Jeff Gardiner on DLC again

[The Dutch Ghost]

Then perhaps this is a better question, why continue with a game series that clearly failed according to you?

If more than anything the heads would expect something new rather than bringing back a failed series just because some developers on the team liked it.

McDonalds doesn't sell fois gras.

And yet is in turn one of the companies responsible for most of the overweight problem.

 

[Ausir]

McDonalds doesn't sell fois gras.

So by your logic, all restaurants should make food targeted at the same consumer as McDonald's? And if it doesn't sell as much as hamburgers, it's a failure?

 

[TychoXI]

Many reviewers complained about the looks of the wasteland being repetitive/dull and what not, So what does Beth do? Take the acshunz to alaska. FPSers complained about "too much depth" and "too many opshunz" so they are delivering, along with the change of setting to alaska, a straight FPS campaign.

Everybody complained about it ending, the level cap and the shortness o' the main quest. So... Beth delivers not only a GODDAM change of the ending, but alleviates the level cap and blah blah blah.

I don't remember what the third DLC was about but I'm sure it addresses some other oft-complained thingy about the game...

I'm not saying this is all bad (perhaps, even, they were already working on some of them before reviews arrived) on part of Bethesda... it's just that it's too bad Beth didn't hear those who complained about real problems like voice acting, 2 dimensional characterizations, childish dialog, skills being rather useless and/or maximizable at level 13 and other sheet like that... that's the kind o' issues I want my DLC to adress,

PS:

And yet is in turn one of the companies responsible for most of the overweight problem.

Tsk tsk my friend. Parents are to blame, not McDonalds nor anything/anybody else.

 

[Marx]

Then perhaps this is a better question, why continue with a game series that clearly failed according to you?

While it was continued in name and spirit, you don't agree it's really the same game - right?

While in this neck of the internet-woods, to some of the die-hards, Fallout = TB GURPs SPECIAL etc. In other portions of the internet, Fallout is about the retro sci-fi post apoc environment, not about the gameplay mechanics.

Games that directly simulate a tabletop environment don't do that hot these days, so the simple remedy is to take the story and run.

And yet is in turn one of the companies responsible for most of the overweight people.

Mass market appeal. Profit. These things a successful company make.

 

[Ausir]

While it was continued in name and spirit, you don't agree it's really the same game - right?

We can agree on the "name" part. It might be the same setting, but how can anyone claim that it's the same game?

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Ignoring the gameplay part for the moment, the game itself doesn't even feel Fallout in spirit.

The quality of the story is way below that of the earlier games as are the locations and quests.

Even the atmosphere is different, for all Fallout 2's crazyness, Fallout 3 is 'stupid wacky'.

 

[Marx]

While it was continued in name and spirit, you don't agree it's really the same game - right?

We can agree on the "name" part. It might be the same setting, but how can anyone claim that it's the same game?

This is the same community that contains folks that brand Fallout 3 as 'not Fallout'. Of course the game isn't Fallout, it's Fallout 3 - the message is clear enough though.

So by your logic, all restaurants should make food targeted at the same consumer as McDonald's? And if it doesn't sell as much as hamburgers, it's a failure?

No.

What I'm saying is if your restaurant fails, don't sit around after the fact and declare that it was the consumer base that was ignorant when your product fails or undersells because you didn't market it correctly or cater to the consumer.

Tossing things like 'it didn't cater to the average gamer' around 7 or 8 years after a lackluster performance is self-apologetic at best.

Bethesda chose to cater to the average consumer and it appears to be quite the success - it has cemented the name and has ensured future Fallout releases.

 

[Ausir]

What I'm saying is if your restaurant fails, don't sit around after the fact and declare that it was the consumer base that was ignorant when your product fails or undersells because you didn't market it correctly or cater to the consumer.

Fallout 1 and 2 didn't fail. They sold pretty well, actually. And I don't see how a product being targeted at a certain niche is a failed product.

Bethesda chose to cater to the average consumer and it appears to be quite the success - it has cemented the name and has ensured future Fallout releases.

And buried the chances for a faithful sequel. If I were a fan of the Civilization series who is not into RTS, I wouldn't be thrilled if e.g. Blizzard bought the rights to Civ5, made it into an RTS and sold millions of copies, "cemented the name, ensuring future Civilization releases", because it wouldn't be a game for me.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Bethesda chose to cater to the average consumer and it appears to be quite the success - it has cemented the name and has ensured future Fallout releases.

I guess it is sort of the "If its not meant for me, its a failure." mindset that is at play here.

