GlowHound
Look, Ma! Two Heads!
Unless you use the multiple companion glitch and have your extra(s) carry your equipment when you go in like I'm going to on my latest save.
I'm taking Cass with me.
I'm taking Cass with me.
So, can we talk about what Fallout 4 does well?
- Thread starter J_Fred
- Start date
Look, Ma! Two Heads!
Why would you do that? It kinda ruins the mood of the whole DLC...
ElderMaxson
Out of my mind, freshly made
Despite the atrocious voice here (playing a tough or emotionless character and doing a mocking voice just doesn't resonate right), this scene made me wonder if Bethesda just keeps throwing good ideas into bits where no one will find them. Creativity in dialogue that should've been everywhere, not just here.
And this may be a personal opinion, but I found that "The Last Voyage of the USS Constitution" was almost great, if only they had went into more detail over the scavengers who needed the ship's content (Piper's dialogue during this quest makes me wonder about the potential moral conflict present, but then the scavengers are portrayed as renamed raiders and the potential is lost). They should've also went further into characterizing more of the robot crew on board rather than name all the lower deck crew "Protectron".
Fallout 4 was less "disappointment" and more "killed potential" for me. It serves a small portion of everything rather than serve a large portion of something delicious, but it still holds up pretty well as an open-world, craft-focused, exploration FPS. Notice how I didn't add RPG into it - Bethesda finally killed their identity crisis and accepted Fallout as contenders for Far Cry and Stalker. No longer is the "RPG" part of it tied to life support and forced to beg for death. It's already dead, but at least that means they can focus on something rather than mess up at everything.
But yes, Fallout 4 starts a lot of things well (with the exception of the intro). The fact it fails to finish any of them, is the problem.
And this may be a personal opinion, but I found that "The Last Voyage of the USS Constitution" was almost great, if only they had went into more detail over the scavengers who needed the ship's content (Piper's dialogue during this quest makes me wonder about the potential moral conflict present, but then the scavengers are portrayed as renamed raiders and the potential is lost). They should've also went further into characterizing more of the robot crew on board rather than name all the lower deck crew "Protectron".
Fallout 4 was less "disappointment" and more "killed potential" for me. It serves a small portion of everything rather than serve a large portion of something delicious, but it still holds up pretty well as an open-world, craft-focused, exploration FPS. Notice how I didn't add RPG into it - Bethesda finally killed their identity crisis and accepted Fallout as contenders for Far Cry and Stalker. No longer is the "RPG" part of it tied to life support and forced to beg for death. It's already dead, but at least that means they can focus on something rather than mess up at everything.
But yes, Fallout 4 starts a lot of things well (with the exception of the intro). The fact it fails to finish any of them, is the problem.
GlowHound
Look, Ma! Two Heads!
For fun. I've already played through it before and I've never done it this way.
I'm not taking in super heavy duty stuff, though. Just a Lever-Action Shotgun, Lucky, and a few other toys.
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aenemic
Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
At first I really felt like this game really did nothing better than previous games. But after playing some more I do have some positive things to say.
1. Even if most quests end up having you kill stuff (actually, that's pretty much all quests), there is at least a bit more variety in how you kill stuff. Hard to put into words, but so far I feel that quests have had you do a bit more varied things. Unfortunately they involve very little dialogue, but things like having Dogmeat track someone is a nice change of pace (then there are parts of that whole ordeal that weren't well implemented, but that's a different story). Don't get me wrong, they could've done so much more and so much better, but I at least feel like they're trying to make questing more interesting.
2. NPC's, although boring, lacking personality and backstory, feel more "alive" than in 3 and NV. Most are more expressive and more animated. I know some people don't like this, but I think it's a big step up from Bethesda's usual lifeless dolls (which often become downright creepy).
3. Gunplay. So much better. If you insist on creating an fps, you better damn do it well. And they've taken a big leap forward. They still haven't remedied one of my pet peeves though - when shooting from behind something, even though your line of sight is clear, you may very well end up hitting what's in front of you because the hitbox is much bigger than what's visible.
