Favorite books / What are you reading?

Escape from Camp 14 -Blaine Harden

About the only (known) escapee from a North Korean prison camp. Some appalling stuff going on in North Korea. Their fog of war machine is so good though, almost impenetrable.
 
I actually finished up on The Road just this weekend, after seeing it mentioned so much in the forum. I must say, it says so much using just the right amount of words, and I think the detachment you get from the lack of speech marks really helps. Very good book.
 
I've been on a Daniel M. Pinkwater kick. Alan Mendelsohn, the Boy From Mars is really a good book - probably the most influential book of my childhood. I've now started in on The Snarkout Boys and the Avacado of Death, which is promising so far.
 
I finished Neuromancer... It had some rather confusing language, specifically for an ESL person like myself. Had to recap the plot at a certain point on Wikipedia - I had very little understanding of what was going on. Other than that, it's a pretty interesting setting, but has an average plot and characters. Reminds me of Lukyanenko, but at least he has more action and less pointless descriptions.

I'm thinking of starting Starship Troopers - which apparently is a very, very good book, a top 100 on Modern Library. I'm hoping for a little change - more simplistic English but a stronger message.

Also I'm reading a little bit of Mark Rippetoe's Starting Strength. Did a little stretching that the book recommends - he's right on spot. Well worth the money indeed.
 
I've always been interested in seeing how Starship Troopers reads after watching the movie. Obviously, the movie was a satire upon fascism, but I've heard the book is starkly pro-fascism. Is that right?
 
Joelzania said:
I've always been interested in seeing how Starship Troopers reads after watching the movie. Obviously, the movie was a satire upon fascism, but I've heard the book is starkly pro-fascism. Is that right?
Click to expand...

I am also curious of this, as I loved the movie and the cynicism portraied. It seems like the author simply set his story in a fascist society. Their ruthless attitude towards the insectoids was part of what fascinated me, the fact that the protagonists turned into vicious conquerors - from the bugs point of view. That doesn't make it an endorsement of fascism, but it actually seems that is what the discussion revolves around :I
I was trying to check it up a bit on wiki, which was mentioning defenders of the novel pointing out "noticeably jewish names" included, as a proof that the intention isn't fascist, a point I find totally irrelevant... I'm not a heavy book worm, but that's a book I've wanted to read.
 
Little Robot said:
Oh man I remember those books
Click to expand...
Yeah, Pinkwater, quite the under-appreciated author. Looking on Amazon I was amazed by how many books he's written. People are asking hundreds of dollars for the ones that are out of print. Alan Mendelsohn holds up well over time, BTW. I really enjoyed reading it again all these years later.

Sub-Human said:
I finished Neuromancer... It had some rather confusing language, specifically for an ESL person like myself.
Click to expand...
I can imagine! If you want any specific passages clarified, feel free to ask.

...Starship Troopers...
Click to expand...
I haven't read it, but it's Heinlein and therefore inherently awesome, regardless of the movie.
 
Joelzania said:
I've always been interested in seeing how Starship Troopers reads after watching the movie. Obviously, the movie was a satire upon fascism, but I've heard the book is starkly pro-fascism. Is that right?
Click to expand...

Not really.

I can't say for sure, since it's been some time since I've read it, and some of the details are probably lost due to the poor translation, but I don't think you could call the book pro-fascist. Yes, the book is swarming with fascist and militaristic ideas and such, but it does not really go as far as to be marked as supportive of fascism or anything.
I remember there are plenty of underlying ideas and little details which can go unnoticed on the first reading.

But, in reality, you should go get the book. You won't regret it.

The film is actually pretty dumb. It is fun until you read the book, then you realize it's crap.

But, again, forming own opinion is best.
Read the book. It's a must.
 
THE CITY & THE CITY by China Mieville is my current read. Hasn't captured me like KRACKEN did, but it's still brilliant.
 
Started reading Might is right by Ragnar Redbeard + For My Legionaries by Corneliu Codreanu but i decided to rearange my entire appartment so i haven't fixed the lights just yet so it will have to wait another week or 2 before i continue this epic journey ;)
 
Atomkilla said:
but I don't think you could call the book pro-fascist. Yes, the book is swarming with fascist and militaristic ideas and such, but it does not really go as far as to be marked as supportive of fascism or anything.
Click to expand...

It actually does. In the book, it's outright stated that our current system (i.e. liberal) will fall to anarchy. The 'History and Moral Philosophy' teachers keep pounding on the topic of how flawed it was; and then they say that their militaristic society will never have a single revolution.

