CanardPC Fallout 3 magazine Preview

Moving Target said:
Oh yeah! I remember playing Q1 back when it new, without the disk and consequently without the soundtrack. Then I got to borrow the disk....What a big difference! Great stuff....
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Quake LAN-play against my mate still rates as about the best multiplayer gaming I've experienced, even though I used to have to take my P60 desktop around to his house (stuffing my huge CRT into the back of his car...)

Ah, halcyon days...!
 
Finally bought the magazine. The author is rather critical, especially as regards combat. I love that, for one, he does not say that VATS is turn based, but " a sort of real time with pause combat system directly stolen from Bioware ". He says that the slow motion gets old really fast because it lasts for 15 seconds ( . . . ) and looks like a parody of Max Payne. He also says that the wasteland themselves, outside of Washington look really uninspired, with lots of trenches ( wtf ? ) and that combat situations often lack of originality ( "does not get better than the most average FPS you can get" ). He also criticizes the appearance of Ghouls ( "zombies coming right from Oblivion" ) and Supermutants( "Orcs on steroids" ), very far from the previous designs. He also says that even though Bethesda are trying hard to be humourous ( at least they are trying eh ) it sometimes sounds like a little bit too much, a little bit forced. Gory effects also look "a bit too much". He concludes by saying that he wants to see more of it because even though he liked some things ( Vault 101 ), some other elements really failed, that even though he has a long time ago lost the hope that Fallout 3 could be a decent Fallout, there is still hope for a good post apocalyptic RPG. Actually the first time I read that in an article...We are no longer alone brothers and sisters ! :clap:


EDIT : might also be considered as "new" information :

Characters with high Perception not only aim better but are able to "see the enemies coming a few seconds in advance". I'm not sure what it exactly means but that's what is said in the article. I should maybe ask the author on the forum.
 
Wait, is that a non-cock sucking preview?

I CAN'T BELIEVE IT!! THERE'S STILL SOMEONE SMART IN THE GAMING MEDIA!! OH GOD!

Finally, someone with BRAINS reviews the game after NMA! I can't even believe that!
 
MrBumble said:
The author is rather critical
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Seriously? "a sort of real time with pause combat system directly stolen from Bioware" :eyebrow:
That's not something you see every day.
Who wrote this? Some kinda Codexian?


Characters with high Perception not only aim better but are able to "see the enemies coming a few seconds in advance"
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BN or SuAside, is that how the 'seeing through buildings', if I got it it right, worked in the demo?

edit:
I mean in regards to the "compass", FYI.
 
PlanHex said:
Characters with high Perception not only aim better but are able to "see the enemies coming a few seconds in advance"
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BN or SuAside, is that how the 'seeing through buildings', if I got it it right, worked in the demo?

edit:
I mean in regards to the "compass", FYI.
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Yes. Also, you see their outline in VATS even if they're behind a wall.
 
MrBumble said:
Finally bought the magazine. The author is rather critical, especially as regards combat. I love that, for one, he does not say that VATS is turn based, but " a sort of real time with pause combat system directly stolen from Bioware ". He says that the slow motion gets old really fast because it lasts for 15 seconds ( . . . ) and looks like a parody of Max Payne. He also says that the wasteland themselves, outside of Washington look really uninspired, with lots of trenches ( wtf ? ) and that combat situations often lack of originality ( "does not get better than the most average FPS you can get" ). He also criticizes the appearance of Ghouls ( "zombies coming right from Oblivion" ) and Supermutants( "Orcs on steroids" ), very far from the previous designs. He also says that even though Bethesda are trying hard to be humourous ( at least they are trying eh ) it sometimes sounds like a little bit too much, a little bit forced. Gory effects also look "a bit too much". He concludes by saying that he wants to see more of it because even though he liked some things ( Vault 101 ), some other elements really failed, that even though he has a long time ago lost the hope that Fallout 3 could be a decent Fallout, there is still hope for a good post apocalyptic RPG. Actually the first time I read that in an article...We are no longer alone brothers and sisters ! :clap:
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kinda sounds like our own preview, doesn't it? ;)

i'm glad to hear that my faith in the ex-Joystick/CanardPC crew wasn't misplaced.

i think i'll kill my subscription to Joystick and see if i can get CanardPC in Belgistan instead? :)
 
I don't feel so bad about the lack of any Soundtrack CD in the FO3 Collector's edition anymore.

