Fallout 2 mod Fallout: Sonora

Discussion in 'Fallout General Modding' started by The_Proletarian, Oct 3, 2019.

  1. Baron of Arizona

    Baron of Arizona First time out of the vault

    54
    Jul 6, 2022
    He should appear when you enter any big location at lvl 7 (For example, I got him at the dam and read how people met him at the Villa on russian forum). Maybe you made a mistake when installing DLC?
    And this robot doesn't lead you to Dayglow, he tells you to go to Inferno where NPC will lead you there. Don't worry about losing your stuff. Close to this NPC there is a chest where you could put all your stuff.
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 2
  2. gustarballs1983

    gustarballs1983 Vault Senior Citizen
    Modder

    Oct 28, 2009
    i just put all the DLC content into game's root folder, and started the game from DLC's exe was it installed incorectly?

    I reached Phoniex as i was lvl 7 but no robot there.

    anyways something is messed up when at level 12 i took gain perk it gave +2 to str but if i decided to take something else SPECIAL did not raise

    I've downloaded most recent Foxx's build, which is packed together with dlc. it turns out i had the dlc main dat file in a wrong folder.

    Started a playthrough on 02.09 Foxx build 1.11+DLC. it's better from what i have since Foxx adapted map edges for the dlc maps to work with Hi Res mod. the one from Nevada Band works natively in the pre great flood era's 640x480, Foxx fixed the maps up so they can handle hires.
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2023
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 1
  3. Violator

    Violator It Wandered In From the Wastes

    184
    Jul 16, 2009
    Sonora doesn't come with different player character styles? E.g no punk girl, long hair dude etc?
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 1
  4. Alphons

    Alphons National Beholder

    Aug 9, 2017
    My review of Sonora with Dayglow expansion without any spoilers. I'll be making a separate post with spoiler tag.
    It's very hard not to compare it to Nevada, so expect a few comparisons.

    I've had a really great time with the game.

    In terms of length I think it hit a sweet spot- it's longer than both Fallout 1 and Resurrection, but not as long as Nevada or Fallout 2.

    SPECIAL and skills
    Not many changes to SPECIAL stats, but playing with very low Strength made my PC a massive gimp. There's a lot of stuff to haul around even if you completely avoid fighting and don't carry a weapon and certain quest in Dayglow required opening crates with a crowbar, which my PC was too weak to do without Buffout.

    Sonora introduces some small changes in the traits- Bloody Mess also allows you to understand Spanish and Night Person is completely replaced by new trait Villa traditions which lowers XP you gain by 20%, but gives you Educated and scouts entire world map (revealing all locations).

    Nevada perks that show you requirements to pass a skill check and allow to play after the ending credits return. Animal Friend is present, but instead of turning all critters friendly, it allows you to feed them to make them passive (LVL 1) or temporary followers(LVL2) (they don't follow you outside their current location).
    There might be some new perks that require physical stats that I have not seen.

    Nevada impressed me with how it utilized the entire classic skill set. Sonora advanced it in some ways, in others I feel it took a step back.
    Traps are no longer items you can set down with the skill, so once again it's only good for disarming them.
    Repair was made more available to different builds, as you can use Junk or Electronic parts to lower the skill check by around 20% per item, but it also means you don't have to invest a lot of SPs into it (there's also an escort quest that gives you a temporary companion that boosts Repair by 20%).
    Science checks cap at around 100%, but they open a lot of options with computers. Also it can be used to hack hostile robots, which makes them help you in combat (if your Sneak is high enough to reach them undetected).
    There's a lot of gambling in both Sonora and Dayglow. Definitely worth investment if you have spare SPs.
    Barter allows you to unlock better stock and even discounts through dialogue.
    Speech is extremely powerful, maybe a bit too much.
    Sneak was boosted. During certain quests you can avoid fights by scaring enemy off using items in the enviroment. There're several rescue quests, where you can save the NPC with Sneak. You also receive extra XP on occasion if you were never spotted.
    Steal was heavily nerfed. Without enough skill you can't even look into the NPC's inventory to attempt theft.
    Doctor has potentially a lot of uses, but alternatively you can just use medicine to cure NPCs. At the end I had aroind 50 stimpacks, so I could've definitely avoided investing in it (though it feels nicer to play as a skilled doctor instead of some random with a needle).
    Guns were completely overhauled. Small Guns now only apply to 1- handed weapons (pistols, revolvers and SMGs) while Big Guns apply to all 2-handed weapons (grenade launcher, rifles, ARs, shotguns).

