Fallout 76 announced!

R.Graves said:
I felt 3 did a decent enough job of pulling the core mechanics of the original over to 3d.
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What mechanics would those be? (...what mechanics did they keep at all, and how would a switch to 3D affect mechanics?)

I'd say it's transition to 3d was clumsy if only because they didn't know what they wanted to keep or how to implement it.
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I don't think so. I think they knew exactly what then intended to discard. FO3 was their TES game template, skinned with the Fallout IP assets.
 
I never had a problem with VATS or the FPS design with Fallout since I cut my teeth on Morrowind and liked what the genre offered. To me Fallout does not need to be turn based although I would prefer it. I had hoped for a turn based spinoff but Bethesda has no talent for that shit. Look they reused F4 assets for 76. Wow.

They destroyed the franchise anyway. We might as well hope for a new generic post apocalyptic turn based RPG which will be along at some point then they will make 4 or 5 back to back from different developers all copying each other because they have no creativity whatsoever and yeah, that includes Obsidian. Mostly management I would venture to say.

Kinda like how D:OS, PoE 1 and 2, and Tyranny all look like the same thing we have been playing for...oh I don't know 20 fucking years. Barring D:OS and that amazing fucking engine.

Basically my point is the adherence to some purism in Fallout's design is absurd. Over half the fanbase are Bethesda fanboys. You can't even get them to play the old games. They won't buy it. Some of them won't buy this.

The best we have right now is UnderRail and Wasteland 3. This is what it has come to.

http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...ure-of-rpgs-at-kotaku-uk-and-pc-gamer.122181/

Even the guys making these things agree. The genre is stagnant as fuck. I don't care how many indies nobody knows about are coming out. None of the supposed saviors of RPG's are making games pushing the genre into the future. It's either cinematic bullshit or the exact same shit from the 90's minus the creativity.

Instead of the entire community complaining about it they really should make their own game. Rabid fanboy rage can only go so far. Fallout is a tarnished brand. The first two games hardly even sold well enough for them to keep making the games in the first place.
 
R.Graves said:
This franchise has already died three times over but holy shit. The only way we can get any further than Fallout now is it becomes a racing series.
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Fallout: Nuts & Bolts.

Gizmojunk said:
I don't think so. I think they knew exactly what then intended to discard. FO3 was their TES game template, skinned with the Fallout IP assets.
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Christ Gizmo, you act like they calculated a way to piss fans off with Fallout 3. There is an intact SPECIAL system, most of the skills, many of the perks, and a modest attempt at continuity. Credit where credit is due, at least they kept something from the classics. They were just lazy, cheap, and sloppy as hell about it.

TorontRayne said:
Instead of the entire community complaining about it they really should make their own game. Rabid fanboy rage can only go so far. Fallout is a tarnished brand. The first two games hardly even sold well enough for them to keep making the games in the first place.
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Thank you! I usually don't talk about this, but Shelf Life (the game I am currently working on) is coming along nicely. I'm aiming for a full demo by the end of 2018. It's themed like Clerks (the movie about working at a convenience store) but gameplay wise it's heavily inspired by Grand Theft Auto, Deus Ex, and Fallout. So all of you bastards have that to look forward to. Free copies for all NMA members on release. I'll start an update thread sometime this year.
 
About the remaster. 6gb is not that much. At most it will be another 'remaster' with nothing more but some improved textures and 64bit support, like Skyrim Special Edition. I really don't see them giving New Vegas a proper remaster or redux, like Metro franchise did it.
 
https://twitter.com/TheBY2K/status/1002880363562184704/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc^tfw&ref_url=https://s9e.github.io/iframe/twitter.min.html#1002880363562184704

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R.Graves said:
This franchise has already died three times over but holy shit. The only way we can get any further than Fallout now is it becomes a racing series.
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By your count, including 76, it died with 3? Wouldn't that be taking it a bit too far? It was on life support then 4 pulled the plug. Now that the series will most likely be co-op, it's a couple more steps away from rally racing through the wasteland. Hopefully Beth will have Codemasters develop it. Great job with Dirt 4.
 
