Best Fallout Antagonist?

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I can't really remember why does he survives the radiations though, but I think I remember that Liam Neeson basically killed himself, didn't he ? Not sure anymore, now that you mention it.

Isn't it obvious? Colonel Autumn surviving was a brilliant foreshadowing for the Cabot House quest in Fallout 4. If you watch Colonel Autumn, you can see just before the radiation kills your dad, he injects himself with a syringe and survives the radiation because of whatever was in that syringe. Obviously this syringe is the same Mysterious Serum you can get from Lorenzo Cabot. It reduces your radiation by 10 points a second after all and it explains how Colonel Autumn retains all his flesh, beautiful hair, and voice after being locked in that container for a while. He was friends with the Cabot family all along. The Cabot family has ties with the Enclave. It's all foreshadowing for the new Enclave Moon Base DLC. A brilliant move I must say.
 
I prefer a contest of dicks to a contest of visions/ideas, I am a more simple minded person as in I prefer simple plot lines and explosions to complex plot lines and complocated reasoning. I thought F3 had a great story, it was thr essential good vs evil, this entire morally grey/complex motivations bullshit bores me. I love good vs evil storylines.
 
I prefer a contest of dicks to a contest of visions/ideas, I am a more simple minded person as in I prefer simple plot lines and explosions to complex plot lines and complocated reasoning. I thought F3 had a great story, it was thr essential good vs evil, this entire morally grey/complex motivations bullshit bores me. I love good vs evil storylines.

Uhhh no... Fallout 3 was not well written like at all.

My default link to anyone who says fallout 3 had a great story:
http://www.shamusyoung.com/twentysidedtale/?p=27085
 
uhhh no...Fallout 3 was ot well written like at all
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That is my opinion and you don't need to waste time trying to debunk it. Why can't you just let an opinion be an opinion? I am not going to read your link either, you needn't waste your time sending me crap I don't care about
also GTFO
Make me
 

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I prefer a contest of dicks to a contest of visions/ideas, I am a more simple minded person as in I prefer simple plot lines and explosions to complex plot lines and complocated reasoning. I thought F3 had a great story, it was thr essential good vs evil, this entire morally grey/complex motivations bullshit bores me. I love good vs evil storylines.
How is Autumn an "evil" character, then ? I mean, sure he's cold, but... Given the moral standard of the wasteland, he's actually a decent man, willing to repair the purifier for a cause he's ready to betray his superiors for. The final confrontation is not even a good vs evil fight, even in its most simple form. Autumn didn't kill your dad, he doesn't want to eradicate mutants. For all we know, he's a rigid soldier who wants to repair a device capable of producing infinite clean water, and you're in his path for some obscure reason. Why does the brotherhood even fights the Enclave, in the end ? To decide who will repair the purifier first ? That's hardly a good vs evil trope. A ignorance vs dedication trope at most, but certainly not a moral one.
 
I voted Frank Horrigan for utter badassery. I shat a brick when I found the random encounter where he slaughters those farmers, because I thought I had to fight him at level 3, haha. Then there's the bit where he punches Matthew nearly in half. It's also ironic how he calls you "mutie" despite being a cybernetically enhanced Supermutant himself.

The Master would be a very close second.
 
I prefer a contest of dicks to a contest of visions/ideas, I am a more simple minded person as in I prefer simple plot lines and explosions to complex plot lines and complocated reasoning. I thought F3 had a great story, it was thr essential good vs evil, this entire morally grey/complex motivations bullshit bores me. I love good vs evil storylines.
If Fallout 3 is a good vs evil story, how is the hero from the good side ? You murder, in cold blood, innocent people just to get out of the vault and look for your dad. That's what a psychopath would do. The guys are just doing their jobs, they want to bring you to the overseer for a very understandable questioning, and your immediate answer is to shoot them in the face ? People who went to your birthday parties, defended you against bullies, people you know by name and grew up with ? At this very moment, you're no longer from the good side of the story. You're on the side of the raiders who hung corpses above their beds for some obscure and not very hygienic reason. Oh right, they killed Jonas. So ? Jonas could have tried to take their gun, as far as you know. You have zero moral evidence that would justify the killings.

