the_cpl
Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?
selfcensored post 
More mud on the already tarnished reputation of Israels Army
- Thread starter Chancellor Kremlin
- Start date
Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?
Really? Were they pro Soviet?fedaykin said:Actually, they fought against the nazis
Alright. I'm just wondering due to the cold relations with Soviet in balticum, with the swedish balt deportment to the Soviet and such.fedaykin said:
Chancellor Kremlin
Mildly Dipped
Why can't people stick to the bloody point?
This isn't about how moral or unmoral or saintly the Wehrmacht or the Red Army was in World War II (Truth be told, both were as brutal and ruthless as can be, the Germans were just more efficient/organised at it)
The point is an Army which is in many ways an army of occupation, which is self proclaimed 'the most moral army in the world' when clearly there are many cases of abuse, injustices and so on.
Not wanting to bring the second world war into this, but since people have already opened the door there, the German soldiers who invaded the British isles of Guernsey were ordered to be as polite and courteous as possible, with explicitly no rape, pillage, maltreatmeant, and ordered to pay damages and services needed.
Documents from Operation Sealion, the planned invasion of Britain, note this strategy would have been applied to the whole of Britain, in an effort to appease the British people to their new 'conquerors', and win the 'hearts and minds' (so to speak)
One wonders if that strategy would have worked better than the brutal ones employed in Eastern Europe.
Having said that, I think Israel's Army has more to learn from such documents, than from their Fundamentalist Rabbis. Mark my words, Israel will cease to be a nation far before Switzerland will ever be, if only because by pissing off all its neighbours its laying the foundations for its own destruction.
This isn't about how moral or unmoral or saintly the Wehrmacht or the Red Army was in World War II (Truth be told, both were as brutal and ruthless as can be, the Germans were just more efficient/organised at it)
The point is an Army which is in many ways an army of occupation, which is self proclaimed 'the most moral army in the world' when clearly there are many cases of abuse, injustices and so on.
Not wanting to bring the second world war into this, but since people have already opened the door there, the German soldiers who invaded the British isles of Guernsey were ordered to be as polite and courteous as possible, with explicitly no rape, pillage, maltreatmeant, and ordered to pay damages and services needed.
Documents from Operation Sealion, the planned invasion of Britain, note this strategy would have been applied to the whole of Britain, in an effort to appease the British people to their new 'conquerors', and win the 'hearts and minds' (so to speak)
One wonders if that strategy would have worked better than the brutal ones employed in Eastern Europe.
Having said that, I think Israel's Army has more to learn from such documents, than from their Fundamentalist Rabbis. Mark my words, Israel will cease to be a nation far before Switzerland will ever be, if only because by pissing off all its neighbours its laying the foundations for its own destruction.
DarkCorp
So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
Hands down people do not like to be occupied. So when any occupying force arrives, its safe to say they are not going to have an easy time.
The problem, (in this case the middle east) we see israeli suffering but nary a waord about palistinian suffering.
Now what I want to know is if the Jews had wanted their own land for so long, why haven't they created the numbers to do so? Why also the need to move into Palistinian land as well instead of taking some uninhabited paradies somewhere and turn it into their own nation or whatever.
I was in an interesting discussion and my friend brought up the idea (dunno if its true or not) that it is also true of the irish, roma, among others. If this is indeed true it makes me wonder.
The problem, (in this case the middle east) we see israeli suffering but nary a waord about palistinian suffering.
Now what I want to know is if the Jews had wanted their own land for so long, why haven't they created the numbers to do so? Why also the need to move into Palistinian land as well instead of taking some uninhabited paradies somewhere and turn it into their own nation or whatever.
I was in an interesting discussion and my friend brought up the idea (dunno if its true or not) that it is also true of the irish, roma, among others. If this is indeed true it makes me wonder.
Bal-Sagoth
Water Chip? Been There, Done That
Chancellor Kremlin said:
If you had to make a prediction how long do you see Israel lasting as a nation? Personally I do not believe they will be "conquered" by a foreign nation anywhere in the foreseeable future.
Even attempting to win a conventional war against them is one thing. Not to mention the support they would likely receive from the United States and others if Israel was on the verge of losing such a conflict.
The truly scary thing is the 100-200 nuclear warheads they are sitting on among the other biological and chemical munitions they are believed to have stockpiled.
Also as far as delivery systems the Jericho III has anti missile defense capabilities and a strike range of the entire Middle East and beyond. The Dolphin class submarine that Germany donated/Israel bought also has second strike capabilities.
If all other options failed I would not put it against them to use non-conventional weapons. It is one of the main reasons I am not worried about Iran ever "openly" using a nuclear weapon against Israel. That would be such a very foolish thing to do.