    Main story
    The story is much simpler and easier to follow than Nevada's. There's also more branching options as instead of following a trail of crumbs, you instead receive certain goal you can accomplish with diplomacy, stealth or violence. Near the end you have to choose between 2 factions or indenpendence, but near the end of game you have a choice only between quietly killing everyone and loudly killing everyone. It's a bit dissapointing, as even if diplomacy is impossible you could at least have the option similar to one Resurrection gave you.

    Side quests
    A lot of classic stuff like collecting debts, looking for missing people, bounty hunting, repairing a water pump, but also some more unique ones. Majority of them have different options dependent on your skills, but there's a couple where you just need to kill someone/something (I think 5 or 6). Some quests are straightforward, others have a moral/ faction choice you have to make.

    You can do tasks for both factions until you join the other or make them hostile.

    Dialogue/ world interaction
    Going through dialogue, asking questions about the world and using options unlocked by Charisma and Intelligence awards you with XP.

    You can give food to people or have a beer with them to get extra dialogue or just Karma, Reputation and XP.

    There're some one-time encounters in towns that can spawn, where you can intervene in different ways like attempted rape, murder or robbery.

    Mexican as a separate language is an interesting idea, but it is used in a hostile location where you can read a terminal for extra information and 2-3 conversations. So unless you love Bloody Mess, it's not really worth taking the trait that allows you to understand it.

    Art
    A lot of really high quality new assets- from new items, weapons, armour, entirely new tile sets, pre-war advertisements, posters, completely new creature, additional human with new sprites, new ghouls and talking heads.

    Music
    Awesome, sets the tone for the game since the moment you start. Some classic Fallout tracks are used in a few places, but it's mostly new music made for Sonora.

    Companions
    I'd say they're on Fallout 2 level, so unfortunately below Resurrection and New Vegas in terms of interactions.

    They have a quest before you recruit them, but only minor interactions later on plus comments about locations you visit.

    I found 3 of them during the game plus several temporary ones. The vehicle you unlock allows you to travel only with 1, but you can take them all on foot if your Charisma allows it.
    There's 1 extra companion after you finish the game and 1 companion in Dayglow.

    Worldbuilding
    It is pretty enjoyable. As the PC is just a peasant venturing outside of his home for the first time it doesn't feel awkward to ask questions.

    Sonora was in a pretty dormant state until certain major thing happened, so most dialogues do not reference anything happening before that moment.

    The main goals and means of factions are understandable, but individual member have differing opinions on them.

    Commerce between towns exists and you can follow the chain of supplies. Certain characters are interested in establishing new trade routes which you can help with. Doing so expands the inventory of merchants and amount of caps they have. It also works the other way, as you can sabotage a resource one town has and the merchants will offer smaller selection of items and have less caps.

    Pre-war companies from New Vegas like Petro Chico and Sunset Sarsaparilla appear. There's not a lot of pre-war stuff to find, but there're some pretty interesting holodiscs and computers to read.

    West Coast factions appear, but they're given a reason to be in Sonora. You can also meet 2 characters from Fallout 1 and a single one from NV. Dayglow additionally adds an origin for a certain faction that did not have it before.

    Ending slides feel more extensive than in Nevada and they have impact on the world after the credits if you have the perk that allows you to continue your playthrough.

    Dayglow
    The expansion starts really awkwardly, as you get a message about it pretty early in the game, but then get pointed to one of the most dangerous locations in the entire game to actually start it.

    It's pretty massive- with around 20 locations and two dozen quests.

    I went there after finishing the base game, did not have trouble with any checks.

    At the end there's some pretty powerful equipment that could probably break the balance if you went there straight after getting the message. At the same time there's a lot of radiation and some powerful enemies that would probably annihilate weak character.
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 4
  5. gustarballs1983

    gustarballs1983 Vault Senior Citizen
    Modder

    Oct 28, 2009
    As for Companions there are 4 permanent companions or 5 if you're stubborn and glitch the game, plus an additional one if you have the perk to play past the ending.
    Although the game has a hard cap of CHA/2 so i don't think you can enlist more than 5 ( including the one past the endgame). I've tried using "unlimited party" option from fo2tweaks but it doesn't seem to work, even after inputing all the Sonora npc PIDs.

    I assume the one you speak of that gives 20% boost to repair while in party, can be a permanent companion, if you decide to take the quest to fetch him, go to him arrange everything with his father, go blow the fetching faction hq, and go enlist that npc. He can't be told to leave though, and if disbanding others, there's going to be one that can't be re-recruited, because he always need to be recruited first.

