RPGCodex gathers Fallout 3 quotes

[xdarkyrex]

Out of context.

The comparisons were clearly drawn as a simple way of saying "they use the same engine" to the average idiot.
Read between the lines

So since you're so good at reading between the lines and reading minds could you please tell me what super powers you have to know for sure that The comparisons were clearly drawn as a simple way of saying "they use the same engine" to the average idiot. and not because the comparisons were actually dead on? The possibility for both DOES exist.


Like I said before, I agree with you that the media likes to do dumbing down these days, but that doesn't mean what they say couldn't actually be true or dead on the way they're quotes right now, in or out of context.

Mind reading?
No no no.
The game doesn't have anything in common with Oblivion other than the developers and the engine used. That much is painfully obvious.

 

[Punck_D]

Thats like me staring at two similar looking cars, and immediately assuming they have the same horse power and gas mileage.

No, like you see the difference when the cars are actually driven, you see it when Todd plays Fallout 3 what kind of game it looks like.

Everybody can distinguish between a solid CRPG and an FPS if seen. Those kind of statements need no context in my opinion.

 

[Tora]

When an author who did not play Fallout 1 or Fallout 2 but did play Oblivion and games like Gears of War write an article previewing Fallout 3

Not saying the rest of the argument is invalid, but just stating that a LOT of these previewers claimed to have played fallout 1/2 if not being fans of them.

Besides, this community seems to pride themselves greatly on being able to make up their own minds and not have their preferences and opinions dictated to them by the media. So why are we so quick to jump on and support every media report that even hints any any sort of negative opinion of Fallout 3?

Because being flooded with overly one-sided media articles makes people skeptical. not necessarily correct or logical, but I would be skeptical when I don't see ANY negative reviews on a product. Seems too good to be true. Everyone has different opinions on everything, and there's nothing such as a perfect product. So what is a minor flaw to one could be a major flaw to another. The fact that no one sees any major flaws tends to hint at Hype more than perfect product.

I would expect this community to be more of the mind of "I will try it myself and then pass judgement" rather than leap to conclusions based on the impressions of gaming media reporters formed after a one hour demo of the game.

Except it costs money yes? Not everyone's swimming in money, and the whole purpose of previews are to help people reach decisions and conclusions so that they don't have to spend money on release day and regret it afterwards. At least that was the old purpose of previews.

 

[VDweller]

Taking the quotes regarding how it looks VISUALLY as a sign that anything aside from the most basic physical similarities are present is not correct.

Are you saying that all these or even the majority of these quotes were made in regard to the game's visuals? Can you actually prove it or is it beneath you?

Media previews comparing Fallout 3 to Oblivion are only natural, but are essentially meaningless in terms of deciding whether Fallout 3 is "more like Oblivion than Fallout 1 and 2."

Does it look to you that there is even a small chance that FO3 could be more like Fallout than Oblivion? Are you suffering from some rare disability that prevents your brain from processing information?

A lot of people did actually like Oblivion...

A lot of people actually liked Halo. What's your point?

I have yet to play it myself as I don't have an Xbox 360 or PS3 and my PC is incredibly outdated, but I found Daggerfull extremely repetitive and devoid of any personality whatsoever and Morrowind only marginally less so.

Well, Oblivion makes Morrowind looks like a fucking masterpiece.

Regardless of what the Fallout fans on this site think of Oblivion, when someone who liked the game compares Fallout 3 to it, it is a favourable comparison and not a slam.

Favorable only if one liked Oblivion. For people who prefer well designed games, it's one of the worst things that could have happened to Fallout 3.

 

[VDweller]

The game doesn't have anything in common with Oblivion other than the developers and the engine used. That much is painfully obvious.

Painfully obvious? Then you wouldn't mind proving it, would you?

 

[xdarkyrex]

Thats like me staring at two similar looking cars, and immediately assuming they have the same horse power and gas mileage.

No, like you see the difference when the cars are actually driven, you see it when Todd plays Fallout 3 what kind of game it looks like.

Everybody can distinguish between a solid CRPG and an FPS if seen. Those kind of statements need no context in my opinion.

http://www.iep.utm.edu/f/fallacy.htm#Misleading Vividness

http://www.iep.utm.edu/f/fallacy.htm#Oversimplification

Think of those as examples of why it is irrelevant.

 

[Tora]

Mind reading?
No no no.
The game doesn't have anything in common with Oblivion other than the developers and the engine used. That much is painfully obvious.

it is? Maybe to you with your super powers, not to me, the mundane human who had to base everything off what I've read in previews.