FO3 might be a decent game . . . it's just the title that's misleading. Beth still have the time to change it and averyone will be happy.
 
I think as well that Cryolator/Mesmetron don't fit in Fallout, they're too unrealistic, IMO. Hypnotysing gun?? WTF? If it could be gained in random UFO encounter as a joke then OK, but other than that it's just plain retarded. And if it's just stunning weapon, then maybe they should name it stunning gun?
Cryolator is even more stupid. Exactly how could they remotely suck someone's energy momentarily (and that's what freezing is, the energy is being taken away) ? But even disregarding fact it's too unrealistic, if they had such a gun, water wouldn't be a problem (as someone previously stated). Not to mention I don't think it would be a practical gun which could be easily acquired. No army in the world would use such ineffective gun, rather some which had better range and which killed instantly. Think, you freeze a guy, and someone shoots that guy, he explodes and a fragment of him pokes your eye. Why use such sophisticated and power draining gun to kill someone?
As for "unrealistic" laser guns. Laser guns have already been produced, but the problem lies with powering them so they could have enough power to actually damage someone. Nonetheless they can blind people, which could be considered as more humane way of neutralizing enemies then killing. So yeah, I think that applying Cryolator into Fallout is too far-fetched.
As for Stealth boy, for some time there are cloaks which make you transparent (thanks to camcorders) so in XXIII century it wouldn't be that strange if it could be used. Gatling guns and power fists were maybe the most far-fetched weapons, but still more plausible than Cryolator/Mesmetron.
This gun is there because they wanted kids to have fun like they have when play GTA and instead of doing missions they kill civilians using tank.
You like it? Good for you. I for one (and from what I see there are many with similar opinion) don't.

As for Mesmetron, check out Section 8's response in the codex forums
Section8 said:
Do you guys seriously think the Mesmetron actually belongs in this sort of setting? Sure it's goofy 1950's pulp, but it completely sidesteps the grittier influences. Most specifically, Fallout doesn't riff of "realism", but it does so enough that such a potent political tool as the Mesmetron would be a big fucking deal.

We can assume it's basically going to be "charm person" or whatever the Elder Scrolls equivalent is, so consider this - You have a personal infantry weapon that can control minds, and the effect is near-instantaneous (unlike extensive programs of hypnosis/brainwashing, etc.) Who the fuck would be building nukes when you could build a mass-scale mind control ray? Who would bother with power armour and miniguns when you could have a ninja hiding up a tree, mind controlling a single enemy soldier and telling him to pull the pin on his grenade?

We know Fallout isn't the real world. We know it has goofy pulp sci-fi influences. But that's no reason for a complete departure from sensibility to try and justify something with such epic ramifications as part of the Fallout world. Mind control is bigger than nukes, bigger than FEV, bigger than power armour... I mean, Imagine the possibilities!.

Again, it's a question of where you draw the line. Do you also include X-Ray specs, because they fit the goofy pulp aspects? The spacecraft of Buck Rogers or Flash Gordon? Brian Blessed as some kind of avian furfag? Do you let the player equip the ring of Ming the Merciless that lets him magically create natural disasters on a planet light years away? A rocket cycle, like the one that brought so many lulz in Fallout Tactics?

I think it's pretty safe to say, given the classic - "My idea is explore more of the world and more of the ethics of a postnuclear world, not to make a better plasma gun" quote from Tim Cain, that if such a thing as a Mesmetron was to exist in the Fallout world, it wouldn't be there as another way to shoehorn a cheap, shitty piece of parlour magic into a lifeless combat system, it would be there as an integral part of the societal and political issues at hand.

So fuck the Mesmetron. The cryolator doesn't offend quite as much, but you can bet it's like a pale shadow of the ice spell in Dark Messiah.
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I urge people who think these guns fit in Fallout to watch again Fallout 1's intro and then come and tell me they fit.

Fade in to the part with the execution and imagine some guy with the freeze spell...erm gun coming in and freezing the other two. LOL! I liek frizzd them!
This is what Bethesda is after... cheap lols.
 
Section 8 is wrong, he's taking things into the absurd realm instead of facing what those weapons really are.

If you remove Science! weapons than all it will stay are pistols, ak's,G3s, uzis and the like.

