Gun Control
- Thread starter Throatpunch
- Start date
GonZo_626
Well Shit!
So was the lee enfield .303, and etc... honestly the list could go on for a long time on rifles and action types (and technology in general) that were designed for the military but find use in the civilian market afterwards. Hell most bolt action rifles nowadays are still using the almost exact same design of bolt-action as seen in WW2 battle rifles.
In the end an AR-15 is nothing but a semi-automatic rifle mostly firing .223 Remington, they do find good use as varmint rifles. .223 is a good fairly flat firing round and semi auto allows for a quick follow up shot if needed. We are told in Canada that we cant hunt with our AR's, but then we hired a bunch of New Zealanders to come and wipe out an invasive species on an island here, guess what they brought with them, that's right AR-15's with 30 round mags.
https://vancouversun.com/news/local...ida-gwaii-featuring-new-zealand-sharpshooters
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Deleted member 93956
Guest
Let's look at this in another way, then. In what scenario would you need a rifle of those specs for self defense, over handguns, shotguns and smaller rifles? Because I can't think of a good fit that isn't either the zombie apocalypse or "overthrow the gubmint", and the former is the most likely to both happen and be effective for.
DarkCorp
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I have already gone into detail about how military STYLE rifles are more of a cool look factor. Otherwise, they really are not that different from other rifles.
So,
I want to know why people have such a problem with such weapons?
So,
I want to know why people have such a problem with such weapons?
BigGuyCIA
Yer fond of me Lobster!
These rifles are almost never purchased for self-defense, though. It's purely a sporting rifle. We can get into the nitty-gritty of what these rifles are predominantly designed to do, but more often than not, in civilian hands, it's pointed downrange at inanimate objects.
We banned rifles (semi-autos included) on a federal level for 10 years and there was no noticeable effect on crime-rates.
On a fundamental level there is a big difference between today's social climate compared to the late 90's/early 2000's. Weapon bans are mostly attempts to stifle the symptoms. Keep in mind that the VT shooter killed 33 people with semi-automatic pistols.
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DarkCorp
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Bigguy
And that is precisely why I do not understand peoples problem with military style rifles. They are not selective fire with auto and burst, they do not fire a round that is all that different from other rifles. Lastly, these rifles are often slightly less powerful than something like the Kar98, which has superior range and velocity.
Again, to all those who want to ban military style rifles, WHY?
And that is precisely why I do not understand peoples problem with military style rifles. They are not selective fire with auto and burst, they do not fire a round that is all that different from other rifles. Lastly, these rifles are often slightly less powerful than something like the Kar98, which has superior range and velocity.
Again, to all those who want to ban military style rifles, WHY?
GonZo_626
Well Shit!
There is only one real answer to this question and you know it. They look scary.
MutantScalper
Dogmeat
So have you shot a deer with an AR-15?
GonZo_626
Well Shit!
Unfortunately no, due to there scary look we are not allowed to hunt with AR-15's in Canada. But yes I do know people who have shot a deer with a ruger mini-14, which is a very similar rifle besides the cosmetics. While arguable many people consider .223 a fine deer hunting round, moose not so much.
But if you want to see someone doing it.
DarkCorp
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If the round is appropriate for the game, I do not see why people wouldn't do it.
Al I keep hearing is, 'We should ban military style rifles cause they look scurry'. There is literally no other reason for it.
Al I keep hearing is, 'We should ban military style rifles cause they look scurry'. There is literally no other reason for it.
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Deleted member 93956
Guest
I asked “why not” and didn’t get a much better answer
GonZo_626
Well Shit!
The question back would be what specs, as the AR-15 is kinda like lego and can be built many ways, also there are not many smaller rifles then an AR (caliber wise), but there are a lot of bigger rifles. As far as a semi-auto firing .223 for self defense well to me its not ideal unless I am in an open area (this would be the same for all rifles). A pump or semi shotgun works excellent for home defense and a handgun would be great for personal defense as these are both close in firearms also a SMG would be great for close in. As short barrel AR though would be just as good as a SMG especially fitted with pistol caliber rounds.
