DGT said:
What? KotOR2's story is leaps and bounds above KotOR1 in terms of complexity and quality. For one, you're not saving the galaxy for the nth time and that alone makes it great.
Feargus Urquhart on the Fallout license
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What? KotOR2's story is leaps and bounds above KotOR1 in terms of complexity and quality. For one, you're not saving the galaxy for the nth time and that alone makes it great.
DGT
It Wandered In From the Wastes
I have issues with it being so unfinished (Hell, Malachor is like a big plate of disappointment), and I actually quite liked the twist in KOTOR -- not many twists catch me by surprise, especially not if they foreshadow to an extent even near KOTOR, but that one did. The whole game had left questions unanswered to that point -- the main one that comes to mind right now is from Carth, and sums up as, "Why us?"
But yeah, I do like that it's more personal and less about the galaxy in KOTOR2. On the other hand, KOTOR1 become (for me, at least) a very personal quest after the Leviathan and the big reveal. Then again, my character fit into the Dark Lord of the Sith bit quite well. xD
But yeah, I do like that it's more personal and less about the galaxy in KOTOR2. On the other hand, KOTOR1 become (for me, at least) a very personal quest after the Leviathan and the big reveal. Then again, my character fit into the Dark Lord of the Sith bit quite well. xD
I dislike KotOR1 because Malak and his sidekicks are so... one dimensional. It's KotOR2 that puts everything in perspective.
As for being unfinished, grab the Restoration Project leak. It's 99% finished and brings KotOR2 back to its full glory.
As for being unfinished, grab the Restoration Project leak. It's 99% finished and brings KotOR2 back to its full glory.
DGT said:
In KOTOR 2 you play [spoiler:8d8b32de4d] an exiled Jedi who wakes up in a mining facility that has been abandoned except for by 3 characters, Kreia who is actually Darth Traya a master manipulator who betrays people because she was betrayed by the Jedi, who threw her out of the Jedi Order because her teachings questioned that of the Jedi and of the Jedi Code, and she was betrayed by her own Sith Apprentices for her power. Kreia wants the force to die because it does horrible things to the galaxy to reach some kind of galactic balance so she seeks you out. You, the Exile, are a Mandalorian Wars Veteran who killed millions at Malachor V with the Dark Mass Generator, including a large number of your fellow Jedi, feeling all that death made you sever yourself from the force so quickly it left a wound in the force, you traveled for many years until Kreia found you, because she felt through you, she could destroy the force. All your companions are Force Sensitive, and are drawn to you by a unique outside force, you can manipulate them to do things that go against their senses, and eventually you train them as Jedi Knights. From this point, Kreia either appeals to you as a savior to kill the Sith Lords and to gather all the Jedi to a place where she can kill them, or she tells you both groups are a threat to your power and you can kill them both.[/spoiler:8d8b32de4d]
Where as in KOTOR the story is[spoiler:8d8b32de4d] You are an [X] soldier for the Republic, you wake up in a ship and try to rescue Bastila who can save the Republic from the "Oooh" evil Sith. After rescuing her you go to Dantooine and become a Jedi. They tell you you are a special case, for which you are given no direct reason. You find out later in the game that you are in fact Darth Revan, who used to lead the very same Sith you're trying to defeat, you were captured by the Jedi who erased your memory and they tried to turn you against your own followers, who now followed your apprentice Darth Malak(Who is extremely uninteresting and is just in it for "GALACTIC DOMINASHUN"). You discover he's using a factory created by an ancient race of conquerors who created an infinite empire, they were a race fueled by the Dark Side, and they were the only creatures who could use the force, keeping the rest of the Galaxy slaves. Eventually they collapsed into war. You found a map leading to the factory and try to either take it for yourself, or destroy it. It gives you that choice.[/spoiler:8d8b32de4d]
TL;DR KOTOR 2's story >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>KOTOR's story.
obviously Kotor 2 has the better story. But at least in Kotor 1 the story feeld finished. Which is not what I can say about Kotor 2. What ever the reason was to rush the story and game (blame Obsidian or Lucas, what ever you like more). But cant help that the game feelt unfinished. Regardless how well the story actualy was but it hurts the experience a bit for me at least.
Crni Vuk said:
The game was rushed into production so it would make it into stores by Christmas. A lot of the quests were left unfinished and the story wasn't really finalized. Hopefully that doesn't happen with New Vegas, because from what I've seen Obsidian has some bad motherfuckers writing the stories in their games.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6_tbKQ0wS34[/youtube]
KarmaPolice
It Wandered In From the Wastes
I'm no troll. I stand about what I said about the Sims. Please note that I stated that it was memorable for introducing new ideas to the world of gaming - in this case, open-ended neighbourhood sim.
I don't like the way that EA made around 14 addon discs (each costing the same as the orig), and it can be real flat gaming, but I will put it along with WiiSports in getting non-gamers into gaming for the first time. Also note I mentioned the PC version, not the crappy console ones.
About Bioware, you are correct. For that, I humbily ask for forgiveness..
I said crippilingly bugged, not 'so annoying that I throw the disc out of the window' bugged. The 'falling through floor in dungeon, falling for 30 secs and then re-appearing somewhere else in the dungeon' that I have encountered in Morrowind, Oblivion & Fallout 3 is annoying, but not crippiling. The only CoD's I've so far encountered on F3 have been instances where I've been pissing around with mods or trying to hack the main source (so my fault, not theirs).
I don't hate KOTOR. I kinda liked it. I played through it three times (evil man, good man and good girl, just to see if gender effects story). The story wasn't that bad. (Poor Mission! Couldn't I just mind-trick her? She was a good servant!). It just felt too liniear for my liking, and I like random exploring, which is really lacking in KOTOR.