And then after that, you willingly participate in a war against the super mutants, while having zero intel on the reason of the said war. For all your character knows, the Super mutants were here for two centuries and didn't even cause a threat to Megaton until the recent arrival of the brotherhood. For all your character knows, you could be taking part in a racial genocide with no second thought. (yes, super mutants are evil in the end, but when you have the proof, you have already taken part in their extermination as a blind judge, jury and executioner, laughing when the brotherhood mentionned how funny it is to make their heads explode. In any case, that makes the lone wanderer a blind mass murderer, even if he doesn't blow up Megaton or kill Tenpenny's residents because he dislikes dandies and the victorian era.) Yes, in the end, it's all worth it for the clean water and everything. But until you know that, you are given ZERO reason to pile corpses upon corpses on the path to James.

And about James. How is he from the good side, if this is a good vs evil story ? He abandoned you for a water purifier NOBODY needed. One of the only civilized place is Megaton, which has technology to pump clean water from the ground (which means that the groundwater is full and clean. Just saying...) and robots to produce a shitload of gallons of water per day with only ambiant moist. If scientists of Rivet City can work a GECK, which works with freaking cold fusion and food replicators, surely they could make moist farms or enhance the Megaton's purifier, which is something that WORKS, as proven by the first hour of the game. A lot of water leaks on the ground of Megaton and nobody cares, because nobody is thirsty. Except a beggar, who litteraly lives 10 meters from a city he can walk in with no problem, with clean water dripping on the ground for freaking free.

James kills four people in cold blood simply because he's too proud to see the Enclave succeeding in what he has failed for decades. After he doomed the project by freaking leaving, and after he almost doomed you to death by leaving you in a hostile area. And after he sent you, his only child, to face a freaking army of raging Hulks willing to eat your brain for fun. And if he finds out that you are actually a genocidal maniac who unleashed nuclear hell on innocents for fun, he just says "Well, I guess that's not a very nice thing to do but I still love you". That's what a crazy psychopath would do, not a "good" guy.

How is the Enclave evil ? Yeah, their IA is also a crazy mass murderer, but as soon as he voices his intentions, he kills himself and we find out that nobody ever followed his genocidal plans in the first place. The Enclave wants to repair a device that is built only to help people, even if the said people don't need it. Maybe the Enclave needs the technology for another thirsty place, who knows ? But what's the hero's response ? Yeah, blow up their house, because they were a bit too british to his taste. Convince an invading military force to bring hell on them and push the button before they do, otherwise... the water purifier gets repaired ?

Even on its fundamental elements, I cannot see how Fallout 3 could be described as a good vs evil narrative, like Star Wars or Hunger Games. The "good" people are crazy raiders with white knight excuses, while the "bad" guys are just british dudes doing their jobs, and the two clash to see who will push a button first, to repair a thing nobody ever needed in the first place.

Now, I'm not trying to convince you that it's a badly written game. You love it, it's fine. I'm happy for you if you have fun with it. I just disagree on the "good vs evil" description of the story.
 
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I voted Frank Horrigan for utter badassery. I shat a brick when I found the random encounter where he slaughters those farmers, because I thought I had to fight him at level 3, haha. Then there's the bit where he punches Matthew nearly in half. It's also ironic how he calls you "mutie" despite being a cybernetically enhanced Supermutant himself.

The Master would be a very close second.
Oh yes, that moment. Simple, mysterious, badass. The build up leading to Horrigan is just perfect. You know what he has done. You know you lived to this moment because he ALLOWED you to, which is a very efficient storytelling trick. You know he defeated the brotherhood and the deathclaws easily, and that if you had to face him, you'd have to be stronger than them. You, a simple tribal wanderer, simply trying to protect a village. You'd have to be better than a pack of deathclaws and a brotherhood agent who already kicked muties' butt before you first saw a gecko in the hunting grounds.
And now, he is in your path, and he is there for you only. That moment when you see him standing in the Enclave's hall is probably the most intimidating moment I ever had in a video game. I can't remember any other moment I sincerely wanted to just run away from a fight, except maybe Amnesia, but that's another kind of game.
 
If Fallout 3 is a good vs evil story, how is the hero from the good side ? You murder, in cold blood, innocent people just to get out of the vault and look for your dad. That's what a psychopath would do. The guys are just doing their jobs, they want to bring you to the overseer for a very understandable questioning, and your immediate answer is to shoot them in the face ? People who went to your birthday parties, defended you against bullies, people you know by name and grew up with ? At this very moment, you're no longer from the good side of the story. You're on the side of the raiders who hung corpses above their beds for some obscure and not very hygienic reason. Oh right, they killed Jonas. So ? Jonas could have tried to take their gun, as far as you know. You have zero moral evidence that would justify the killings.