Maybe my PE and IN stats are too low compared to yours for me to figure it out!

 

[xdarkyrex]

Mind reading?
No no no.
The game doesn't have anything in common with Oblivion other than the developers and the engine used. That much is painfully obvious.

it is? Maybe to you with your super powers, not to me, the mundane human who had to base everything off what I've read in previews.

Maybe my PE and IN stats are too low compared to yours for me to figure it out!

Well I do have a 10 in IN and PE

 

[Punck_D]

Think of those as examples of why it is irrelevant.

It could be hard for you, but yes, it is THAT simple. It looked like an FPS to some people who saw it. Period. No context needed.

And don't link me to some encyclopedia while discussing. That's really lame.

 

[Briosafreak]

The game doesn't have anything in common with Oblivion other than the developers and the engine used. That much is painfully obvious.

Er wait a second. I'm with those that say the game has more to do with DeusEx or System Shock than the other influences, either Oblivion, Fallout or Gears of war, but still nothing in common?

We are talking of a First Person game(check) using the engine that powered Oblivion (check), with real time combat (check), mini games (check), radiant AI (check), by the same development house (check), in a free roam world (check), with the same character creation way of Oblivion, a dual creation method (check), and fully voiced (check)...

This doesn't have anything to do with Oblivion ? What?

 

[Tora]

Well I do have a 10 in IN and PE

Damn, I must beat you good with my 10ST 10LK and 1 INT! Prepare for combat that you can't convince me out of because I'm too dumb to understand your language!

Though seriously, it be nice if Bethesda just stopped playing the hype game and gave people enough information on how things worked, and a bit more background. I'd rather know enough to be able to clearly take the game off my list or keep it on my list, instead of coming back here every day to read more articles out of the same mold.

 

[xdarkyrex]

It could be hard for you, but yes, it is THAT simple. It looked like an FPS to some people who saw it. Period. No context needed.

Exactly, and as such, this article is only limited to what it LOOKED like. Nothing more. And even then, JUST because it has guns and is first person doesn't make it a "mindless-action-game-clone of Oblivion", which is what is inferred by the list. It's loaded speech. Thats fallacious.

And don't link me to some encyclopedia while discussing. That's really lame.

Well I get tired of explaining the same things over and over again.
I've resorted to linking. That's not your fault, it's just based on past experience. It's tedious to point out where people went wrong all the time in my own words when I'm not nearly as concise and effective as that link. The link isn't long, it's very short and sweet. Would you rather I quote AND link?

 

[Tora]

Exactly, and as such, this article is only limited to what it LOOKED like. Nothing more. And even then, JUST because it has guns and is first person doesn't make it a "mindless-action-game-clone of Oblivion", which is what is inferred by the list. It's loaded speech. Thats fallacious.

But _I_ inferred from the list that it was just showing that it LOOKED LIKE a "mindless-action-game-clone of Oblivion".

 

[Punck_D]

Exactly, and as such, this article is only limited to what it LOOKED like. Nothing more.

How it looked while Todd was PLAYING it. It's not only about first person and guns, it's also about game mechanics that were seen working in this presentation. The action that was shown reminded people there of first person shooters.

This discussion is not about Fallout 3 being a shooter, but about being more a shooter than a CRPG, what also means being more an Oblivion with guns than a Fallout game.

 

[xdarkyrex]

Exactly, and as such, this article is only limited to what it LOOKED like. Nothing more.

How it looked while Todd was PLAYING it. It's not only about first person and guns, it's also about game mechanics that were seen working in this presentation. The action that was shown reminded people there of first person shooters.

This discussion is not about Fallout 3 being a shooter, but about being more a shooter than a CRPG, what also means being more an Oblivion with guns than a Fallout game.

No, thats false dilemma.

You are stating that it must be one or the other and can not in itself be a unique entity.

 

[Tora]

No, thats false dilemma.

You are stating that it must be one or the other and can not in itself be a unique entity.

I don't think so... he's stating its more of one than the other.... sorta like saying someone's more right-winged than left-winged in politics. Granted claiming someone's a right-wing nut when they're only slightly right-wing'd isn't exactly correct, but when they're the ones that provide the comparison themselves.....

 

[xdarkyrex]

*sigh* this is becoming more tedious then poignant at this point.

I'll get back to this later, and try to answer some of the posts I skipped or missed, too.

This is gonna be a real labor, haha.

Something tells me that when I'm finished I'm gonna get a lot of "TL/DR"