Bethesda chose to cater to the average consumer and it appears to be quite the success - it has cemented the name and has ensured future Fallout releases.

Ah yes, the average gamer, they are such a misunderstood lot, barely getting any games that are aimed directly at them while we elitists get all the best stuff.

 

[Patton89]

Fallout 3 is awful sequel to the previous games. In respect of dialogue, story, cohesion, and overall RPG elements, fallout 3 is sub-par RPG and sequel. Mediocre game.

And again, Fallout sold well for its time, why do you continue to ignore that you cant DIRECTLY compare todays numbers of sold units in 3 platforms, to those sold 11 years ago on one platform.

Interplay was simply mismanaged to the grave, it wasnt because their games wouldnt have sold, if they had made sequels. It was because they made spin-offs like POS and tactics.

So to you, the quality and "Falloutness" of future fallout releases is secondary or non-important ?

You really didnt like Fallout did you ? You really dont like RPGs that much ? or is it that you dont just like the Fallout and Post-Apoc ?

 

[Ad Astra]

Fallout was never meant to be a mass market title, targeted at the "average consumer".

And I see that worked so well for Interplay.

So Fallout wasn't a mass-market game ten years ago.

turn based isometric rpg fans are the niche fallout was made for originally

Yeah, a decade ago when that was the norm for mass market games. Bethesda wants to make money, it is a company after all, you make a product that will sell.

No wait, Fallout was a mass-market game ten years ago!

I try to make my opinions fit reality. Some people prefer it the other way around.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

What I wonder Patton89 is why Marx feels that mainstream gamers 'need' Fallout but that it needs to be changed to suit their tastes.

Then they could just as well demand Ultima, or X Com or other classics that weren't directly aimed at a broad audience, and have those reinvented Fallout 3 style so that they can finally like them.

Does the new generation of gamers feel that they are deprived of classic franchises because they aren't what they would like them to be?

 

[Ausir]

What Kubrick's 2001 needs is a Michael Bay sequel!

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

What Kubrick's 2001 needs is a Michael Bay sequel!

Yeah, some awesome space battles, some sex scenes, and a big scene in which we humans prove to be better than some enlightened aliens who are probably pinko commies.

 

[Ad Astra]

What Kubrick's 2001 needs is a Michael Bay sequel!

We already have that absolutely awful, terrible, disgustingly horrible remake of The Day the Earth Stood Still (lots of action, too much CGI, no plot and terrible acting - it's so mainstream it hurts), so just give it a little time.

But look on the bright side! Once all movies are exactly the same, you'll be able to go to the theaters, pick a movie at random and get the same action-packed, neuron-destroying experience no matter what you choose! It will be like living through the dialog of a modern RPG: no matter what option you pick, the result will always be the same.

 

[Per]

Guys, that wacky Jeff Gardiner and his PDLC, eh?

 

[Ausir]

What does "P" in "PDLC" stand for anyhow?

 

[Patton89]

Pwned-DLC

 

[TheWesDude]

Then perhaps this is a better question, why continue with a game series that clearly failed according to you?

While it was continued in name and spirit, you don't agree it's really the same game - right?

While in this neck of the internet-woods, to some of the die-hards, Fallout = TB GURPs SPECIAL etc. In other portions of the internet, Fallout is about the retro sci-fi post apoc environment, not about the gameplay mechanics.

huh? i dont say fallout is about the atmosphere, art style, setting, mechanics, or anything.

the original creators of the game itself decided what the goal of the game was.

example:

take 50 people and have them listen to Sting's "Every Breath You Take" and you will get generally a few opinions on what it means. popularly, its a song of love and lost yearning. it gets played at TONS of weddings and funerals. was even re-made by P Diddy after Biggie Smalls died to commemorate his death.

and yet what is this song loved by billions the world over? what is the meaning? from sting.com:

Like Star Wars: You'll be under surveillance but also... protected.

If it actually happened, someone would be done for stalking. Every breath you take being monitored - euucchhhh! Ghastly sentiment.

On the me hand it's quite seductive, on the other hand it's about control and jealousy.

"I used to get letters from couples saying, Dear Sting, thank you for writing that beautiful song, it's our song. Sick! It's a very sinister song, but it's seductively dressed up."

and there is more...

so who is right? all these people who play the songs at their weddings and funerals and even puff daddy who did his remix for biggie smalls...

or the person who wrote the song? who is right?

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Guys, that wacky Jeff Gardiner and his PDLC, eh?

I wonder when they will bring up the Commonwealth/Institute DLC, like the Pitt it has been mentioned several times so its probably on the list.