Men's Rights Activism

[TheWesDude]

This is bullshit. I'm sure the statistics are more or less correct (though I'm pretty sure you're exaggerating - everything I find isn't nearly as lopsided), women have been outperforming men in US colleges for ages. Why is that? Well, for a number of reasons. For one, we would actually expect women to be better present in institutes of higher learning: there are more women than men in the population, after all.

finally! someone made this argument.

so then you admit that men are the minority, and as such deserve minority protections, and since women are the majority, they should not have protections or special considerations correct?

as men are the minority population wise, it is US that deserve the protections and considerations, NOT the women.

they should create programs to encourage men to go to colleges. take the money from the ones aimed at women.

 

[Crni Vuk]

And yes, females are more valuable than males. We can't give birth to children. Sperm is commonplace, fertile wombs are not. Furthermore, women are generally a tad more intelligent than men, more social, less inclined towards violence and are far more resistant to long term pain.

I would not say that. I experienced it by my self. The violance or lets say harm caused by females can be as huge like with males if you now beat your kids almost to death or if you neglect them so much that they almost strave to death makes no difference to me its violence after all. Its just not something that is shown very often in the media compared to the guy who raped a child/female which causes very huge emotional reactions. What about the situations where mothers stoped to care about their baby? Or where prostitutes kill their children etc. Crime statistics show that both males and females comit similar crimes. Just with different capabilities.

About the firefighter women thing: women on average are less physically fit and weaker then men.

says who? Yet females on average can do the same like males. I am talking about every day tasks and jobs here which is the point.

I love how this "female that male that" gets thrown around so often. Yet Both genders have shown countless times that the physical differences are not as big as people believe. Not from my experience be it in martial arts, the fire brigade or school. The further we move the more the "lines" blurry. There are physical differences between males and females like the size of the hips and a few other things. But they have muscles like males. They can perform the same moves. They can train and do sport etc.

Rich. (and maybe more jewish than white)

what about the white jews though? Also stop reading Mein Kampf.

 

[Sander]

finally! someone made this argument.

so then you admit that men are the minority, and as such deserve minority protections, and since women are the majority, they should not have protections or special considerations correct?

as men are the minority population wise, it is US that deserve the protections and considerations, NOT the women.

This reasoning is ridiculous. There are more women than men. That does not mean that women actually have more power, are in a better position - nor does it mean that men need protection over women. None of that is, in fact, the case. Being a minority is not enough to get any kind of preferential treatment.

they should create programs to encourage men to go to colleges. take the money from the ones aimed at women.

As I explained in the part of my post you conveniently did not quote, men are encouraged to college and are increasingly going to college every year. What you are suggesting already happens.

 

[Hoxie]

Oh god this thread.

 

[Verevoof]

This thread is so headache-inducing, it's ridiculous. At least it got that loser Token-whatever banned.

I was going to jump in on this, but Sander is saying all that I wanted to say. I'll continue to watch from the sidelines, with a bag of popcorn in one hand and painkillers in the other...

 

[TorontoReign]

This thread is so headache-inducing, it's ridiculous. At least it got that loser Token-whatever banned.

I was going to jump in on this, but Sander is saying all that I wanted to say. I'll continue to watch from the sidelines, with a bag of popcorn in one hand and painkillers in the other...

Might want a drink to go with that.

 

[34thcell]

The regular requirements for starting military training don't tend to be very high, any reasonably fit man or slightly fitter woman can achieve them. The actual discrimination is in not letting them in actual combat and/or prohibiting them from elite roles (despite being used in special operations for decades). Not many women could pass the tests for special forces, but that doesn't matter.

Also, women are the new men, men are the new bitches.

 

[DammitBoy]

[Being a minority is not enough to get any kind of preferential treatment.

Ahahahahaha - please try explaining that to the U.S. Government or any minority in america.

Alsoplustoo - If women can perform to the exact same standards as the men in any job that has a physical fitness requirement - more power to them.

The double standard of two different acceptable levels of fitness is bullshit.

 

[TheWesDude]

This reasoning is ridiculous. There are more women than men. That does not mean that women actually have more power, are in a better position - nor does it mean that men need protection over women. None of that is, in fact, the case. Being a minority is not enough to get any kind of preferential treatment.

im not sure how it is in your country, but there are many upon many scholarships and grants available to women that are not available to men to encourage more women to go to school.

well, they worked. now women are a large majority of college/university attendees. even after you account for population bias of more women than men.

so, because those programs worked, and now men are the minority beyond population bias, we need to end those programs and create them for men to encourage more men to go get degrees.

in the US these schools are registering less enrollees in the practical sciences and technology and business areas. the fields women tend to shy away from. they are making a comeback in the business areas, but practical sciences and technology programs are having to cut back in many schools.

 

[Courier]

And yes, females are more valuable than males. We can't give birth to children. Sperm is commonplace, fertile wombs are not.

Artificial wombs exist you know... (edit: actually my mistake, apparently they're still only a theoretical technology. In vitro fertilisation exists though.)