4. Crafting. I like it a lot and think they've landed on a good balance here. Could've implemented more types of mods and more variation than the straight up increases/decreases to stats, but so far there's enough to tinker with that it keeps me happy. But I wish I could put a grenade launcher, a flamethrower or a flashlight on my gun. Stuff like that.
5. Level design is much more interesting. I love the verticality of it all, it makes the game world feel much bigger and more realistic. Being able to move over rooftops, having to climb tall structures etc - things the previous games sorely lacked.
6. Power armor. I like that it's this big, heavy thing that makes you really tanky, and I love the HUD for it. But it needed a bit more balancing, and I wish it wasn't so readily available. They could've introduced it as early as they did, but implemented something that put it out of use after the quest. Given you a taste for it, but then having you work for your very own suit, that is. Fusion cores also need to be a lot more scarce. I've decided never to buy them and only use the ones I pick up, that way I only use the power armor when I feel like I really need it. Also, they could very well have forced you to be in power armor to be able to use the heavier weapons, such as minigun and fatman. And maybe even made it impossible to use small arms. Oh, and made it impossible to sneak in it. Anything to make the use of power armor a more strategic decision, instead of pretty much gimping yourself by not wearing it all the time. Shit, if I had the time and patience to make my own mod for it, I would.
7. Layered armor system. Although I feel the options are very limited so far. Too many of the outfits take up all slots, and there are too few types of pieced armor types.
That's what I can think of at the moment.
8. I remembered another thing - magazines and bobble heads. I'm not gonna go into the skill/perk system, partly because I haven't really made up my mind about it, and also because it's not really relevant. But within the system they've decided to go with, I like how they've handled magazines and bobble heads. Some of them are less interesting than others, but having them do something else than just slightly increase your skill make them so much more fun to find.
1. Even if most quests end up having you kill stuff (actually, that's pretty much all quests), there is at least a bit more variety in how you kill stuff. Hard to put into words, but so far I feel that quests have had you do a bit more varied things. Unfortunately they involve very little dialogue, but things like having Dogmeat track someone is a nice change of pace (then there are parts of that whole ordeal that weren't well implemented, but that's a different story). Don't get me wrong, they could've done so much more and so much better, but I at least feel like they're trying to make questing more interesting.
2. NPC's, although boring, lacking personality and backstory, feel more "alive" than in 3 and NV. Most are more expressive and more animated. I know some people don't like this, but I think it's a big step up from Bethesda's usual lifeless dolls (which often become downright creepy).
3. Gunplay. So much better. If you insist on creating an fps, you better damn do it well. And they've taken a big leap forward. They still haven't remedied one of my pet peeves though - when shooting from behind something, even though your line of sight is clear, you may very well end up hitting what's in front of you because the hitbox is much bigger than what's visible.
4. Crafting. I like it a lot and think they've landed on a good balance here. Could've implemented more types of mods and more variation than the straight up increases/decreases to stats, but so far there's enough to tinker with that it keeps me happy. But I wish I could put a grenade launcher, a flamethrower or a flashlight on my gun. Stuff like that.
5. Level design is much more interesting. I love the verticality of it all, it makes the game world feel much bigger and more realistic. Being able to move over rooftops, having to climb tall structures etc - things the previous games sorely lacked.
6. Power armor. I like that it's this big, heavy thing that makes you really tanky, and I love the HUD for it. But it needed a bit more balancing, and I wish it wasn't so readily available. They could've introduced it as early as they did, but implemented something that put it out of use after the quest. Given you a taste for it, but then having you work for your very own suit, that is. Fusion cores also need to be a lot more scarce. I've decided never to buy them and only use the ones I pick up, that way I only use the power armor when I feel like I really need it. Also, they could very well have forced you to be in power armor to be able to use the heavier weapons, such as minigun and fatman. And maybe even made it impossible to use small arms. Oh, and made it impossible to sneak in it. Anything to make the use of power armor a more strategic decision, instead of pretty much gimping yourself by not wearing it all the time. Shit, if I had the time and patience to make my own mod for it, I would.