    Do You have a savegame from just before entering Dayglow?
    I'd like to know if InvSizeMode=4, and InvSizeLimit= <over 9000> set in sfall, can somehow surpass the initial Dayglow weight entry limit of 20lbs and the exit limit of 100lbs

    InvSizeMode=4 would cause the game to count player encumbrance only by items that player char wears in armor and both hand slots, all the rest of inventory would count as 0lbs. I'm still far from reaching the Dayglow, so I won't find out any time soon by myself, and I'm itching to know, if i could just hoard all the good stuff from the Dayglow.
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 2
  6. Alphons

    Alphons National Beholder

    Aug 9, 2017
    Who are the additional ones?
    I got
    Paladin Berkley from Inferno, spy from Hermosillo and Arthur from the Vault.
    Plus grandpa Felix from the crypt after the credits.

    I do have, I'll check if that works.
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 1
  7. gustarballs1983

    gustarballs1983 Vault Senior Citizen
    Modder

    Oct 28, 2009
    Besides that, there's Diana, a follower of Apocalypse from Inferno, after you do her quest to set her free (and get the PA as well) she asks you to escort her to Casa Nueva, You can simply avoid letting her go when at Casa Nueva, you only miss a small boost to Doctor skill if i remember right.

    And there's Eugene, a small boy mechanic, that Rangers tell you to fetch. He normally is escorted to Rangers Dam and stays there, however instead of recruiting him from the get go to escort to rangrs, one can arragne the escort with boy's father, go blow up the dam for BoS, and later when other teammates are recruited thanks to drowning in pre war whiskey, you can go to Garage City and recruit Eugene. As for Felix Tejada, I have no idea, i played earlier versions of the game, where there was only "Senior Asistant", Tejada's personal robot, which was found in Founder's Crypt in Villa. a location revealed by Granny Adonisa after completing the game, yes the robot was the companion back then, Tejada's Sarcophagus had nice loot in it including Tejada's Machinegun, a decent bust weapon

    Oh yeah one thing though Eugene is not present in Party.txt which means he's rather a glitch than a meant to be companion, after giving him a decent armor to wear, his resistanes drop to 0/0% when armor is worn, after you change maps, He's got child animation sprite, and is only proficient in throwing, so only grenades, firebombs, and flares. although if you beef up pyromaniac perk via Perks.ini he can fare nice ( lit flares do fire damage in Sonora) although you need to have combat control Mode=2 for this, as he wil not lit the flares all by himself, anyways to have him protected one has to add him to party.txt and that causes current save incompatibility, so meh
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2023
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 3
  8. Violator

    Violator It Wandered In From the Wastes

    184
    Jul 16, 2009
    Thanks for a great review! @Alphons

    Would you say that changes Sonora introduced to some skills and how you can handle quests in several different ways made different builds actually viable? As in, you can't get everything out of the game in one go, since it tests you heavily both on the stat and skill side? So a DIPLO or a STEALTH char will have a different experience and replay value is thus increased?

    Also, is there a way to raise primary stats in Sonora?
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 2
  9. Alphons

    Alphons National Beholder

    Aug 9, 2017
    I've played a very gimped character with Good Natured and Skilled traits, 9 INT (and pretty quickly raised to 10) with tags in Speech, Sneak and Doctor, picking as much Educated perks as I could, so it might have warped my experience.
    I think I was able to pass 95% of quests without killing anything (actually got a karma title for reaching LVL 12 without killing a single human).

    Based on that playthrough I don't think a lot would change between diplomat and sneaking playthroughs, as many options overlap and result in peaceful resolution.

    However it looked like there'd be a lot of stuff changing depending on the faction you support (or going indenpendent, as your Villa has a pretty extreme plan to secure their safety without any alliance).
    Both factions have support from different settlements and certain side quests can shift these allegiances- so the things would change depending on which side you're working with.

    Yes, both Sonora and Dayglow.
    I found sunglasses similar to the ones Mason from FO2 has (+1 Charisma when equipped in weapon slot), a permament Luck bonus from unmarked quest, option to install an implant if you befriend one of smaller factions (I think you can get only 1) and a coupon for any SPECIAL point for winning arcade games (found 1 in special encounter and 1 in Dayglow).
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 2
  10. Violator

    Violator It Wandered In From the Wastes

    184
    Jul 16, 2009
    >he took the Skilled pill
    My man :monocle: I fell in love with the trait since Nevada. I think it's crucial to both mods, especially if you're looking to squeeze out from the game as much content as possible in one go, you just float the SP and apply them when needed. I only wish they kept the +10% to all skills from F1 AND +5 SP per level from F2 :lol:

    In my current run I went with Skilled and Villa Traditions, I think it's a better choice than Good Natured, because by lvl.10 you get the same +20 SP as you would with GN, except that you can choose where to distribute those points, instead of them being pre set. Awareness is always nice to have and the 20% exp penalty doesn't hit at all that hard imo (was lvl. 4 when leaving the Villa for the first time, just reached Garage City), and ironically those two bonus perks counteract the Skilled drawback in a way.

    Also, I thought the Steal rework would prevent you from raking in some more loot/exp "for free" to boost your early/mid game but I was wrong. It's even crazier now imo, because you have to actually raise the skill for it to work, which means less save scumming and greater exp reward. And if you're a Skilledchad, you're drowning in skill points anyway so it's not much of an issue PLUS in my case the Villa Trad exp pen doesn't even hurt here, since for some reason it's not applied to exp gained when stealing - I can casually farm 100 exp. per steal attempt by stealing/planting a few weightless items ad infinitum and probably even more if I raise the skill higher, it's disgusting.

    Charsheet:


    Loving the Villa so far, it's such a strange meld between Arroyo from F2 and Shady Sands from F1, I think they've executed the vibe perfectly and there's so much to do. New assets aside, I only wish they've populated the maps a bit more with scenery, Mutants Rising spoiled the fuck out of me with their pretty maps.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2023
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 2
  11. gustarballs1983

    gustarballs1983 Vault Senior Citizen
    Modder

    Oct 28, 2009
    @Alphons

    So how it's going, about checking that InvSizeMode=4 and Dayglow transfers for me?
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 1
  12. Violator

    Violator It Wandered In From the Wastes

    184
    Jul 16, 2009
    Is it possible to use Sonora Express to move your stuff between towns? The Sending/Receiving parcel boxes made me think it was, but I seemingly can't get an option in the dialogue to initiate a send :confused:
     
  13. gustarballs1983

    gustarballs1983 Vault Senior Citizen
    Modder

    Oct 28, 2009
    I've seen a guy in a Russian playthrough do exactly the oposite.. he threw a bunch of stuff into sonora express crates in Phoniex, went to Two-Sun and spoke with sonora express guy there to claim his stuff after a fee..
    He had to aproch the sonora express guy few times before it worked, or i misremembered something and it does not work at all (can't remember), anyways for inventory pains i use:
    InvSizeMode=4
    InvSizeLimit=2000000000

    in correct section of sfall, and all inventory managment is a breeze ( this works for followers too :D )
     
  14. Violator

    Violator It Wandered In From the Wastes

    184
    Jul 16, 2009
    But that's cheating :(

    Btw, I'm getting this error when some NPCs initiate combat after a failed Steal attempt:



    Does anyone have an idea what in SFall might be causing it and how to fix it?
     
  15. gustarballs1983

    gustarballs1983 Vault Senior Citizen
    Modder

    Oct 28, 2009
    well You can always get sfall's modder's pack and get the stealcheat.int that way you won't fail stealing. If you're bothered for getting too much xp, just set your steal at 300% You'll get 0xp for stealing.
     
  16. Violator

    Violator It Wandered In From the Wastes

    184
    Jul 16, 2009
    Kinda disappointed a bit with how the "guards" and factions in Sonora just let you rummage around with no actual consequences or repercussions. Not sure if it has anything to do with me stealing/hacking everything in sight, before going to dialogue but I doubt that is it. Sacred Fire guys literally don't care if you're running around their inner base/sanctum with a posse of armed mercs. It spoils the atmosphere a bit and makes the whole mod feel somewhat unpolished.
     
  17. gustarballs1983

    gustarballs1983 Vault Senior Citizen
    Modder

    Oct 28, 2009
    Slavers don't just let you take their stuff without sufficient sneak skill, and stealing from people has various amount of steal skill threshold you need to have in order to get your stuff, as for the fire worshippers try to walts around the vault and the church without worshipper robes and you'll see hostility, they just let their own take stuff not just everyone. you can't even mess with scientists computer if you don't sneak.. i'd say the main sin of this game is too early acess to stealthboy, that just makes all sneak checks a breeze, either this or You play an *enhanced* character as well :p... well there's also the possibility you took the thief route and forgo all the other skills, and gimped your game's experience this way..

