I like fallout 3

[TerminallyChill]

Say what you like about Moira, but she does have a distinct personality, tons of dialogue options, and even skill checks. She's arguably the most well written character in the game. (Which really isn't much of a contest to begin with, but still.)

True. Klein's a huge asshole but he's a funny asshole.

Dr. 0 (a.k.a. Dr. Venture) is my favorite.

 

[Norzan]

Say what you like about Moira, but she does have a distinct personality, tons of dialogue options, and even skill checks. She's arguably the most well written character in the game. (Which really isn't much of a contest to begin with, but still.)

I'm of the opinion that having a distinct personality doesn't make your character good or not terrible. Moira might be the most well written character in the game, but it's still terrible overall given what the franchise had before and after.

 

[Cliffy McEdgeface]

Dr. 0 (a.k.a. Dr. Venture) is my favorite.

Dr. 0 has some really funny lines and getting him to stand up to Klein is actually pretty awesome. Dala's funny too, in a different way, and also makes a hilarious foil to Klein.

Anyways, Moira. Moira is almost emblematic of what exactly is wrong with Beth's writing habits and sense of humor (and why they're a bad fit for Fallout).

 

[TerminallyChill]

I'm of the opinion that having a distinct personality doesn't make your character good or not terrible. Moira might be the most well written character in the game, but it's still terrible overall given what the franchise had before and after.

All I'm saying is there are way worse characters than her out there to pick on. Like... an entire Capital Wasteland's worth. I suppose Moira is just the only one people can remember at this point, though. That and THREEEEEDAAAWWG.

Dr. 0 has some really funny lines and getting him to stand up to Klein is actually pretty awesome. Dala's funny too, in a different way, and also makes a hilarious foil to Klein.

I just like the actor who voices Dr. 0. Any of the lines they gave him would have probably come out hilarious. Of course the rest of the cast in Old World Blues is great, too.

 

[Cliffy McEdgeface]

I just like the actor who voices Dr. 0. Any of the lines they gave him would have probably come out hilarious. Of course the rest of the cast in Old World Blues is great, too.

When I first played OWB I was initially put off by the level of QUIRKY ZANY in it, but after a couple playthroughs it kind of grew on me. Yes, it's sort of jarring, the change of tone between the base game and OWB, but there is actually a pretty sad and somber story (multiple stories, technically) underneath the QUIRKY ZANY stuff and it's overall written reasonably well. Contrast with Fallout 3, where you scratch the QUIRKY ZANY away a bit and find... little of substance.

 

[Helloitme]

To be honest fallout new vegas’ narrative makes less sense than fallout 3s. In fallout new Vegas Benny shoots you in the head for the platinum chip. But why do you go looking for him? Why would you try to follow the person who nearly killed you? It’s an irrational decision to go out of your way to find him. Fallout 3 on the other hand is about your dad leaving for project purity, and while that’s happening the overseer is hunting you down in the vault, so there are 2 good reasons for escaping.

 

[Cliffy McEdgeface]

To be honest fallout new vegas’ narrative makes less sense than fallout 3s. In fallout new Vegas Benny shoots you in the head for the platinum chip. But why do you go looking for him? Why would you try to follow the person who nearly killed you?

Spoiler

To get my fucking package back and shoot the bastard what done it, maybe after beating the reason why out of him first. A meeker Courier might have said "fuck it" but then there wouldn't be much of a game. I mean, if nothing else when you wake up in Doc Mitchell's place your Courier is probably asking "What the fuck just happened to me?" and when Doc Mitchell hands him the Delivery Order the first piece clicks into place: "I am a courier, I was delivering a package, this guy took it and tried to ice me. I wonder why this guy was willing to kill for... a giant platinum poker chip? How odd." I mean, Benny is actually incredulous that you tracked him down, so the game itself isn't shy about pointing out that you may be an unusually determined person. Or, honestly, you can ignore the MQ entirely and fart about the Mojave until you trip over the NCR and Legion and maybe you think THAT'S a more compelling thing than your Courier job. There's no shortage of narratives in the Mojave to follow, really.