That all being said I am Canadian and not really allowed to defend myself (much like most of the countries people hold up as great at gun control). If I did have to defend myself my life as I know it would be over anyways as I would be put through legal hell for a couple of years. Most likely I would have to sell everything I own to pay the legal fees, and my whole family would have to be put through the stress of all this. Many have lost there jobs, or had there significant others leave them due to the stresses. It is effectively punishment through process as a lot of them are finally found justified and have the case dropped before the courts, or get let off during the trial, or found not guilty. Worth it though if it saves my wife and children's lives in my opinion.
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Deleted member 93956
Guest
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/self-defence-what-s-acceptable-under-canadian-law-1.1229180
Is this inaccurate? Because it seems like you're being overly dramatic for the argument's sake. Which doesn't really bode well if you wanna play the "you're just scared of them!" card as well too to downplay overkill. And this is before considering the actual chance for such a scenario to show itself in Canada.
DarkCorp
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Because banning something for reasons I have already debunked above is asinine, period. Every argument that people have brought up about military style rifles have been debunked.
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Deleted member 93956
Guest
You've not debunked shit and repeating that word isn't gonna change that. Gonzo has made an argument for the versatility of it making an arbitrary ban redundant and BigGuy had a statistical source and an argument for what they're actually used for, even if I still fail to see the problem with the decommission of a weapon (class) that is suboptimal for what is the most agreeable application of firearms for self defense, home and property defense, and has proven little difference to wether it's banned or not, and generally serve for simply leisure and practice, but that's just me. Oh wait, DEBUNK'D, now my point is way stronger now.
DarkCorp
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Arnust
I clearly pointed out how military style rifles are semi-auto, not full auto or burst. I have also pointed out that the ammunition isn't that much different when compared to other similar rounds used for hunting. I also pointed out that the muzzle velocity for military style rifles are still similar, if not slightly lower, than many other rifles.
The above also happens to be the primary reasons that most folks give when hollering for a ban on military style rifles.
I have heard jack and shit from you in regards to making a coherent argument for banning military style rifles. All I have seen from you so far is your self righteous moaning about how stupid some of us are for liking military style rifles and if not for us stupid people, we could make them go away.
I clearly pointed out how military style rifles are semi-auto, not full auto or burst. I have also pointed out that the ammunition isn't that much different when compared to other similar rounds used for hunting. I also pointed out that the muzzle velocity for military style rifles are still similar, if not slightly lower, than many other rifles.
The above also happens to be the primary reasons that most folks give when hollering for a ban on military style rifles.
I have heard jack and shit from you in regards to making a coherent argument for banning military style rifles. All I have seen from you so far is your self righteous moaning about how stupid some of us are for liking military style rifles and if not for us stupid people, we could make them go away.
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BigGuyCIA
Yer fond of me Lobster!
You're asking a nebulous question: Why people, of their own free-will, would choose to make a poor decision when selecting weapons for self-defense. You're free to question that decision just as much as they're free to make that decision. Every gun store I have been to asks you what you're looking to do. If you say home defense they'll point you to handguns, shotguns, or pdws. If someone decides to ignore the retailer's advice then that's their prerogative.
GonZo_626
Well Shit!
It is and it isn't, notice how I said punishment through process. Also that article is from when we had a Conservative government and not with the shitbag Turdeau running the country. Our police force will do things differently depending on if they think the gov will spank them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Colten_Boushie - this would be better called the persecution of Gerald Stanley imop. 5 armed drunk natives terrorizing a guys property (this also goes to show how the more liberal side view things).
BigGuyCIA
Yer fond of me Lobster!
I'll be honest with you gonzo, that case isn't as cut and dry as it looks.
GonZo_626
Well Shit!
Yeah the wiki article does not go into it very well, but this was a very big case going on in Canada so I have knowledge of reading lots of articles about it. The wiki does not really do it justice and you would have to read many articles to get up to speed. I found a better one to illustrate my point from southern Alberta.
https://www.macleans.ca/news/canada/alberta-farm-shooting-is-a-new-touchstone-for-rural-gun-owners/
https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/appla...opped-against-man-in-rural-shooting-1.3984882
Trust me I can keep finding more, it just takes some google-fu.
https://www.dailywire.com/news/19212/meet-canadian-whos-now-being-prosecuted-self-aaron-bandler