Fallout 3 OXM 10/11 confirmed

[Brother None]

Although the OXM review still seems to be mostly hidden out of view (perhaps more from this magazine later), the 10 (out of a possible 11) score has been confirmed (in the same mag Fable II got a 9.5 and Dead Space a 6.5), and here is the conclusion and the bullet points:<blockquote>By now, you've probably noticed that we're giving Fallout 3 a big ol' score, so in the interests of quelling any outcry - no, this game is not perfect. In particular, we really wish that Bethesda had worked more on the dialogue system. In this post-Mass Effect era, it's disappointing not to hear yourself talk and to have to pick your dialogue options from big blos of text. Other quibbles: NPC chatter often overlaps in a confusing tangle, the third-person view is more than a bit crap, and we were always bummed that in such an otherwise-detailed world, no one noticed the corpses of their friends who we'd just stealthily killed. The biggest annoyance, though, is not being able to fast-travel unless you're outside - commuting sucks enough in real life, so we really resent it in our games!

But those points really are quibbles at worst. Our 40-ish hours of game time over four days at Bethesda's Maryland HQ went on fast-forward. We often forgot to eat, and we begrudged bathroom breaks. Games this captivating don't come along often. Between its engrossing story, ginormous world, well-crafted RPG side, and white-knuckle FPS combat, Fallout 3 completely, utterly gives you your $60 worth.

+ A genuinely compelling story that you want to follow.
+ Massive, rich world that you'll explore for a loooong time.
+ Intense, challenging combat
? Can someone make a real-life Pip-Boy? That'd kick some iPhone ass.</blockquote>

 

[Brother None]

Those are stupid-ass criticisms. "Doy dialogue isn't dumb enough doy"

And he actually had to stay at Bethesda HQ to play it? Owtch. Very fair.

 

[***F.E.A.R.***MaNiaC]

"well crafted" RPG?
*cough*bought*cough*

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Does it matter much what these guys say or write?

As you yourself once said or wrote BN, it was pretty much expected that reporters from big magazines like these would be positive about Fallout 3, ignoring or downplaying any problems they had while playing.

I am not sure if they are positive because Bethesda made it or because this is called a Fallout game.

Independent gamers and fan review sites will probably have a more honest opinion.

***F.E.A.R.***MaNiaC, these days people look at the box to classify a game.
I am sure that if someone had put Shoot-Em-Up on the box of Sim City that some reviewer would have called it one of the best "Shoot-Em-Ups" he has ever played.

 

[Paul_cz]

Okay,I like not being able to fast travel from insides, I like the old school dialogue trees (screw ME system). Too bad about bad AI (though its not a deal breaker), and I don't get how could they fuck up that TPP again.I was looking forward to play it from that perspective, just like Gothic and Bloodlines.

 

[Vasara]

Wait, they actually liked the Mass Effect dialogue system? I guess actual sentences just aren't next-gen enough.

 

[Brother None]

Lots of the mainstream AAA media like the Mass Effect dialogue system, calling it "the next gen" of dialogue systems and thinking any game that doesn't use it is hopelessly traditional and out-dated.

Yes, they are that stupid.

 

[aronsearle]

Wow, they admitted it has faults, but still slapped a 10/10 on it.

Got to admire their balls.

 

[ArmorB]

Wow, they admitted it has faults, but still slapped a 10/10 on it.

Got to admire their balls.

Yeah what does that say about the standards of gaming now a days? Guess if it's the best piece of poop in the pile it has to get a 10. Granted I'm still excited to pay it.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Yeah what does that say about the standards of gaming now a days? Guess if it's the best piece of poop in the pile it has to get a 10. Granted I'm still excited to pay it.

Nothing wrong with wanting to try it put but if a game has flaws you would mention that in your opinion when someone asks for an honest one right?

 

[***F.E.A.R.***MaNiaC]

***F.E.A.R.***MaNiaC, these days people look at the box to classify a game.
I am sure that if someone had put Shoot-Em-Up on the box of Sim City that some reviewer would have called it one of the best "Shoot-Em-Ups" he has ever played.

i know.. thats just what i was referring to.
Its so sad.

Shoot Em Up was a great movie btw... best persiflage on Shooters and action movies alltogether. And featuring Clive Owen.

/edit

btw.. what the fuck?@launch party

 

[Dionysus]

Wait, they actually liked the Mass Effect dialogue system? I guess actual sentences just aren't next-gen enough.

WTF is a sentence? Are you talking about those big blobs of text?

 

[Ranne]

Wait, they actually liked the Mass Effect dialogue system? I guess actual sentences just aren't next-gen enough.

Ridiculous accusations like that annoy the hell out of me. Mass Effect dialogs all had "actual sentences". If you are senselessly criticizing the fact that they weren't printed verbatim on the dialog selection menu, then, first, with multiple dialog lines at the time, a move like that would be highly impractical and next to impossible implement in an aesthetic manner, and, second, forcing a player to read through all two to five conversation lines before forcing him to listen to his character repeating one of them out loud would be one ridiculously brain-dead design decision, no matter how you may look at it.

These knee-jerk "next-gen" criticisms may be perfectly substantiated most of the time, but you have to remember that some of these "next-gen" products that come out today are actually innovative and inspirational to the entire industry. Despite its obvious faults, cliches and imperfections, Mass Effect was certainly one of them. Fallout 3, on the other hand, most certainly is not.

 

[Apocalypse.]

no, this game is not perfect

few lines later...

10/10

I wonder what readership this magazine attracts. I wouldn`t be surprised if they call it a 10 page review and 6 of them are filled with Besthapo approved screenshots.

