New CD-Action Preview

[Forhekset]

Bethesda, making gaming easier FOR you.

Makes me think of the character status screen that we recently saw (help, someone crippled my head!) that showed a giant "HEAL" button. Gotta dumb things down for the kids who grew up on Xbox.

Hmm, are the games dumbed down, or are the gamers dumbed down?

Both. I know what you're getting at, though. A better question would be, which one is a result of the other?

As a side note, what annoys me most about the whole toilet drinking thing isn't even whether or not it would be feasible in the real world (we're talking about a video game, guys). It's that in the first game, the main objective was to get a new water chip, because water was (naturally) an extremely precious resource. In Bethesda's vision of Fallout, though, water is everywhere! No need for a new water chip - just find yourself a toilet and lap that stuff up.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Hmm, are the games dumbed down, or are the gamers dumbed down?

 

[offside.beef]

dutch ghost has given a good point
forhekset has given a good answer, each side has each other to blame

it pretty much has come down to do what most of the audience in gaming now days are; young children
they have been all these privileges that they accept whatever is given to them, this is where fanboy-ism comes from
accepting GRAFIXS! more than story, poor gameplay and everything being just really dull
it also adds to the fact that it comes also the the education of children as they are also dumb as hell now then compared to like education in the 80s. (i will not go into the real problem here until needed )

whilst older gamers whom we rode every storm out and ended up to where we are have seemed to appreciate the story more and the graphics more as a given aspect
we saw 8bit we saw 16bit we hit 32bit

 

[shorrtybearr]

this is where fanboy-ism comes from
accepting GRAFIXS! more than story, poor gameplay and everything being just really dull
it also adds to the fact that it comes also the the education of children as they are also dumb as hell now then compared to like education in the 80s. (i will not go into the real problem here until needed

Think you're doing the youngsters a bit of a disservice there mate. Hell im even still considered a youngster and i can mentally run rings around most of the older generation. Its not really a problem with the overall intellegence of the youngsters its just that the mentally challenged tend to breed more and therefore the result is a general dumbing down of the nation(s).

Hehe feel this is going a little off topic.

 

[offside.beef]

Think you're doing the youngsters a bit of a disservice there mate. Hell im even still considered a youngster and i can mentally run rings around most of the older generation. Its not really a problem with the overall intelligence of the youngsters its just that the mentally challenged tend to breed more and therefore the result is a general dumbing down of the nation(s).

Hehe feel this is going a little off topic.

well there are always some exceptions that we can except =P

but it is true about what i stated, you look at the stupid
sony vs xbox crap threads that go around
they are always blasting about which has the better graphics
instead of what they actually bring and what they will be bringing

yes PC still prevails all, but we must face it at the moment the PC gaming industry is failing due to crap being released and we would download the majority.....but then devs don't get the point of picking up their 'game'

 

[Phil the Nuka-Cola Dude]

dutch ghost has given a good point
forhekset has given a good answer, each side has each other to blame

it pretty much has come down to do what most of the audience in gaming now days are; young children
they have been all these privileges that they accept whatever is given to them, this is where fanboy-ism comes from
accepting GRAFIXS! more than story, poor gameplay and everything being just really dull
it also adds to the fact that it comes also the the education of children as they are also dumb as hell now then compared to like education in the 80s. (i will not go into the real problem here until needed )

More youth-bashing, the majority of gamers are between something like 18-34, not children as the atari generation would have you believe. Oh, and this really isn't the place to throw around 'fanboy'.

Games are being "dumbed down" because many developers are lazy twats that lack imagination. Its a hell of a lot easier to make a dumbed down piece of shit with pretty graphics than an innovative masterpiece with top-notch gameplay and story.

It has nothing to do with the age or intelligence of gamers, so stop peddling that shit because no one is buying it.


/rant


*edit*

yes PC still prevails all, but we must face it at the moment the PC gaming industry is failing due to crap being released and we would download the majority.....but then devs don't get the point of picking up their 'game'

Oh my god, you've got to be fucking kidding me. Not this uninformed shit again. PC gaming isn't going anywhere, and is absolutely trashing the console market in revenue. Hell, world of warcraft (bullshit that it is) makes GTA 4 sales look like a joke.

