Gun Control

Discussion in 'General Discussion Forum' started by Throatpunch, Jul 25, 2016.

  1. Crni Vuk

    Crni Vuk M4A3 Oldfag oTO Orderite

    Nov 25, 2008
    Conindering how shallow you are, it sure wasn't a deep cut.

    I am the supreme court of the united states?
  2. valcik

    valcik So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Dec 20, 2008
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 1
  3. GonZo_626

    GonZo_626 Well Shit!

    Jul 29, 2016
    Well right now in my lovely home country of Canada the Gun Control debate is raging once again because some (self censoring for fear of being called racist) people have been illegally obtaining guns and shooting one another. Now the CBC is the Canadian version of a government paid for progressive news source put out this wonderful article.

    Handgun bans no silver bullet in attacking senseless gun crime

    Is a nation-wide handgun ban a necessary restriction on individual liberty?

    Brian Pfefferle · CBC News · Posted: Sep 20, 2018 11:30 AM CT | Last Updated: 6 hours ago

    Senseless gun violence shook Canada on multiple occasions this summer, thrusting the issue of tougher and more restrictive gun laws back into the public conversation.

    Municipal governments in both Toronto and Montreal have declared a call to action. The federal government now plans to study the possibility of a full ban on handguns and assault weapons in Canada.

    But what action, if any, should the federal government take? Is a nation-wide handgun ban a necessary restriction on individual liberty?

    Canadian gun ownership: bearing arms a privilege, not a right

    Firearms owners in Canada often possess firearms for more than just protection. Target shooting, collecting and wildlife hunting are all legal reasons to own guns. These types of use unquestionably generate economic benefits for our country.

    Canadian citizens can only obtain a handgun licence if they are a target shooter, a collector, or need a handgun in the course of their employment.

    It is important to note the debate around guns is very different in Canada than the United States. Justice Peter Cory of the Supreme Court of Canada commented on the distinction in the case of R v Hasselwander, [1993] 2 S.C.R. 398 when he wrote, "Canadians, unlike Americans do not have a constitutional right to bear arms."

    Not just any Canadian can own a gun.
    - Brian Pfefferle

    More recently, the Canadian Supreme Court described gun ownership in Canada not as a right but rather a heavily-regulated privilege. In the case of R v Wiles, [2005] 3 S.C.R. 895 Justice Louise Charron remarked, "The state interest in reducing the misuse of weapons is valid and important. The sentencing judge gave insufficient weight to the fact that possession and use of firearms is not a right or freedom guaranteed under the Charter, but a privilege."

    As a result, not just any Canadian can own a gun. To legally buy and own firearms and ammunition, you must be at least 18 and have a firearm Possession and Acquisition Licence (PAL). Canada also requires residents to pass a written and practical exam.

    After these exams are completed, the applicant must pass a detailed background check which can consider an applicant's mental health and domestic relationship histories. Contrary to what some believe, a PAL doesn't allow you to carry firearms for self-defence.

    Most handguns are classified as "restricted" under the federal Firearms Act. Owners of restricted firearms need registration certificates from the federal government and special permits from their province's chief firearms officer to transport their weapons. Transport and storage of restricted firearms is heavily regulated.

    Gun violence reportedly on the rise

    Proponents for strict gun laws and handgun bans often cite statistics. Some appear to suggest a recent spike in hand gun-related crimes.

    Statistics Canada reported that "More than half (60%) of firearm-related violent crimes involved handguns in 2016." It also declared that "in recent years, firearm-related crime has been increasing—while most other types of crime have been on the decline."

    The reality is that violent crime involving firearms will often be committed by non-lawful gun owners.
    - Brian Pfefferle

    The Canadian judiciary has also commented on gun violence as a growing societal problem. More than 10 years ago, Ontario Superior Court Justice David McCombs said, in the February 2008 bail decision of Awet Zekarias, "Guns have become a scourge in our community. People have become justifiably fearful that gunfire may erupt at any time, even in crowded popular areas frequented by law-abiding citizens."

    These comments read as ominous foreshadowing of this past summer.

    The handgun ban 'solution'

    It seems easy enough.

    Handgun use in violent crime is reportedly increasing. Human lives are certainly worth more on balance than the social benefits associated with sport shooting, collecting or a feeling of personal safety achieved through gun ownership.