7. Layered armor system. Although I feel the options are very limited so far. Too many of the outfits take up all slots, and there are too few types of pieced armor types.
That's what I can think of at the moment.
8. I remembered another thing - magazines and bobble heads. I'm not gonna go into the skill/perk system, partly because I haven't really made up my mind about it, and also because it's not really relevant. But within the system they've decided to go with, I like how they've handled magazines and bobble heads. Some of them are less interesting than others, but having them do something else than just slightly increase your skill make them so much more fun to find.
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I have to confess that I actually like the Institute and the Synths, or at least the idea behind them.
To be honest I don't really mind that much that there is still a scientific organization with Pre War origins around discovering new knowledge and doing scientific research and development.
The Brotherhood and the Followers of the Apocalypse were much more about preserving pre war knowledge and rediscovering it, and what research the Brotherhood and the Enclave did was rather narrow minded; new weapons and such. (Big Mt at this point was no longer a center of research and development any more as the Think Tank was to focused on fighting Dr Mobius and escaping the perimeter field)
I would have liked it though if some of the Institute's background was better explained. For example that House had provided the CIT with a similar anti ballistic missile shield like the one he created for Las Vegas. That perhaps the Institute also had acquired the matter re arrangement technology that had been developed for the Sierra Madre (explaining where their resources came from), and that the Institute had developed microprocessor technology and more advanced miniaturization methods. (I don't mind the idea that microprocessor technology would exist in the Fallout verse as long as it is very uncommon)
The Synths are acceptable up to the point that they need human DNA for the basis of their construction which I think is a bad thought out idea.
If the idea would be that the pure artificial frame is coated with cloned organic tissue like the terminators is one thing, but if Synths are 'grown' than they rather are some type of 'biot' (biological robot) or clone.
It is a rather stupid plot device on the explanation on why the Survivor's son was kidnapped.
If I would ever make my own 'Fallout bible' for a pen and paper role playing session I would not mind having the Institute in it but I would make them perhaps a bit more indifferent rather than antagonistic. Basically a bunch of scientists who just want to be left alone to do their research and who use Synths as a labor and defense force. (and definitely not people who create yet more super mutants)
To be honest I don't really mind that much that there is still a scientific organization with Pre War origins around discovering new knowledge and doing scientific research and development.
The Brotherhood and the Followers of the Apocalypse were much more about preserving pre war knowledge and rediscovering it, and what research the Brotherhood and the Enclave did was rather narrow minded; new weapons and such. (Big Mt at this point was no longer a center of research and development any more as the Think Tank was to focused on fighting Dr Mobius and escaping the perimeter field)
I would have liked it though if some of the Institute's background was better explained. For example that House had provided the CIT with a similar anti ballistic missile shield like the one he created for Las Vegas. That perhaps the Institute also had acquired the matter re arrangement technology that had been developed for the Sierra Madre (explaining where their resources came from), and that the Institute had developed microprocessor technology and more advanced miniaturization methods. (I don't mind the idea that microprocessor technology would exist in the Fallout verse as long as it is very uncommon)
The Synths are acceptable up to the point that they need human DNA for the basis of their construction which I think is a bad thought out idea.
If the idea would be that the pure artificial frame is coated with cloned organic tissue like the terminators is one thing, but if Synths are 'grown' than they rather are some type of 'biot' (biological robot) or clone.
It is a rather stupid plot device on the explanation on why the Survivor's son was kidnapped.
If I would ever make my own 'Fallout bible' for a pen and paper role playing session I would not mind having the Institute in it but I would make them perhaps a bit more indifferent rather than antagonistic. Basically a bunch of scientists who just want to be left alone to do their research and who use Synths as a labor and defense force. (and definitely not people who create yet more super mutants)
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Dr Fallout
Centurion
I had an idea for the institute. What do you think?
[h=1]The Institute[/h]Creators: Various MIT and prominent US scientists.
