So, can we talk about what Fallout 4 does well?

Discussion in 'Fallout 4' started by J_Fred, Nov 17, 2015.

  1. J_Fred

    J_Fred Long time lurker

    286
    Dec 22, 2013
    Either as a Fallout game (which, admittedly may be limited), a FPS or even from a story/character perspective.

    I'll start.

    1. Power Armor gameplay. In Fallout 4, getting in the power armor and mowing down enemies in a minigun feels like what I imagined it to be in Fallout 1 and as an old school Fallout fan, this Power Armor change (it's a fucking tank now) and the Deathclaw animations are exactly what I imagine when I romp through Adytum to the Gun Runners in Fallout 1, or when I go on long caravan rides across the most dangerous parts of the wasteland in Fallout 2.

    2. Settlement building is a cool little addition. It's a bit gimmicky, sure, but I think it fits the world well, if it's not a bit too fast paced (you're building fortresses within a few days). But, overall, I like that this was included in the game.

    3. Companion quests. They aren't as good as NV (imo, at least not from what I've seen), but they are an improvement from 3, and there are times when I actually want the companions around to chat with them. Ignoring the talking player character (I do not like this, even if the voice acting is good), the conversations with companions, and even some standard NPCs are fairly engrossing, especially for a Bethesda game.

    4. Gunplay. I'm a bit mixed on this, as it is an improvement. Hit markers, grenade hotkeys, decent aiming and a bit of a cover system really add to the 3D fallout games. This is definitely an improvement over 3 and NV for the most part, at least without mods to those games. My ambivalence comes from the fact that Fallout isn't (imo) supposed to be a FPS, and this seems a move in the wrong direction, even if the mechanics are well done.



    That's kind of where I am. I'm enjoying the game as a Fallout inspired Bethesda game, but I think at this point Fallout 4 is a better game and Fallout game than Fallout 3 at least. I'd like to hear what you guys think Fallout 4 did right and/or improved. There's no shortage of critique of Fallout 4 (poor optimization, stripped RPG mechanics, lore inconsistencies, stupid story telling/quest (the 200 year old ghoul boy quest is asinine), etc...), but I think it's fair to talk about what Fallout 4 does right, at least when compared to 3 and to a lesser extent NV.


    So, any other thoughts?
     
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  2. Irwin John Finster

    Irwin John Finster Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Nov 13, 2015
    I'll try to say something nice about Fallout 4 after about 50 hours in the game, but I apologize in advance because I can't talk about Fallout 4 without also going into why it's a direct insult to previous fans.

    Power Armor looks cool.

    Everything that makes this game Borderlands is great and a vast improvement - all the mindless first-person shooting and MMORPG grindfest "go here kill this" quests are improved. In other words, this is a perfect Borderlands game. Too bad Borderlands is boring and shallow as they come. However, the voice acting is actually WORSE than Borderlands. The fact that I'm even comparing this game to Borderlands shows what an insult Fallout 4 is to fans. If this game was titled Borderlands 4 I would say it is a VAST IMPROVEMENT on the Borderlands series.

    Anything related to being an MMORPG grind is at least "well done" in the sense that yes, it's an MMORPG grind - the settlement building, procedurally generated base clearing quests (if they aren't procedurally generated, they might as well be), the fact that NPCs only exist to give you quests and not to talk to you with clever dialogue. All of this is what MMORPG grinds are about, and that is what Bethesda clearly set out to make. So in that sense, these are "good" things because that is what Bethesda wanted to do to Fallout.

    Gunplay is vastly improved. The Wasteland really feels like a dangerous place and when you're sneaking around the city in between large buildings you do get a sense of being in a dangerous situation with all the Raiders, Super Mutants, Ghouls, etc.

    If you have to brag about how one character can say 1000 names your game probably sucks.

    These are the only good things I can say about this game. Even the "humorous" quests that I enjoyed in Fallout 3 and New Vegas are dumb as rocks. I was thinking I would say something like "the writing is at least better than the Transformers movies" but then I released that it's not - Transformers and Michael Bay films have more artistic and intellectual value than Fallout 4.

    Soup Can Harry is a funny character you hear in a holotape.
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2015
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  3. Hassknecht

    Hassknecht For hate's sake. Staff Member Admin Orderite

    Aug 16, 2010
    I pretty much agree. Power armours feel, well, powerful, and that's a big plus. I would have liked it if there were different kinds of pwoer armour chassis and not just a single type of frame, but hey, mods will probably add that at some point.
     
