FOnline third test dated

S1ayer55 said:
oh....hmm well what dose the sniper perk do?

I think it upgrades every shot to a critical hit after a luck roll. Fine in a single player game, but in a PVP multiplayer game it means combat lasts all of four seconds, as some poor loser gets shot in the eyes. Neither of them enhance the game and need to be included, really.

I don't even like the 'increased critical chance' perks - combat in later levels is too crit-orientated, I think. I prefer the idea of people just plugging away at each other with unaimed shots, rather than trading eyeshots.

But the 2238 team have already addressed that, by making the target areas with the most damage potential, such as eyes and head, have a higher AP cost. Something which I think will contribute to more interesting and varied combat.
 
So i will make a stealth/Sniper with bunch of agility. Which means ill cap your ass before you even know it. Face it there will be a "pvp build char". Just like in good old ultima online. But thats ok. As long as there is no Sneak/rocket launching/eye crit shooting rusians with 500+ hps running around.

@lex: So gifted perk is out of game? :shock:
 
Asmodai said:
So i will make a stealth/Sniper with bunch of agility. Which means ill cap your ass before you even know it. Face it there will be a "pvp build char". Just like in good old ultima online. But thats ok. As long as there is no Sneak/rocket launching/eye crit shooting rusians with 500+ hps running around.

@lex: So gifted perk is out of game? :shock:
I'm pretty sure Slayer + Sniper are out as they said, not just Gifted. As soon as someone got Slayer/Sniper it would be quite impossible to win a fight against them.
 
Because of the level cap of 21 you can't get Slayer and Sniper anyway. If we would higher the level cap, we would cut out the perks, of course. And yes, gifted is out too because it sucks. I already wrote about it.
 
Asmodai said:
U don't need a perk to be "sniper" , that wos what i ment.

True. Three picks of Bonus Critical Chance + Better Criticals + high PE, AG and LK = Ultimate cold sniper. Thrown in sneak if you want to be unseen. Thing is, you will have to sacrifice some of your stats like ST and EN. You will be a glass cannon. Snipers are usually this, so IMHO its okay. A Sniper could be countered by a Gunslinger character (High AG, PE and EN, small guns and sneak, Fast Shot and Bonus ROF, Magnum Revolver with speedloader = Gunslinger). A low HP sniper with a fast shooter nearby is pretty much dead.

EDIT: Are melee-unarmed characters getting anything new? Having the abilities to disarm a enemy or push him to the ground for a moment would be very interesting.
 
Slaughter Manslaught said:
Are melee-unarmed characters getting anything new? Having the abilities to disarm a enemy or push him to the ground for a moment would be very interesting.
No, not right now. We'll observe such players during the open beta and probably add some bonuses because they seem to be a bit unbalanced comparing to armed players.
 
lisac2k said:
Slaughter Manslaught said:
Are melee-unarmed characters getting anything new? Having the abilities to disarm a enemy or push him to the ground for a moment would be very interesting.
No, not right now. We'll observe such players during the open beta and probably add some bonuses because they seem to be a bit unbalanced comparing to armed players.
Oh please, that would be so great! :D Because I usually go unarmed/melee when I play Fallout games but have been thinking not to online as it might get me killed all the time. :oops:
 
I have tagged unarmed in last beta and guess what. It was a perfect way to level up in hell without having any items, punching random people spawning there x)
Of course this time we don't have Hell, so...
Hm. What about new perks and something for "gifted"? Any plans?
 
Gifted was replaced with night person.

I think most traits could do with being worked on, half of them aren't worth bothering with. The most obvious example being Kamikaze - you don't need sequence when most combat is realtime. I think maybe it could be retooled into 0 AC and an extra action point or two. Something like that.

Fast shot, however, is way more useful in realtime than it ever was in Fallout 1/2.

I think Sex Appeal could do with being replaced with Van Buren's 'Red Scare'.

You are paranoid in the extreme and think that everyone around you may be trying to do you in. Your effective PE is +2 for purposes of determining sight range, but your shaky nerves in combat give you a -5 penalty to hit.