Purpose: To continue various scientific experiments on synthetic life forms and advanced space travel well after the nuclear apocalypse. The original plan was to let this technology out to humanity, though trouble and surrounding hostility delayed this. Soon after the continued suspicion by the Commonwealth the plan was overwritten and replaced by the central committee, changing the goal to attempt ‘justified’ domination. The Institute itself wasn’t particularly interested in power and lording over others but wanted to spread knowledge and fairness to a bitter wasteland. Or so they say,
Events: The Institute didn’t survive the war in a unified manner, but more accurately went their own way with some going to vaults and others surviving by fate or some other method. However after the war various members joined up, forming regional bases which later re-joined. All this formed into the more disciplined Institute which continued and started various experiments such as Synths. By the time the Institute was fully formed the Commonwealth had sprang up, creating it’s powerbase in Boston and the surrounding area. The Institute was willing to cordially set up technology agreements, but the Commonwealth distrusted them, especially as they found out of an infiltration attempt including Synths. Currently there is a cold war between the two, as both are unsure whether to deal or destroy each other.
This conflict was forced aside as the Brotherhood of Steel (Midwest) found out of the technologically advanced Institute from traders and first-hand accounts. Suspicious of the possibility of a different technological force they marched in full force. After confirmations the BOS declared quarantine and war on the Institute. Anyone in the way was to be eliminated with extreme prejudice. The Institute has been hard pressed to fight the well armoured and equipped Brotherhood, churning out military Synths and hiring mercenaries to fight this threat.
[h=1]The Institute[/h]Creators: Various MIT and prominent US scientists.
Purpose: To continue various scientific experiments on synthetic life forms and advanced space travel well after the nuclear apocalypse. The original plan was to let this technology out to humanity, though trouble and surrounding hostility delayed this. Soon after the continued suspicion by the Commonwealth the plan was overwritten and replaced by the central committee, changing the goal to attempt ‘justified’ domination. The Institute itself wasn’t particularly interested in power and lording over others but wanted to spread knowledge and fairness to a bitter wasteland. Or so they say,
Events: The Institute didn’t survive the war in a unified manner, but more accurately went their own way with some going to vaults and others surviving by fate or some other method. However after the war various members joined up, forming regional bases which later re-joined. All this formed into the more disciplined Institute which continued and started various experiments such as Synths. By the time the Institute was fully formed the Commonwealth had sprang up, creating it’s powerbase in Boston and the surrounding area. The Institute was willing to cordially set up technology agreements, but the Commonwealth distrusted them, especially as they found out of an infiltration attempt including Synths. Currently there is a cold war between the two, as both are unsure whether to deal or destroy each other.
This conflict was forced aside as the Brotherhood of Steel (Midwest) found out of the technologically advanced Institute from traders and first-hand accounts. Suspicious of the possibility of a different technological force they marched in full force. After confirmations the BOS declared quarantine and war on the Institute. Anyone in the way was to be eliminated with extreme prejudice. The Institute has been hard pressed to fight the well armoured and equipped Brotherhood, churning out military Synths and hiring mercenaries to fight this threat.
gunplay was fun at first but now I am really getting tired of killing people like its becoming a complete ball buster. I had killed everyone in vault 95 ( like 30-40 people I believe) and thn I had to go back for a quest which didn't even work properly so I killed another 30-40 people again for no reason and if I this quest pops up and I can actually do it I will have to kill another 30-40 people again...
samturret
such a lust for revenge
Something i noticed was an attempt to make the settlements more believable. Diamond City has farms and a water purifier. Every other Settlements also has farms or you can build farms for them. I'd say this is a step up from Fallout 3, where the Megaton and Rivet City citizens apparently only survived on meat and pre-war food.
But being able to build water purifiers with some scrap makes the whole main story of Fallout 3 even more dumb. James needs this whole facility and a geck to make a water purifier while you can just build one with random crap you find in the wastes.
But being able to build water purifiers with some scrap makes the whole main story of Fallout 3 even more dumb. James needs this whole facility and a geck to make a water purifier while you can just build one with random crap you find in the wastes.
