BioShock in for a bumpy release

[Sander]

Well I knew about the couple games that required 3.0 and the only way I found out about it was by this little wonder of an event of hitting the 2K forums and reading other peoples posts defending the 2.0 PS problem. So don't give me that bs line of 'educate yourself more' when you honestly have no clue about what I do or do not know based on absolutly nothing I actually said.

You said that it doesn't actually say anywhere on the box that you need SM 3.0, while it actually *does* say that, since it requires a Directx 9/0c compatible card, which is SM 3.0. That's why we said you didn't know what you were talking about, and again you show that you indeed do not know what you are talking about.

Well I dunno about that line 2.0 shaders can't handle Bioshock. The 2K forums got quite a few people who would disagree with you, and show you work in progress screenshots of there PS 2.0 mod to make the game work.

Yes, *mod*. They are *modifying the game* so it can work with SM 2.0. They are not making the game work with SM 3.0 as is, they are modifying game contents so it can work with SM 2.0.

If somebody can mod the game in there spare time and for free, to run on old PS2.0 cards. Then I really think Bioshock can be handled.

And with out being able to find a link of my own there is the posts about Unreal engine, the same engine Bioshock was made on is compatible with 2.0 shaders. The programmers ether avoided the idea of compatibility, or they didn't have time to incorporate it.

They didn't use a stock Unreal engine, they used a modified Unreal engine. Heavily modified, and modified in such a way that they can fully utilise SM 3.0.

I don't know whether you're missing something here, but SM 3.0 isn't just some random feature you can toggle on or off for any game. 2K Boston created Bioshock to fully utilise SM 3.0. This means that it uses a lot of features that are simply *not present* in SM 2.0. Hence trying to make the contents work on SM 2.0 would require a lot of work, and a lot of workarounds.

If a modder can make the game run, be it still alpha work arounds, then I'm left to wonder why it wasn't just done to begin with. As such my coveted burned feeling.

Because that takes lots of time and money to do properly.

Which also, it doesn't matter if I justify it to you or anybody else for that matter. I mean honestly, I don't need approval for how I feel. If I wanna feel burned about when I bought my truck. Hell I will, even though I got a great deal and the tranny hasn't fallin out yet. Still got a burning senstation.

Good for you. But when you come onto a forum to whine about something with unsubstantiated arguments, then that gets pointed out to you.

 

[MrBumble]

There's no game using the Unreal Engine 3 that runs with graphic cards that do not handle SM 3.0. Splinter Cell Double Agent, Rainbow Six Vegas, Monster Madness, Bioshock...They all NEED SM 3.0. cards. It's not specific to Bioshock. As sad as it may be ( and I do feel sorry for all the guys who bought the game and cannot run it now ), you should have checked the system requirements first...as I did.


EDIT : here's a list of games using UE3, and they all NEED SM3.0 :

Unreal Engine 3

* Aliens — (2009) Gearbox Software
* America's Army 3.0 — (2008) US Army
* APB — (2008) Webzen
* Black Powder Red Earth - (2007) Echelon Studios
* Brothers In Arms: Hell's Highway — (2007) Gearbox Software[35]
* BioShock - (2007) 2K Boston/2K Australia
* BlackSite: Area 51 — (2007) Midway Austin
* DC Comics MMO — (TBA) Sony Online Entertainment
* Earth No More — (2009) Recoil Games / 3D Realms
* Elveon — (2007) 10tacle Studios[36]
* Fatal Inertia — (2007) Koei[37]
* Frontlines: Fuel of War — (2008) Kaos Studios
* Fury — (2007) Auran[38]
* Gears of War — (2006) Epic Games
* Global Agenda — (TBA) Hi-Rez Studios[39]
* Hail to the Chimp — (2008) Wideload Games [40]
* Hour of Victory — (2007) Midway Games
* Huxley — (2008) Webzen Games[41]
* Interstellar Marines - (2008) Zero Point Software [42]
* The Last Remnant — (2008) Square Enix
* Lost Odyssey — (2007) Mistwalker[43]
* Mass Effect — (2007) BioWare[44]
* Medal of Honor: Airborne — (2007) Electronic Arts[45]
* Monster Madness: Battle for Suburbia — (2007) Artificial Studios[46]
* RoboBlitz — (2006) Naked Sky Entertainment[47]
* Rogue Warrior: Black Razor - (2007) Bethesda Softworks
* Stargate Worlds — (2007) Cheyenne Mountain Entertainment[48]
* Stranglehold — (2007) Midway Chicago[49]
* The Scourge Project — (N/A) Tragnarion Studios
* To End All Wars — (2008) Kuju Entertainment [50] [51]
* Tom Clancy's EndWar — (2008) Ubisoft
* Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six: Vegas — (2006) Ubisoft
* Turning Point: Fall of Liberty — (2007) Spark Unlimited
* Turok — (2008) Propaganda Games
* Undertow — (2007) Chair Entertainment
* Unreal Tournament 3 — (2007) Epic Games
* Upcoming Mortal Kombat 8 Game — (Unknown) Midway Games
* The Wheelman — (2007) Midway Games
* HEI$T — (2007) InXile Entertainment

 

[st0lve]

Bioshock has a fan made patch which makes it work with SM2. Loading times are way longer, and not all textures and stuff get the correct color, but it works.

