Favorite CONSOLE Rpgs
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UncannyGarlic
Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
Haven't played Tactics Ogre and FFXII is a steaming pile but otherwise I agree.pkt-zer0 said:
/FFXII rant
FFXII's plot, which wasn't extraordinary to begin with, is bogged down by long gaps between story segments and the two characters thrown in by Square's marketing department who felt that Bosch wasn't appealing enough to Japanese audiences and forced in Vaan and Penelo, characters who are completely unimportant and uninvolved in the main plot. It went from a second person perspective narrative to a third person perspective (or an involved third person to an observer).
Also, unlike his other titles, he doesn't have the gameplay to fall back on. The gameplay is relegated to setting up AI commands for your characters, watching them fight, and navigating dungeons which offer no navigational puzzles or the like. The experience system is garbage too as every character ends up identical (a third to two thirds of the way through, depending on how you play) other than minor stat differences with minimal impact. All in all, it's a poor and minimally interactive interactive movie.
That isn't even mentioning the post game bosses who are not hard because they have interesting patterns, abilities, or AI but because they have so much HP that you must stay awake and engaged enough to ensure that your characters are the right range from them. The gameplay of the game in the end is simply moving your characters and the movement options are as basic as they get.
FFXII rant/
The Tales games that I've played are all fun, they have a good battle system. I honestly need to play more of them but I had a lot of fun with Tales of Phantasia (I got to the final dungeon and quit, I've since lost that game so I plan on replaying it for the PSX) and would list it among the top SNES RPGs. That said, random encounters (certainly as handled by JRPGs) make me cringe.pkt-zer0 said:
Guiltyofbeingtrite
Vault Dweller
I'll add Legend of the Dragoon, and the Xenosaga games (mainly as an interactive movie)
The Vault Dweller
always looking for water.
Given that console RPGs are almost exclusively JRPGs which I rarely play I can't recommend many. However like anything with a large selection there are always exceptions. Other than Final Fantasy Tactics, FF6, and Chrono trigger I can only think of two.
The Persona series. A very unique setting and quite complicated combat system. Exploration is pure first-person dungeon mapping.
The Saga Frontier series (or at least the first two). A very unique way of telling a story which amazing not only have I never seen before outside of this game, but is so well-made I wish others would do it. You have a group of individual heroes whose adventures you play through one at a time. Each character you play after the first has their experience altered due to the series of events created by the first character. Not to mention one of the few JRPGs that allow multiple endings. Also the combat system was really well-made and not cliche or simple at all.
Sincerely,
The Vault Dweller
The Persona series. A very unique setting and quite complicated combat system. Exploration is pure first-person dungeon mapping.
The Saga Frontier series (or at least the first two). A very unique way of telling a story which amazing not only have I never seen before outside of this game, but is so well-made I wish others would do it. You have a group of individual heroes whose adventures you play through one at a time. Each character you play after the first has their experience altered due to the series of events created by the first character. Not to mention one of the few JRPGs that allow multiple endings. Also the combat system was really well-made and not cliche or simple at all.
Sincerely,
The Vault Dweller
Has the quality in console RPG’s diminished with the growth in console capabilities…I think the answer is yes. While the visuals might overwhelm the eyes, and the stories and settings, including the mechanics just aren’t as enjoyable as they use to be.
Metaphysician
First time out of the vault
Not *all* console RPGs have suffered; example, the afforementioned Persona series, and various Tales games. I think its more, Square-Enix are the big boys, and they have suffered some kind of nasty internal creative breakdown. Hence most of their new releases for several years being mediocre. So there are still good JRPGs, you just have to look elsewhere.
UncannyGarlic
Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
I'd actually say that mechanics have improved a fair amount, though not always as much as they should. For example, the last Tales game I played was Tales of the Abyss and I was a bit disappointed that they hadn't done more to build on Tales of Phantasia's battle system, they seemed to have pretty much copy and pasted it. Not that it's a bad system, I just feel like they could have done more to improve it is all.
I'd say that the bigger problem is that some archaic design is still used, like random encounters. There is no reason for any modern JRPG to not have encounters be visible and avoidable (Lufia) and/or completely scripted (Chrono Trigger, which actually does both).
I also think that they have probably become overly commercialized, Final Fantasy in particular seems to have too many character design decisions handed down from upper management/marketing. I'm not sure how bad XIII was but XII added in Vann and Penelo in order to have characters of those stereotypes which apparently are popular with Japanese audiences.
I'd also say that too many JRPGs seem to think that the story they are telling is the most important thing and makes mediocre or bad gameplay irrelevant. I just don't think that the overarching design is as good as it should be. I think technology has played a part in that and I also think that consumers haven't sent a firm message that they aren't willing to put up with it (or the companies aren't listening).
