Fallout: New Vegas wins 'Best RPG' at Golden Joystick

[Paul_cz]

The Witcher 2 definitely needed some mods for me, more than New Vegas actually. Gameplay was just all-around bad. But what can I say, tastes.

Yeah, tastes, since I have no idea what you talk about.Gameplay being "all around bad" is a huge WTF to me.

 

[WorstUsernameEver]

The Witcher 2 definitely needed some mods for me, more than New Vegas actually. Gameplay was just all-around bad. But what can I say, tastes.

Yeah, tastes, since I have no idea what you talk about.Gameplay being "all around bad" is a huge WTF to me.

Combat is a huge clusterfuck, the weight system is unbalanced as hell (crafting becomes a pain in the ass very quickly considering the low weight limit), potion-making is butchered compared to The Witcher 1 and the talent tree is poor enough that I never found any reason to reflect on what talents I should grab. Oh, and QTE.

 

[brfritos]

However, I agree with Lexx. New Vegas comes the closest to what RPGs once have been and it even made me play more than I want even though I can't stand 3d aRPG. The Witcher is nice too, but the RPG aspects are almost nill.

You people really need to play NV with a mod called Arwen Realism Tweaks.
It shows a lot how Bethesda/Obsidian were lazy with the mechanics.

Also the mod is the only one that resambles more the first F1/F2, where the character attributes have more weigh in the build.
The curious thing about it, this isn't the modder goals, she wants only to make FNV a better RPG.
Like is stated on her page, FNV is supposed to be a RPG not a FPS.

BTW, you'll need to learn how to play the game again.

 

[Surf Solar]

However, I agree with Lexx. New Vegas comes the closest to what RPGs once have been and it even made me play more than I want even though I can't stand 3d aRPG. The Witcher is nice too, but the RPG aspects are almost nill.

You people really need to play NV with a mod called Arwen Realism Tweaks.
It shows a lot how Bethesda/Obsidian were lazy with the mechanics.

Also the mod is the only one that resambles more the first F1/F2, where the character attributes have more weigh in the build.
The curious thing about it, this isn't the modder goals, she wants only to make FNV a better RPG.
Like is stated on her page, FNV is supposed to be a RPG not a FPS.

BTW, you'll need to learn how to play the game again.

Does it remove the shootan' elements and introduces a grid or hex based turn based combat?

Anyway, thanks, I'll check the mod out.

@WUE: I'm playing Witcher 2 right now, it's an ok game but I agree with you. I am constantly overloaded with items, combat basically consists of spamming Quen over and over again or rolling around like an idiot. Still, it's not a bad game, loving the art direction and the more down to earth fantasy.

 

[aenemic]

You people really need to play NV with a mod called Arwen Realism Tweaks.
It shows a lot how Bethesda/Obsidian were lazy with the mechanics.

yeah, being better at repairs and able to carry more weight just because you're male is so realistic. really.

 

[Lexx]

Then throw away crap you don't need. I never had a problem with my carry weight in Witcher 2. If I couldn't sell something, I just threw away what was heavy and what I will not need anyway. I am not a hamster, I don't need 1000 wood and stuff in my inventory.

@the NV mod above: From reading the changelog, it doesn't seem to make the game closer to Fo1/2. Looks like just another "realism" tweak stuff (I don't get why everyone wants "realism" anyway).

 

[Hassknecht]

You people really need to play NV with a mod called Arwen Realism Tweaks.
It shows a lot how Bethesda/Obsidian were lazy with the mechanics.

yeah, being better at repairs and able to carry more weight just because you're male is so realistic. really.

Well, the weight thing would be realistic, but we have the strength attribute for that.
Of course, a woman at her top physical strength is still probably weaker than a man at his top, so maybe a strength of 10 for a man should really be different than 10 strength for a woman...
But that's just nitpicking the mechanics, I guess.
The repair thing is stupid.

 

[WorstUsernameEver]

You people really need to play NV with a mod called Arwen Realism Tweaks.
It shows a lot how Bethesda/Obsidian were lazy with the mechanics.

Also the mod is the only one that resambles more the first F1/F2, where the character attributes have more weigh in the build.
The curious thing about it, this isn't the modder goals, she wants only to make FNV a better RPG.
Like is stated on her page, FNV is supposed to be a RPG not a FPS.

BTW, you'll need to learn how to play the game again.

I like Arwen's ideas, but her implementation often felt very clunky to me, and didn't really mesh well with the action gameplay, which, like it or not, is the core gameplay of New Vegas. Which, by the way, should absolutely fixed in a sequel, be it from Bethesda or Obsidian, clunky shooting is not a feature, and has nothing to do with stat-based gameplay anyway.

As for CD Projekt, a clarification: I immensely respect their work. They're clearly passionate, there's a lot of attention to detail and effort put into the title, and they're supporting it the way a title like this should be supported were this a better, fairer world. But gameplay-wise it's a more intelligent and far clunkier Mass Effect 2.