And then after that, you willingly participate in a war against the super mutants, while having zero intel on the reason of the said war. For all your character knows, the Super mutants were here for two centuries and didn't even cause a threat to Megaton until the recent arrival of the brotherhood. For all your character knows, you could be taking part in a racial genocide with no second thought. (yes, super mutants are evil in the end, but when you have the proof, you have already taken part in their extermination as a blind judge, jury and executioner, laughing when the brotherhood mentionned how funny it is to make their heads explode. In any case, that makes the lone wanderer a blind mass murderer, even if he doesn't blow up Megaton or kill Tenpenny's residents because he dislikes dandies and the victorian era.) Yes, in the end, it's all worth it for the clean water and everything. But until you know that, you are given ZERO reason to pile corpses upon corpses on the path to James.

And about James. How is he from the good side, if this is a good vs evil story ? He abandoned you for a water purifier NOBODY needed. One of the only civilized place is Megaton, which has technology to pump clean water from the ground (which means that the groundwater is full and clean. Just saying...) and robots to produce a shitload of gallons of water per day with only ambiant moist. If scientists of Rivet City can work a GECK, which works with freaking cold fusion and food replicators, surely they could make moist farms or enhance the Megaton's purifier, which is something that WORKS, as proven by the first hour of the game. A lot of water leaks on the ground of Megaton and nobody cares, because nobody is thirsty. Except a beggar, who litteraly lives 10 meters from a city he can walk in with no problem, with clean water dripping on the ground for freaking free.

James kills four people in cold blood simply because he's too proud to see the Enclave succeeding in what he has failed for decades. After he doomed the project by freaking leaving, and after he almost doomed you to death by leaving you in a hostile area. And after he sent you, his only child, to face a freaking army of raging Hulks willing to eat your brain for fun. And if he finds out that you are actually a genocidal maniac who unleashed nuclear hell on innocents for fun, he just says "Well, I guess that's not a very nice thing to do but I still love you". That's what a crazy psychopath would do, not a "good" guy.

How is the Enclave evil ? Yeah, their IA is also a crazy mass murderer, but as soon as he voices his intentions, he kills himself and we find out that nobody ever followed his genocidal plans in the first place. The Enclave wants to repair a device that is built only to help people, even if the said people don't need it. Maybe the Enclave needs the technology for another thirsty place, who knows ? But what's the hero's response ? Yeah, blow up their house, because they were a bit too british to his taste. Convince an invading military force to bring hell on them and push the button before they do, otherwise... the water purifier gets repaired ?

Even on its fundamental elements, I cannot see how Fallout 3 could be described as a good vs evil narrative, like Star Wars or Hunger Games. The "good" people are crazy raiders with white knight excuses, while the "bad" guys are just british dudes doing their jobs, and the two clash to see who will push a button first, to repair a thing nobody ever needed in the first place.

Now, I'm not trying to convince you that it's a badly written game. You love it, it's fine. I'm happy for you if you have fun with it. I just disagree on the "good vs evil" description of the story.
Dude, you shouldn't have bothered writing all that because I don't care.
I just wanna shoot muties in the face and fuck enclave shit up.
 
Then play the good games where you can Do that. Fallout 1 & 2. Are you uh... Are you sure you fit in here?
Yeah, Doomsday you seem to be a symptom of the problem behind Beth's Fallouts, if the series had to change in order for you to enjoy it then you have to admit that it's (likely) a shitty entry in the series.
The previous Fallout's had grey moral choices, Fallout 3 didn't, therefore Fallout 3 is a shitty Fallout game with an equally shitty villain, regardless of how much you personally enjoyed it/them.
 
Then play the good games where you can Do that. Fallout 1 & 2. Are you uh... Are you sure you fit in here?
Yeah I played those too, and I shot muties in those, and it was good.
Never enjoyed them as much as I did fallout NV or 3 though,
The previous Fallout's had grey moral choices, Fallout 3 didn't
You played the Pitt DLC?
Also I dont really care about grey moral choices, I just like shooting stuff, and exploring the wasteland.
 
Oh I enjoyed fallout 3. I had to ignore the game entirely and run around listening to GNR to enjoy but I'm pretty sure that's how anyone who enjoyed it did
 
Oh I enjoyed fallout 3. I had to ignore the game entirely and run around listening to GNR to enjoy but I'm pretty sure that's how anyone who enjoyed it did
I actually enjoyed the story, its fine that you didn't enjoy it. We're all different.
I cant find a place to talk properly about my love for Fallout 3, I might register on another forum
Yeah, Doomsday you seem to be a symptom of the problem behind Beth's Fallouts, if the series had to change in order for you to enjoy it then you have to admit that it's (likely) a shitty entry in the series.
Are you saying my perfect taste in games is bad?