    So we can solve the hard problem of increased gun violence — particularly handgun violence — by banning the lawful ownership of handguns.

    Easy. Pass the law already.

    Not so fast…

    It is often said that "hard cases make bad laws."

    While a total handgun ban makes sense on a superficial level, many lawful gun owners are appropriately skeptical that such a ban would be anything more than symbolic. I suspect that almost all of those same lawful handgun owners would happily turn over their restricted firearms if they truly believed that banning these weapons would actually solve the gun violence problem and actually save lives. Emphasis on the lawful.

    The reality is that violent crime involving firearms will often be committed by non-lawful gun owners. It often involves illegally possessed weapons.

    While there is always the possibility that lawfully owned guns will enter an illegal market, either through theft or illegal sale, one wonders how we can drain the Canadian streets of illegal handguns and millions of other firearms once the legally owned handguns are banned. Is the pool already too big?

    A reported 839,295 restricted firearms were registered to individuals or businesses in Canada in 2016, according to the RCMP. This obviously doesn't include the underground restricted weapon market.

    Tracking the numbers of illegally possessed handguns is impossible. Those familiar with the gun-control debate have also heard, "the only thing that can stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun." So would banning lawfully owned handguns actually contribute to the problem?

    The handgun ban may also have little effect on gun violence generally. Surely those desiring to shoot someone with a handgun could use a different gun if a handgun was not readily available.

    Although handguns are easy to conceal and store, many traditional long guns can be easily modified and "sawed off" to — illegally — make them more concealed. Zip-guns or homemade firearms, like the one used recently in downtown Saskatoon, are also easily fashioned by criminals.

    No quick fix: solution to the problem will require dialogue

    Senseless acts of gun violence — like all senseless acts of violence — are a rogue element of our civilized society. Incidents of senseless gun violence have become a depressingly regular occurrence.

    The federal government is appropriately reviewing gun laws to determine if changes can actually improve overall community safety. Unfortunately, like all politically charged debates, voter opinion can influence the ultimate decision.

    Finding a solution to these issues will not be easy. it will require open minds, something we rarely see during gun debates.

    It would be nice to see the government ignore the polarizing rhetoric on gun control and individual gun-owner rights and make only necessary and measured amendments to firearms laws — ones that seek to actually improve the lives of Canadians and not simply appease voters.

    I suspect that those who believe the obvious solution to increased gun-violence is banning handguns may find that, like most "obvious solutions", it is not a really a solution at all.

    If you cant tell I really like that last line.
  4. Crni Vuk

    Crni Vuk M4A3 Oldfag oTO Orderite

    Nov 25, 2008
    Well, good thing that no one here ever said we should bann hand guns. I am with you, there is no reason to bann weapons completely.
  5. GonZo_626

    GonZo_626 Well Shit!

    Jul 29, 2016
    Yeah we have them heavily restricted here as you can read through the article. I would love to carry one while out in the bush (and we have lots of that here, vast empty areas of it) but that is a no go here.
  6. MutantScalper

    MutantScalper Dark side in da houssah

    Nov 22, 2009
    I must be strange but I can always tell if a chick is under 20. So, to me it's really not an issue. And I also don't see guys molesting underaged chicks as the victims here, nope.
  7. Arnust

    Arnust Maybe you've seen it, maybe, in a dream...

    Feb 2, 2016
    Oh, the terror of #metoo, underaged girls in the victim role not being as criminally responsible as a grownass dude cultprit that was using the faggiest dating site I've ever seen. Yeah, getting your birth date wrong on an online registration should totally override your rights, that's totally not a theme of this same thread that has gone on forever.
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2018
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 1
  8. MutantScalper

    MutantScalper Dark side in da houssah

    Nov 22, 2009
    You are like one of the judges on it yes. A 'decider' for life here on NMA. If you say someone's a a-hole, then that's how it is and Hass approves it.

    But you're not like Kavanaugh, you don't drunkenly rape 15 year olds.

    Wait, Kavanaugh almost raped a 15 year old and now this Cody Wilson has too? What is it with GOP figures and sexual deviancy and pedo stuff?
  9. Cimmerian Nights

    Cimmerian Nights So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Aug 20, 2004
    Oblivious demonstration of ideological blindspots.
  10. DarkCorp

    DarkCorp Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Oct 27, 2003
    In regards to the girl signing up on to the site and lying to do it.