 

[Paul_cz]

Combat is a huge clusterfuck, the weight system is unbalanced as hell (crafting becomes a pain in the ass very quickly considering the low weight limit), potion-making is butchered compared to The Witcher 1 and the talent tree is poor enough that I never found any reason to reflect on what talents I should grab. Oh, and QTE.

Combat - I finished the game first time on normal, second time on hard, and I have no idea what is clusterfucky about it. I played with x360pad and it was great, the only problem I had was operator fight...that I had to repeat about 15 times before I managed to kill him.If I had one complaint about combat, it would be that harpies were too easy in second chapter.
Plus, patches made many improvements to combat anyway.

Did not have any problem with weight system, every once in a while I simply sold some ore or wood and I had space again.Not to mention they patched in a storage chest, so even that small issue went away.

Potion making I admit is weaker than in the first game. It was more complex there, but I liked the improvement here that it is impossible to drink during combat. That one was a good change.

Talent-tree...not the most complex RPG system ever, but it was satisfying enough to make me happy about levelling up, and difference between mage or swordfight build is there.
QTE is about 1% of the game, it makes cutscenes a bit more interactive, I do not like them, I do not hate them. I just do not care about them.
Of course, if the whole game is made through them, like Heavy Rain...that sucks.

 

[aenemic]

You people really need to play NV with a mod called Arwen Realism Tweaks.
It shows a lot how Bethesda/Obsidian were lazy with the mechanics.

yeah, being better at repairs and able to carry more weight just because you're male is so realistic. really.

Well, the weight thing would be realistic, but we have the strength attribute for that.
Of course, a woman at her top physical strength is still probably weaker than a man at his top, so maybe a strength of 10 for a man should really be different than 10 strength for a woman...
But that's just nitpicking the mechanics, I guess.
The repair thing is stupid.

I don't agree. such limitations should be up to the player to decide. 10 is the maximum strength available, and thus should be equal no matter what gender. it's not like women are physically incapable of being as strong as men. going down that road, you might as well put similar differences on the other attributes, based on general statistics.

@ Lexx: I'm all for a healthy dose of realism in my rpg's, but there is definitely a limit. I enjoy the hardcore mode in NV mostly as a novelty, not because it offers some kind of challenge. but adding "realistic" elements that make the game a drag and doesn't do more than add further limitations in what you can do is rarely a good idea.


on topic: I'm glad New Vegas won, because to me it's frankly the best rpg that's come out in a good while. I have yet to try Drakensang: RoT admittedly, but I definitely will once I'm finished with my current playthrough of NV. horrible game engine aside, bugs aside and below average fps-gameplay aside, this game just offers so much. I'm still finding new areas, new npc's and new quests. and I think it's pretty damn well written overall. I didn't get that far into The Witcher 2 before the clunky controls and horrible inventory system got the best of me. usually a good story can make up for such things, but I just couldn't be bothered with this one. and I really enjoyed the first game, story-wise.

 

[Hassknecht]

I don't agree. such limitations should be up to the player to decide. 10 is the maximum strength available, and thus should be equal no matter what gender. it's not like women are physically incapable of being as strong as men. going down that road, you might as well put similar differences on the other attributes, based on general statistics.

Exactly, that's why I said that it would be nitpicking the mechanics.
The strength attribute is just fine the way it is.
Although, choosing the gender with all its limitations would be a decision of the player.
I don't know if women are really capable of being as strong as men in general. Sure, there are exceptions, but men have a big advantage to begin with.

/edit: To contribute to the topic: New Vegas rightly won. It simply is the best RPG of the last year, at least for me. That being said, I hope the indie community will bring forth a few new 'pure' RPGs.

 

[WorstUsernameEver]

Combat - I finished the game first time on normal, second time on hard, and I have no idea what is clusterfucky about it. I played with x360pad and it was great, the only problem I had was operator fight...that I had to repeat about 15 times before I managed to kill him.If I had one complaint about combat, it would be that harpies were too easy in second chapter.
Plus, patches made many improvements to combat anyway.

Did not have any problem with weight system, every once in a while I simply sold some ore or wood and I had space again.Not to mention they patched in a storage chest, so even that small issue went away.

Potion making I admit is weaker than in the first game. It was more complex there, but I liked the improvement here that it is impossible to drink during combat. That one was a good change.

Talent-tree...not the most complex RPG system ever, but it was satisfying enough to make me happy about levelling up, and difference between mage or swordfight build is there.
QTE is about 1% of the game, it makes cutscenes a bit more interactive, I do not like them, I do not hate them. I just do not care about them.
Of course, if the whole game is made through them, like Heavy Rain...that sucks.

Combat was clunky and unresponsive before the patches, I don't know how it is now, and item storage is a nice addition, I agree, but I never got to try it. Either way, I suspect we'll just have to agree to disagree because I doubt I'll manage to change your opinion, and so far you've done very little to change mine.