Anyway, I think I am the only F3 fan on here.
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At least Fallout 3 was 'somewhat' a 'genuine' attempt at making a Fallout game. It shows, heck the Pitt was good too. Far Harbor was comparable to Point Lookout, and from what I saw it seemed FH still managed to stand on its' own, too. But one big mistake Bethesda made now is there seemed no Pitt-like DLC is going to get released any sooner because the Season Pass quota is getting fulfilled, and it seemed they want to release another stupid-ass Automatron/WW-like DLCs.

Also, while stupid, the writing in Fallout 3 at least enjoyable - well, Dragonborn's Fallout WARS enjoyable, I mean.
 
An action filled Fallout is actually fine with me, and probably fine with everyone here. Hell, Tactics was extremely brutal, and it was, by all means, a pretty good Fallout game ! Because a brutal game can and must have good writing. Mad Max is what you expect in a game, apparently. And let's face it, it was a good game, mainly because of its decent writing. There's no plot hole. Your actions are justified. So, you have a reason to blow shit up and have fun doing so.

See, the overall grudge with Fallout 3 has nothing to do with its action. It's just that for many, many of us, we need to have a reason for shooting people, especially when you play a guy who's never killed a man before, and when you play a game that pretends to be a successor of the guy who wrote Planescape Torment. You know, one of the most complex and well written game of all times? As said before, it's very hard to understand WHY your character suddenly turns violent, because he has zero reason to do so. No reason, no immersion. No immersion, no RPG. No RPG, no Fallout.

You're immersed in a game when you know why you do what you do. Why do you kill people, in Fallout 3 ? Why are you fighting the Enclave or the super mutants in the first place ? Why do you risk your life for water ? Without the answers, it's really hard to care about what's happening, and when you're in the middle of a gunfight and explosions, you should be knowing why you're here, and not in the comfort of a vault.
 
I actually enjoyed the story, its fine that you didn't enjoy it. We're all different.
I cant find a place to talk properly about my love for Fallout 3, I might register on another forum

Are you saying my perfect taste in games is bad?

Anyway, I think I am the only F3 fan on here.
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I'm also a fan of Fallout 3 and Fallout 4, but at the same time I can acknowledge their flaws. Personally I know no prejudice when it comes to the Fallout series; I love all the games (Well except for that which shall not be named) equally.
 
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I'm also a fan of Fallout 3 and Fallout 4, but at the same time I can acknowledge their flaws. Personally I know no prejudice when it comes to the Fallout series; I love all the games (Well except for that which shall not be named) equally.
Huh, I wished I had your "Love all the games equally" attitude. It's so innocent, so... optimistic. Not implying I'm pessimistic, though, just realistic towards the whole affair.

Fallout 3 was my first 'Fallout' game, and at this point I'm not sure if I'm in a love-hate relationship with Fallout 3. Somewhere deep in my heart and my mind, I'm kind of 'revered' my very first experience with it, that if I were to not play New Vegas and the originals, I'm certainly gonna think Fallout 3 as one of the most unique game I've ever played in my whole life *shudders*, so it wasn't pure hatred. But the reality is, having played NV and the classics, a pure hatred was sparked in me to the point I even scratched my current TTW playthrough by uninstalling both NV and 3 that time to cleanse my machine every bits of Fallout 3 existences so obviously I didn't love it either. Though, this happened partly due to my mistake of going for Operation: Anchorage and Mothership Zeta first, instead of ignoring them and go straight into the Pitt and Point Lookout. I dunno about you, Doomsday, but I can understand the sentiment of most of NMA here. Having experience such an exquisite that's Fallout 1 and 2, only to be greeted with something like Fallout 3 after long wait and disappointment of Van Buren getting canceled... really, I'm just parroting this site's old age lamentation despite most of already tired and left the forums.

P.S: Sorry Risewild :-(
 
P.S: Sorry Risewild :-(
Hey, TTW may make playing Fallout 3 a better experience, but we don't make miracles.
No need to apologise. :ok:

I haven't posted in this thread before because I really can't decide which antagonist I like more :razz:, I agree with much of what was already said around here though.
 
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