Get this; in Starship Troopers, only military men who have finished their service without being discharged are given the right to vote. It's stated throughout the book that only through voluntary service - which is made as hard as possible to pass through - can a man shape himself to know to vote right.

So if the book states that our society is flawed and destined to fail, and that a militaristic one is not - I would call this book as pro-fascistic.
 
Militarism =! Fascism.
Heinlein did have a knack for rather conservative values, though, and he often portrayed his personal views in his books (also very evident in Beyond This Horizon).

/edit:
I'm currently reading the Mars Trilogy by Kim Stanley Robinson. Those books are amazing. Best science fiction I've ever read. After I finish Blue Mars I'll read '2312', also by Robinson, and he'll quite possibly solidify my intense boner for his work with that book.
Also, read the Zones Of Thought Trilogy by Vernor Vinge. Excellent books. Vinge zlatans writing about interesting alien lifeforms.
 
Sub-Human said:
Atomkilla said:
but I don't think you could call the book pro-fascist. Yes, the book is swarming with fascist and militaristic ideas and such, but it does not really go as far as to be marked as supportive of fascism or anything.
Click to expand...

It actually does. In the book, it's outright stated that our current system (i.e. liberal) will fall to anarchy. The 'History and Moral Philosophy' teachers keep pounding on the topic of how flawed it was; and then they say that their militaristic society will never have a single revolution.

Get this; in Starship Troopers, only military men who have finished their service without being discharged are given the right to vote. It's stated throughout the book that only through voluntary service - which is made as hard as possible to pass through - can a man shape himself to know to vote right.

So if the book states that our society is flawed and destined to fail, and that a militaristic one is not - I would call this book as pro-fascistic.
Click to expand...

[spoiler:ccb872e268]I dunno, you could be right.

Yes, he criticizes the democratic society in many ways (IIRC, spot-on), and offers his solution for it, but I don't think even Heinlein would take the system he proposes as a realistic long-term solution for anything.

So yeah, book is ridden with fascist ideas and supports it, but, like I said, I don't think anyone should go so far to take it for real as a whole. I guess you can call it pro-fascist. But I can't be sure just as I can't be sure if Heinlein would take it as such.[/spoiler:ccb872e268]

I really need to read it again to lead any proper discussion, though, so I will stop here.
However, if you guys carry on, I suggest you use
, plenty of folks haven't read it yet.
 
Atomkilla said:
[spoiler:37bd1536e8]I dunno, you could be right.

Yes, he criticizes the democratic society in many ways (IIRC, spot-on), and offers his solution for it, but I don't think even Heinlein would take the system he proposes as a realistic long-term solution for anything.

So yeah, book is ridden with fascist ideas and supports it, but, like I said, I don't think anyone should go so far to take it for real as a whole. I guess you can call it pro-fascist. But I can't be sure just as I can't be sure if Heinlein would take it as such.[/spoiler:37bd1536e8]
Click to expand...

[spoiler:37bd1536e8]He could or he could not (we cannot see the way he sees, after all). But I thought that the way it is said through a school subject (i.e. designed to teach facts) to children suggests that he wants this kind of society. It is not painted as propaganda, like Orwell's 1984 for example.

One key fact to my argument that I'm missing is the way war is described in the book. Somewhere towards the end, there's a good page or two where it says that war is started through population pressure, and morals is survival instinct without the personal qualities but intended for the others, and that these two our tied together. Could someone clarify what he was trying to say there?[/spoiler:37bd1536e8]

In more general terms, however, the book was very enjoyable. Some good insight on soldier discipline. And some interesting science-fiction! I'd recommend reading it again, perhaps in English to appreciate the language he employs here.
 
[spoiler:59c39342b4] Boot camp in the book is a lot less harsh than the movie. [/spoiler:59c39342b4]

I watched the movie then went straight to the book. Probably should'nt have. I actually really like the movie. Always have.
 
Heinlein's Starship Troopers is a very good book. The movie is something entirely different; for starters, it doesn't even include power armour and depicts a rather callous approach to the life of a soldier.

They're two separate works. The movie wasn't even originally an adaptation of Heinlein's work.

I've recently read The Turner Diaries. A rather frightening look into the way extreme right wingers and racists think, though the way it is delivered makes it often unintentionally hilarious. It stops being so when you reach the 3/4th mark, where mass lynchings of non-white people, pogroms and genocide are depicted as a good thing.

I turned to Isaac Asimov's Foundation series, using it as an antidote. Love his works, though the nuclear-everything technology feels quaint.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top