' heal.

I do have a special place for Benny, as far as antagonists are concerned; he's the weasel I just love to hate. So smarmy and cowardly. I enjoy killing him every time.
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I love crucifying Benny... smarmy idiot.
 
Marko from New Vegas Bounties III. Built up through three huge campaigns, and when you finally reach him, you find out he was just trying to leave his life of brutality behind, and the thing that pushed him back into his old ways was your pursuit of him, more out of curiosity and a chance to test yourself than any personal grudge. A lot of bad stuff happens because of my courier's pride and curiosity. It made me hate that bastard, but also kind of respect him, in a twisted sort of way. And it did not make me feel good about my PC.

Hey, who said it had to be from the base game?
 
peadar87 said:
Marko from New Vegas Bounties III. Built up through three huge campaigns, and when you finally reach him, you find out he was just trying to leave his life of brutality behind, and the thing that pushed him back into his old ways was your pursuit of him, more out of curiosity and a chance to test yourself than any personal grudge. A lot of bad stuff happens because of my courier's pride and curiosity. It made me hate that bastard, but also kind of respect him, in a twisted sort of way. And it did not make me feel good about my PC.

Hey, who said it had to be from the base game?
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Hm, interesting pick, but true. He fits the grey moral compass of the courier. Finding out that good intentions and good karma are two different things is a central theme of New Vegas, and Marko highlights that.
I know he's more or less a joke character, but I love Bobby Bass from New Vegas Killer. His voice acting is amazing, and the little references to Van Buren he makes (Denver's dogs, for example) are always appreciated.
 
Never thought the master was an antagonist, just some deluded mutant dude trying to create his vision of a perfect society. Always thought that Col Autumn and Eden were proper antagonists though, especially Autumn who killed your dad, one of the coolest characters in Fallout in my opinion.
 
Doomsdayprepper69 said:
Never thought the master was an antagonist, just some deluded mutant dude trying to create his vision of a perfect society. Always thought that Col Autumn and Eden were proper antagonists though, especially Autumn who killed your dad, one of the coolest characters in Fallout in my opinion.
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In my opinion, the problem with Autumn is that you can't voice the possibility that he can be true, even after witnessing him comitting high treason for his ideals. Why create empathy towards him, if we can't voice it afterwards ? Also, I didn't feel like he represented an antagonist "force", in the artistic way. He represents himself. It's not a problem for his character, don't get me wrong, it just reduces the final fight to a fistfight between two dudes who were dicks to each other for weeks, instead of a standoff between two ideas, two visions etc.

I can't really remember why does he survives the radiations though, but I think I remember that Liam Neeson basically killed himself, didn't he ? Not sure anymore, now that you mention it.
 
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