I did like KOTOR 2 more, partly because it dealt more with shades of grey as well as b/w morality (Goto doesn't care who wins the Jedi war, as long as the winner takes over the Republic and makes it strong) but the ending was rather flat (If I, Sith Lord kill all the Jedi BUT save the Republic from collapse, wouldn't I go and take it over, or at least go and re-build the Sith, ready to strike the Republic when I have enough sabre-toting minions? Not just sit in a dead rock?)
Yes, Rogue Squadron was just a flight game. But it did what it said on the tin. That's why I liked it.
Well, back OT. I would guess that they want NV to have a Christmas '10 release, at least for the consoles. So give a mid-Nov stocking of stores, a mid-Sept order to manufactuers, and a month to do a quick beta. So if they don't announce it by July, I suspect it won't see the light until Spring '11.
I don't like the way that EA made around 14 addon discs (each costing the same as the orig), and it can be real flat gaming, but I will put it along with WiiSports in getting non-gamers into gaming for the first time. Also note I mentioned the PC version, not the crappy console ones.
About Bioware, you are correct. For that, I humbily ask for forgiveness..
I said crippilingly bugged, not 'so annoying that I throw the disc out of the window' bugged. The 'falling through floor in dungeon, falling for 30 secs and then re-appearing somewhere else in the dungeon' that I have encountered in Morrowind, Oblivion & Fallout 3 is annoying, but not crippiling. The only CoD's I've so far encountered on F3 have been instances where I've been pissing around with mods or trying to hack the main source (so my fault, not theirs).
I don't hate KOTOR. I kinda liked it. I played through it three times (evil man, good man and good girl, just to see if gender effects story). The story wasn't that bad. (Poor Mission! Couldn't I just mind-trick her? She was a good servant!). It just felt too liniear for my liking, and I like random exploring, which is really lacking in KOTOR.
I did like KOTOR 2 more, partly because it dealt more with shades of grey as well as b/w morality (Goto doesn't care who wins the Jedi war, as long as the winner takes over the Republic and makes it strong) but the ending was rather flat (If I, Sith Lord kill all the Jedi BUT save the Republic from collapse, wouldn't I go and take it over, or at least go and re-build the Sith, ready to strike the Republic when I have enough sabre-toting minions? Not just sit in a dead rock?)
Yes, Rogue Squadron was just a flight game. But it did what it said on the tin. That's why I liked it.
Well, back OT. I would guess that they want NV to have a Christmas '10 release, at least for the consoles. So give a mid-Nov stocking of stores, a mid-Sept order to manufactuers, and a month to do a quick beta. So if they don't announce it by July, I suspect it won't see the light until Spring '11.
DGT
It Wandered In From the Wastes
Okay, I have to agree with you on Malak and Co. -- they are somewhat one-dimensional Sith. I always saw that as rather intentional, though; while Revan was clever, doing what needed to be done and using no more brutality than needed, Malak was more simple and obsessed with the Dark Side. It seems like a recurring message in Star Wars that the Sith are prone to becoming stupidly absorbed in the borderline barbarism that they think means they're badasses. Both KOTOR1&2 are, to me, more the story of Revan and his (or her, if you hate canon; I know I do) legacy than anything else.
KarmaPolice, I was mostly j/k about the troll comment -- games are a rather subjective thing, and the Sims aren't exactly something I expect to hear/see praised on NMA. And yeah, I loved Rogue Squadron -- I actually was trying to find a way to replay it recently, with no luck.
Is the unfinished TG RP really good, Tagaziel? I haven't checked it out, just because I was afraid of rampant bugs and/or unfinished sections. Clearly, the guy left at TG is not remotely worried about finishing/releasing anything. -_-
KarmaPolice, I was mostly j/k about the troll comment -- games are a rather subjective thing, and the Sims aren't exactly something I expect to hear/see praised on NMA. And yeah, I loved Rogue Squadron -- I actually was trying to find a way to replay it recently, with no luck.
Is the unfinished TG RP really good, Tagaziel? I haven't checked it out, just because I was afraid of rampant bugs and/or unfinished sections. Clearly, the guy left at TG is not remotely worried about finishing/releasing anything. -_-
well to be fair one-dimensional characters fit the Star Wars setting.
DGT said:
KOTOR2 put KOTOR1 in perspective, remember.
There are a handful of non-game breaking bugs. The RP is awesome.
DGT
It Wandered In From the Wastes
Yeah, you're right -- I guess it had a little bit of gloss in my memory for being the first. After discussing it and remembering, 2 trumps 1 all around except for being rushed out the door by Lucas.
I'm definitely gonna have to check that RP out, then. Gonna have to reinstall, though, since I've got some other guy's smaller-scale RP. Stoney, I think.
Nice discussing this, even if we did get far offtopic. x_X
Edit: And lol @ one-dimensional characters fitting Star Wars. Rather true, but I love the setting regardless. Lucas is a moron that was touched by a stroke of brilliance at some point.
I'm definitely gonna have to check that RP out, then. Gonna have to reinstall, though, since I've got some other guy's smaller-scale RP. Stoney, I think.
Nice discussing this, even if we did get far offtopic. x_X
Edit: And lol @ one-dimensional characters fitting Star Wars. Rather true, but I love the setting regardless. Lucas is a moron that was touched by a stroke of brilliance at some point.
Guiltyofbeingtrite
Vault Dweller
My main issue with KOTORs was that the Jedi playable characters were much more useful than the non-Jedis, to the point where I felt it wasn't even worth using them.
I have some friends who feel the same way, the moment Jedi characters become available the non Jedi team members can take a hike.
The only thing then they are useful for is non combat skills like hacking or lockpicking in case you haven't build out your character in those departments.
The only thing then they are useful for is non combat skills like hacking or lockpicking in case you haven't build out your character in those departments.