I have the feeling that Bethesda backpedaled a bit on quite a few of the utterly retarded things that were in Fallout 3. The Enclave (and its ugly power armour), the stupid water purifier, the utterly ridiculous vault experiments are a bit less ridiculous now (ok, there's still Vault 75 which is basically Little Grimdark. Seriously, what's with Bethesda and their obsession with teenage communities? I guess they're big fans of The Tribe there...), the Vault 87 supermutants, the White Knights of Steel...
Babysteps. Too bad they ruined it all by half-assing every positive thing, and going all out on everything terrible.
samturret
such a lust for revenge
Yeah, i really like the Broterhood of Steel in fallout 4. Super Mutants are still really fucking stupid, just there because ''It isn't a Fallout game without Super Mutant, right?''. And now they're suddenly green. Is there an explanation for this, actually?
Atomic Postman
Vault Archives Overseer
Before the release of Fallout 4, I was speculating that the Super Mutants were from the Capital Wasteland and had migrated after the Brotherhood learnt the location of Vault 87 from the Lone Wanderer. The BoS presence in Boston might have been explained by chasing down the Super Mutants, at this point I was assuming the BoS were the White Knights.
Apparently the actual in-game explanation is different, not entirely sure but I've heard it's yet another FEV Vault.
Apparently the actual in-game explanation is different, not entirely sure but I've heard it's yet another FEV Vault.
As far as I know it's the Institute, not a Vault.
Ilosar
Vault Fossil
It's the Institute. They tried to merge both strains of FEV (Mariposa and Vault 87) before moving on to Synths as their favored footsoldiers after it failed. The current director tried to revive the program to no avail. Which makes some sense but puts even more moral baggage on everyone's favorite mad scientists, as if they needed more.
As for me, I really enjoyed the USS Constitution quest. They could have made the salvagers more sympathetic, but you actually had a choice and (gasp!) high INT was actually relevant and allowed you to repair stuff instead of trekking around the wasteland to find components. Plus the dialog with Ironsides and Bosun was funny.
I also now have a full suit of Advanced Power Armor, oh oh oh (or X-01 as the game insists to call it). But it wasn't easy; I found it in a derelict building that wasn't marked on the map. The suit was sitting pretty on the second floor... except getting near activated an Assaultron and a Legendary Sentry Bot. The assaultron was a piece of cake, the Sentry Bot was not and shredded me twice before I managed to kill it. Once it mutated (which is a stupid concept but anyway) its minigun killed me in two seconds flat. I had to abuse the terrain a bit to finally turn it to scrap. On the plus side, the suit looks awesome, seems to have even better stats than the T-60, and its headlamp option actually makes the eyes glow. I'm like a kid with his new toy right now.
Yeah, finding a full suit of X01 is the best. There's an easier to reach set below the Abandoned Shack in the Glowing Sea, but it lacked the arms when I went there (might have been because of my level, though).
The Sentry Bot on 35 Court was brutal. Tight space, combined with an Assaultron... Harsh. Good thing I brought a lot of pulse grenades...
Ben Soto
Professional Salt Shaker
I haven't gotten the game yet, but I can still comment on this game's presentation and story.
- The mutants look a lot more... mutant-y. I like the green color (so much better than the ridiculous yellow shit F3 did) and the tumors and stuff make them look like big biological experiments rather than orcs and ogres.
- I like power armor now. There's subtle changes to the previously-established power armor, and while T-60 kinda contradicts lore, it more than makes up for it by essentially being what T-45 should've been.
- Guns look a lot better than before. I like the less realistic look some of these weapons have. They're bulkier and more detailed and I really like that. My favorite have got to be the laser pistol, the minigun and the assault rifle. I don't like the Ripper, though.
- The story, while a bit cliche, is leagues above anything F3 ever did. Despite what the general opinion maybe, Bethesda has gotten a lot better at telling a good story and it shows. It's not FNV, or even F1/2, but it's a step in the right direction.
