UN Diplomats Walkout During Ahmadinejad Speech

[cronicler]

Patton89:
I am not talking about Israel at all. Your basic Arabian culture has been pumped with hate and trimmed for any sign of moderation / peace for a long time. European Powers played this game to get the clans riled up against Ottomans.

Adding on top of this pile of hate, English and French Diplomats managed to create an extremely divided region at the end of WW1. Just search for "Churchill's Burp" Millions have died on those damn borders. And guess what? Only 1 of those regimes/families west supported is still in power.

Soviets and Allies used the same methods to discredit each other. Anyone who had moderate views were seen as security risks and shut down.

Meanwhile the world economy gave tremendous power to the regional leaders.
They are raking the cash from nothing. Do you believe those leaders would do anything to enrich their country except making 24 tee golf courses on deserts?

So you have a lot of poor, semi literate, supersititious and misguided people who can only think at clan level. They are told that others are evil and must be killed.

What I am trying to point out with this explanation is the fact that it doesn't matter what Israel does or does not.

Anyway on topic: Ahmedinijad is probably the worst thing that has happened to "western" countries in the last 50 years. The man is actually a very canny politician and knows how to talk unlike rest of the leaders of region. If / when they let him talk he can use the poor position Israel is in to rip them apart.

I guess thats why US is trying so hard to blacken his name in public and Eu diplomats try to block him at every step. If he gets to speak freely then it would be really bad for a lot of different groups.

 

[Patton89]

To say that the entire arab culture is just hate and has no room for peace is ridicilous and its bigotry, you cannot apply this universally, same goes for the clan thinking.
Yes, middle-east isnt as "great" as west,nor are all of the countries doing well, nor is it as advanced , but you know,

So you have a lot of poor, semi literate, supersititious and misguided people who can only think at clan level. They are told that others are evil and must be killed.

can be applied to many republicans , clan part removed, they really thinked that commies were evil, and now they thik that muslims are evil, and they believe in a magical sky daddy and spirits, they cant spell, many of them cant even find europe on world map.
Do our leaders really care about us ? You should think about this.

Ottomans tried to enforce turkish language upon the areas they controlled, naturally anyone would rebel against such actions, you seem to miss this. And also they tried to centralize their empire, that had been more loosely governed. Europeans didnt need to "pump" hate. Arab nationalism surged already, as would have in any culture and country.
European powers loaned money to many middle-eastern countries, and then used that debt to increase their influence.

I know that europeans created the mess, i know the british actions of dividing the area, but yet you have not given me enough proof so you could write ENTIRE culture off as hopeless, or to make israels actions meaningless. Any action will have a counter reaction.

 

[Crni Vuk]

Well their God isn't exactly very clear about that as what he says, what he does, and what his proxies do don't exactly agree.

Yeah but if I remember correctly most roots of the abrahamitic religions say something about "you shall not kill" or something. I mean yes ... as soon you start to argument with religion it becomes a very complicated topic. But the issue is just that many people (not just jews and moslems though ...) start to use the "bad" interpretations of their religion, like defence against everyone, attack of the non-believers is not realy murder etc. you know the whole "god wants it!" gibberish stuff. But whats with forgiveness? grace of charitiy? Simply "not killing" ?

Religion is always a matter of "interpretation". But you dont have it always do construe it for the benefit of violance as like some arch-conservative believers do cause many times enough it was done anyway just for the strugle of power and resources by either side may it be christian, moslem or jews.

People should start to get their own oppinion about the religion they seem to follow like sheeps (or better lemings ...). And when I see quite some of the new generations in Israel, students of both sides Jews and Palestians, they seem not to share all of the oppinions like some of the hardliners and would want to coext peacefully. People should take a example from them.

 

[cronicler]

Ottomans enforced the use of Ottoman (A mix of Middle Asian Turkic, Persian, a little bit of Arabic and French at the end of Ottoman reign) on the regional leaders and people who did business with other parts of the empire.

Despite the withering tone of my posts, I am interested in Middle Eastern, Persian and Western Hindu cultures. All of them were the most modern cultures when they were young and like the religion I was born into, all of them have bogged down on artificial controls that stifle them to death.

Call me irrational but any culture that has direct connection to the middle east just goes on the same route. They stop caring about airy and useless things like poetry, finding out how and why things happen, They stop caring about anything that is not in their closest range.
Feed more untruths, add more control, feed more, add more and in the end everyone from top to bottom believe the lies that were told to control the lower classes.

Btw you are aware that my country is also considered in the raghead zone too, aren't you? Even here in this "Secular" country, there are now neighbourhoods where my gf can't enter wearing jeans and holding my hand or we will get into a fight within 5 minutes.