Lazy developers, money hungry Nividia (which probably knows that the game WILL work with SM2 cards but try to cover it up so that people will buy a new card!!!!!)

 

[Sander]

Bioshock has a fan made patch which makes it work with SM2. Loading times are way longer, and not all textures and stuff get the correct color, but it works.

Lazy developers, money hungry Nividia (which probably knows that the game WILL work with SM2 cards but try to cover it up so that people will buy a new card!!!!!)

...
What? No it won't. The game will not work with SM2.0 cards. It simply won't. Full stop. Nothing more to it.
The fanmade patch works by modifying game assets to circumvent SM 3.0. But by doing this, as you noticed, a lot of textures and the like get messed up.

 

[Kyuu]

Bioshock has a fan made patch which makes it work with SM2. Loading times are way longer, and not all textures and stuff get the correct color, but it works.

Lazy developers, money hungry Nividia (which probably knows that the game WILL work with SM2 cards but try to cover it up so that people will buy a new card!!!!!)

Yes, *mod*. They are *modifying the game* so it can work with SM 2.0. They are not making the game work with SM 3.0 as is, they are modifying game contents so it can work with SM 2.0.... I don't know whether you're missing something here, but SM 3.0 isn't just some random feature you can toggle on or off for any game. 2K Boston created Bioshock to fully utilise SM 3.0. This means that it uses a lot of features that are simply *not present* in SM 2.0. Hence trying to make the contents work on SM 2.0 would require a lot of work, and a lot of workarounds.

Can't really say it any better than that.

 

[metalboss44]

This actually reminds me of when deus ex 2 came out. That game got some great reviews too but the fans knew the game was a steaming pile. It didn't include support for SM1 cards which was unexpected. It also was completely crippled on the PC. Bioshock seems to be following suit, although they are upping the ante by adding this over the top copy protection that only serves to punish the people who purchased the game legitimately.

This guy must have been 2k games DRM adviser

 

[MrBumble]

This actually reminds me of when deus ex 2 came out. That game got some great reviews too but the fans knew the game was a steaming pile. It didn't include support for SM1 cards which was unexpected. It also was completely crippled on the PC. Bioshock seems to be following suit, although they are upping the ante by adding this over the top copy protection that only serves to punish the people who purchased the game legitimately.

1)Bioshock *IS* what it was advertised as : a deep shooter.
2)Bioshock *IS NOT* System Shock 3
3)Bioshock *IS NOT* a "steaming pile"
4)Bioshock works great if you have a decent rig.
5)Bioshock *IS NOT* completely crippled on the PC
6)Bioshock not supporting SM2 *IS NOT* a surprise if you actually know what a "100% DX9.0c compatible graphic card" means
7)Yes, the protection system sucks

 

[SuAside]

in a time like this you come to appreciate publishers like THQ

they seem to support a no-protection policy or at least low protection policy

euhm, no?

THQ screwed me over 3 times in a row...

as for your W40k reference, they only removed the copy protection (securom) from the W40koW game after serious monthlong outcry from the community about how fucking sucky the protection was. (which is why Dark Crusade doesnt have any)

 

[Celluloid]

On the bright side of life, the game would actually launch under win2k with a bit of dll juggling.

It worked like a charm for me on the demo version.
The same trick solved the same problem with the MOH Airborne demo.

Bioshock Win2K fix

 

[Stag]

Bioshock...I finally got it working, and I just stopped playing after about a half hour.
I don't like the FPS aspects of the game...Everything just feels flimsy. People take forever to die, and maybe this is just the System Shock style of gameplay, but I think it's stupid as shit when I have to shoot someone four or five times, point blank, in the chest for them to die. I quit at the start of the first boss level. The boss character was very cool and interesting to me, before I found out that A: his health is even more ridiculously high than the other inhabitants of Rapture, and B: he heals. I got him down about three or four shots to death, before he'd jump onto a healing thing. That's bullshit. That's ridiculous. When I died the first time, I realized that I only respawned with the ammo I had previously, which was five shots with the revolver. I shoot him five times, and then have a great time chasing him down and beating the living fuck out of him with a monkey wrench. After about six minutes of just wailing on the guy with the monkey wrench, his health was only down by half, and mine was gone, and I died again. I tried one more time, and then I was just sick of it.
What is the point of this kind of gameplay? It's frustrating as hell, completely unrealistic, and just fucking ridiculous.

Now, on the positive side, this game looks amazing (despite it not having any AA...), and the world of Rapture is brilliant. It is so very reminiscent of Fallout, and the story is great.

I'd recommend the game if you don't mind a day of searching forums for fixes, and aren't too into "realism".