Again I'm sorry but on this I agree with the wikipedia:

Fallout draws from 1950s pulp magazines, science fiction and superhero comic books, all rooted in Atomic Age optimism of a nuclear-powered future, though gone terribly awry by the time the events of the game take place. The technology is retro-futuristic, with various Raygun Gothic machines such as laser weaponry and boxy Forbidden Planet-style robots. Computers use vacuum tubes instead of transistors, architecture of ruined buildings feature Art Deco and Googie designs, energy weapons resemble those used by Flash Gordon, and what few vehicles remain in the world are all 1950s-styled.

Fallout's other production design, such as menu interfaces, are similarly designed to resemble advertisements and toys of the Atomic Age. The characters sheet cards and perks available resemble those of the board game Monopoly, and other advertising in the game such as billboards and brochures have a distinct 1950s flavour. The lack of retro stylization was one of the things the Fallout spin-offs were criticized for, as retro-futurism is a hallmark of the Fallout series.
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And with Tim Cain:

Seriously, the artists just thought that 50's tech looked cool. So they set out to make a future science that looked like what the Golden Era of science fiction thought that future science would look like (if you can follow that sentence). Vacuum tubes, ray guns, mutants, the whole works. And I think they succeeded quite well.
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You have exploding nuclear cars and nuclear slingshots, something that it's there to attract shooter fans and is completely implausible in the setting. Do complain about those, but please don't try to remove Science! weapons and "the Future that can Be!" weapons outright, that would make the Fallout setting loose a part of it's uniqueness and flavor.
 
True, not only do they fit the setting but who cares ( credibility-wise ) about these two weapons when Fallout 2 had a "Garden of Eden Creation Kit" anyway ?
 
If you remove Science! weapons than all it will stay are pistols, ak's,G3s, uzis and the like.
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Plasma rifle? Pulse rifle? Aren't these enough?
Tim Cain doesn't mention anything remotely similar to the weapons Dethesda is throwing in.

This sounds like "OK, at least they're doing something related to fifties... let's be happy". No, it's just forced.
 
FeelTheRads said:
I urge people who think these guns fit in Fallout to watch again Fallout 1's intro and then come and tell me they fit.

Fade in to the part with the execution and imagine some guy with the freeze spell...erm gun coming in and freezing the other two. LOL! I liek frizzd them!
This is what Bethesda is after... cheap lols.
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Just imagine the same scene with the alien gun..."lulz fried !" Both guns fit the setting despite being caricatural. The Wikipedia excerpt mentions "Forbidden Planet" and it's an excellent case in point as regards retrofuturist technology, you should watch it : it's a pretty good illustration of how the future was perceived during the fifties.
 
Then again, the Alien Blaster was an easter-egg and it was by no means as stupid as Bethesda's weapons. Besides there isn't much difference between the Blaster and a Laster Pistol, is there?

Unless these weapons will just easter-eggs in Fallout 3, and I doubt they will be, they do not fit. Although the Mesmetron wouldn't fit in any possible situation. It's just too stupid.
 
Do you speak in terms of setting or purely in terms of believability ? Because then again, it's not much worse than the idea of a FEV transforming humans in supermutants or having aliens in Fallout 2...
 
I'm speaking in terms of believability in the setting. Section 8 explained it quite well why such weapons don't fit.
Seriously, not everything fifties fits in Fallout.
Fallout simply borrows from the fifties, it doesn't copy everything.
 
FeelTheRads said:
I'm speaking in terms of believability in the setting. Section 8 explained it quite well why such weapons don't fit.
Seriously, not everything fifties fits in Fallout.
Fallout simply borrows from the fifties, it doesn't copy everything.
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No he didn't. He didn't explained why Fallout's Science! weapons are different from this. He tried but didn't make a convincing case about these weapons in particular. Again remove 50's pulp influences and imagery and we'll have something between FOBOS and Gears of Wars, not something related to Fallout.

Of course I might be wrong, it's something that one day I'll have to try to see what the original Fallout devs would say.

With so many things to complain on that article you go for the one good thing. Bizarre.
 
You're confusing me Briosafreak. You're saying "removing 50's pulp influences" when referring to these weapons like they were already in the Fallout universe and we want them removed. They weren't and neither was anything similar.
And we don't want these influences removed... it's Bethesda who removes them and then slaps some things together and claims "LOOK! OMG, FIFTIES! IT"S FALLOUT!"

I sure would like to hear what the developers would say, though. Or at least Roshambo - he might have some inside information.
 
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