What traits did you guys never bother with in the old Fallouts?
 
Lazlo said:
What traits did you guys never bother with in the old Fallouts?

I completely avoided Chem Resistant and Chem Reliant as they just seemed useless. :?

Lazlo said:
Kamikaze - you don't need sequence when most combat is realtime. I think maybe it could be retooled into 0 AC and an extra action point or two. Something like that.

For 0 AC you'd think that you might deserve more than 1-2 extra action points. Something like 5 might make people actually want to take it as almost no one took it before. :?
 
Melee-Unarmed IS better on FOnline because they changed the melee damage calculation. Now each extra point of strength above 5 gives you another melee damage point. That makes more sense. Still, Melee-Unarmed needs new things. There are a lot of guns, and only a few melee-unarmed weapons. We need more make-shift melee weapons, for one thing.

What traits did you guys never bother with in the old Fallouts?

Bruiser: The bonus is marginal (its slightly better in FOnline) and the penalty is staggering. AP is too important to sacrifice for punching strength.

Kamikaze: Totally useless. So I get some sequence... but sequence was never useful to begin with. Specially not in a CTB game. Kamikaze would make more sense if you got more AP.

Heavy Handed: The opposite of finesse, except it only helps meleers. Its better in FOnline because punching is generally stronger, but it gets useless higher levels because other meleers will be making many more critical hits. And melee usually depends a lot on critical hits and aimed attacks (Shaitan, anyone?), or else you get gunned down. My suggestion would be to change this into doing more damage, give it a benefit to gunners and change the name to something like "Overkiller." Maybe meelers should get increased knockdown chance on their attacks. Maybe give more range to throwers, too?

Fast Metabolism: I usually use this when the one trait I sellect is enough. So I get Fast Metabolism. Its handy, but not that much. Now, if poison was more lethal (and player-usable) and the healing stronger, this could be useful.

Bloody Mess: People die in more violent ways I was going to see anyway. Boring.

Good Natured: Has potential but it requires more use for non-combat skills. I could see a non-combat character using this if the bonus was better and non-combat skill more developed.

Chem Reliant: In theory good, but drugs should be more useful, and by more useful I mean "can get stats above 10." That would make it a lot more useful. I would like to be able to do a "druggie character."

Chem Resistant: Boring. You get half the benefit of drugs but get addicted -50% less. Theorically cool, but boring. Chem Reliant seems more fun to me.

Sex Appeal: Too marginal.

Skilled: One of the worse. Some skill points and then you gain perks each 4 levels? You can't be serious. The penalty is unbearable.


Gifted was replaced with night person.

Night Person was damn useless. It was just a moronic -2 PE -2 IN penalty for half a day. It would've made much more sense if it gave you inherent extra sneak, extra to-hit chance and range detection at night and reversed the aiming tables for day and night. It would enable you to make something similar to Night Combat characters in Jagged Alliance 2.
 
Slaughter Manslaught said:
Bloody Mess: People die in more violent ways I was going to see anyway. Boring.

Maybe the FOnline team should make it similar to how Bethesda made it in Fallout 3 with a bonus to the damage you can cause as well, though more than 5%. :?
 
Slaughter Manslaught said:

Agree with pretty much everything you've written.

As for melee weapons, I was hoping one of their strengths would be that they could be assembled on the fly out of junk. The devs weren't too keen.

I feel traits were a wasted opportunity to encourage more interesting and varied styles of play.

Chems are being tweaked - I just hope it's the kind of system whereby you can function so long as you have a steady supply of drugs. The downtime for jet was ridiculous - why would anyone take a drug that got you high for five seconds and then had you out of action for another 24 hours? The stat penalty was much too extreme to bother with.

I don't know what to do about traits. I could just keep making posts about it on the Fonline forum until my fingers bleed, but I've mentioned it enough times. They'll do them when they feel like it.
 
Slaughter Manslaught said:
Night Person was damn useless. It was just a moronic -2 PE -2 IN penalty for half a day.