 

[Norzan]

To be honest fallout new vegas’ narrative makes less sense than fallout 3s. In fallout new Vegas Benny shoots you in the head for the platinum chip. But why do you go looking for him? Why would you try to follow the person who nearly killed you? It’s an irrational decision to go out of your way to find him. Fallout 3 on the other hand is about your dad leaving for project purity, and while that’s happening the overseer is hunting you down in the vault, so there are 2 good reasons for escaping.

Are you serious? It seems at this point you are looking for things to criticize New Vegas to make Fallout 3 sound less stupid. Then again, you compared Power of the Atom with Run Goodsprings Run and Ghost Town Gunfight.

What if i want revenge? What if i want to know why he shot me in the head? What if i want to steal the Platinum Chip from him? Just the mere fact you think it's "irrational" just shows you don't know what roleplaying actually is and completely lack any imagination. This is why the backstory of the Courier is so vague, you can add any motivation yourself to it. In Fallout 3 i can't say no to helping my dad, i'm forced to help him even if i'm the worst person in the wasteland.

 

[Helloitme]

Look regardless if it’s out of curiosity or vengeance, going after Benny would still be a stupid idea, he killed you once so how do you know he won’t do it again. You wouldn’t go looking for someone who beats you to a pulp and leaves you for dead, so why should I be forced to confront someone who my courier might not want to meet, what if my courier is a coward and never wants to find Benny? I can’t do that because progressing through the story must include finding Benny.

Also good job for saying I have no idea what roleplaying is and have no imagination for criticizing a narrative in a video game

 

[Cliffy McEdgeface]

Look regardless if it’s out of curiosity or vengeance, going after Benny would still be a stupid idea, he killed you once so how do you know he won’t do it again. You wouldn’t go looking for someone who beats you to a pulp and leaves you for dead, so why should I be forced to confront someone who my courier might not want to meet, what if my courier is a coward and never wants to find Benny? I can’t do that because progressing through the story must include finding Benny.

The fuck I wouldn't. I'd find the sonofabitch and do him double what he did me.

Also good job for saying I have no idea what roleplaying is and have no imagination for criticizing a narrative in a video game

You are reaching really, REALLY hard with all of this.

 

[2273nate]

It doesn't really leave much to the imagination. You're still stuck as a 19 year old with a living father and dead mother. Not to mention it shows too much. What if i was such a dick that nobody showed up to my birthday party and if anyone did, they were forced to? What if i had no friends? What if no one liked me? The intro just shows too much, it makes it too restricting.

Not to mention how you can't talk down the Overseer or the guards he sends to kill you. You are either forced to run or kill them, no diplomacy allowed.


You do know this is stupid? Sacrificing yourself makes no sense when you have a Super Mutant and a Ghoul that can do it with no downsides. Why would you sacrifice yourself when there's a no downsides option? Sacrifice should be a LAST resort, not something your character just does it because so. If they wanted a noble sacrifice, then don't allow any companion to join you that can do it for free.


This doesn't really work when you go to the wasteland with no weapons or people to protect yourself. He should be dead 15 minutes into entering the wasteland with no protection.

So much of the story of Fallout 3 is done with contrivances and nonsense. Just illogical things happen when they wouldn't if logic was a thing in the game. Much of the Fallout 3 story could have worked if they just rewrote a lot of stuff to make sense but they didn't.


Moira Brown is a terrible character (it's made worse when she instant Ghoulifies and retains her sanity) along with Fawkes. Specially Fawkes, the conveniently sane Super Mutant. No, no, a lot of people that were injected with FEV were turned into mindless ogres but Fawkes is special somehow. Same with Uncle Leo. You can't fill the games with mindless Super Mutants and then suddenly have these two keep their sanity when they turn, with no explanation given.

You forget that most kids playing video games these days want everything done for them. They don't want to have to develop stories for their characters because they could care less. They just want to jump into the action and beat the game. I think that's partially why Bethesda did it the way they did. As far as the story being a good open ended choose your own path fallout one and two type of story it fails completely, but the story is good in my opinion if you don't compare it to fallout one and two because they are just different games.