Anyways this whole "men's rights movement" thing is just as stupid and unnecessary as Third Wave Feminism. Neither sex these days is oppressed the point where a sex-specific movement is necessary. Any issues with equality and the likes could be handled better by a sex-neutral Egalitarian movement, not these two petty and whiny bullshit movements that apparently view "rights" as some sort of pendulum that can only be on one side or the other.

 

[Sander]

im not sure how it is in your country, but there are many upon many scholarships and grants available to women that are not available to men to encourage more women to go to school.

well, they worked. now women are a large majority of college/university attendees. even after you account for population bias of more women than men.

so, because those programs worked, and now men are the minority beyond population bias, we need to end those programs and create them for men to encourage more men to go get degrees.

Your conclusion does not follow logically from your premise. What y you want to do is encourage everyone (or everyone capable, at least) to go to college, and that's exactly what's happening with competence scholarships etc. Removing women's scholarships will not enable more men to go to college: it will only reduce the number of women in college.

By the way, have any numbers on the number of gender-exclusive scholarships? Because so far all you've done is just say "this is the way it is!" with no citations.

in the US these schools are registering less enrollees in the practical sciences and technology and business areas. the fields women tend to shy away from.

Hey, this sounds like something you'd want to fix. By encouraging women to take those kinds of majors. With scholarships. Just saying.

 

[Crni Vuk]

Not many women could pass the tests for special forces, but that doesn't matter.

Not many men could pass them either. Remember from 10 people 1 or maybe 2 actually succeed.

Again. The difference between males and females is not as huge as people think. The isralian army has females as soldiers since a long time. The Second World War has seen probably a very high number of female soldiers in all kind of roles, from pilots, to snipers and even tank crews. There are stories of female nurses on the Soviet front which would jump INTO a burning tank to get the crews out. It was their job. And they saw it as their duty as well. And people should not forget for example in military training for special forces the issue most of the time is not so much the physical test which is not to different from what any professional athlete has to do where females actually are very present as well and pretty much in any kind of sport! It is the mental stress together with the physical tasks which makes it so difficult, they want to get people to work perfectly even under combat situations more then typical soldiers.

I don't see why females should not be capable of doing the same physical tasks like males. Are they handicapped or something? I don't think so. The physical differences are not that huge so females could not achieve what males do with correct training.

 

[Cimmerian Nights]

Anyone who thinks that men have it rough never spent a night in Kabuki-cho.

And if you think women have it so easy, spend some time in an OB-GYN office. You don't even want to know...

 

[34thcell]

Not many women could pass the tests for special forces, but that doesn't matter.

Not many men could pass them either. Remember from 10 people 1 or maybe 2 actually succeed.

Why do you respond as though that wasn't the point of the post?

 

[thegaresexperience]

All I have to say is: Men's Rights is a good idea that was taken over by the very vocal minority misogynists who use it to complain about how women run the world and men are weak and powerless, false rape accusations/men are raped more than women (it's true BUT ONLY IN PRISON), blah blah.

I'm all for the idea of men getting more equality in divorce and custody battles, but not for its use as a vehicle for hatred.

 

[Crni Vuk]

Anyone who thinks that men have it rough never spent a night in Kabuki-cho.

And if you think women have it so easy, spend some time in an OB-GYN office. You don't even want to know...

No one said females have it "easy".

Not many women could pass the tests for special forces, but that doesn't matter.

Not many men could pass them either. Remember from 10 people 1 or maybe 2 actually succeed.

Why do you respond as though that wasn't the point of the post?

Dunno, because people think females cant do what males can. But they can.

 

[welsh]

Men's Right's Activism sounds rather homo-erotic or fascist, or maybe a bit of both, because honestly all those Stormtroopers in leather boots and black clothing is like a picture perfect gay pride parade for those into Sadomasochistic Broadway shows.

As a guy married to a strong willed, powerful woman, I say I don't need a self help group to remind me I have testicles cause when I act up, my wife can just reach out and grab mine and SQUEEZE.

And Fuck ya all if you can't take it, ya pussies.

No seriously. I knew one guys in my entire life who made a habit of protesting women's empowerment and the idea that it was a feminist world. And the guy was razor thin, had a red beard down to his belly button, and thought that most of the world's problems came down to verb forms. I suspect his values came either from linguistics- which is a bit too feminist really, or the fact he couldn't get laid.

Somehow his inability to get laid had something to do with women's empowerment?

Maybe the reason we got Muslim dudes who blow themselves up in suicide bombings is to get to those virgins in the afterlife because they can't get any in the real life.

Me, I like strong women, and women empowered with equality- awesome.

 

[Jebus]

Oh crap Welsh is back

Hide your Economists, everyone!

 

[welsh]

Hey bud, you know its been ages since I have read the Economist, but since you're thinking about it.....

Good to see you still around here.

 

[Jebus]

Why did you stop reading it? Did you find yourself disagreeing with their journalism, or did - as did I - you find yourself lacking time to keep up with your magazine subscriptions? I had to cull two subscriptions in order to not have my OCD bone tingling over all the unread magazines lying around.

Also, good to see you back too, Welsh. You have quite some posting to do in order to catch up with Kharn again...