Decay of video game discs

[Buxbaum666]

Guys. GUYS. Let's not get too technical about our respective anal details.

 

[Gizmojunk]

So maybe I've forgotten some of the specifics, but don't patronize me by telling me it's wrong because you read about it somewhere.

Who did? Don't be so thin skinned. People should be able to say that a person is wrong or that something they said is inaccurate, without that person taking it as a personal attack.

I looked into it a bit more today, and I've seen mention of the chemical dye layer on CDRs forming pits from the recording laser... so as to visually look the same as stamped CDs to the reader.
That is not how I had thought it worked. I didn't know that the heat from the laser physically damaged the surface of the dye; I had thought that it was just causing a [dye] surface change in reflectivity.. not digging out pits. So that's neat to learn.

 

[Crni Vuk]

Yeah! Gizmo is right, dont be so skinned Gizmo! Just because Gizmo patronized you Gizmo!

 

[Tagaziel]

Some old game discs had aggressive copy protection that included deriberate corrupt sectors and shit like that. Some drives couldn't read these at all. But c&c 3 apparently had Securom protection so no unreadable sectors there. Some discs just die earlier than others and all CDs and DVDs eventually will. Blu-Rays are supposedly more durable.

I have the same problem. The irony is that C&C95 discs work perfectly (and that's the first Polish release from the nineties). So does Tiberian Sun (first Polish release). Both C&C3 and KW are dead. A shame, I love those games.

 

[Nas92]

Tiberium Wars is available on Steam, it's also on sale right now, it's dirt cheap. I thought about buying it myself, last I checked there was a pretty active multiplayer community, surprisingly enough.

 

[Atomkilla]

Some old game discs had aggressive copy protection that included deriberate corrupt sectors and shit like that. Some drives couldn't read these at all. But c&c 3 apparently had Securom protection so no unreadable sectors there. Some discs just die earlier than others and all CDs and DVDs eventually will. Blu-Rays are supposedly more durable.

I have the same problem. The irony is that C&C95 discs work perfectly (and that's the first Polish release from the nineties). So does Tiberian Sun (first Polish release). Both C&C3 and KW are dead. A shame, I love those games.

Share the pain, bro.

Tiberium Wars is available on Steam, it's also on sale right now, it's dirt cheap. I thought about buying it myself, last I checked there was a pretty active multiplayer community, surprisingly enough.

I'll probably get it during winter sale then. More free time.

 

[SnapSlav]

Yes, regular CDs do get pressed the way you described. You wrote CD-R/RW work by that. That's incorrect.

No, that is NOT what I said. I said they were NOT made the same way, and as a result of the different manufacturing processes, CDRs and CDRWs were prone to completely different types of damage than regular CDs. I also said that my knowledge was rusty, but that the worst case scenario was that a production method had been improved upon, so a method of creating a disc "that does not 'decay'" would only have been made better, speaking solely of CDs, not Writable/ReWritable. Whatever's changed in the manufacturing process of THOSE I would have absolutely no idea. And it was Gizmo's "from what I read" comment that I considered more patronizing, not necessarily yours. I simply lumped your statement in with his because both were "no, wrong" comments, and I was explaining that my explanation was derived from experience, not research.

Who did? Don't be so thin skinned. People should be able to say that a person is wrong or that something they said is inaccurate, without that person taking it as a personal attack.

I never said anything read was perceived as a personal attack. I said it was patronizing. Look up the word, and maybe you'll understand.

 

[Hassknecht]

When you write data to a CDR/CDRW, you're creating divets in the metal between both layers of plastic, and those are in turn read as binary. These discs can be rendered unreadable if you pass them through a very powerful magnet, because it will shift the metal and alter the code that was written in them.

That's what you wrote. Sorry if I misunderstood you there, but I can only work with what I read.

 

[Tagaziel]

Tiberium Wars is available on Steam, it's also on sale right now, it's dirt cheap. I thought about buying it myself, last I checked there was a pretty active multiplayer community, surprisingly enough.

Hah, just 5 Euro. That's about a pack of beers and I can skip that.

I never said anything read was perceived as a personal attack. I said it was patronizing. Look up the word, and maybe you'll understand.

The way you react to the slightest disagreement with you shows otherwise.

 

[SnapSlav]

When you write data to a CDR/CDRW, you're creating divets in the metal between both layers of plastic, and those are in turn read as binary. These discs can be rendered unreadable if you pass them through a very powerful magnet, because it will shift the metal and alter the code that was written in them.

That's what you wrote. Sorry if I misunderstood you there, but I can only work with what I read.

And what I said very clearly illustrated that Rs and RWs use an entirely separate manufacturing process. They look the same, but they're not made the same. I was very clear about this.

Maybe it was specifically RWs that were drastically different and I forgot that detail? But I never once said CDs and CDRs and CDRWs were made the same. Only that they were all made in the same building I worked at. They still used entirely different machines in separate rooms to make them.

 

[Hassknecht]

When you write data to a CDR/CDRW, you're creating divets in the metal between both layers of plastic, and those are in turn read as binary. These discs can be rendered unreadable if you pass them through a very powerful magnet, because it will shift the metal and alter the code that was written in them.