Yes, you can't talk down the guards, but what about all of the other options you have? take the situation with Butch when he attempts to get you to help him save his mother. You can tell him no, kill him and his mother, convince him to go in and save her himself or go and help him. The situation with the guards is such a small thing that it really wouldn't matter and realistically you would not be able to talk them down as they are loyal to the overseer and they see you at fault for the vault falling apart. There are plenty of situations in fallout one and two I can think of that really have the same outcomes. Take the tribal in the temple of trials that is used as your final text for example. There is now way to talk him down either and you are forced into fighting him with no other options available (So far as I know).

That is true with sending Fawkes in to activate the purifier and I think it kind of makes the ending seem a bit illogical. I wish you were not able to send him in there like that. It makes things seem too easy, but aside from this the ending is decent if you go the route most do as opposed to sending Fawkes in.

 

[Norzan]

Look regardless if it’s out of curiosity or vengeance, going after Benny would still be a stupid idea, he killed you once so how do you know he won’t do it again. You wouldn’t go looking for someone who beats you to a pulp and leaves you for dead, so why should I be forced to confront someone who my courier might not want to meet, what if my courier is a coward and never wants to find Benny? I can’t do that because progressing through the story must include finding Benny.

Also good job for saying I have no idea what roleplaying is and have no imagination for criticizing a narrative in a video game

Because frankly, your criticism of the narrative hook is kind of dumb and it makes no sense.

The first time he tried to kill you was because you were caught off guard by the Kahns and him. Now you know who did it and you can plan a counter attack by finding out where he is. It's perfectly legitimate for a Courier to want revenge, wanting to find out why he did it or maybe actually side with them after you know what the Platinum Chip does. These are all legitimate reasons to go after Benny. Like Benny said, it was just business and nothing personal.

You said the Courier, under any circunstances, shouldn't go after Benny because it makes no sense. This makes no sense. The only legitimate criticism is that the Courier is forced to deal with Benny. But at least there's several ways to deal with Benny, while in Fallout 3 there's no different ways to deal with the main quest.

You forget that most kids playing video games these days want everything done for them. They don't want to have to develop stories for their characters because they could care less. They just want to jump into the action and beat the game. I think that's partially why Bethesda did it the way they did. As far as the story being a good open ended choose your own path fallout one and two type of story it fails completely, but the story is good in my opinion if you don't compare it to fallout one and two because they are just different games.

This is pretty much a non-argument. Fallout isn't made for kids, or at least weren't made for kids in the previous two games. And yes, i'm gonna compare it with the first two games, 3 is part of the franchise. This "you should look at the game on its own" doesn't work when it's part of the same franchise. Inevitable comparisons are going to be made.

Yes, you can't talk down the guards, but what about all of the other options you have? take the situation with Butch when he attempts to get you to help him save his mother. You can tell him no, kill him and his mother, convince him to go in and save her himself or go and help him. The situation with the guards is such a small thing that it really wouldn't matter and realistically you would not be able to talk them down as they are loyal to the overseer and they see you at fault for the vault falling apart. There are plenty of situations in fallout one and two I can think of that really have the same outcomes. Take the tribal in the temple of trials that is used as your final text for example. There is now way to talk him down either and you are forced into fighting him with no other options available (So far as I know).

It's not a "small" part, it's a perfect representation of the game. No choices, just kill and loot. This is what the whole Overseer sequence symbolizes.

And wrong, you can convince the guy in the Temple of Trials to let you pass if you have good speech. The most infamous part of Fallout 2 has more choices than Fallout 3 as a whole. And that's a bad thing.

 

[2273nate]

To be honest fallout new vegas’ narrative makes less sense than fallout 3s. In fallout new Vegas Benny shoots you in the head for the platinum chip. But why do you go looking for him? Why would you try to follow the person who nearly killed you? It’s an irrational decision to go out of your way to find him. Fallout 3 on the other hand is about your dad leaving for project purity, and while that’s happening the overseer is hunting you down in the vault, so there are 2 good reasons for escaping.