Yeh, and +2 PE and +2 IN every other half of the day, always depending on the base stats. So, if you choose 7 PE and 7 IN as default values, you get on day 5 PE and 5 IN and in the night 9 PE and 9 IN. IMO, night person is much more worth in FOnline because the night comes pretty often (faster ingame time).
 
1 Chem reliant is not all that bad...it has it's uses. Especially when save/load/save/load/load/load is not an option. And is Overdose implemented?

2 Kamikaze - why not use the version from tactics? It's way more decent trade-off there than in FO2&1...

3 Bloody Mess...here's an idea:

"By some strange twist of fate, people around you die violently. You always see the worst way a person can die...including you! All critical hits deal +20% more damage."


If that's not bloody... :D

Also you could add "One in a Milion" (VB trait); it works in the same manner as the "Born Under the Sign" background from Arcanum.

And in the world of FOnline, will there be a place for scoundrels and thieves? I really would like to play a unarmed/steal/doctor combo :)
 
'skilled' isnt as bad as it first looks. By the time youre 21 thats 105 skill points gained. Which is the equivilant to 4or5 (decently high int) levels of skill points. With a level cap at 21 you would recieve 5 perks instead 7. Which does suck, however it does let you esentially 'skip' the more mundane level 3 perks. Owing to the fact you can choose when and where you want to level up.

Its very possible to level till level 4, then dont visit your character screen until you reach level 6. Then when you visit the character screen you will be able to pick the perk you should have picked 2 levels ago, however all the lvl 6 perks will now be available to you. (2 levels later at level 8 you can pick another)

If you tried the same trick without 'skilled' when you reach level 6 you will only be able to choose one perk (essentially losing a perk).. or you would be forced to pick the level 3 perk, imo the best of a bad bunch would be toughness(marginal use when you consider you are probably going to get one shot however high your DR is) or Awareness (nice info, but you can live without it)

While im here i'll also mention the level 3 perk Thief (10% to sneak/lockpick/steal/traps). At first glance it does not appear particularly strong. Indeed, if taken early you will recieve the least bang for your buck (equivilant of 40 skill points, or two levels with a decent 'int' character).

However due to the fact 1% costs 6 points after you reach 200% in a particular skill, if you save 'thief' until you reach 200+ in a particular skill (probably sneak) it will be the equivilant of 90 skill points (60 for sneak, 10 for the others assuming none of those are 100+, at which point it would become even stronger)

Combining the above two facts, I estimate it will be possible to produce a character at level 21 that has ~260sneak + Ghost(20% at night).

By the same token, 'Harmless' (20% steal) would be worth 120skill points. Nice if you wished to create a 'master thief' type character.

Has any changes been made to the crit table. IMO the crit table is the first candidate for nerfing if you wished to introduce some balance into the game... and smooth out the dmg spikes. Some of the rolls you recieve on the crit table essentially allow you to one shot people regardless of thier armour/health.

edit - If you can revive dead people, but only dead people that are not blown into a million pieces, I see bloody mess as becoming a very useful trait, even in its current form. Assuming reviving dead people is brought into the game of course.
 
JEZUS! Stop maths + fo!!! Just make a char you like, that will have 1 agro skill(guns/big guns/ eng.Weps) to 150, and you will do just fine.

@Lex. Will Books work? like guns&amo, BB of S ( you know wich one :P ). Like 5+ bonus and limited amount of books you can read. (10 or something).

And is there a cap how high you can raise 1 skill??? (Lets say 120 cap to all skils. ) It would be funny watching players blowing everything up, xept their targets :twisted: .
 
Well, yes, in FOnline books work since a few days. Bur for 2238 we deactivated them because they are not good for game balance, even if we would put a limit on them. In the end would be just free skill points for players who have friends who can get their hands on the books or for players who want to "get up" their alternative characters.

And is there a cap how high you can raise 1 skill???

I think, at the moment the max value for every skill is 300, like in Fallout 2.
 
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