 

[aenemic]

QTE is about 1% of the game, it makes cutscenes a bit more interactive, I do not like them, I do not hate them. I just do not care about them.

it wasn't really that simple. it took me several attempts to kill the first boss, not because I didn't know the tactics required or because I failed at the sword-fighting, but because that damn QTE all of a sudden popped up and ruined it for me. QTE has no place in a game like this, where your characters skills should come first and your gaming skills should come second. QTE has nothing to do with the first and little to do with the second. it takes you by surprise and says "fuck you" if you don't react fast enough. then you have to memorize each step of it to be able to complete it.

 

[Paul_cz]

Combat was clunky and unresponsive before the patches, I don't know how it is now, and item storage is a nice addition, I agree, but I never got to try it. Either way, I suspect we'll just have to agree to disagree because I doubt I'll manage to change your opinion, and so far you've done very little to change mine.

Fair enough, we each have our own experience, they differ...it is a shame you did not enjoy the game as much as me, but such is life.
Though you might want to try to give it a second go, maybe the patches solved your issues. Specifically combat responsiveness seems flawless, from what I tried in the arena.

it wasn't really that simple. it took me several attempts to kill the first boss, not because I didn't know the tactics required or because I failed at the sword-fighting, but because that damn QTE all of a sudden popped up and ruined it for me. QTE has no place in a game like this, where your characters skills should come first and your gaming skills should come second. QTE has nothing to do with the first and little to do with the second. it takes you by surprise and says "fuck you" if you don't react fast enough. then you have to memorize each step of it to be able to complete it.

This is not and oldschool turnbased RPG in case you did not notice...player skills are just as important as character skills here. Whether QTE has a place here is up to anyone's opinion, you do not like them, other people do not mind them (I admit I do not know anyone who specifically likes QTEs..).
Still, it is possible to turn them off in the menu, they even give you that option, it is too bad you did not disable them if you cannot manage to go through them easily.

 

[WorstUsernameEver]

Fair enough, we each have our own experience, they differ...it is a shame you did not enjoy the game as much as me, but such is life.
Though you might want to try to give it a second go, maybe the patches solved your issues. Specifically combat responsiveness seems flawless, from what I tried in the arena.

I will, likely, just when I have less work to do, less exams to study for and less games in my backlog.

 

[Surf Solar]

it wasn't really that simple. it took me several attempts to kill the first boss, not because I didn't know the tactics required or because I failed at the sword-fighting, but because that damn QTE all of a sudden popped up and ruined it for me. QTE has no place in a game like this, where your characters skills should come first and your gaming skills should come second. QTE has nothing to do with the first and little to do with the second. it takes you by surprise and says "fuck you" if you don't react fast enough. then you have to memorize each step of it to be able to complete it.

This is not and oldschool turnbased RPG in case you did not notice...player skills are just as important as character skills here. Whether QTE has a place here is up to anyone's opinion, you do not like them, other people do not mind them (I admit I do not know anyone who specifically likes QTEs..).
Still, it is possible to turn them off in the menu, they even give you that option, it is too bad you did not disable them if you cannot manage to go through them easily.

You can only disable "hard qte" in the options, not disable them completely (unlessed they changed something in the newer patches). There are still lots of rageworthy moments where these things pop up.

@ The Playerskill/Characterskill: Some people on the codex tried to beat the game without spending talent points etc at all - perfectly possible besides one occassion where the game scales your damage to the characters level and its impossible to hit a certain enemy. So, what for are there skills, level ups and all that if it doesn't change the gameplay at all, or is required to develop your character further? It doesn't matter if/how you develop your character, only your twitch skill counts. This has little to do with "RPGs" in my book.

 

[PainlessDocM]

You can only disable "hard qte" in the options, not disable them completely (unlessed they changed something in the newer patches). There are still lots of rageworthy moments where these things pop up.

You are right there is no way to disable them completely.

I'm playing the W2 with the latest patch right now and I still have to do these shitty QTE from time to time.

Witcher 2 hampered by QTE and console ready UI.

FNV hampered by F3's gamebryo.

 

[Lexx]

There are still lots of rageworthy moments where these things pop up.

No. If you disable QTEs, you will only have less than a hand full of those still in the whole game and they all are hardly what I would call "rageworthy moments."

 

[Surf Solar]

There are still lots of rageworthy moments where these things pop up.

No.

It's nice how you seem to know how I am playing. I disabled them right at the start before I even began the game and still have lots of these fuckers popping up all the time.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Okay it goes without saying, no more crappy engines or quick time events in RPGs in the future please.

(QTE in the Witcher, what the hell was CD projekt thinking?)

Also, if you are going to use a FPS like set up, make at least the enemies that would be intelligent use cover and try to surround the player or flush him/her out.