- I don't care what anyone says, I like the voiced protagonist. I don't like the dialogue cross, but I really like the voiced protagonist. I prefer Nora to Nate, but they're both pretty good.
- I also like the new leveling system. I won't know how effective it is until I actually get the game, but it's better than the haphazard mess of F3's leveling, and I think it's better than the traditional leveling system of previous Fallout games on account that they're trying something new and unique and I like that.
- No Enclave. I maybe would've liked something like the Remnants, or something like those Japanese officers who fought WWII 'till the 70s (that's an interesting plot for the Enclave) but at least it's not completely and utterly horrible.
Atomic Postman
Vault Archives Overseer
How in God's name did MIT get their hands on Mariposa FEV?
They didn't. Its actually said that the guy working on the FEV project for The Institute has no idea where or how they got the FEV from.
He does mention working on multiple strains, but the guys at Vault 87 made multiple strains from the base FEV themselves, and nothing in the recording states the strains he was talking about were the Mariposa and Vault 87 strains. So the strains in question were just ones they made up in the lab themselves, and not the Vault 87 and Mariposa ones.
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Okay, I just find this a very badly conceived and written and it comes down to that Bethesda wanted an excuse to introduce yet more Super Mutants.
That scientists from the CIT were hired to work at West Tek is one thing but the Pan Immunity Virion project which research led into the FEV project was handled by West Tek (a corporation that had a genetics research department) and the government and it would be highly unlikely that Vault Tec (which was specialized in power sources and computers before adding preservation shelters) or the CIT (while MIT has handled projects for the government and government connected organizations such as NASA) which is quite public and thus would be more closely monitored by the Chinese for any government going-ons, would be given samples of FEV to experiment with.
West-Tek and later Mariposa offered secrecy, one was a corporate facility already known for its own top secret projects, and the other was a military base re-purposed specifically for FEV research and improvement.
I also find the idea ridiculous that the CIT managed to make it all the way to California to retrieve a sample of FEV (I think Mariposa was already destroyed by the Vault Dweller) or Vault 87 which is filled with hostile super mutants (thus requiring a small army to go along with the expedition).
Bethesda should either have done migrating Super Mutants from the Capital Wasteland if they were so damn insistent on using Super Mutants or better, just drop the damn subject. (along with the goddamn exploding population of feral Ghouls)
Yeah, I would not mind that idea.
I might have changed it so that the people that make up the Institute were not separated from each other from the start but like in FO4 they had taken shelter in a bunker underneath the CIT which construction had been funded by the government as part of its efforts to preserve its country's intelligencia. (perhaps the Enclave within the government saw the importance of preserving some of the scientific elite that weren't members of the Enclave but still to important to be left vulnerable like most of the US population which were considered expendable, as well as providing them with a self sufficient facility in which the researchers and scientists continue their research and development undisturbed in the anarchistic period that would follow after a nuclear war).
Alternatively the CIT managed to acquire funding through private means such as alumni like House who funded the CIT's private nuclear shelter project.
The CIT before the war was already working on androids that could truly mimic the human shape and pose as a human as part of a government project to create espionage agents and assassins. And this project still continued after the War but then for the Institute's own goal to reclaim the surface and rebuild human civilization. (they had robots like Protectrons and Mr Handy's but these were simply to limited in processing capacity)
When the Institute finally developed microprocessor technology and the means to miniaturize electronics on a scale previously impossible (and learned how to mimic the intricacies of the human body), true androids or 'synths' were finally possible.
The biggest problem I have however with these explanations is that we Fallout gamers ourselves have to come up with these to fill up the plotholes rather than that Bethesda's writers could be bothered to think this one out.
And I do think they had more than sufficient time to think about their concepts beyond the point of 'would this not be cool?'
just coming up with credible background and explanation is part of atmospheric story telling, giving us gamers a 'hey that could actually work' lightbulb moment rather than putting skeletons and teddy bears in funny poses and positions.
Again, I can live with the idea of the Institute, it having superior technology, and the Synths, they just need to be better explained to fit in the Fallout world because right now it really bends credibility to the breaking point.
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