    Technically, the burden is on the older person as he should 'know', better. Of course it is stupid that men have to 'card', girls they are thinking about having a fling with but oh well, this is the society we live in.
  11. MutantScalper

    MutantScalper Dark side in da houssah

    Nov 22, 2009
  12. GonZo_626

    GonZo_626 Well Shit!

    Jul 29, 2016
    Well of course not, they are heavily armed with little gun control...…….
  13. MutantScalper

    MutantScalper Dark side in da houssah

    Nov 22, 2009
    They're going to go and attack the Texas cops and other public sector employees who are upholding the law (including gun laws) and bust that guy free?
  14. GonZo_626

    GonZo_626 Well Shit!

    Jul 29, 2016
    No I was just saying why you don't mess with Texas, if you noticed I only quoted that part, and for a reason. Like the 99.9999% of legal firearms owners I have a vast amount of respect for law enforcement officers, after all a lot LEO's are legal gun owners and NRA members themselves.
  15. MutantScalper

    MutantScalper Dark side in da houssah

    Nov 22, 2009
    Yes, must be really nice for the US cops that their nation is so saturated with guns. Norwegian cops are green with envy when they drive around with their service weapons only in their car and not on their belts. So nice when US cops arrive to a crime scene and everyone is armed and they don't know who the bad guys are. As a bonus they get to bury their colleagues and sometimes are wounded or dead themselves.

    Btw there is nothing "national" or "federal" about the NRA, it's a private entity, the PR-firm of the US gun industry.
  16. GonZo_626

    GonZo_626 Well Shit!

    Jul 29, 2016
    Hmmm seems to me an organization that works in all parts of a nation can call itself "national". Yes we also know you drank the leftist media Kool-Aid.
  17. Cliffy McEdgeface

    Cliffy McEdgeface bitch I will cut you

    Jun 28, 2018
    Oh, didn't you know? Women/female human beings are NEVER responsible for anything they do. It's ALWAYS a man's fault. Are you drunk as a skunk and half-passed out on a bed? Sally the THOT can get a little tipsy, walk in, sex you up without your consent as you gurgle incoherently in a drunken stupor, and then accuse YOU of rape. And there's a good chance it'll work. See, you're both drunk, but she can't consent while drunk. Your consent doesn't matter, of course. Silly man. We all know men always want it.
  18. Arnust

    Arnust Maybe you've seen it, maybe, in a dream...

    Feb 2, 2016
    Yes, because totally all sexual abuse instances are actually just dindu nuffins from both exactly equally drunk parties, didn’t you know. It’s always dodgy definitions of consent, and not the judges letting the dude off in a handful of months of community service because allegedly she didn’t say no enough. And of course, nobody cares about the reverse scenario, ever.

    But hey, she/he should have had a gun! That’s a good segway back to the original topic away from dickheads mad at rape culture (very) slowly going away, right?
  19. Cliffy McEdgeface

    Cliffy McEdgeface bitch I will cut you

    Jun 28, 2018
    What's the dumbfuck saying, I don't care enough to unblock his stupid ass.
  20. GonZo_626

    GonZo_626 Well Shit!

    Jul 29, 2016
    And this is why a real conversation cannot happen. One is too machoistic, the other with there head buried. To actually solve the "rape culture" hard conversations have to happen, hard and uncomfortable conversations like where in the hell were that 16 year old's parents while she committed fraud to prostitute herself off on the "lamest dating site", or what did you think would happen when you went to a movie producers hotel at 3 a.m. to "read the script". Yes when you put yourself into a stupid situation bad shit happens, and while not your fault there is obviously something you could have done to prevent it from happening. I also think the soft on criminal leftist approach is to blame for any repeat offender, just castrate those that do are guilty. Chemical castration has been recommended for pedo's who cant control themselves by mental health professionals. And where is all the talk of this in other non western countries, you know the one Mutant keeps saying the Americans are there to kill brown babies. These countries are rampant with sex assaults, where is the outrage and demand that they change, and how do you force that change on them? I tell you, by doing what America has been doing, they fixed Europe into the shithole it is now that is free to hate them.

    Also and correct me if I am wrong here but from my limited understanding of consent laws in Europe, it seems like this would not have been a crime as she is of consenting age (16 in most of Europe).