That's what you wrote. Sorry if I misunderstood you there, but I can only work with what I read.

And what I said very clearly illustrated that Rs and RWs use an entirely separate manufacturing process. They look the same, but they're not made the same. I was very clear about this.

Maybe it was specifically RWs that were drastically different and I forgot that detail? But I never once said CDs and CDRs and CDRWs were made the same. Only that they were all made in the same building I worked at. They still used entirely different machines in separate rooms to make them.

You said CD R/RW have data written on them by creating dents in the metal. This is wrong. They're written by altering the dye using the writing laser. The metal is not affected. Also, (static) magnets have no effect on the metals used.
It's not that you said normal and writable CDs were made in the same way, because you obviously didn't. It's specifically that you wrote that writable CDs (R and RW) are filled with data by creating divets in the metal, and that magnets could render them unreadable. Nothing else.

 

[Crni Vuk]

what ever you do guys ... just leave females out of this, mkay?

 

[SnapSlav]

You said CD R/RW have data written on them by creating dents in the metal. This is wrong. They're written by altering the dye using the writing laser. The metal is not affected.

AND, for the 3rd or 4th time, I also wrote this:

Granted, my knowledge of the manufacturing process of CDs is a bit over 10 years old, so it goes without saying that there may have been changed/improvement since then.

At the time I was working where they made CDs, they pointed out to me that the CDRs and CDRWs had information burned into them via burners by placing it on the metal layer inside the 2 plastic layers, and this was over 10 years ago. Was the guy bullshitting me? Was it all correct but time has changed that? Was it my memory that changed the information I was told? It could be any of these things, but you determined it was "you're wrong" right from the get-go, and no other possibility. That's what *I* take issue with.

 

[Hassknecht]

You said CD R/RW have data written on them by creating dents in the metal. This is wrong. They're written by altering the dye using the writing laser. The metal is not affected.

AND, for the 3rd or 4th time, I also wrote this:

Granted, my knowledge of the manufacturing process of CDs is a bit over 10 years old, so it goes without saying that there may have been changed/improvement since then.

At the time I was working where they made CDs, they pointed out to me that the CDRs and CDRWs had information burned into them via burners by placing it on the metal layer inside the 2 plastic layers, and this was over 10 years ago. Was the guy bullshitting me? Was it all correct but time has changed that? Was it my memory that changed the information I was told? It could be any of these things, but you determined it was "you're wrong" right from the get-go, and no other possibility. That's what *I* take issue with.

No, they were not bullshitting you, I think you just misunderstood them. The holes burned in it are in the dye layer, not the metal layer.
You know what I take issue with? That when it was pointed out to you that you had something wrong you immediately went for claims of authority and feeling patronised instead of re-examining your posting and checking with the information widely available on the net. When I point out what I thought was wrong with your post you still refuse to even look at it again and simply claim that you never wrote that, which is quite obviously false as evidenced by the quote. When it's 100% proven that you were wrong, you instead try to weasel out by going back to ten year old memories of authority again and that maybe the process changed.
You know what I did when I saw your initial post and thought "Hm, that's not quite how I remember it..."? I checked the history of writable CDs. Checked and crossreferenced several pages to freshen up my own memory and to check if I actually got it right. That's when I decided that yes, you are wrong.
I even looked into all the possible metals used in CD manfacturing and checked if there are any ferromagnetic materials involved that could somehow be disturbed by magnetic fields. I thought about how maybe your Gods of CD processing meant high frequency elctromagnetic fields which induce currents that can destroy a CD, like a microwave. That's when I decided you were wrong.
I looked stuff up. It's fucking common courtesy, and frankly, I find your behaviour insulting.
Go ahead, find this post patronising as well. It's fucking meant that way.

 

[Tagaziel]

Oh man. Hassknecht, I love you.

 

[Atomkilla]

Guys, what the fuck have you done to my thread?

 

[valcik]

What baffles me the most is that SnapSlav was working on shipping the Fallout discs for Interplay. That makes him grown up man, at least 35 years old, unless there are persons under age 18 employed in the United States. 35 at least! Friggin shocking for me, actually. Until now I considered him to be some nerdy teenager in age 20-22 for some reason.

Guys, what the fuck have you done to my thread?

It's decayed, in the same way as your disc!

 

[Hassknecht]

Guys, what the fuck have you done to my thread?

Sorry about that.
It's about the principle.
There's a difference between the oblivious and the ignorant. Simply not knowing is forgivable, but ignoring implies deliberately refusing to accept something, and that's not acceptable.

 

[Nas92]

That makes him grown up man, at least 35 years old, unless there are persons under age 18 employed in the United States.

Although I'm Eastern Yuropoor, such as yourself, I seem to recall that you can work under 18 in the US.
BTW can't you work under 18 in Slovakia? I live in Hungary and I remember a few of my friends did some weekend type work in high school and elementary school. Can't imagine Slovakia being that different. Of course, I lived in a small town, so not sure if it was even legal...

 

[valcik]

Yup, students in age 15-18 are permitted to short-term employment contracts too, it's usualy 2-4 weeks of manual labour as shifting boxes or collecting fruits. Definitely not clerks responsible for shipping goods, you need proper education and resume for such work here in SVK.