This is not about Arabian or Western cultures. When people in power manage to feed useless things and untruths to the populace, you get this. Western mentality and using religion untruths create the "republicans" and "liberals" and "hippies" and whatever.
Middle Eastern Mentality and Religion untruths create blind hate.

And you know what is the most hurting fact is? The bastards that started the lies are so caught up in the lies that they also believe them.

 

[Ratty Sr.]

While I think that Jews have a right to a place to live, I think that the place that was given to them was retarded and moronic.

I can think of several reasons why Palestine was given back to the Jews in the aftermath of the WWII, and all of them are pretty good:

1. It is their one and only ancestral homeland.

2. As a direct result of the Zionist movement and its influence, there was a constant stream of Jewish immigrants into Palestine and a lot of Jews were already living there prior to the establishment of Israel.

3. None of the western powers wanted Jews on their soil, let alone give up national territory to create a Jewish state.

4. Last but not the least, the major powers wanted a powerful ally in the oil-rich Middle East, and a Jewish state in Palestine seemed like a suitable candidate.

 

[cronicler]

4. Last but not the least, the major powers wanted a powerful ally in the oil-rich Middle East, and a Jewish state in Palestine seemed like a suitable candidate.

"Sir Ronald Storrs, the first British military governor of Jerusalem explained that the Zionist “enterprise was one that blessed him that gave as well as him that took, by forming for England ‘a little loyal Jewish Ulster’ in a sea of potentially hostile Arabism.”

 

[Crni Vuk]

well strange is though that in the begining the brits tried to stop jewish imigration to israel (before the state was created). I think I seen once a documentation about it. THey have send waves of ships with only jews on board back to europe just to see them try it later again.

While I think that Jews have a right to a place to live, I think that the place that was given to them was retarded and moronic.

I can think of several reasons why Palestine was given back to the Jews in the aftermath of the WWII, and all of them are pretty good:
...
3. None of the western powers wanted Jews on their soil, let alone give up national territory to create a Jewish state.
...

You think that is/was good ?

 

[Slaughter Manslaught]

cronicler, Are you from Turkey? Judging from one of your comments, it seems you hail from Turkey. I've heard good things about that place. Seems to be the saner area of the Middle East.

 

[Ratty Sr.]

You think that is/was good ?

When I say they are "good reasons", I don't mean good in general, but good from the perspective of western policymakers who decided to create the Jewish state.

 

[Chancellor Kremlin]

To summarise, this is all Yasser Arafat's fault.

 

[cronicler]

Slaughter: Yes I am and yes this place is on the saner side. As the real Muslims of Middle east don't count us as real Muslims and the Balkans hate our guts by default and our inept politicians managed to piss every Turkic country in Asia; we have been slowly steaming with our inner stupidness.
Unfortunately this place has become a spy playground; You should be ok for holiday if you are not connected to any military or economic secrets

 

[Zeal]

If a country like Iran gets the H-bomb, the cold war terror we all lived until the "iron curtain" fell, will feel like a day in the spa...


Edit:

You think that is/was good ?

pragmatic reasons = good reasons

Umm, a retard would develop into industrial and agricultural power with the amount of money tha has been pumped into Israel.

And where did the money come from? They found it at the end of the rainbow?

How many billions go into the midle east? How many people go hunger?

You basically said winning the war had given them the right to stay there.

Err... how do you think nowdays borders were determined?

If Israel keeps doing these acts, we cant support them. How can we support something like that without undermining the values that are considered to define the west. (human rights , freedom)

.... What?!.... Are people really that oblivious? or was it a typo and you meant hamas or/and palestine? (since its the same basically)


Ah hell, i arrive too late to this, cant reply to all irreflected remarks...

About the nose, is there some place in the web where u can play "hit president of iran with a clown nose"?

kinda like the one with the shoe and Bush..

 

[Crni Vuk]

...

You basically said winning the war had given them the right to stay there.

Err... how do you think nowdays borders were determined?

Well I guess a few forgot how the US acquired its autonomy. Or a few other pretty "young" nations like Finland which got its autonomy around the first world war and has defend itself quite a few times pretty hard against Russia.

I think its not so much the question about if it is "right" or "wrong" what happend around Israel and the state. But fact is that the situation cant be restored how it was 50 or 20 years ago just as we can not decide to give Spain back the "rights" over South America or North America back to Britain (which they as well acquired from the native populations with fighting ...) But sadly quite a lot of Jewish and Islamistic radicals would like to see some parts of the "past" restored which will not happen.

 

[cronicler]

Sigh, Crni just look up the winter war will you. See how winning the war on the field (or fighting it to a draw) allowed the Finns to loose only all of their strategic defense depth by big chunks on the peace talks.

Except the American colonies (north and south) no one in the world was given the breathing room to be Free.