  4. Magnus

    Magnus Water Chip? Been There, Done That
    Modder

    953
    Dec 6, 2007
    It sounds like we're on the same page.

    I'd like to add that I've reached the downtown Boston area now, and the city is hands down one of the most impressive things I've ever seen in a videogame. It's huge, it's wide open, it's everything I could hope for. Massive creds to the art department for this.
     
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  5. Big No

    Big No Watch as I open and close this door

    634
    Oct 28, 2014
    I like it's graphic style, I know a good amount of people say it's worse than most games for XB1 and PS4 but I think it gives it a sort of charm. Not too realistic but a bit "cartoonish", I don't think I would enjoy a Fallout game with uber-realistic graphics.
     
  6. Gaddes

    Gaddes Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    381
    May 18, 2010
    Power Armors, crafting and modding and general exploration. If you ignore the Z grade story and it's a decent game.
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2015
  7. MercenarySnake

    MercenarySnake Kept you waiting huh?

    Aug 22, 2015
    The power armor even though Deathclaws can one shot you in it and crafting(it would be sooo much better with realistic weapons and without stupid effects like radiation damage which was stolen from Borderlands.). That is all I can find nice about it after 30 hours.
     
  8. Gizmojunk

    Gizmojunk Half-way Through My Half-life

    Nov 26, 2007
    Fallout both pulled off, and got away with many things because of its simple graphics, and the sometimes horrific events they implied. During development of FO3 I truly wondered how Bethesda could get away with the same, using the far more detailed graphics I'd seen in Oblivion. And the answer was that they didn't even try.

    Compare the flamer attacks for instance, or any of the critical deaths from both games. I don't think they could have gotten away with a more realistic depiction of a female raider on fire rolling on the ground until dead, charring up and crackling into ash. Fallout pulled it off though. In FO3, the target of a critical hit death usually burst (comically) into six pieces, and/or giant chunks of red bloody mystery matter that clearly couldn't have come from inside of them.

    Is FO4 any different? I would imagine given the silly situation with ratings across multiple countries, that this was the right thing to do ~from a business perspective.
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2015
  9. Walpknut

    Walpknut This ghoul has seen it all

    Dec 30, 2010
    I agree with the first post. It's a solid action game, Power armor feels cool, Settlement building is a good idea if implemented poorly, companions have personality, the individual locations tend to have good level design and that's kind of it.
     
  10. MercenarySnake

    MercenarySnake Kept you waiting huh?

    Aug 22, 2015
    Oh I almost forgot to add that the first person shooting combat is really good but it seems the rest of the game suffered for it. I like the idea of the settlement building even though it's restricting and you can't make a wall around a settlement with hills since the snap to other items feature ruins it, should of had a manual and snap to toggle.
     
  11. Walpknut

    Walpknut This ghoul has seen it all

    Dec 30, 2010
    Also to clarify the GUNPLAY is better. The melee and unarmed tho? Terrible, you might as well just spam vats most times.
     
  12. Magnus

    Magnus Water Chip? Been There, Done That
    Modder

    953
    Dec 6, 2007
    Let me just power attack this guy - *WHOOOOSH* (throws a molotov cocktail at himself)
    Shit.
     
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  13. Chromevod

    Chromevod Nope.

    663
    May 25, 2011
    Yeah, I basically agree with the first post, just add in that I also enjoy weapon crafting. The simple act of wandering around, and just PLAYING the game is pretty fun for me. Tying in with the weapon, armor, and settlement crafting, I like being able to tag certain resources to seek out and then going off to scavenge them. Those elements are probably going to get me to come back and just muck about in the world for a while. Some people also mention that a lot of the sidequests are kind of MMO in their structure, basically amounting to fetch quests, go kill x wolves, etc. I don't really mind these so much because I actually like the combat in the game quite well enough. Funny, it's the departure from many RPG mechanics that makes this tolerable for me, while killing it as a Fallout experience.

    Honestly I can say I'll probably end up putting more hours into Fallout 4 than I did in 3, but I've still got a bunch of ideas for stuff I want to finish up doing in New Vegas too, so NV would probably end up getting more of my attention in the future. At this point, the reality of Fallout 4 is that I'm waiting to see what sort of interesting mods come out. If someone ever takes on the challenge of porting everything from New Vegas into Fallout 4 as a mod, like they're doing/have done for Morrowind in Skyrim, I'd be all over that.

    I'm still waiting on a graphics mod that fixes the shoulder clipping with Power Armor though. That's the first thing I'm looking for.
     
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  14. Walpknut

    Walpknut This ghoul has seen it all

    Dec 30, 2010
    Whoever made the gunbash-Power attack- And Grenade Hotkey the same button needs to be fired.... off a cannon.
     