 

[Maphusio]

Bioshock...I finally got it working, and I just stopped playing after about a half hour.
I don't like the FPS aspects of the game...Everything just feels flimsy. People take forever to die, and maybe this is just the System Shock style of gameplay, but I think it's stupid as shit when I have to shoot someone four or five times, point blank, in the chest for them to die. I quit at the start of the first boss level. The boss character was very cool and interesting to me, before I found out that A: his health is even more ridiculously high than the other inhabitants of Rapture, and B: he heals. I got him down about three or four shots to death, before he'd jump onto a healing thing. That's bullshit. That's ridiculous. When I died the first time, I realized that I only respawned with the ammo I had previously, which was five shots with the revolver. I shoot him five times, and then have a great time chasing him down and beating the living fuck out of him with a monkey wrench. After about six minutes of just wailing on the guy with the monkey wrench, his health was only down by half, and mine was gone, and I died again. I tried one more time, and then I was just sick of it.
What is the point of this kind of gameplay? It's frustrating as hell, completely unrealistic, and just fucking ridiculous.

Now, on the positive side, this game looks amazing (despite it not having any AA...), and the world of Rapture is brilliant. It is so very reminiscent of Fallout, and the story is great.

I'd recommend the game if you don't mind a day of searching forums for fixes, and aren't too into "realism".

Eh? Are you using your super Mutant-X powers?! (Studies show that names that have an "X" in them sell.)

 

[Kyuu]

I shoot him five times, and then have a great time chasing him down and beating the living fuck out of him with a monkey wrench. After about six minutes of just wailing on the guy with the monkey wrench, his health was only down by half, and mine was gone, and I died again. I tried one more time, and then I was just sick of it.

Did you try any of your plasmids? I've only played the demo, but generally, in that type of situation, there's a trick to help you out. Either an environmental solution, or possibly something to do with your "special abilities" (plasmids), which I didn't see you make any mention of. Perhaps even a way to disable his ability to heal himself? Just guessing here.

 

[Stag]

I was out of Eve. I think I might've been able to get him with some electricity while he was in the water.

 

[SuAside]

Bioshock...I finally got it working, and I just stopped playing after about a half hour.
I don't like the FPS aspects of the game...Everything just feels flimsy.

euhm, and how exactly did you miss the fact that the game is marketed as an FPS? if you dont like FPS aspects, don't buy FPS games?

People take forever to die, and maybe this is just the System Shock style of gameplay, but I think it's stupid as shit when I have to shoot someone four or five times, point blank, in the chest for them to die.

they are genetically modified people that have been at war with eachother for a while. how unlikely is it for them to be able to take a beating?

(you'll note that others go down with a zap & then a hit from ze monkey wrench)

What is the point of this kind of gameplay? It's frustrating as hell, completely unrealistic, and just fucking ridiculous.

Bioshock never pretended to offer realism... gtfo

also, ammo, eve and first aid kits are pretty dang plentiful. go play on easy if you cant handle the difficulty?

 

[Stag]

No, I obviously knew that, I just didn't like how the FPS bits were handled.

I ran out because of this boss fight. I'm not sure what I did wrong, but I ran out after the second time I fought him.

 

[Sorrow]

Bioshock...I finally got it working, and I just stopped playing after about a half hour.
I don't like the FPS aspects of the game...Everything just feels flimsy.

euhm, and how exactly did you miss the fact that the game is marketed as an FPS? if you dont like FPS aspects, don't buy FPS games?

There are different kinds of FPS - there are FPS like Soldier of Fortune that care about believability and there are FPS that don't.
Personally, I prefer the first kind, especially when game has a serious setting.

 

[Sander]

euhm, and how exactly did you miss the fact that the game is marketed as an FPS? if you dont like FPS aspects, don't buy FPS games?

There are different kinds of FPS - there are FPS like Soldier of Fortune that care about believability[/quote]
Please don't ever use 'Soldier of Fortune' and 'believability' in the same sentence again, ever.

and there are FPS that don't.
Personally, I prefer the first kind, especially when game has a serious setting.

Bioshock never pretended to be anywhere close to realistics. I mean, really, it has plasmids and mutated enemies.

 

[Sorrow]

believability != realistic world and technology.

There are different kinds of FPS - there are FPS like Soldier of Fortune that care about believability

Please don't ever use 'Soldier of Fortune' and 'believability' in the same sentence again, ever.

Why? Damage model was pretty believable.

 

[Sander]

believability != realistic world and technology.

And in a game world with hyped up mutants, it is quite believable that they can take a beating.

Why? Damage model was pretty believable.

That's about all of the game that was 'believable'. It was just an arcade shooter like Unreal Tournament for the rest.

 

[Tagaziel]

Why? Damage model was pretty believable.

Glocks punch holes the size of fists in people.

NUKULAR KATAPULTZ, excuse me, MICROWAVE GUNZ!

FN Minimi punching holes like a .44 Magnum Desert Eagle.

"Pretty" believeable.