    The game is not perfect.. but it's OK in my book.. volounteer work, absolutely free, decent completely new story, excelent new maps, brilliant quests, and new mechanics to spice it up.. what more do you want.. It's all for free for fucks sake.. So You can't argue with your money's worth, now do You?
    Quit complaining and be glad you got something new.. it's still far better than nothing.. isn't it?
     
  18. Violator

    Violator It Wandered In From the Wastes

    184
    Jul 16, 2009
    It's ludicrously easy to do it though, I managed to clean out every container with ~30%≤ Sneak

    For the life of me I thought I figured it out, but now I'm not sure how this rework actually works. The inability to view the NPC inventory due to insufficient Steal skill level is cool, but it's like the game no longer checks your % for the purpose of actually stealing stuff? I have like 115% invested and still fail on the first attempt most of the time which is???? I think there was a "sweet spot" when I had somewhere around 60-70% Steal, and was able to casually grab/plant 6-7 items in one go, but after going higher it's as if the skill was "reset" and it feels as if I effectively again have >10% lol. Weird.

    Not quite right. I ran around their cathedral and Phoenix vault in metal armor and literally no one batted an eye at me. You can literally bypass any guards with dialogue and sufficiently high Speech...which is ok, if the dialogue explanation made sense. But 99.99% of the time it goes something like:

    >HEY MOTHERFUCKER! The fuck are you doing here, who let you in?
    >Oh, hi guys, sorry I must've took a wrong turn. I'm just looking around, heh... [Speech 90 or whatever]
    >Ahhh, makes perfect sense, feel free to zoom around, we're sure you'll find your way out eventually
    >Thanks fam ))))
    >Run along now chap
    :jiggy:

    I'd prefer it if they just escorted you out or turned outright hostile if you lacked the robes/they notice you, and you had to make a diversion of some sort for them to go away so you could sneak through or something.

    Also, what the fuck was that with the Resistance dudes having totally different characters depending on the floor/level of the cathedral/vault you were on lol? They were changing the whole time. And again, no monks were reacting to them, apart from the guards in Aaron's room and the two priest in the leftmost room of the Overseer level in the Vault. Maybe I did something in the wrong order, or stole/hacked too many things, since after completing the quest, Marcos also disappeared for me and was nowhere to be found although the resistance guys at the base were thanking me for helping them win. But, it is what it is, eh.

    never had to use it imo

    Nope, I don't endorse cheating :p I just went all in on skill points with IN9 Skilled and Villa Traditions plus using the coupon to raise IN to 10 once I got the Legend City random encounter. Also bartering everything I loot/steal for manuals from the book bitch in Phoenix, for even more skill points. I wanted to squeeze out as much content as possible from the game in one go and it's working pretty good so far (except that I gimped myself in combat by dumping EN on an Unarmed build X_X). Current char sheet:


    The only reason I'm "arguing" is precisely because the mod is so good...and it could have been outstanding, with just a bit more polishing (same as Nevada tbh). I'm loving it so far, the main story, the mechanics, the worldbuilding, the side quests, everything really and it just pains me a bit when I run into some things that feel either broken, unfinished or even abandoned. It's like "criticizing" something not because you want to drag it through the mud, but because you want it to shine even brighter than it's already shining. The potential is there without a doubt, definitely, and I would love to throw money at BlackDesigner and his team if they were to accept it. I hope he doesn't decide to just hang his hat after Dayglow and stops doing Fallout altogether, I'm forever greatful for both Nevada and Sonora, flawed gems that they are :salute::salute::salute:

     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2023
  19. gustarballs1983

    gustarballs1983 Vault Senior Citizen
    Modder

    Oct 28, 2009
    Hey @Violator
    is the Sonora translation 1.2.1 coupled with the DLC, I can't seem to stumble upon the friggin robot on clvl 7. I hit level 7 while in Flagpool underground after convincing that Ranger to leave, and after map switches the robot did not appear. Went to main town map and nothing still no robot. are You sure, the translation comes with DLC?
     
  20. Violator

    Violator It Wandered In From the Wastes

    184
    Jul 16, 2009
    100%. I got the robo in Flagstaff right after hitting lvl. 7. Try passing time maybe? Not sure how the bot triggers exactly, if there's some other req maybe.

    The Dayglow_DLC.dat is in the mods folder, so make sure you get all three files from the dropbox:
    • master.dat
    • sfall.dat
    • mods folder