Because of what you just said. He tried to kill you. However you don't have to go after him with motives for revenge, but most people would attempt to hunt him down I would say. Also you are not forced to go after him if you don't want to. There are plenty of other quest.

 

[Cliffy McEdgeface]

Because of what you just said. He tried to kill you. However you don't have to go after him with motives for revenge, but most people would attempt to hunt him down I would say. Also you are not forced to go after him if you don't want to. There are plenty of other quest.

Seriously, why wouldn't you want to track the guy down and at least go "Excuse me, what the fuck?"

 

[2273nate]

Because frankly, your criticism of the narrative hook is kind of dumb and it makes no sense.

The first time he tried to kill you was because you were caught off guard by the Kahns and him. Now you know who did it and you can plan a counter attack by finding out where he is. It's perfectly legitimate for a Courier to want revenge, wanting to find out why he did it or maybe actually side with them after you know what the Platinum Chip does. These are all legitimate reasons to go after Benny.

You said the Courier, under any circunstances, shouldn't go after Benny because it makes no sense. This makes no sense. The only legitimate criticism is that the Courier is forced to deal with Benny. But at least there's several ways to deal with Benny, while in Fallout 3 there's no different ways to deal with the main quest.


This is pretty much a non-argument. Fallout isn't made for kids, or at least weren't made for kids in the previous two games.

That's a rather bold statement. I think they were made for whoever showed interest, but most certainly Bethesda makes its games intending them to be for younger audiences and they make that clear.

 

[Cliffy McEdgeface]

That's a rather bold statement. I think they were made for whoever showed interest, but most certainly Bethesda makes its games intending them to be for younger audiences and they make that clear.

There's a difference between making games for puerile audiences and making games for actual kids, though. I think you may be confusing the two. A game where I can pop someone's head like an overripe pomegranate with a well-aimed bullet ain't exactly kid stuff.

 

[2273nate]

In the end the hostility against Bethesda will not change a thing neither will bashing the newer fallouts. They have the rights and the fallout games are going to continue to be less focused on rpg aspects and more focused on attempting to make them feel like an open world new age "rpg" where you run around killing monster endlessly with only one single goal and that's to level up.

 

[Cliffy McEdgeface]

In the end the hostility against Bethesda will not change a thing neither will bashing the newer fallouts. They have the rights and the fallout games are going to continue to be less focused on rpg aspects and more focused on attempting to make them feel like an open world new age "rpg" where you run around killing monster endlessly with only one single goal and that's to level up.

Yes, well, doesn't mean we have to like it or suffer it silently. Bitching about it may not do much good but it feels nice.

 

[Norzan]

In the end the hostility against Bethesda will not change a thing neither will bashing the newer fallouts. They have the rights and the fallout games are going to continue to be less focused on rpg aspects and more focused on attempting to make them feel like an open world new age "rpg" where you run around killing monster endlessly with only one single goal and that's to level up.

I criticize the new Fallout games (besides New Vegas) because i want to make people aware of how they fucked this franchise. If i just make one person want to try the first two games and New Vegas and see how good this franchise can be, then i'm all good. I know my complaining won't change a thing.

 

[2273nate]

I criticize the new Fallout games (besides New Vegas) because i want to make people aware of how they fucked this franchise. If i just make one person want to try the first two games and New Vegas and see how good this franchise can be, then i'm all good. I know my complaining won't change a thing.

I was praying fallout 76 would bring back a New Vegas type of game where character development and world building mattered, but then I found out that it's going to be a multiplayer game which tells me they have all but abandoned what fallout has meant to be. As time has went on Bethesda has morphed fallout into a completely different game which really sucks. Most kids these days play fallout four and are content with it because they have no idea what it used to be and most refuse to play the older games simply because of the graphics or the turn based combat. In all honesty today's gamers seems to show less interest in rpg games and by that I mean real rpgs (not the rpgs we have today) and so Bethesda is actually making money off of it. Fallout is no longer an rpg it's more of an open world free for all focused on leveling up non-stop and the only skills that matter are your combat ones because in most scenarios you are forced into shooting first and then asking questions later.
Fallout 1, 2, NV and 3 may be the last fallout games I will ever be able to enjoy.