I hate sounding like a broken record but Chrono Trigger is where it is on JRPG lists (at least mine) because it's a concise and deliberate game. The content all seems hand-placed and controlled, making the pace of the game exactly what the developers wanted and making the player's party be at very predictable levels throughout most of the game. The plot is always advancing and advances at a good and consistent pace, without really long pauses between plot events, minor or major. The player is also always rewarded for what they do, usually through plot/world events (such as changing the attitude of the mayor of the town or planting trees which turn into a forest). Really the worst side content in the game is the stuff that doesn't do that, fighting stuff for crafting materials in 10,000BC and the minigames at the millennium fair. It's a fairly short game but I'd rather play a Chrono Trigger than a FFXII that takes at least five (I'd say closer to ten) times as long to do all of the side content.
I just feel like they don't design games with enough attention to detail as they should. I like games to be of a reasonable length but it's about quality before quantity and I feel that too many games sacrifice the former for the latter. If that means that the game is only twenty hours of content instead of one hundred, so be it.
I think part of the thing is is that the SNES games felt like they were moving the genre forward and the later ones like they were really pushing the platform to it's limits. The most recent game that really excited me was the beginning of FFX, up until you land in Besaid.
I need to get around to playing the Persona games, I've heard nothing but good things about them. Actually, Persona 4 sounded like it incorporated visual novel elements into it's story telling.
I'd say that the bigger problem is that some archaic design is still used, like random encounters. There is no reason for any modern JRPG to not have encounters be visible and avoidable (Lufia) and/or completely scripted (Chrono Trigger, which actually does both).
I also think that they have probably become overly commercialized, Final Fantasy in particular seems to have too many character design decisions handed down from upper management/marketing. I'm not sure how bad XIII was but XII added in Vann and Penelo in order to have characters of those stereotypes which apparently are popular with Japanese audiences.
I'd also say that too many JRPGs seem to think that the story they are telling is the most important thing and makes mediocre or bad gameplay irrelevant. I just don't think that the overarching design is as good as it should be. I think technology has played a part in that and I also think that consumers haven't sent a firm message that they aren't willing to put up with it (or the companies aren't listening).
I hate sounding like a broken record but Chrono Trigger is where it is on JRPG lists (at least mine) because it's a concise and deliberate game. The content all seems hand-placed and controlled, making the pace of the game exactly what the developers wanted and making the player's party be at very predictable levels throughout most of the game. The plot is always advancing and advances at a good and consistent pace, without really long pauses between plot events, minor or major. The player is also always rewarded for what they do, usually through plot/world events (such as changing the attitude of the mayor of the town or planting trees which turn into a forest). Really the worst side content in the game is the stuff that doesn't do that, fighting stuff for crafting materials in 10,000BC and the minigames at the millennium fair. It's a fairly short game but I'd rather play a Chrono Trigger than a FFXII that takes at least five (I'd say closer to ten) times as long to do all of the side content.
I just feel like they don't design games with enough attention to detail as they should. I like games to be of a reasonable length but it's about quality before quantity and I feel that too many games sacrifice the former for the latter. If that means that the game is only twenty hours of content instead of one hundred, so be it.
I think part of the thing is is that the SNES games felt like they were moving the genre forward and the later ones like they were really pushing the platform to it's limits. The most recent game that really excited me was the beginning of FFX, up until you land in Besaid.
I need to get around to playing the Persona games, I've heard nothing but good things about them. Actually, Persona 4 sounded like it incorporated visual novel elements into it's story telling.
I’m yet to play Chrono Trigger…but I’m certainly looking forward to it. I have the PS1 version. The visuals are beautiful…I still love the look of SNES games.
UncannyGarlic
Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
The PS1 version does have the disadvantage that the menu screen has a little bit of a load time. That aside, it's a good port and definitely worth your time.
FFIV on Final Fantasy Chronicles (the version I assume you're talking about with Chrono Trigger) is the original Japanese version rather than the easytype version that was originally released in the US for the SNES so it's the best English version of FFIV.
FFIV on Final Fantasy Chronicles (the version I assume you're talking about with Chrono Trigger) is the original Japanese version rather than the easytype version that was originally released in the US for the SNES so it's the best English version of FFIV.
I disagree with most of that, obviously. I think it's a bit silly to single it out for traits present in basically every single JRPG ever, though.UncannyGarlic said:
Encounter-rate modifying items have pretty drastic effects in ToDr. You can basically run through a dungeon without a single random encounter if you have the holy bottle effect activated constantly.pkt-zer0 said:
I wouldn't say that's specific to console RPGs, though..Pixote. said:
Tales of the Abyss's battle system is horribly broken, actually, mostly thanks to Free Run.UncannyGarlic said:
As for improving the battle system, if you look at Team Destiny's efforts, the step-by-step evolution of the concept is quite clearly visible when going from Destiny/Phantasia -> Destiny 2 (PS2) -> Rebirth -> Destiny remake.