Norzan said:
Fallout Kart confirmed. (i recall like a pic in this forum that had Fallout Kart)
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This one?


TerminallyChill said:
Christ Gizmo, you act like they calculated a way to piss fans off with Fallout 3.
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I'll tell you this: The release of FO3 felt like having camped out (too long) at the door to some special event to be first in line, and when the doors finally open, having it happen that the management buses in their own VIP convention as preferred customers. FO3 was made for the TES fanbase; they only cared about using the Fallout fans to spread the hype—the fans that actually mattered to them were the ones they planned to make from their established customer-base.

There is an intact SPECIAL system, most of the skills, many of the perks, and a modest attempt at continuity. Credit where credit is due, at least they kept something from the classics. They were just lazy, cheap, and sloppy as hell about it.
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We have a different definition of the word 'intact'. The only credit I give them is for their 3D landscaping—that's it. In that minuscule (but difficult) aspect, they did a superb** job; about as spot on as can be, (and a lot better than I would expect from Troika).... but the rest of it is awful. It's like watching a dead cat on puppet strings—one that you used to know, and like.

** They did it wrong of course, but the design workmanship is admirable; doubtless the designers made what they were asked to make.
 
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Gizmojunk said:
FO3 was made for the TES fanbase; they only cared about using the Fallout fans to spread the hype—the fans that actually mattered to them were the ones they planned to make from their established customer-base.
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Why would they not want to appeal to existing Fallout fans in addition to the Elder Scrolls crowd if they could? The plan you suggest just makes zero sense financially. It's not like Bethesda didn't try to win over series veterans, they just failed spectacularly. These developers were simply one trick ponies who only knew how to make shit like Oblivion. Not everybody can be Tim Cain. Never attribute to malice what can be explained by stupidity.
 
TerminallyChill said:
Why would they not want to appeal to existing Fallout fans in addition to the Elder Scrolls crowd if they could?
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Mutually exclusive taste in gaming; some less profitable. The better they make it for one group, the worse they make it for another.

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It's a bane of game design. Developers trying to hit three targets with a single shot. It is impossible to strike the bulls-eye... What you get from the attempt is mediocrity at best; something just barely tolerable to all, and great for no one; (think Food-Court Cajun food, instead of authentic).

It's the worst when this is the marketing plan from the outset. If the majority of all players like it just enough to tolerate it... Job well done, it has sold to them all! :evil:

Never attribute to malice what can be explained by stupidity.
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I would never characterize them as stupid. FO3 is a very impressive work; you can't make something like that if you are dumb. I DO consider it a cold and calculated evisceration of the IP, for the parts they can use in their TES derived money funnel.

I don't believe for a second that they had any concern for the precepts, and intents of the series. They were making a digital Westworld-Style sandboxed era-simulation. Where the player hikes around in the environment; digitally clad in a costume, and pretending to live there. Characters in their games are like vestigial tails, that they'd rather push out of the way; and they have been.
 
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I think y'all are going a bit too crazy about a relatively inconsequential yet promising spinoff me lads, let's just wait until the 11th to get dramatic about it.
 
The Franchise is beyond saving at this point. Bethesda will take a good thing and run it into the ground. I mean maybe there might be something good out of Fallout 76. I'm going to wait till e3, but even then I'm not expecting anything impressive.
 
Cobra Commander said:
I was thinking this yesterday ..... but come on. It's Bethesda. What are the odds?
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Never let them tell you the odds, kid!

But really, in the "fabulously optimistic" way as codexers would call it, if you think about it it's the only non-mainline Bethesda game studios proper has done in almost two decades now (there's Redguard I guess?). They've got a chance to let their hair loose for once, and there's most definitively talent working there that doesn't really get to shine when having to make pretty much the same game over and over.

And regardles if it turns out to be just alright or mediocre, like it'll probably be, not a gaping hole of badness like POS, I'm not sure how it's now the time to ring the death bells and throw out the funeral. The previous games will be always there and can't be written out of history, independebtly of what you think of them, that's pretty much the point of this site.