 

[Forhekset]

Games are being "dumbed down" because many developers are lazy twats that lack imagination. Its a hell of a lot easier to make a dumbed down piece of shit with pretty graphics than an innovative masterpiece with top-notch gameplay and story.

Why do these dumbed-down games sell so well? Doesn't that say something about the intelligence of the modern gamer?

 

[offside.beef]

yes it is true that games are dumbed down due to the fact that most devs lack imagination and are twats, but then we have devs that would break this barrier for something good, but then its fanbase would then bash it.

we won't take beths to this category cause they chose more bad than good.

for the new PoP they were taking it back to its original state, most of the fanbase would not accept the fact that the new one is not going to have the sands of time, they have taken it for granted.
Since its PoP it has to have the SoT.

which i am stating, most young gamers just accept what they are given, thinking that since its the latest its the best.

yes for WoW it has got a huge fanbase, but take for example CoD 4
they have redone the whole engine to suit the PC but their PC sales are very poor when you compare it to their console sales as most people had downloaded CoD 4 more than purchase it.
When they make a game that is multi-plat more sales are placed upon the console when compared the PC.

 

[Phil the Nuka-Cola Dude]

Why do these dumbed-down games sell so well? Doesn't that say something about the intelligence of the modern gamer?

Not really. It says everything about the quality of games being developed/released though. Gamers are always going to purchase games, and with the majority of games today being pieces of shit; a mediocre game (GTA IV) among a crowd of abortions (Haze) is going to shine like the fucking hope diamond.


This elitist shit is getting old.

*edit*

yes it is true that games are dumbed down due to the fact that most devs lack imagination and are twats, but then we have devs that would break this barrier for something good, but then its fanbase would then bash it.

Again, completely wrong. If a developer takes a well-known franchise, throws away all of the much-loved core gameplay in some misguided attempt at "breaking the mold" and gives it a facelift... obviously the fans aren't going to be pleased. If they expand upon the original and create an enjoyable/memorable experience, you can bet it'll sell well whether or not a few fans are disgruntled.

for the new PoP they were taking it back to its original state, most of the fanbase would not accept the fact that the new one is not going to have the sands of time, they have taken it for granted.
Since its PoP it has to have the SoT.

Prince of Persia : Classic got 'bashed' because it takes ~50 minutes to beat and has no replayability.

which i am stating, most young gamers just accept what they are given, thinking that since its the latest its the best.

Actually, all you're doing is perpetuating an inaccurate stereotype and making yourself look ignorant in the process. It is no different than saying "All black people like fried chicken, grape drink, malt liquor, and watermelon", or that "All gays love Liza Minelli and showtunes".

yes for WoW it has got a huge fanbase,

World of Warcraft's success has little to do with the prior success of Warcraft 1-3, they're radically different genres. It has everything to do with the addictive nature of MMOs.

but take for example CoD 4
they have redone the whole engine to suit the PC but their PC sales are very poor when you compare it to their console sales as most people had downloaded CoD 4 more than purchase it.
When they make a game that is multi-plat more sales are placed upon the console when compared the PC.

Where the hell are you getting your facts? Call of Duty 4's sales were poor on the PC? I suppose that explains why it has maintained the #2 most-played game slot on Xfire for the last 217 days right?

Poor Infinity ward, all of those Game of the Year awards and only 145,490 Xfire users playing it per-day.

If you're going to pull facts out of your ass, at least wipe them off first. I can smell bullshit a mile away.

 

[pkt-zer0]

Oh my god, you've got to be fucking kidding me. Not this uninformed shit again. PC gaming isn't going anywhere, and is absolutely trashing the console market in revenue. Hell, world of warcraft (bullshit that it is) makes GTA 4 sales look like a joke.

Well, one could say that bullshit like WoW massively outselling fairly decent games like GTA4 does indicate that PC gaming is dying, at least in a way.


Then again, there's Company of Heroes, Mask of the Betrayer, King's Bounty: The Legend, and the like, which still seem to avoid being "dumbed down for the console 'tards". Or "good PC games", if you will.

 

[offside.beef]

Where the hell are you getting your facts? Call of Duty 4's sales were poor on the PC? I suppose that explains why it has maintained the #2 most-played game slot on Xfire for the last 217 days right?

Poor Infinity ward, all of those Game of the Year awards and only 145,490 Xfire users playing it per-day.

If you're going to pull facts out of your ass, at least wipe them off first. I can smell bullshit a mile away.

have you taken to account to the people that play CoD4 on private lan patches and hamachi?
google search cod4 private lan patches you would then see there that most of the gamers would then be on those instead of dedicated servers.

 

[Phil the Nuka-Cola Dude]

Well, one could say that bullshit like WoW massively outselling fairly decent games like GTA4 does indicate that PC gaming is dying, at least in a way.

My god, can't you people think for yourselves and do some research?

PC gaming isn't going anywhere, it never has been, it never will be.






P.S - Despite all of the 10s being handed out like candy, GTA4 is mediocre at best.


P.P.S - If a review site is carpeted with paid ads for a game it has reviewed, you can bet said review is going to be full of shit.



*edit*

have you taken to account to the people that play CoD4 on private lan patches and hamachi?
google search cod4 private lan patches you would then see there that most of the gamers would then be on those instead of dedicated servers.

Please tell me you aren't claiming that the majority of gamers playing Call of Duty 4 are using cracked versions on Hamachi.

Are you even reading what you're typing? Or are you just typing the first thing that comes to mind and clicking Post
?
You should search '2 girls 1 cup' on Google. I'm sure the amount of hits would have you believe that the majority of females worldwide are shit eating lesbians.

 

[Jabu]

Why do these dumbed-down games sell so well? Doesn't that say something about the intelligence of the modern gamer?

Not really. It says everything about the quality of games being developed/released though. Gamers are always going to purchase games, and with the majority of games today being pieces of shit; a mediocre game (GTA IV) among a crowd of abortions (Haze) is going to shine like the fucking hope diamond.


This elitist shit is getting old.

I don't think the dumbing down has to due a lot with the lowering of av. IQs (which is incidentally actually growing, but thats more to do with the flaws of the testing method than rising inteligence), but I do think that people's expectations and wants, in relation to games, are changing, and not solely because of the industry changing itself. Games are being dumbed down, simplified --or to use the politically appropriate term--streamlined because, I think, among other things the vast majority people don't want complicated interfaces or game mechanics they can't immidiatley grasp or swallow without a bit of thought or concentration.

Target audiences have become bloated. Nowadays with extreme production costs and consequential heightend risk, the returns have gotta be equally big. In desperate search for more comsumers, games now cover a greater range of genres, meshing them into one (read: fps, fps, ocasionally tps and fps).

Plus, with the drones of people working on a single project, managing it all becomes quite a feat in of itslef. So like you said, games end up being simpler not to say duller; less game, less trouble.

 

[offside.beef]

Please tell me you aren't claiming that the majority of gamers playing Call of Duty 4 are using cracked versions on Hamachi.

Are you even reading what you're typing? Or are you just typing the first thing that comes to mind and clicking Post
?
You should search '2 girls 1 cup' on Google. I'm sure the amount of hits would have you believe that the majority of females worldwide are shit eating lesbians.

well i'm not going to bother dragging this on, Phil....
we'll believe what we perceive

 

[iridium_ionizer]

As a side note, what annoys me most about the whole toilet drinking thing isn't even whether or not it would be feasible in the real world (we're talking about a video game, guys). It's that in the first game, the main objective was to get a new water chip, because water was (naturally) an extremely precious resource. In Bethesda's vision of Fallout, though, water is everywhere! No need for a new water chip - just find yourself a toilet and lap that stuff up.

Of course Fallout 1 was set in Southern California most of is a seasonal desert (brown dead brush in the summer). It's only because of modern technology (loads of aqueducts, pipelines, reservoirs, dams, deep wells with submersible pumps, pumping stations, etc.) that the Southern California you see in Hollywood films is green at all (except for after winter rains). You would expect that Southern California would revert to a desert after a nuclear war destroys modern society and all of its infrastructure.

I'm not an expert in post-apocalyptic meteorology, but with all of the possible weather changes from a large scale nuclear war I would expect that the area surrounding Maryland and Virginia (most of the Southeast US is known for its greenery) areas would still have more water than Southern California. Maybe not in the toilets, but definitely more water.

Of course, I guess you could make the point that the ecology of Fallout was stylized (with plentiful use of brown) as a desert just to show how sucky a nuclear war would be. In which case I would have to relent that the original creators of Fallout would have intended that the D.C. area and everywhere else for that matter be dry and brown.

 

[terebikun]

P.S - Despite all of the 10s being handed out like candy, GTA4 is mediocre at best.

Actually, it's pretty damn good.

P.P.S - If a review site is carpeted with paid ads for a game it has reviewed, you can bet said review is going to be full of shit.

That's a pretty stupid assumption to make. Game Informer runs ads for games they've savaged in their reviews, and even sites like Penny-Arcade where I completely disagree with their gaming opinions, they have the honesty to not run ads for games they don't like. Game review sites make revenue from game ads. Shocking I know, but not cause for witch hunting. There are certainly sites where you can bet on favorable reviews for certain high-profile titles, but they don't make up the entirety of the game review world.

 

[Phil the Nuka-Cola Dude]

Actually, it's pretty damn good.

- Absolutely terrible controls.

- Loads of crashing.

- REALLY bad vehicle handling compared to 3/VC/SA.

- Broken auto-targeting.


Yet the paid-reviewers all hopped on the 10 bandwagon; simply glossing over the above issues, giving GTA4 a 'Perfect' rating to a far less than perfect game.

A title that wasn't as incessantly hyped as GTA4 would have been ripped to pieces for those problems. Or maybe if the reviewers weren't being babysat by the publishers in a hotel room while they played the game they could have formed a more thorough and honest opinion. The blame lies on both of their shoulders I suppose.

That's a pretty stupid assumption to make. Game Informer runs ads for games they've savaged in their reviews, and even sites like Penny-Arcade where I completely disagree with their gaming opinions, they have the honesty to not run ads for games they don't like. Game review sites make revenue from game ads. Shocking I know, but not cause for witch hunting. There are certainly sites where you can bet on favorable reviews for certain high-profile titles, but they don't make up the entirety of the game review world.

A stupid assumption to make would be that there isn't a conflict of interest when a site is wallpapered with advertisements for a game that it is supposed to be objectively reviewing. There is corporate pressure on reviewers to give a sponsored game favorable reviews. We all know about the gerstmann/navarro scandal, so don't feign ignorance for the sake of argument.

As for honest review sites, the only ones I can think of are destructoid/PA.

 

[pkt-zer0]

Well, one could say that bullshit like WoW massively outselling fairly decent games like GTA4 does indicate that PC gaming is dying, at least in a way.

My god, can't you people think for yourselves and do some research?

Wait, you mean WoW and Sims isn't outselling basically everything else? That's news to me.

 

[Phil the Nuka-Cola Dude]

Wait, you mean WoW and Sims isn't outselling basically everything else? That's news to me.

Read the highlighted text in the quote.

As I've said before, PC gaming isn't by any means dying; and the yearly growth is outstanding.

The only thing that is going to die are brick and mortar stores that sell said games, because it is becoming all about digital distribution.

 

[Forhekset]

Of course, I guess you could make the point that the ecology of Fallout was stylized (with plentiful use of brown) as a desert just to show how sucky a nuclear war would be. In which case I would have to relent that the original creators of Fallout would have intended that the D.C. area and everywhere else for that matter be dry and brown.

You make some great points about ecology that I'd never really considered. However, this last part that you wrote is what I always thought of while playing Fallout - that the whole world was a "desert" as a result of nuclear holocaust. I didn't think much about it past that.

I dunno, it just seems that Bethesda has trivialized what should be an extremely precious resource in a post-apocalyptic wasteland.