Providing a even amount of battles during any given timespan would be one of the reasons to go with random encounters. With the battle system being largely separate from the rest of the game, I don't think it works out particularly horribly.UncannyGarlic said:
My favorite turn-based RPG is the original Wild Arms. It came out around the same time as FF7. I tried FF7, but I thought it was boring as fuck and wondered what the big fucking deal was with everyone going gay over that game.
Never played any of the Chrono games.
My all-time favorite RPG right now is a tie between the Mass Effect series and the Elder Scroll series. Elder Scrolls counts as a console RPG because I still have Morrowind and Oblivion. Daggerfall sucked a fat dick with its complicated dungeon map system.
Never played any of the Chrono games.
My all-time favorite RPG right now is a tie between the Mass Effect series and the Elder Scroll series. Elder Scrolls counts as a console RPG because I still have Morrowind and Oblivion. Daggerfall sucked a fat dick with its complicated dungeon map system.
vasquezkelley
First time out of the vault
I like RPGS games and I have a huge collection of it. But, mostly I play Super Mario RPG, The Legend of Zelda and Disgaea: Hour of Darkness. They are all best RPGS games for me.
Guiltyofbeingtrite
Vault Dweller
I really enjoyed Super Mario RPG and have played it several times. I think I beat it in two days once. It really opened the door for a lot of RPGS for me.
DirkGently
Still Mildly Glowing
Console RPG's?
Let's see:
Knights of the Old Republic 1 and 2 (I don't give a crap about exclusivity, I'm going by what I've played). There aren't any words needed for this.
Mass Effect 1 &2. Again, not much need for words here.
Final Fantasy Tactics is the only Final Fantasy game I can still stand. The Job system in it was very, very dynamic, and really allowed you play who you wanted to play although you got fucked on certain story missions if you were careful with Ramza's job class. And the story, for once, wasn't complete trash. it was just mostly trash, once it started getting involved with zodiac stones and all that bullshit. Before that's golden. After that, not so much.
Fable 1 & 2. Fuck you, fuck PM hate, I love this games. They're quite simply fun, and I'll enjoy them whether you like it or not.
NOw then, there aren't too many new 'pure' RPG games on consoles these days. Or atleast something I'd call a pure RPG and can think of at this point. BUt games with RPG elements are getting pretty common, so I'm going to list some of those.
Crackdown 1&2 were pr. fun with their SKILLS FOR KILLS, AGENT. SKILLS FOR KILLS.
Dead Rising I wouldn't consider to be properly full on of a RPG if only because your skills/stat bumps were completely random.
I'm tired and I'll finish this later.
Let's see:
Knights of the Old Republic 1 and 2 (I don't give a crap about exclusivity, I'm going by what I've played). There aren't any words needed for this.
Mass Effect 1 &2. Again, not much need for words here.
Final Fantasy Tactics is the only Final Fantasy game I can still stand. The Job system in it was very, very dynamic, and really allowed you play who you wanted to play although you got fucked on certain story missions if you were careful with Ramza's job class. And the story, for once, wasn't complete trash. it was just mostly trash, once it started getting involved with zodiac stones and all that bullshit. Before that's golden. After that, not so much.
Fable 1 & 2. Fuck you, fuck PM hate, I love this games. They're quite simply fun, and I'll enjoy them whether you like it or not.
NOw then, there aren't too many new 'pure' RPG games on consoles these days. Or atleast something I'd call a pure RPG and can think of at this point. BUt games with RPG elements are getting pretty common, so I'm going to list some of those.
Crackdown 1&2 were pr. fun with their SKILLS FOR KILLS, AGENT. SKILLS FOR KILLS.
Dead Rising I wouldn't consider to be properly full on of a RPG if only because your skills/stat bumps were completely random.
I'm tired and I'll finish this later.
Shadow of the Wastes
It Wandered In From the Wastes
Final Fantasy 7 (Yes, I know the problems with this game. I don't care, I still like it a lot.) and 10, Mass Effect 2 (didn't like the first one so much), Elder Scrolls 3 and 4 (first played them on Console, prefer them on PC, but my PC is shit), Fallout 3, and (if we're calling them RPGS now) Crackdown 1 and 2.
Guiltyofbeingtrite
Vault Dweller
I'm playing Valkyria Chronicles on PS3 right now and I'd highly recommend it. Solid tactics-rpg that blends real time and turn based strategy quite well. Great AI that doesn't really make stupid mistakes, nice art as well. The dialogue is a bit childish but not in a bad way at all.
DirkGently
Still Mildly Glowing
I'd definitely have to say art is subjective. Oh man that game is so fucking ugly-dumb looking.