After all, one of the themes of Fallout is letting go and paving the way for the future...
 
Gizmojunk said:
Mutually exclusive taste in gaming; some less profitable. The better they make it for one group, the worse they make it for another.
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Gizmojunk said:
It's a bane of game design. Developers trying to hit three targets with a single shot. It is impossible to strike the bulls-eye... What you get from the attempt is mediocrity at best; something just barely tolerable to all, and great for no one; (think Food-Court Cajun food, instead of authentic).
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I get what you are saying, but operating on this logic New Vegas shouldn't exist. It was possible to merge Elder Scrolls and Fallout gameplay well enough to make both parties happy, Bethesda just doesn't understand how to pull it off. If they could have made New Vegas right off the bat, I can't imagine they wouldn't have. This theory that they intentionally tried to leave OG fans in the dust just doesn't hold water upon closer inspection. When you're a developer looking to appeal to essentially 'everyone', that blanket falls on die hard fans as much as it does a casual audience. Todd Howard is just painfully out of touch with the classic Fallout community.

Gizmojunk said:
I would never characterize them as stupid.
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They are. At least when it comes to the things that made Tim Cain and Josh Sawyer smart. This community (myself included) loves to rip on Howard for being evil, but in reality I highly doubt this is actually the case. It's far more plausible he's just a slightly above-average AAA game director who is set in his ways. That sucks for us, but it's the truth. No conspiracy, sorry.

Arnust said:
But really, in the "fabulously optimistic" way as codexers would call it, if you think about it it's the only non-mainline Bethesda game studios proper has done in almost two decades now (there's Redguard I guess?). They've got a chance to let their hair loose for once, and there's most definitively talent working there that doesn't really get to shine when having to make pretty much the same game over and over.
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Nice thought Arnust, but generally I try to be as pessimistic about these sort of things as possible. That way, when they come out above expectations, it softens the blow.

The sad thing about Fallout 76 is that even my absolute worst case scenario is plausible in today's market. Free-to-play, battle royale, microtransactions, etc.
 
TerminallyChill said:
I get what you are saying, but operating on this logic New Vegas shouldn't exist. It was possible to merge Elder Scrolls and Fallout gameplay well enough to make both parties happy, Bethesda just doesn't understand how to pull it off.
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...And they had New Vegas done for them by experts, and they still discarded it afterwards; do you see anything of New Vegas in FO4? Do you think that's an accident? It's not the plan. It appears to me that they are refining a template for a cash funnel game-product.

Consider if the developer sees their split market as 90/10; where the 10% want feature X, and the 90% freak out if feature x is in the game; (and so they could lose part of the 90% to gain part of the 10%). They don't even make RPGs; RPGs evaluate when to say 'no' to the player. Bethesda games never say 'no'—perish the thought.

Pete Hines has blatantly contradicted Fallout's brilliant design as against policy. He states that they do not surprise the player, and they telegraph outcomes; citing that he has played games where he made a choice, and things didn't turn out as expected—and that's a bad thing to him. He also was the one who admitted that "dialog was not a battle they wanted to fight", (ie. Pick your battles). Have you listened to Todd Howard's speeches? He derides the earlier series. Of their own games he mentions seeing players/testers (their target audience) clicking past any carefully crafted dialog (unread), to find out who they have to shoot next. Look at FO4.


They are [stupid]. At least when it comes to the things that made Tim Cain and Josh Sawyer smart. This community (myself included) loves to rip on Howard for being evil, but in reality I highly doubt this is actually the case. It's far more plausible he's just a slightly above-average AAA game director who is set in his ways. That sucks for us, but it's the truth. No conspiracy, sorry.
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They are not. They don't value what made Tim Cain and Josh Sawyer smart. They target players who would glaze over and sigh (in disappointment—or fury) at being restricted by the PC, or being expected to read the dialog (and consider its implications) in order to play sensibly.

Distilled... It's choosing your market: Do you make your money on custom leather boots, or (bulk sales) by making Skechers knock-offs. In the long run, the latter can be more profitable.
 
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