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  15. Severite

    Severite First time out of the vault

    78
    Dec 19, 2008
    That.....sounds really, really terrible design :#
     
  16. MercenarySnake

    MercenarySnake Kept you waiting huh?

    Aug 22, 2015
    I watched and I am subscribed to your Youtube channel, how to you keep man handling those Deathclaws with melee VATs and I noticed the Skyrim giant launching you in the air "feature" is back but with that Deathclaw you killed.
     
  17. benwade

    benwade First time out of the vault

    48
    Nov 16, 2015
    Oh it doesn't just sound like a terrible design. It is a terrible design. It's also the same key used for ejecting Fusion cores for a 3rd level perk.
     
  18. WastelandMenace

    WastelandMenace First time out of the vault

    4
    Jun 16, 2012
    Very good map design

    Not only is the map huge (it's A LOT bigger than people give it credit for being) it's full of interesting areas to explore and see as well. I've 100 hours+ logged in to this game so far and have not visited every place yet. The only flaw IMO with the mapping of Fallout 4 is there's not enough major NPC settlements.

    Best crafting/tinkering system in the series

    The crafting system is simple, has lots of depth and is rewarding. I honestly didn't bother too much with New Vegas's crafting but I find myself doing it A LOT in Fallout 4. In fact, the system is so good I even do runs exclusively to find junk that I'd never pick up in previous titles.

    Good companions + system

    Companions like Nick Valentine, Danse, Piper are very likeable and also have interesting backstories - Nick especially. Not only that but they often have something to say for major quest's as well.

    Settlements

    Ever since I played the "Wasteland Defense" mod. for New Vegas I absolutely fell in love with the concept of building settlements in Fallout and defending them. I was so glad when this feature was announced for Fallout 4 and even happier when the feature turned out to be good.
     
  19. Walpknut

    Walpknut This ghoul has seen it all

    Dec 30, 2010
    I actually think th COmpanion system is actually pretty terrible, the dialogue system in general is pretty buggy with characters sometimes walking off dialogue because they started an animation and forcing you to restart conversations. They should've kept the Companion Wheel from New Vegas or copy JIP's Companion Control interface. Mapping everything to 4 buttons is just terrible.

    I like that Codsworth and Dogmeat can wear some pieces of clothes. Altho Codsworth only seems able to equip Bowler Hats, I wanted it to equip the Sea Captain's hat. Ended up giving that one to one of the Settlers in Sanctuary.
     
  20. Justalittlebaby

    Justalittlebaby First time out of the vault

    15
    Jun 7, 2015
    Very happy about the choice you're given in regards to helping a faction based on your choice.

    The quest where you go inside Kellogg's brain was also nothing short of amazing. Incredible way to give such an otherwise one-sided and dull mercenary character an astounding amount of backstory in so little time, and to even open up the possibility that the Gunner you shot yesterday might've had some backstory of his own.

    Speaking of backstory, Gabriel and the terminals at his location provided exactly what I just mentioned; in this case a new perspective on raiders.

    The Museum of Witchcraft was an extremely cool addition, and it was very well executed if you actually put yourself in the right mood for it and didn't just stomp through it in your X-01 Mark VI power armor (which I didn't do. Obviously).

    Voice-acting is performed very well in my opinion. I really don't see where the criticism is coming from.

    The dialogue-wheel (or whatever it's called), despite its shortcomings, is a very intuitive way to converse with NPCs, and there's only been one time that I haven't been satisfied with it (I talk a lot to NPCs by the by).

    Good to see the Brotherhood of Steel returning to their roots, although they are certainly more invasive in their methods this time around.

    Last but not least, the variety of enemies is a vast improvement from Fallout 3. Back then all you fought was super mutants, raiders or Talon Company mercs, pretty much 98/100 times, perhaps the occassional pack of ghouls or Enclave if you were lucky, but this time the variety in enemies and their attack patterns is just the right spice to make fighting them a little more worthwhile.

    Some things I agree with that's said before, I'll make it short: Modding weapons is great and fun, makes collecting trash strangely rewarding and being a scavenger SHOULD be rewarding in a post-apocalypse setting. Power armor is fun. Collecting power armor is even more fun. And having a jetpack making you able to climb buildings and stuff is such a joy, it really beats all expectations in terms of satisfaction. Combat received an overhaul that really helped, feels like a very good first-person shooter mixed with RPG elements, and it suits the game well. Awesome, awesome map design. Especially the city is incredible, as stated earlier. The verticality(what am I saying?) of it gives a new prospect on combat, with enemies on top of buildings shooting down at you and whatnot.
     
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