There is no conceivable measure or standard by which that genocidal terror-state could be considered better than even the failed multinational federation that was Yugoslavia. I acknowledge this even though I've experienced the Yugoslavian collapse first hand.The Guardian said:
What "dark path"? You mean the current recession? A minor reversal that doesn't even begin to change the fact that never in history have the Croatian people had a standard of living as high as they do now. Not under communists, not under Serbs and certainly not as servants of various Germanic empires.
Too bad it would also be enslaved by a brutal totalitarian regime and its Nazi puppet-masters.
Indeed, too bad the reasonably moral and restrained Wehrmacht was but one the two main components of the Nazi war machine, while the other was responsible for horrors that defy description.
Don't look at me, it was your pal Guardian here who started using this thread as a conduit for Nazi apologism. But then again, since you appear to share his neo-Nazi sentiments, I'm sure you are well aware of that fact and are merely trying to set up a strawman.
By the way, thanks for those YouTube videos, I needed a good laugh.
Nazi propaganda sounds as hollow and spurious as it did 60 years ago.
the_cpl
Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?
selfcensored post
The Guardian
It Wandered In From the Wastes
Mainly because of anti-Semitism, one can easily find and list the crimes committed by Israel, as many have been documented throughout the 20th and 21st centuries, including the attack on the USS Liberty.
The article I posted earlier should sum up the ideology and opinion of individual Israeli soldiers, quite well.
What an aggressive stance, not very peaceful at all.
The article I posted earlier should sum up the ideology and opinion of individual Israeli soldiers, quite well.
The German White Book said:
What an aggressive stance, not very peaceful at all.
Bal-Sagoth
Water Chip? Been There, Done That
I just saw an Alex Jones link, this thread continues on its path towards greatness.
SSteve and The Guardian, you two are a match made in heaven.
SSteve and The Guardian, you two are a match made in heaven.
Chancellor Kremlin
Mildly Dipped
Bal-Sagoth said:
I am talking about the next couple of hundred years. Israel will not be able to count on the support of the U.S for ever, and God knows what geopolitical changes might happen to that region in 100-200 years.
It would not surprise me if there was a nuclear exchange there. The U.S and the U.S.S.R almost did it in the cold war, I see no reason why it could not actually happen there.
At the end of the day, the creation of Israel was a mistake. Now that it is there though, we have to deal with it. I don't see the continued oppression of the Palestinians as being the solution, nor the continued firing of rockets into Israel making it any easier.
Both sides will have to concede, and Israel, as the actual nation, the military supremacy, and with its best interests at heard, should be the first to do it.
Bal-Sagoth
Water Chip? Been There, Done That
Chancellor Kremlin said:
Ah never mind in that case. We could speculate for days on end about what would occur in that type of time-span.
Chancellor Kremlin said:
Good luck.
the_cpl
Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?
selfcensored post
Chancellor Kremlin
Mildly Dipped
Bal-Sagoth said:Chancellor Kremlin said:
Ah never mind in that case. We could speculate for days on end about what would occur in that type of time-span.
Chancellor Kremlin said:
Good luck.
Hmmn indeed. Its up to them though. Until someone sees and implements that we will continue to have this tit for tat conflict which resolves nothing.
As for the report, it doesn't surprise me. At some point in the next 50 years if not sooner Turkey will most likely aquicre nuclear arms, at that point Iran will have also probably done it, and maybe also Egypt. From then on who knows what will happen.
The Guardian
It Wandered In From the Wastes
Chancellor Kremlin said:
Turkey is allied with Israel, and would defend it rather than nuke it.
Bal-Sagoth
Water Chip? Been There, Done That
A conventional war against Israel from outside nations I suppose is a possibility. Unless something drastic changes I can also see Israel getting quite a bit of support from the United States among other Western Nations.
How far that support would go I am not sure, it is open to speculation if we would put boots on the ground. I would guess it would have to be a pretty dire situation for that to even be considered. I also wonder if Israel would allow Non-Jewish foreign volunteers to serve if said events ever occur.
A nuclear conflict would be much more tricky. Wiki has a fairly nice read on Israel and WMD. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_and_weapons_of_mass_destruction
I would not want to dance that jig with Israel.
How far that support would go I am not sure, it is open to speculation if we would put boots on the ground. I would guess it would have to be a pretty dire situation for that to even be considered. I also wonder if Israel would allow Non-Jewish foreign volunteers to serve if said events ever occur.
A nuclear conflict would be much more tricky. Wiki has a fairly nice read on Israel and WMD. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_and_weapons_of_mass_destruction
I would not want to dance that jig with Israel.
Chancellor Kremlin
Mildly Dipped
The Guardian said:
Like I said, in the context of what I said, that is a temporary state.
Being Israel's ally did not stop the Turkish Prime Minister from making scathing remarks about it and storming out of the Davos talks.
All that Turkey needs to change stances is a change in party. Given middle east politics, that is not a far-fetched scenario, especially in a 50-100 year time frame.
The Guardian
It Wandered In From the Wastes
I hope people are not still discussing this topic in 50 years' time.Chancellor Kremlin said: