Rebuttal of Escapist's "Bethesda Killed Fallout" article

I would say that with Black Isle essentially gone, Obsidian unlikely to ever touch the IP again, and Bethesda being beneath contempt in their treatment of the IP... that the fanbase (which is all that matters anymore) can rightly salvage what's left of the IP canon from any credible sources available, and the FO:Bible is a credible source; possibly the last one that will ever be; unless Bethesada loses the IP or outsources it to ex-Black Isle devs again.
 
I would say that with Black Isle essentially gone, Obsidian unlikely to ever touch the IP again, and Bethesda being beneath contempt in their treatment of the IP... that the fanbase (which is all that matters anymore) can rightly salvage what's left of the IP canon from any credible sources available, and the FO:Bible is a credible source; possibly the last one that will ever be; unless Bethesada loses the IP or outsources it to ex-Black Isle devs again.

As a Star Wars fan it's a terrible thing for me, personally, that Disney owns the franchise now. They deleted the entire Expanded Universe. All of the games and books that I grew up with are officially non-canon, and the trash that Disney pumps out is considered "canon". I hate it.

So I can understand fans wanting to salvage what's left of the IP canon. I respect that.
 
They deleted the entire Expanded Universe.
Nah m8ty we've still got the clone wars cartoon. which, at least post season 1, is some of the best star wars media anyone could ask for. and they're bringing it back for further seasons. here's hoping it continues past the final battle of the clone wars and just writes over revenge of the sith. then we'll finally have a decent backstory for vader where the plot makes sense and he's actually a likable character.
 
This link is pretty clear about the Fallout Bible being non-canon. Straight from Chris himself. It was meant as a guide to help the devs create Van Buren. Bethesda can refer to it for help and even canonize parts of it, but that doesn't mean the entire document is iron clad canon.
I mentioned that, Chris said it shouldn't be canon, but Bethesda said it is canon and used it in their own Fallout games.
Didn't you see the quote from Todd Howard, the quote from Emil Pagliarulo and the example of Vault 106 I posted?

Also why are we talking about the Fallout Bible? IIRC it was something to do with the GECK? Even without taking into account the Bible, it wasn't a matter disassembler and then reassembler, that reassembled the matter into a non-radioactive state like Fallout 3 says.

The GECK was never like that, and I have no idea why we are dragging this thread talking about this.
 
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Clone Wars wasn't on the same level of canon as the rest of the EU. It was separated into tiers with the movies at the top, then clone wars beneath it, then all other books/games/comics. Still lost a massive amount of content.

Fallout Bible was discussed regarding the GECK being a box of seeds vs a replicator, I guess it doesn't really matter since fallout 3 could've had a different type of GECK anyway.
 
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It is possible to visit and explore the Mariposa military base, interact with the super mutants, and then leave; without firing a shot.
proof.gif


Even Harry can be reasoned with. Some Supermutants ignore the PC, others do attack on sight; and some are nuts... but that's to be expected.

i know i run into super mutants that just shit on humanity but you made a point that not all mutants are the same

I think it depends on what type of super mutant
 
game never says it so that justification doesn't work.

Fallout 2, Fallout 3, and the GECKs in both games are canon. If the GECK in Fallout 2 is seeds and holodisks, and the GECK in Fallout 3 is a terraforming device, then it's logically impossible for them to be the same item. They must be two different items with the same name.
 
If the GECK in Fallout 2 is seeds and holodisks, and the GECK in Fallout 3 is a terraforming device, then it's logically impossible for them to be the same item.
its also impossible for all FEV research to be moved to mariposa but also vault tec and MIT also have FEV. the same situation applies here.
which means that fallout 3 was written by a hack that straight up contradicts canon. they're only different items if the lore supports it. nowhere in the game does it say its the GECK MKII which would have been a really easy if but cheap fix.
 
Fallout 2, Fallout 3, and the GECKs in both games are canon. If the GECK in Fallout 2 is seeds and holodisks, and the GECK in Fallout 3 is a terraforming device, then it's logically impossible for them to be the same item. They must be two different items with the same name.

or some were fake ones

its also impossible for all FEV research to be moved to mariposa but also vault tec and MIT also have FEV. the same situation applies here.
which means that fallout 3 was written by a hack that straight up contradicts canon. they're only different items if the lore supports it. nowhere in the game does it say its the GECK MKII which would have been a really easy if but cheap fix.

Yea how Dare the Fallout US government that we know was kinda nuts lying and been irresponsible with the FEV

Your issues is that you expect this game to follow real world logic when they just don't

Why did Vault Tech have FEV? could be because Vaultech in lameman terms is just a wing of the Enclave? The enclave that is the US GOVERNMENT ?????
 
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The classic "It's a fantasy world so it doesn't need to have consistency" defense. Do people still use that unironically? Isn't that kind of an automatic L in any discussion?

Vault-tec wasn't a wing of the Enclave, also the Enclave didn't control the FEV and they weren't just "The Government" they were more a group of elites that included military personell, rich corporates, government officials and the like, they were more the "Deep State" than the government controlling everything. Vault-tec didn't even have anything to do with the FEV to begin with. The Super Mutants weren't the end project of the FEV experiment and they only came about after decades of experimentation by the Master, and he created them with a propouse. Now, because bethesda has the imagination of a teenager on anti-hyperactivity drugs they need to convolute new ways for there being a increasingly numerous amounts of what in the first game was explictly a freak discovery of a Mutated genius madman, and they also increasingly forget to give their existence a porpouse. You know, text book Shitty writing. Fanfic level.

In FO1: A man falls into vats of the FEV and after years of mutating and combining with other living creatures he emerges as the Master. He then starts experiments to see how the FEV could be used to help humanity survive and his most promising project is the Super Mutants, but even he doesn't know how to make them properly and comes to the conclussion that proper Super Mutants would be the result of using "pure humans" from Vaults as the base.

FO2: The Enclave after hearing about the debacle of the Unity and it's destruction, launches an expedition to find the FEV so they can experiment with it. To this end they use miners from Reddin to excavate the rubble, in a freak accident, several miners fall into the Vats, creating the Second generation super mutants. The Enclave later experiments with the FEV to create Frank Horrigan and the strand of the virus they will use to kill the inland population of the US with the exception of Vault Dwellers and the Enclave themselves.

FO3: This Vault had FEV and they tested it on it's population, even after the war, no idea what their end goal was but they created the Simpsons Super Mutants.

FO4: The Institute got FEV and created Super Mutants for ????? then released them into the surface for ????????

FO76: There was this place that had FEV and they threw it into the water for ?????? it somehow created super mutants despite the fact that those have to be Dipped in the stuff, not drinking it.
 
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Your issues is that you expect this game to follow real world logic when they just don't
okay, Pete Hines. its not about realism. its about consistency. in fallout 1 ZAX states that all FEV research was moved to Mariposa prior to the bombs dropping. seeing as ZAX is a military computer with military files found in a military base i'm gonna go ahead and say he's a reliable source on what the military was doing. so if all FEV research was at mariposa when the bombs dropped then how can Vault tek and MIT have FEV in such massive abundance? not only do they have FEV but both have FEV that produces a race that is shockingly similar to the race the master created with his own personally created strain. even if it fit in with established lore, which it clearly doesn't, its undeniably lazy and a coincidence so unlikely that is shatters suspension of disbelief.
 
or some were fake ones



Yea how Dare the Fallout US government that we know was kinda nuts lying and been irresponsible with the FEV

Your issues is that you expect this game to follow real world logic when they just don't

Why did Vault Tech have FEV? could be because Vaultech in lameman terms is just a wing of the Enclave? The enclave that is the US GOVERNMENT ?????
Ah... Its been a while since we had a Beth fanboy come here and try to make us "Bethesda hating trolls" see the light. This is going to be fun.
 
Ah... Its been a while since we had a Beth fanboy come here and try to make us "Bethesda hating trolls" see the light. This is going to be fun.

Is it possible for everyone to co-exist together in peace as Fallout fans, or is this one of those things where the factions are doomed to fight each other for eternity
 
When fans of Fallout 3, 4 and 76 resort to bullshit excuses to all the crap these games have and specially when they start to use the "it's a video game, it's not meant to be realistic", even though that's not what we meant because we mean in-universe consistency, then no. Even made worse when they say we are "Bethesda haters". We are not "Bethesda haters", we just hate poorly made games.


Some people here actually like Fallout 3 and 4 and have no problems discussing with everyone here. But they know these games are extremely flawed and poorly made and don't try to throw crap at everyone who dislikes these games.
 
Is it possible for everyone to co-exist together in peace as Fallout fans, or is this one of those things where the factions are doomed to fight each other for eternity
well since the two sidea are by definition at odds... no. people can like nu-fallout all they want. but the second they try to say they're good fallout games they're just flatout wrong.
 
Ah... Its been a while since we had a Beth fanboy come here and try to make us "Bethesda hating trolls" see the light. This is going to be fun.
Bethesda fanboy me? lol far from it but when there is stuff i like i will say it.
 
Yea how Dare the Fallout US government that we know was kinda nuts lying and been irresponsible with the FEV

Your issues is that you expect this game to follow real world logic when they just don't

Why did Vault Tech have FEV? could be because Vaultech in lameman terms is just a wing of the Enclave? The enclave that is the US GOVERNMENT ?????
Adding to what Graves said here:
okay, Pete Hines. its not about realism. its about consistency. in fallout 1 ZAX states that all FEV research was moved to Mariposa prior to the bombs dropping. seeing as ZAX is a military computer with military files found in a military base i'm gonna go ahead and say he's a reliable source on what the military was doing. so if all FEV research was at mariposa when the bombs dropped then how can Vault tek and MIT have FEV in such massive abundance? not only do they have FEV but both have FEV that produces a race that is shockingly similar to the race the master created with his own personally created strain. even if it fit in with established lore, which it clearly doesn't, its undeniably lazy and a coincidence so unlikely that is shatters suspension of disbelief.

Vault 87 timeline doesn't match with the previous lore F.E.V. related timeline.
Vault 87 construction was started on 2066 and finished in 2071, each vault was constructed for a particular objective, and Vault 87 objective was to work on the Pan-Immunity Virion Project in conjunction with Mariposa. But the Pan-Immunity Virion Project was only formed in 2073. So how did they managed to make a vault that had the objective of working on something that was only thought about 8 years after the vault started it's construction and 2 years after the vault was finished?
 
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