//I wonder if Dead Space is really that worse or maybe EA forgot to send out invitations.

 

[Brother None]

Ridiculous accusations like that annoy the hell out of me. Mass Effect dialogs all had "actual sentences". If you are senselessly criticizing the fact that they weren't printed verbatim on the dialog selection menu, then, first, with multiple dialog lines at the time, a move like that would be highly impractical and next to impossible implement in an aesthetic manner, and, second, forcing a player to read through all two to five conversation lines before forcing him to listen to his character repeating one of them out loud would be one ridiculously brain-dead design decision, no matter how you may look at it.

Hah. I hope you're joking. Mass Effect simplified dialogue changes back to keywords, exactly the same way Oblivion did, where all-important context sensitivities were lost, meaning your character could easily say something you would not expect.

Imagine you're in the middle of talking to Gizmo and the options are:
- Done deal.
- Why?
- Coat pocket.

Doesn't really indicate what you're actually going to say, no?

Mass Effect sacrificed a sensible full-line option system just so they could live out their wet fantasy of being a bad film in video game format, a kind of cross-format pollination that has poisoned BioWare RPGs for ages now. Whether or not the BioWare target audience attention span is also too short to bother reading short dialogue lines ("redding is the hard...") as you indicate isn't even relevant.

People are actual back-assed enough to consider that innovation? It breaks an existing system that already works perfectly to replace it with an old, tired system that never worked properly (keyword dialogue is older than BioWare), rather than actually expanding the sensibilities of the dialogue system (which, I should note, some older RPGs already did much better than either BioWare or BIS RPGs ever managed).

Not to mention Mass Effect's dialogue suffers that age-old BioWare curse of being completely pointless, with most dialogue choices being fake choices that lead to exactly the same outcome.

If Mass Effect is the shining beacon of where RPG dialogue should go, we might as well give up on the genre here and now. It did the cinematic interaction, voice acting and face modelling better than anything else, but system-wise, ME dialogue was broken.

//I wonder if Dead Space is really that worse or maybe EA forgot to send out invitations.

Reviews have been pretty positive, OXM is the lowest review score so far.

 

[DocConrad]

Wow, they admitted it has faults, but still slapped a 10/10 on it.

Got to admire their balls.

The OXM Scale goes to 11 on very very rare occasions, so theoretically an imperfect game can still score a 10. And yes, this IS the Spinal Tap system of ratings.

 

[Seelix]

Re: Fallout 3 OXM 10/10 confirmed

+ A genuinely compelling story that you want to follow.

I hate when reviewers tell me such things about the story because I am the one to judge whether game, book or movie contain good story and why the story is good. And when it is repeated again and again I start to suspect that something is very very wrong.

+ Massive, rich world that you'll explore for a loooong time.

This song became old a long time ago.
I prefer smaller world, less rich world, closed world even, but with an atmosphere, not an effects of someone's "copy-paste" fest.

+ Intense, challenging combat

Yeah, right. With unskippable, boring and simply ugly slo-mo after every aimed shot in game. I just can't wait...

? Can someone make a real-life Pip-Boy? That'd kick some iPhone ass.

WTF?

I noticed that nowadays so many reviewers/journalists try to advertise a game in a way that definitely would discourage me from buying. And their writting often indicate that games have no flaws at all which is simply impossible.

 

[Brother None]

The OXM Scale goes to 11 on very very rare occasions, so theoretically an imperfect game can still score a 10. And yes, this IS the Spinal Tap system of ratings.

Yip. They bumped it up to 11 after getting flak for giving some game a 10. Forgot which one.

No idea why I put up 10/10 in the newspost. Fixed.

I hate when reviewers tell me such things about the story because I am the one to judge whether game, book or movie contain good story and why the story is good. And when it is repeated again and again I start to suspect that something is very very wrong.

Nothing wrong with a reviewer judging a story. Only we already know the Fallout 3 story is some of the biggest tripe ever to hit RPG-land.

 

[Lexx]

Heh, funny. "We can not give the game a 10/10, so we make it 10/11!"

 

[Ranne]

Hah. I hope you're joking. Mass Effect simplified dialogue changes back to keywords, exactly the same way Oblivion did...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MnJOXZLMT0

Yes, exactly like Oblivion. Identical in any way. And how infinitely primitive in comparison to the Pulitzer Prize winner that is Fallout, my god...

End of sarcasm.

Now, first of all, it's key sentences, not key words, and, once again, it would make absolutely no sense whatsoever to display all of them in full beforehand only to repeat the actual selection vocally in a couple of seconds. Second of all, what's with the conformist mentality? Mass Effect is not a Fallout sequel and it was never intended to be one. Just as it was never intended to be "the shining beacon of where RPG dialogue should go", which is a complete non sequitur if you ask me. It didn't sacrifice. It took an entirely different route. Wet fantasy? "Film in video game format" is a definite and not in any way pessimistic future of the gaming industry, no matter whether you and I like it or not. There is nothing wrong with making an initial step toward this future. Frankly, it's not like the textual games of the "good old days" were ever able to compete with actual books. Not even close. So, adhering to rather primitive ten-word sentence choices as though they were some literary masterpieces, while dissing two-to-six-word choices that consequently get translated into entire speeches seems pretty simplistic and biased to me. Just as forcing ones preferred standards and stereotypes onto every single product that happens to share the genre.

(EDIT) Let me put it this way:
Simplifying dialog options for the mere sake of simplification - without any offsetting action - is a negative thing. Doing it for the sake of making the actual dialogue much more complex and its presentation much less repetitive is not.